@FelisConcolor - Layton, UTWhat does Korvers Salary have anything to
do with anything ? The Nobel prize winner gets a million dollars, so now that he
has a million dollars his knowledge and credit goes out the door ?Money buys experience people with money are able to experience things you can
only dream about so for a guy like Korver he able to Travel the country world
and see and do thing you cant afford too. I would say this give him a little
more in site than the average Utahan
There is some really good discussion here...and some not so good. Overall I
think Kyle is trying to say we just need to truly "do unto others as you
would have done unto you" (The Golden Rule). We are not perfect and we all
can do better. I am troubled by the Westbrook incident. Was there
conclusive evidence that the fan's comments were racist or was it a "he
said...he said?" If there was, then I wholeheartedly support the Jazz
management's decision. We all have been on both the giving and receiving
end of comments that were basically "what you heard is not what I
said/meant." That usually happens when the receiving party is looking for
offense (even subconsciously). When that happens, things can escalate
quickly.I took a communication class that showed even in the best of
circumstances there is about a 50% chance that verbal communication will be
misunderstood.Remember...We are not perfect and we all can do
@UteologyRegarding your comment:"Research disagrees. Hate group count hits 20-year high amid rise in white supremacy, report
says."That report does not prove racism is valid in every single
accusation. The Smollett case is an example, Michael Brown (aggressive
criminal) is another. I already indicated that I believe racism exists, and
will add it is repugnant when it occurs, however, it is not equal to the
perception we are led to believe by the media and the numbers that Kyle
suggests. It is far more complicated than that. That is why I refer to it as
Does racism exist? Yes. Does it define the individual or a group though? It
shouldn't, but it does. Let me preface it this way. I am LDS and I
served a 2 year mission in LA. Walking down the street with my companion I was
called everything from "Fed" and "Pig" to "Encyclopedia
Salesman". Why? Because I was white. Was I asked if I was any of those
things? No I was not. Did I hold it against a group of people because of their
ignorance? No because that is just plain stupid.This is why the
"white privilege" or "black privilege" argument does not hold
water with me. I think that anymore this "privilege " argument is
just another tool to sow anger and hate amongst the masses.My question is
when is personal responsibility going to be looked at and scrutinized? Instead
of the actions of a person who may look like me or you and it be blamed on
"privilege" based on skin color.
@ Squirtle - April 9, 2019 8:31 a.mAnd of what political party were
the ones that wanted to keep & segregate those former slaves? ... be
honest!Was it England that established slavery in the colonies?One of the first slave owners in The American colonies was Anthony
Johnson, who was Angolan (African) & he owned black & white slaves.To help you with the first question, search history for
‘Dixiecrat’. But please do it while sitting down, I will not be
responsible for any injuries you may have when your knees give out from shock.
@CooldudeIf you're really interested in learning if "white
privilege" exists, maybe you should see what Korver is talking about, get to
know some people in the African American community, and ask about their
experiences, see for yourself if they're just making things up.I'm from Utah, before I got married to a AA woman, I thought slavery
ended in 1865, I certainly wasn't prejudiced and there really wasn't
any more excuses. I wouldn't have believed it if I didn't see what my
own family members, what my kids go through. It's not imaginary.I sense that you want to just call it good and declare these problems as
non-existent... which is your *privilege*. Nice tidy way to avoid the topic.
Just live your life, you don't have anything to worry about.If
you were on the other side of the equation, you wouldn't be able to declare
your own experiences as not happening. That's what Korver is talking
@toosmartforyou"BLM makes the issue worse."BLM is
merely asserting that because1. all lives should matter but 2.
that is not how things currently arethey are giving a voice to
challenge the racial disparities that currently exist with a demand that black
lives (should) matter (too).
"While there will be a significant number of Jazz fans who harbor views
like, "I don't want to be lectured to by a spoiled NBA athlete," we
all know what hides behind those kinds of sentiments."Please
explain to us under what warped moral principle does a multimillionaire get to
lecture ANYONE about privilege?Kyle Korver's annual salary is
approximately 122 times greater than the US median household income ($7.5
million vs. $62,000). He makes more money in a single game than the average
Utahn makes in a single year. Moreover, he makes all that money by playing a
kid's game, not by producing a tangible product or providing a necessary
service.He is the walking, talking embodiment of privilege; the very
definition of the "One Percent". A man who has never known poverty or
want during his entire adult life.For him to tell any person of any
race that they are somehow undeserving of the fruits of their labor is both
ridiculous and disgusting.
