Giuliani: Nothing wrong with Trump camp taking Russian help

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  • Sportsfan123 Herriman, UT
    April 23, 2019 11:18 a.m.

    Utah girl

    "Back in the day, not terribly long ago, we called people who willingly and enthusiastically accepted russian "help" communist's.

    "That was years before russia declared war on the sovereignty of our election's."

    "While we are questioning allegiances here...."

    As Sheryl Crow put it, "isn't it Ironic" that some are posting anti leftist ideology referring to communism as a bad thing when their very own party is pushing extreme leftist ideology in socialism and communal idea's like OAC's green new deal, and berney sanders self proclaimed socialism the entire left of congress has adopted the very ideology that you despise, and if Based on one's comments I think it is safe to say said poster votes democrat. To again quote Sheryl Crow "It's a little Ironic, don't you think".

    The fact's are clear that hillary, the DNC and and the leftist obama administration FBI took unverified fake op-ed research data paid for by hillary and the DNC from the russian's and used it to smear trump and when it was all said and done trump is not guilty of the fake crime alleged, but the left are still pushing this false narrative.

    It truly is ironic and some just can't see it because of hate.

  • Sportsfan123 Herriman, UT
    April 23, 2019 10:36 a.m.

    Anti trumpers

    All of you are so wrong on the trump tower meeting, read the mueller report and get it straight.

    The tower meeting was set up by fusion GPS the opposition research firm hired by hillary and the DNC the russian lawyer met with fusion gps before and after that meeting and absolutely nothing in that meeting had anything to do with dirt on hillary, even if there was there is nothing illegal about getting dirt on your political opponent even if it is from a russian.

    Look at the facts, the fake dossier came from russian nationals compiled by fusion gps, if your are going to complain that a russian lawyer met with don jr and mannefort in the trump tower then you need to complain that fake dirt on trump came from russia. You can't have it just one way.

    It is a correct statement that there are no laws prohibiting any american getting information from russia, if the clinton's can do it then why can't trump.

    Mueller cleared the trumps of any wrong doing from that meeting and in his own words there was no legality issues with it.

    The media has been feeding this lie for the last three years and thanks to the gullable americans who believe, the big lie is alive and well.

  • Mad Hatter Santa Fe, NM
    April 22, 2019 7:55 p.m.

    Copybook Headings - Draper, UT
    April 22, 2019 4:17 p.m.

    "The DNC can fill up the comment boards of every news outlet in the country. It will not sway the majority of Americans from thinking that the Mueller investigation was a witch hunt from the get go."

    Donald Trump's approval numbers are heading south. With 37% approval in the latest polls, 56% of Americans disapprove. That doesn't help you "majority of Americans" claims. In fact, I don't think Trump has ever polled over 45% in his hey day.

    The DNC is not making the comments here. Most appear to be disaffected Republicans and Independents. We'd have to check that, but I suspect the real, loyal Trump supporter is down around 25% who will stick with him even if he confessed to criminal conspiracy. They might argue that it's a "slip of the tongue" or he was just being sarcastic, yet they will never abandon him as their one, true leader.

    Additionally, now that the Mueller report has been made public, you must think it is not as William Barr said, but is a statement critical of Trump. It doesn't exonerate him of the charges as initially reported. In fact, in the "pre-release days", the report was supposed to be vindication.

  • silo Sandy, UT
    April 22, 2019 5:27 p.m.

    @copybook headings
    "Every day I come to these threads and every day the blather and bloviating from sore loser Democrats makes me want to vote for Trump all the more."

    You're fooling yourself if you think the only opposition to Trump is coming from 'sore loser Democrats'.

    There are many, many, many people like myself, an Independent who still considers conservatism to mean fiscal, moral and ethical conservatism. Qualities Trump is completely lacking.

    You may attempt to brush people like me off by calling me a RINO, or a liberal, or a Democrat, but I know I've held to my values, I still carry the right to vote and I'll make sure to exercise that right to vote for someone who won't stain the office of the President as Trump has.

  • Copybook Headings Draper, UT
    April 22, 2019 4:17 p.m.

    "When did ignorance and stupidity become a valid reason to get away with committing an illegal act. "

    On July 5th, 2016.

