The DN continues to be tone deaf and doesn't even mention its systemic
failures over the past two years. Thank God that other commenters in this thread
display more journalistic integrity than this publication. The news media has
been deeply dishonest, to their everlasting shame.
It is also a Rorschach test for Mueller showing the bias of he and his team of
Democrats with clever, but deliberate omissions concerning vital background; but
Mueller had to give the Democrats something for the millions of dollars spent.
Mueller and his anti-Trump supporters have done more harm to our country than
Russia, China, N. Korea and terrorists combined; they have divided our country
and brought into disrepute the FBI and national intelligence agencies. The one
good by-product has been to show, again, the true colors of some of our vaunted
Now that the Mueller report is out, we know some things for certain: 1)
Russian meddling in our elections began during Obama's presidency.2)
Obama knew his National Security Advisor Susan Rice told her staff to "stand
down" when they wanted to strike back at Russians meddling. 3) Obama
allowed this because he was working on the nuclear arms deal with Iran and
didn't want anything to get in the way of that "victory" for his
administration. So let me get this straight: Obama knew about it
and still allowed it? And perhaps worse than that, the media covered it up
and/or downplayed it. Why is that? Those of us who voted for
President Trump don't approve of everything he does or says, but we do
appreciate that he will call out the hypocrisy and the downright evil intentions
of those in elected office and those in the media who will do anything to get
power. Because of him, we can see them for who they are. Again I
ask: why would the media cover up something that B.O. allowed, and then try to
impeach President Trump for it?
"They have the constitutional responsibility for oversight. However, if they
weaponize hearings for political purposes, that will distract the country from
more crucial conversations."I have to chuckle at Greg. Not once
did he bring up the Benghazi hearing as a political witch hunt. Here we have
the President who, so many recognize, did things that was were wrong. Even
Mueller implies that a congressional investigation is needed. However, Greg and
his fellow republicans evidently feel that unless Trump is guilty of criminal
acts, they are just fine with him.
It a Rorschach test only for those who haven't actually read the report.
For those who have, we call on the House and the Senate to remind themselves of
their oath of office, put aside any loyalty to one individual or party and be
loyal to the Constitution and the country, and remove him from office. He makes
Clinton look like a choir boy.
So, Sessions recused himself; but no one else did, including Mueller and other
DOJ people who had greater conflicts of interest than Sessions. More of the
dishonesty Romney condemns, yet did not in these cases.
Ironic that Trump did not collude but the dems want him for obstructing
something that didn’t occur. He should have just chilled and let the
investigation occur. Unfortunately, the entire investigation was created by the
DOJ and the FBI based on a fake Dossier paid for by the Clintons through the
DNC, not to mention the spying that occurred on the Trump campaign. The dems
need to stall this as long as possible to distract from the enevitable
investigation into the Steele dossier and the FISA warrant fiasco. Someone In
the DOJ or FBI is going to have to be a scapegoat.
Like many current and historic societies have done, the United States will
eventually elect leaders who will totally control our way of life and poverty
will prevail.History repeats itself and tells us this will
happen.The traditional American voter and culture is disappearing,
and will be as the governments our current refugees are fleeing.--
Great analogy. People see in the Mueller report exactly what they want to see.
If it were a report on Mr. Trump's ethical behavior it would be definitive,
but it was an investigation into criminal behavior. On that count it was a
failure. Let's change the subject and work on education, the environment,
the economy and foreign affairs.
Well, "keeping communities free from the stain of discord" is kind of an
empty goal. We could have avoided the civil war if no one criticized people
for owning slaves.There are things that can be done to prevent
discord, like telling the truth, following the law, and treating people with
respect, but there are times when discord is exactly the right thing to happen.
I am impressed with Ben McAdams. If we had more centrists and moderates in
Congress ;like McAdams I believe we would actually see our government making
progress on difficult problems.
"if House Democrats weaponize hearings for political purposes, that will
distract the country from more crucial conversations — debt and the
deficit, immigration and health care."Nice try. Republicans are
already distracted, or more accurately, do not care about:the debt
(rollover in your grave Mr. Reagan)immigration (makes a re-election sound
bite, but no plan)nor about health care (how many years has it been an
STILL no plan?)
Something happening upwards of 10 times is not isolated, it's not an oops.