Now that Kyle Korver has addressed the important issue of white privilege, he
can tackle some other important issues such as nice-smile and handsome-guy
privilege, tall-guy privilege, good-health privilege, two-good-parents
privilege, well-educated privilege, millionaire privilege along with big topics
such minority-victim privilege. Perhaps affirmative action or reparations could
be set up to even the playing field here.
Another example of how racism does not exist in our society today:YouTube was forced to disable comments on a livestream of a House Judiciary
hearing on hate crimes and white nationalism on social media Tuesday morning
after it was flooded with racist and anti-Semitic comments.
Brave Sir Robin - San Diego, CAApril 9, 2019 10:17 a.m.Jazz fans
have a real opportunity to make things right after the Russell Westbrook
incident, and Korver gave you the perfect forum to do it. But from reading the
comments here, I think the chances of that happening are extremely low.--------------Racism isn't the problem for these "Utah
County" Jazz fans, it's reverse racism. SAD!
@AZJazzFanThere is a knee-jerk response of anything that can possibly be
racist is racist. A knee-jerk response to victimization and not taking
responsibility. Racism does exist in our society.-------------Research disagrees. Hate group count hits 20-year high amid
rise in white supremacy, report says.Then again conservatives also
think climate science research is a hoax by China.
Who is the judge that determines when White American privilege has finally come
to an end? Who is the judge that determines when the end of White
American privilege has become the beginning of African American privilege?Is there really such as thing as White American privilege or African
American privilege? We just need to drop the rhetoric, drop the
hype, quit being bleeding hearts and just live in peace. The whole race issue
is a creation of those who have nothing of substance to take up their time.
Why would I be surprised if suddenly everyone was just an "American?" I
guess that's too simple....making everyone equal regardless of the color of
their skin. (Sigh) Our society should be so lucky but we must quit pointing
fingers at each other and even be willing to overlook offense, as well as not
purposely offending others, too. Good luck---we have a ways to go.
Fallacy of composition: Inferring that something is true of the whole from the
fact that it is true of some part of the whole. This is the opposite of the
fallacy of division.Fallacy of division: Inferring that something is
true of one or more of the parts from the fact that it is true of the whole.
This is the opposite of the fallacy of composition.The constant
refrain of "racism," especially "systemic racism" undermines
those who consider themselves "victims." Once one considers oneself a
victim, and assumes their road is "harder," they also take on a form of
hopelessness that robs them of the will necessary to succeed. They focus on
obstacles rather than opportunities, barriers instead of solutions.The combined annual earnings of MLB, NBA, NFL is $12.5 billion. That
doesn't include endoresements. If athletes want to provide opportunities
for minorities, invest in minorities.
Jazz fans have a real opportunity to make things right after the Russell
Westbrook incident, and Korver gave you the perfect forum to do it. But from
reading the comments here, I think the chances of that happening are extremely
@Mind Baggage - About "black privilege" in the NBA. There
are different styles of basketball, and unquestionably the European style has
helped land some of those players in the NBA. When I played basketball, there
was no "Euro-step".The best players in Europe sometimes have
an advantage that American players - white and black - have not had, by learning
a style that has found success in the NBA, where the bottom line is winning
& losing, by whatever means required.Utah Jazz fans have come to
accept and enjoy the international makeup of the Jazz: USA, France, Australia,
Africa, Spain, Brazil, Sweden... wherever the best available players are from.
(This doesn't mean Jazz fans are anti-American.)Many near-NBA
college players go to Europe, some of them make it back to play in the US.
Sometimes those players are white Americans, who beat out African Americans, who
may go to Europe to work more on their game, learn the Euro style, etc.It's hard to mask a lack of talent in the NBA. Conversely, where players
are from or what their ethnic background happens to be, is irrelevant.
I've lived in the South and witnessed "racism" rear its ugly head.
I recall when the Utah Stars came to SLC and Zelmo Beatty wasn't allowed to
live in the neighborhood where he wanted. His salary was a whopping $25K a year.
The NBA and NFL are anything but "white privileged" institutions.One of the big problems in when anything occurs that out of circumstance
involves two persons of different race, "racism" is screamed long and
loudly by the press and by the attorneys. As a result, that term has really
lost its significance, potency and meaning, which is sad. It's like the
little boy who always cried "wolf" and when one appeared no one would
believe him. Pres Obama was a master at that strategy, unfortunately. The
sting of racism only goes one way, however. Labron James had a difficult time
growing up, yet do you feel he is subjected to "white privilege" today?