    The DNC can fill up the comment boards of every news outlet in the country. It will not sway the majority of Americans from thinking that the Mueller investigation was a witch hunt from the get go. It will not remove the bitter taste in average American's mouths that the DNC just charged them 25 million dollars to do opposition research on Trump. It will not remove the notion from average American minds that a sitting President ignored threats of Russian intervention in our elections until his party's candidate lost. Every day I come to these threads and every day the blather and bloviating from sore loser Democrats makes me want to vote for Trump all the more. Keep it up Dems because every day more and more people are coming to the same conclusion.

  • Karen R. Houston, TX
    April 22, 2019 2:45 p.m.

    "On the facts here, the government would unlikely be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the June 9 meeting participants had general knowledge that their conduct was unlawful," the report stated. "The investigation has not developed evidence that the participants in the meeting were familiar with the foreign-contribution ban or the application of federal law to the relevant factual context."

    What I don't understand about this is that Paul Manafort was a part of that meeting. He's a long-time veteran of U.S. political campaigns. Why shouldn't he be expected to know? Does a campaign have an obligation to have on staff or retainer someone that is versed in such things? This wasn't an impromptu meeting. It was planned, scheduled. Manafort had time to ask a lawyer, "Hey, is this a legal thing we're considering?"

    Less and less of this is making sense to me. The Trump campaign didn't help Russia hack/steal, but they knew they'd done it and they used the information to their advantage anyway, an act that furthered Russia's purposes. How is this not aiding and abetting the enemy?

  • Dart Thrower Ogden, UT
    April 22, 2019 1:44 p.m.

    Rules only apply to small fry. Trump has bent, spindled, mangled and twisted the law his whole life and Rudy is using a megaphone to say "It's OK folks, nothing to see here".

    Either we are nation of laws or not. If Trump is not held accountable for openly working with an enemy state, then no one in the future will be either. We will get candidates that are backed by Russia, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, etc. Foreign money and influence will select our government. I, for one, think that is a tremendously bad idea.

  • Janet Pete Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2019 1:05 p.m.

    JkeithC - Richland, WA
    April 22, 2019 8:32 a.m.

    "Where Mueller found no collusion . . . "

    Read the Mueller report. You are quoting William Barr and his "finding". Too many people in this thread defending Donald Trump are referencing Barr without bothering to read the report.

    Robert Mueller said he could not find sufficient evidence to find conspiracy since he was unable to do a complete and thorough examination. He was unable to interview Russians, emails had been destroyed, and he used the "too stupid to know" rationale for many in the Trump campaign to explain their ignorance and lack of intentional complicity. In other words, they were too dumb to acquaint themselves with the law as if that is an excuse.

    Although "collusion" is not a legal term, there is plenty of evidence of untoward activity to show a willingness by the Russians to help Donald Trump win the election and a willingness by the Trump campaign to accept all the help the Russians could give. Just because the didn't all sit down together at a table and plan it all out was an issue for Mueller, according to his report. Trump knew about coming WikiLeaks dumps, he just didn't know what was specifically in them.

  • Daedalus, Stephen Arvada, CO
    April 22, 2019 10:31 a.m.

    @JkeithC: "Where Mueller found no collusion..."

    Huh.

    This makes as much sense as saying "Mueller found total collusion".

    Why?

    The number of times in his report that Mueller states there was "no collusion" is the exact same number as the times Mueller states that he found "total collusion".

    That number?

    Zero.

    Don't believe me? Then avail yourself to one of the several searchable versions of the Mueller report.

    A.G. Barr skillfully floated the phrase "no collusion" like a dry-fly cast onto a trout stream.

    There is no shame for a trout rising to take the bait from a skilled, convincing cast.

    That said, shame and embarrassment IS well-deserved when a trout in the creel goes on to brag about how delicious its last meal was.

  • T-money$$$ Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2019 9:35 a.m.

    I am very concerned that Russia might try and interfere with our elections again in 2020. Comments like this from Rudy and others in the GOP are not helping.

  • dmcvey Los Angeles, CA
    April 22, 2019 9:18 a.m.

    It's shameful what's happened to our country at the hands of these men.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    April 22, 2019 9:13 a.m.

    So this is what the Republican Party has descended to....