In your opinion, what, 2 years and nothing, too bad, no collusion, no
obstruction, by the way Trump could have Fired Muller at any time for any
reason, it’s not obstruction people. Must be hard for you to eat the
“Russia may have failed in ultimately undermining the 2016 election, but
it succeeded in planting seeds of discord.”May have failed?!?!
The Russians have the president they wanted in the Oval Office! The discord is
in that the current president, his administration, and news outlets still use
terms like ‘may’ when we know that the Russians had their finger on
the scale to get the man they wanted into the White House.
Yes, prevent Russia from interfering again, but it seems like there's a
connection between the Trump Administration's refusal to do anything
meaningful about the Russian attacks on our system in the past 2 years, and the
massive efforts by Pres. Trump himself to get his supporters to lie about their
contacts with Russia and help him obstruct the invesigation, nicely detailed in
the Mueller Report.Based on the past 2 years, why does the Deseret
News have any confidence that the Trump Administration will do anything
different in the next 2 years?
A Rohrschach test is one that can be interpreted in different ways. But the
Mueller report contains many facts. As the DN article points out, it is a fact
that Russia tried to alter the election in Trump's favor. From the Mueller
report we learn that it is a fact that people in the Trump campaign actively
sought illegally obtained emails from the Clinton campaign. Another fact is
that Trump tried over and over again to obstruct the investigation and was only
saved by the fact that so many of his staff refused to do what he asked them
“I am also appalled that, among other things, fellow citizens working in a
campaign for president welcomed help from Russia — including information
that had been illegally obtained; that none of them acted to inform American law
enforcement; and that the campaign chairman was actively promoting Russian
interests in Ukraine.” Senator Romney
Nothing to see here, folks, so let’s move along.
@MOMS- If you are truly looking for "evidence that Russia compromised any
aspect of American democracy," then you should, you know, read the Mueller
“Mueller has been a hero to the left and potential villain to the right.
Now those perceptions have flipped, which means he probably got it
right.“It is true Mueller’s status has substantially
improved among Republicans. However, his respected status among Democrats
largely remains the same.It is curious to me that a potential POTUS
can be made personally aware of a foreign power interfering in an election on
our behalf, not report it to those in charge of national security, yet escape
being charged as an accessory to a crime. And what are we doing to
prevent interference again?
Leonidas, Are you working for Russia? Your conspiracy theories are not wanted
here. If ideas like yours are not considered "highly speculative" then I
don't know what is. Deep state shadow government answering to Obama?
This article suggests that trust in government has eroded because of Russia.
Who convinced Americans that Obama was an illigitimate president?
Who talks openly about the corruption of government leaders? Who doubted the
conclusions reached by the FBI? Who reassures Americans that our enemies are
not as bad as we think, but that our own government is worse than we think.?
Who talks constantly about the failure of American border security? Who
suggested NATO has no usefulness? Not Russia.
This analogy would only work if a Rorschach test involved convincing other
people to see certain things in the inkblot. Many people use
their description of the report to manipulate thoughts and actions rather than
to express their thoughts.
@Craig Clark: "Pelosi fears embarking on an impeachment attempt that fails.
She fears it would merely ralliy Trump supporters and strengthens his chances
for reelection in 2020. ... There is more at stake here than political
calculating if she fails to keep her own oath of office by ignoring the greater
moral imperative to defend the Constitution ...."Yeah, I think
we are on similar page.But the usual D.C. dynamic is knocked out of
kilter for the coming days, as politicians on both sides of the aisle digest the
substance of the report and look at the polling back in their states/districts.
Pelosi's prior reluctance about starting impeachment, and relative
silence in day or so may just be some prudence, and letting things shake out for
a bit before committing one way or other, post-Mueller report. I would not be
surprised if at least some -- sure, not many but some -- GOP Senators have been
in discussions behind the scenes re: the viability of an impeachment vote. If Trump's approval dives below 35% and stays there, I think
impeachment will proceed. But shame to see Pelosi playing the cynical rather
than patriotic hand in the meantime.