BLM makes the issue worse. Why are we always "African Americans and
whites" instead of "Black Americans and White Americans", or
"European Americans and African Americans"? Hollywood and the media are
one-way streets. If there can only be two people in an advertisement, one must
be black, one must be a woman.
Kyle, I have great respect for you as a ball player and more importantly as an
individual, but I think in some ways you have missed the mark here. You say we
are not "guilty" of the sins of our forefathers, but you believe we are
"responsible" for them. Absolutely and unequivocally not. If your great
grandfather was a serial killer or serial rapist or whatever, should you be
"responsible" for his actions? You certainly would not be; nor would it
be fair for anyone to assert otherwise.
In all honesty--I have already forgotten the name of the man who was banned from
Jazz games for life. But I won't ever forget this act by Kyle Korver, or
his sweet jumper. While there will be a significant number of Jazz fans who
harbor views like, "I don't want to be lectured to by a spoiled NBA
athlete," we all know what hides behind those kinds of sentiments. Like that
banned fan--they will fade into obscurity holding on to sad and impotent
memories of the days when they thought their bigotry was earned or appreciated.
Kyle Korver is a grown man and a leader and I thank him for this.
This gives me hope that one day we Jazz fans will be worthy of the team the
Millers have given us.
Two points to this whole fiasco that stood out to me:1) The
fan's comment toward Russell Westbrook was a gay slur. The fan was trying
to get him riled. He doesn't think Westbrook is gay. If he did, he
wouldn't have said it. This was at worst, a bad case of gamesmanship. Not a
major salvo in some perceived war of the races.2) Left to
Korver's natural conclusion about white privilege and race-- isn't the
NBA a proponent of black privilege? Or at least the basketball universe in the
USA seems to be that way. The game is played in a way to negatively affect white
ball players. Perhaps I am being too sensitive about the fact that lots of
white talent here in the States is disregarded. Kind of a "White men
can't jump" attitude that permeates coaches of all races, teammates,
etc. Blacks no doubt enjoy a privilege in this sphere similar to how whites
enjoy privilege in larger society. How do I know? The fact that the majority of
white NBA players are from outside the USA. Without a predominately black
influence in Europe, whites seem to be able to better develop as players. Where
here in the states they are beaten down in high school never to go further.
Korver did a really good job of explaining "white privilege" - he can
choose to help teammates in dealing with what they encounter... but for him
it's entirely an option.In an interracial marriage with 4 kids,
I know what Korver means, and what he's seen. For example, I had a
coworker tell me racist jokes... before he knew who my family is. I've had
my sons pulled over by the police, for tiny traffic infractions I don't
even think about, like going 3 miles over the limit. My wife was stopped by the
police while driving home from church... they were looking for a shoplifter.I can make self-deprecating jokes to strangers, without worrying it will
mushroom into a time consuming "incident".It's
definitely not all the time, and Utah is generally better than other places, but
white privilege in the US exists. It just does. I usually don't even
think about it, unless one of my family or friends has to deal with something
I've never given a second thought to.
@RRB - SLC, UTApril 8, 2019 8:36 p.m."Frozen FractalsI've heard whites called those names also. During slavery
whites lost their jobs to slaves. Many whites were just as poor in the south,
and unlike slaves, many had no housing or food provided to them."Are you kidding! A race of people were violently kidnapped, taken accross the
ocean in the hold of a ship with no warmth, food or enough water, living in
their own feces, and forced to be a slave. they were property, not people.
they were bred like cattle. they were beaten and raped; had their children
taken from their arms and had absolutely no rights.Once freed, they
were given so little opportunity, that many remained share croppers, in essence
still slaves, just to stay alive. They couldn't attend the same schools,
ride the same bus, use the same businesses. I can assure you that nothing was
"provided" for these former slaves. And if you think this
is ancient history, most of this didn't change until the 70's and
Although I do not disagree that racism exists in our country, I do disagree when
people insinuate that it's the white person's problem and that all
white people are racist. This will NOT be a popular opinion, but I am here to
tell you that racism is a two-way street. We ALL have to look at ourselves and
do better. I have absolutely nothing against any person of color...and I know
many. There are good people and not so good on both sides of this issue. I
refuse - as a white person - to take the brunt of the responsibility for racism.