    Of note, the Republicans would be screaming bloody murder if the other party climbed into bed with the Russians. Can someone explain why it's OK for the Republicans to consort with a sworn enemy of the Untied States? It's a fair and legitimate question.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    April 22, 2019 8:51 a.m.

    "President Donald Trump's lawyer Rudy Giuliani insisted Sunday there was "nothing wrong" with the president's 2016 campaign taking information from the Russians"
    ____________________
    There was a time not so long ago when the thought of a President's lawyer offering such a veiled admission of guilt as a defense was incomprehensible. Each day, this becomes more and more like an unending bad dream we can't seem to wake up from.

  • JkeithC Richland, WA
    April 22, 2019 8:32 a.m.

    The brilliance of some of the comments here is truly something to amaze.
    Where Mueller found no collusion after spending 22 months and over $25,000,000 of your taxes while employing 2 dozen rabid anti Trump sycophants, all that seems necessary is for some of you unrequited anti Trump prostelytes is the continued exercise of your vivid imaginations and the nonsense rolls on.

  • unrepentant progressive Bozeman, MT
    April 22, 2019 8:09 a.m.

    It is obvious that the President and his various defenders have a very weak case. The President may not technically be legally guilty of the various nefarious actions described in the Mueller report, but he is guilty of behavior beneath the office of the Presidency. Or even the local dogcatcatcher.

    You may not have liked Trump's predecessors, but you generally felt comfortable that they would not embarrass the country. Not so with the current President. He is a stain on the good name of this country.

    Yet GOP tribalism will defend him to the death. Morals and ethics have become extinct on the Right.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2019 7:58 a.m.

    The logic of this position is absurd. At least, their should be full disclosure as the the name of the agent of the foreign power who should wait at FBI Headquarters for 48 hours after the information drop.

  • Daedalus, Stephen Arvada, CO
    April 22, 2019 7:12 a.m.

    The same moral logic of Trump/Republicans suggests that a married man who gets caught having an affair with an attractive co-worker has done nothing wrong because he was not charged with a crime.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    April 22, 2019 6:30 a.m.

    This isn't a slippery slope - it's the highest, silicon/graphite lubricated ski jump on Earth.

    As Republicans conveniently ignore the 200 pages of the Mueller report dealing with the specifics of Russian interference, we may find our nation has become a large morsel the rising superpowers fight over to sway elections, in their favor.

    Reports of numerous Asians who don't speak English with new memberships in Mar-a-Lago is just the tip of the iceberg.

  • Baron Scarpia Logan, UT
    April 22, 2019 6:19 a.m.

    The reality is that Russia wants to be our friends and put people in office who won't oppose Russian interests throughout the world. Hillary and Obama opposed Putin's annexation of Crimea, and it wanted a friend in the White House. What more legitimate friend than a GOP president?

    So far, Russia has found that friend in Trump. Trump has time and again declared how it would be a good thing to be friends with Russia. He's sided with Putin when he asked if Russian interfered with the elections. He's stood tall with Russian against our intelligence community. That's a true friend!

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    April 22, 2019 5:47 a.m.

    Rudy was, even for him, incredibly unhinged in tv interviews yesterday. He bent himself into pretzels trying to defend the incompetent and borderline treasonous actions of the trump campaign.

  • Copybook Headings Draper, UT
    April 22, 2019 4:24 a.m.

    "Although there is evidence of potential violations of the statutes regarding the handling of classified information, our judgment is that no reasonable prosecutor would bring such a case."

    James Comey - July 5th, 2016

    The hypocrisy of some of the comments in this thread is simply stunning.

  • Iron Rod Salt Lake City, UT
    April 22, 2019 2:55 a.m.

    “Trump, who spent the holiday weekend at his private Mar-a-Lago club in Palm Beach,“

    I remember people complaining about President Obama going to Hawaii on Christmas vacation.

    The sound of silence from these same people is deafening.

    What was bad for Obama is apparently OK for Trump.

  • Mad Hatter Santa Fe, NM
    April 21, 2019 10:48 p.m.