This article is way too rational for most. Great Job !!! Fact is both parties
stink of self service. I'm no great fan of Trump but obviously he managed
to upset their little sandbox and both sides are quite unhappy. Very funny stuff
"Russia clearly meddled in the 2016 elections and compromised aspects of
American democracy. “Judging by my Twitter feed, the #MuellerReport
is nothing more than a 400-page Rorschach test.”The quip has truth
to it."________________________________Outrageous.First, there is absolutely no evidence that Russia compromised any
aspect of American democracy. If the News has that evidence, it should provide
it.More importantly, no legitimate news organization should minimize
the Mueller report’s clear finding that there was no collusion,
coordination, or conspiracy with Russia. After two years of baseless
allegations, the report is not a Rorschach test, it is a final judgement on one
of the most serious charges ever leveled against a President. Do
T$$$,Care to cite that in the report? 1 - dirty politics
- what was the origin of this whole dossier? I agree with you, however your
myopic view misses that Clinton and Obama seem to have done far worse and used
deep state bad actors. So you are right but don't score a point. 2 - trump also asked Obama to stop the meddling - I guess we'll see soon
if he wants this to continue. Obama allowed this. By the way, where is this in
the report. 3 - that's a huge stretch. Contrast that to Adam
schiff and others who outright lied and continue to do so. 3.2 -
conspiracy theory much? Pretty sure you didn't read the report.
You cite as if you did to gain credibility but have arguments where at best you
accuse others of lesser things than those you seem to support. Sorry, not compelling at all.
The report shouldn't be a Rorschach at all for those who read through it.
Frankly Mueller's work made things plain and clear (most of which reputable
news outlets have been saying for a while) with a variety of corroborated
evidence. 1) Russia was working with bad actors to have Clinton
loose and undermine the democratic process. 2) The Trump campaign
and Trump himself welcomed Russian interference - and at times even encouraged
it on camera. 3) Trump's press secretaries outright lied to the
press about the investigation multiple times.3) Trump directed his
inner-circle to stop the investigation, but most of his advisers didn't
To the above -only in part did they sow the seeds of discord. This is not how
Russia wins, it is from within, just as Nikita Kruschev said, 'little by
little, without a shot they won't even notice they are socialist
(communist).' By way of weaponizing first the IRS, then the DOJ, the
FBI, the FISA court, CIA, NSA, etc. co-opting parties to try to take down a fair
and legally elected President because they 1) don't like him 2) they are
globalists and he isn't 3) they want open borders and he wants sovereignty
4) most of America agrees with him! The rest of the story is yet to be exposed
to the public eye. Those who have worn blinders will be aghast at what
'they' have been doing to our rule of law and Constitution. Shameful
so many commenting here are unaware of the true underlying investigation of the
corruption. The IG report should shock you all to the core.
@Jane B: "We are witnessing nothing less than the moral collapse of the
republican party."I couldn't agree w/you more Jane, &
that includes our illustrious Utah delegation in US Congress who've been
happy to ignore the corruption of Trump & his admin., to ignore the truth,
& are even now attempting to sweep this report under the rug. They seem to
think we're all too dumb to understand the obvious import of Muller's
arguments & damming statements. I for one, am not.It also
includes conservative newspapers & media outlets who seek to ignore or
whitewash the lies, obfuscations, & immoral & unethical behavior that
has been revealed in this report, regardless of whether it meets criminal
behavior "beyond a shadow of a doubt". I agree w/commenters
who mock the idea that attempts at obstruction don't matter, simply because
people around Trump thwarted his efforts. Because, you know, DA's never
charge anyone with "attempted murder". This is what our
country has come to--where the only qualification that a leader can claim is
that no "crime" can be "proved" against him.Trump
refused to testify because his lawyers were afraid he would lie under oath,
& he couldn't "recall" a lot.
Mueller did an impeccable job? Give me a break! Just shy of two freakin'
years to troll & trawl thru anything he could find, while last year Congress
exonerated Trump on any collusion with Russia in the elections, and then Mueller
and others say Trump attempted 'obstruction of justice'? What justice?
If there was no collusion, there was no crime. If there was no crime, even if
Trump had stopped the investigation (which he didn't), what
'justice' would be obstructed?The 'justice' that
needs NOW to be pursued was the Spygate of the US Government colluding with
Hillary's campaign & the Democratic Party to try to overturn the
legitimate election of Trump; the lying to the FISA court on
'evidence' (the dossier Mr Steele, a foreigner, put together that was
paid for by #NeverTrump Republicans, then Hillary & the DNC & the FBI
which was all full of speculation & lies about Trump). This makes Watergate
look timid.Now, the Justice Dept, FBI, DNC, Hillary's campaign,
& their operatives for this attempted coup of Trump, as well as the dirt
screen thrown up to distract attention away from Democrats. A Dem Congress
further investigating Trump? C'mon, DN editors. are you part of the DNC
Daedalus, Stephen" . . . . Pelosi is purposefully demurring starting
impeachment, using the lack of GOP support in the Senate as a convenient excuse
for abdicating her sworn duty to put America's interest ahead of short-term
political gain or potential downside risks. Not a good look for her or the
Democrats, giving the overwhelming evidence of obstruction contained in the
Mueller report."____________________Pelosi fears embarking on an
impeachment attempt that fails. She fears it would merely ralliy Trump
supporters and strengthens his chances for reelection in 2020. Better to keep
Trump embattled and hamper his agenda for the next year and a half.I
understand that view. Pelosi is shrewd and tough but her stance on this is
entirely political. There is more at stake here than political calculating if
she fails to keep her own oath of office by ignoring the greater moral
imperative to defend the Constitution against a President who is without morals,
ethics, or regard for law.
Impeachment at this point, without a large sized smoking gun would be useless
and cause more harm than good. Without the possibility of a 2/3 vote in the
Senate to remove, the action by the House would mean nothing. Did we learn
nothing from the Republican mess with Clinton?
@Craig Clark: "Nancy Pelosi’s tepid frame of mind on impeachment is a
political roadblock that could prove to be catastrophic."Cynicism is driving Pelosi's tepidness. Reading through the
Mueller report, especially Vol. II, makes clear that impeachment is wholly
warranted, and what America needs.Not surprisingly, few if any
Republican politicians have signed-on to that yet. But I think Pelosi is
purposefully demurring starting impeachment, using the lack of GOP support in
the Senate as a convenient excuse for abdicating her sworn duty to put
America's interest ahead of short-term political gain or potential downside
risks. Not a good look for her or the Democrats, giving the overwhelming
evidence of obstruction contained in the Mueller report.
Russia meddling in the election was designed to damage American democracy, help
Donald Trump and hurt Hillary Clinton. Putin's hatred for Hillary is
well known. His desire to expose weaknesses in America is as well. With Trump
he succeeded beyond his wildest dreams.Trump has done much damage
from within. His war on science, facts, the environment, traditions and norms,
due governmental process--aided and abetted by a political party that's
done almost nothing to curb him--shows how lucky Putin was.Part one
of the Mueller report details the meddling, part two shows the results.
There's nothing Rorschach about it.
If this moment doesn’t bring Republicans and Democrats together in a
common cause to root out the insidious culture of lawlessness Trump leads, then
America is at a critical crossroads for the future. Nancy Pelosi’s tepid
frame of mind on impeachment is a political roadblock that could prove to be
catastrophic. President Mike Pence is the less than ideal solution that both
sides may soon be forced to consider whether they like the idea or not.
"Mueller deserves recognition for performing impeccable work"Fusion GPSI can't wait until a real investigation exposes the
details of this attempted coup. "Insurance policy," indeed.
No collusion, no obstruction!' Oh wait. Mueller notes ten
instances where Trump asked those under him to commit crimes by interfering with
the investigation- those under him were just smart enough to say no so the
crimes didn't happen- not from Trump's morals, but theirs. So 'no
collusion, TEN obstruction'. There you go.So if you ask someone
to commit a crime and they don't do it, then you did nothing wrong
according to trump loyalists?So when somebody starts asking around
for someone to eliminate their ex or wife or someone, and someone mentions it to
police isn't that a crime, or because nobody actually did it, no harm no
The Mueller report is no Rorschach test. It's conclusion is clear and
alarming. Russia did meddle in the U.S. Presidential election with help from the
inside and it was a 100% success with conspirators who have yet to be brought to
justice. That's my take on the Mueller report.