    When did ignorance and stupidity become a valid reason to get away with committing an illegal act. If you're Donald Trump, a member of his family, or part of his administration. Michael Cohen, Mike Flynn, Paul Manafort and all the others convicted of crimes should have used this defense. Maybe Flynn and Manafort, but not Cohen. Trump turned against Cohen and cast him out so he doesn't get covered by the "Get Out Of Jail Free" card that Trump apparently carries around. Also, he didn't have Bill Barr around when he was needed.

    So where do we go from here? Obviously the House committees and federal/state prosecutors have work to do. Democrats need to keep investigations going while developing legislation to make American lives better. Trump isn't about to do any of that.

    Then we have impeachment raising its divisive head which should probably be abandoned. Let people decide Trump's fate in November, 2020. Impeachment is a bridge too far. Since Trump will probably never be convicted, impeachment will go nowhere except make some people feel good about themselves. Better to expose Trump than to give him a flag to rally his base around. It would consume Congress and nothing gets done.

  • Mackenzie Iwamoto Bronx, NY
    April 21, 2019 10:35 p.m.

    Apparently Rudy Giuliani is doing the exact same con that Bill Barr did. He is trying to justify the unjustifiable by not giving all the facts even though they are available to anyone to read. When Barr said that Robert Mueller didn't find Donald Trump guilty of obstruction, he failed to mention that Mueller said in his report that if he found Trump innocent of obstruction of justice, he would have said it.

    Similarly, Giuliani said that there's no law against taking information supplied by a hostile nation, he neglected to add that the information was stolen, just like any robber breaking-and-entering someone's home, and the Trump campaign gladly accepted all the help the Russians could give. Although there was no strategizing between the two groups on what information was wanted and how best to get it, when Trump suggested Russia find Hillary Clinton's 33,000 emails, it's no coincidence that 5 hours later there was a WikiLeaks dump of more anti-Clinton material.

    Trump was always after more material coming from Russia through WikiLeaks. We even learn that he was aware of available information before it was released. With Giuliani, if it's not your house being robbed, don't worry.

  • Jim Chee Lahaina, HI
    April 21, 2019 10:21 p.m.

    The only thing Rudy Giuliani forgot to mention is that the information was stolen. Then he went on to say "it's depends" on the information. Maybe he meant that if it was the opposition party getting the information it would be wrong. But if Republicans receive stolen information, it's OK. What's unethical about that.

    Next we'll have a argument that it doesn't matter what a Republic;an does to win, winning is the objective. Lie. Cheat. Steal. The need is to get the power and hold on to it. It's everything your mother ever taught you not to do. If you're friend steals from a storekeeper and gives you the stolen goods, does that make you innocent of stealing? We have laws about theft and receiving stolen property is not right despite what Giuliani says.

    Also, Guiliani is trying to misdirect people from the facts found in the Mueller report. He may be urging people that they don't need to read the report because both he and William Barr will tell you the "truth". If you read it, maybe you'll get the wrong idea and think Donald Trump and his campaign did something unethical and illegal. Such an observation doesn't fit their narrative.

    "No collusion"? Lot of evidence for conspiracy.

  • Utah Girl Chronicles Eagle Mountain, UT
    April 21, 2019 9:49 p.m.

    Back in the day, not terribly long ago, we called people who willingly and enthusiastically accepted Russian "help" . . . Communists. That was years before Russia declared war on the sovereignty of our elections.

    While we are questioning allegiances here, it is interesting how Giuliani delivered a sound byte that seemed deliberately destined to make Putin happy.

    That seems to be the next GOP propaganda crusade, convince the rest of us Russia knows what is best for the USA than we do.

  • David Centerville, UT
    April 21, 2019 9:46 p.m.

    "On the facts here, the government would unlikely be able to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the June 9 meeting participants had general knowledge that their conduct was unlawful," the report stated. "The investigation has not developed evidence that the participants in the meeting were familiar with the foreign-contribution ban or the application of federal law to the relevant factual context."

    I did not realize that prosecution of the law was dependent upon one's knowledge of the law. For example, if I fail to see a speed limit sign, am speeding and get pulled over by police, I guess I can just declare I did not understand or know that in that particular area I was speeding. Right?

    Or regarding tax law--I guess if the IRS audits me and finds me in violation of the US tax law (currently at 2600 pages of codes and requirements) I can be found innocent if I was ignorant of the law?

    I didn't think it worked that way.