Russian meddling. Horror of horrors. How can such a thing be?In
early September 2016, Obama told Putin to "cut it out." And that was
that.Until December of 2016 when he was expelling diplomats from
Washington.What changed in three months? Russian meddling became the
reason Hillary lost. That's all.Russia has been meddling ever
since there was a Russia. They tried to influence our elections during the
Depression. You could even make a case that FDR was elected because Russia had
motivated American union members (and wannabees) to pick FDR over Hoover.The Wobblies had to create a campaign that they were going to purge the
unions of communists. And it's not just the Russians. Even the
Brits try to meddle in our elections for their own purposes. And China. And
Mexico. And every other country that has any resources.We do the
same thing around the world. We give it a fancy name -Regime change - but it is
really just trying to put our guy in power.In a way, the hubbub
about meddling is hilarious.
Headline: "Mueller report looks more like a Rorschach test"No, it looks more like a Hieronymus Bosch triptych.Yes, it is
important for Americans to learn that Russian efforts to sway the 2016 election
were as "sweeping and systematic" as Mueller report finds. And it is
important that America take steps to prevent that from happening again.But that is an obvious point. If THAT is your only take-away from
a such a tableau of malfeasance and the abberation, it goes to show how much of
Trump's behavior has been normalized.
The report totally exonerates me. Trump... not so much.
I, for one, have been wading through two years of indictments for the 'big
picture' that puts the collusion puzzle together. For example, why did
George Papadopoulos (Trump campaign) confess before a judge about lying to the
FBI concerning his July 2016 meeting with Joseph Mifsud, 'The
Professor' with Kremlin ties, about the Russians hacking “dirt”
on Hillary Clinton? The Mueller investigation was supposed to connect the dots
between this puzzle piece, and the Trump Tower meeting piece, and Roger
Stone's Wikileaks connection piece, etc., etc., etc. Is it really all just
a big 'nothing burger'? I seriously doubt it. That's why I'm
not ready to 'move on'. I'm still as confused and frustrated
'as all get out' about learning the truth.
Russia's purpose was to delegitimize the elected president. Who is aiding
I bet Putin is in a state of uncontrollable laughter. The Russians accomplished
exactly what they set out to do. They have pitted Americans against Americans.
And this was all done when Barack Obama was President.
" For the rest of the country, keeping communities free from the stain of
discord would be a proper outlet for their frustration."So I
take it you mean the stain of contention is our main concern. On the contrary I
assert our main concern should be the nature of Trump and his movement, which is
a new instance of fascism, and as such poses a grave danger to constitutional
We have a bigger problem than Russia's successful interference in our
election: the unrestrained and saturating malfeasance in the White House. The
Mueller report is stunning, (though not surprising, knowing Trump.)We are witnessing nothing less than the moral collapse of the republican
party. The GOP voted for the impeachment of Bill Clinton for far less egregious
conduct. Time for GOP congress to find their consciences, and turn
the ship around. No more Trump.
I have read only snippets of the report. I am going to read the whole thing.
But at this juncture it appears clear Trump and his campaign were
eager to get Russia's help in the election. Does this concern you? It
appears it doesn't and that amazes me.
Headline: "Mueller report looks more like a Rorschach test."About as much as the Mona Lisa does.The report now speaks for
itself.Reading anything more or less into the report than the
unethical and abberant behavior it describes suggests the reader has normalized
and personally adopted Trump's values as their own.
No collusion, no obstruction!' Oh wait. Mueller notes ten instances
where Trump asked those under him to commit crimes by interfering with the
investigation- those under him were just smart enough to say no so the crimes
didn't happen- not from Trump's morals, but theirs. So 'no
collusion, TEN obstruction'. There you go.Like the collusion,
it wasn't from lack of trying, but his ineptitude.Not sure how
people can defend him. This is like a person asked someone to murder
another person and they said no, so no harm no fowl...this time. And
this is what passes for a republican president?Barr refuses to
answer whether he shared info with the White House before it's release.One thing the report shows is just how prolific a liar and how
comfortable the white house is with lying to the people. You see Sarah repeat a
lie over and over, and then when asked under oath she finally tells the truth,
but only under threat of an actual penalty.The presidents answers or
lack of answers was useless as he didn't recall over 36 times, this
wasn't under pressure in front of an audience like Reagan or Clinton, but
we all know it was just Rudy writing the responses.
It isn't solely Russia that is dividing this country, it is leftist
ideology originating in our universities, media and Hollywood that has been
dividing this country for the last 100 years and has now been stripped of
it's it veneer for all informed to see in it's stark reality. It has
taken Trump and his bold style of confrontation to the deep state to reveal
that the main stream media is just a tool of the Democrat party.