I am, however, accountable for my own actions; as we all are.
@Uteology - East Salt Lake City, UtahApril 8, 2019 11:06 p.m."If you listen the right reverse racism is the bigger problem. The study, “Healing our Divided Society: Investing in America Fifty
Years After the Kerner Report” by the Milton Eisenhower Foundation,
disagrees with the conservative movement.It says, "We made
progress on virtually every aspect of race and poverty for nearly a decade after
the Kerner Report and then that progress slowed, then stopped and in many ways
was reversed, so that today racial and ethnic discrimination is again
worsening.""---------------I know the world must
be off its axis, but for the first (and probably only time) I agree completely
with something Uteology has written. It was well thought out, researched, and
sounds sane, actually. We are going backwords in the way we treat our fellow
man as a society, with too many pointing a finger at others and crying that
things aren't (or are) equal and its somebody elses responsibility
"cause i'm just fine." Korver took an outward facing approach and
stated that its all of our responsibilities to treat people with fairness and
@AZJazzFan - Gold Canyon, azApril 9, 2019 1:28 a.m."Racism
does exist in our society, however, I believe if we had the technology to look
into the hearts and minds of people there is far less racism than the perception
we are led to believe."If only that were true. I strongly
believe that there is more bigotry, purposeful or ignorantly, in peoples'
hearts and minds and they simply do not speak or act out on what they feel. In
the past two years hate crime is up two fold in the US and we all know that
people feel increased freedom to degrade and demean at will. I believe this is
because many are following the example of our President and freely stating and
acting out on what is really in their hearts and minds.As a life
long member of the church for over 50 years, but having only lived in Utah while
attending BYU, I am always shocked at the lack of empathy and compassion coming
from some who claim to be Christian. King Benjamin taught charity and that it
was wrong to judge whether they may have brought their situation on themselves.
If we are talking reparations for anyone whose ancestors were slaves, then maybe
we should consider reparations, also, for those descendants of slave owners who
were deprived, without compensation, of property they owned and paid for. . .
Irrational attempts to correct injustices that occurred a couple of centuries
ago is just harmful to everyone current living. Stop living in the past and
look forward.Let us remember the wrongs that occurred in the past,
without becoming captive to them. Wiping out history does no one any good;
neither does any feeble attempt to redress wrongs by throwing tax dollars at
people who were not specifically injured - whether descendants of slaves or
I served my mission in Kentucky. Utah is not racist. If you want to see
racism, go to the south.Also, many of the points Kyle brings up are
not wrong, though they may appear, at face value, to be that way. Each
individual case would need to be looked at to see if it was right or wrong.
There are just too many successful minority peole out there (and I'm not
talking about athletes) to say minorities are being held down. If you have the
ambition you can make it. Ben Carson is a good example. There are choices in
life; it's no one else's fault if you make the wrong ones.
I would suggest that Korver sees the issue from a very unusual perspective as an
NBA player, associating closely with, primarily, millionaires. I wonder if he
would feel the same if he were a convenience store worker in inner Baltimore?
His perspective is unquestionably skewed by his micro-universe. I am not saying
Korver is wrong, but his view is shaped by his circumstances. Other folks view
are undoubtedly shaped by theirs, which will certainly be different and likely
not be very similar to his.
This is a well reasoned piece that challenges us all to become better allies for
those among the "others" in our society. As for these comments,
once again those who stop by the Dessert News along with their otherwise
exclusive media consumption at Fox News and Infowars reveal themselves by their
bizzare and tortured views.
"The fact that black Americans are more than five times as likely to be
incarcerated as white Americans is wrong. The fact that black Americans are more
than twice as likely to live in poverty as white Americans is wrong. The fact
that black unemployment rates nationally are double that of overall unemployment
rates is wrong. The fact that black imprisonment rates for drug charges are
almost six times higher nationally than white imprisonment rates for drug
charges is wrong. The fact that black Americans own approximately one-tenth of
the wealth that white Americans own is wrong.""The NBA is
over 75% of people of color" . . . . based on that logic, that is wrong
also. Apparently, if we are all equal than the ratio should be exact to the
ratio of the demographic. There is a knee-jerk response of anything
that can possibly be racist is racist. A knee-jerk response to victimization
and not taking responsibility. Racism does exist in our society, however, I
believe if we had the technology to look into the hearts and minds of people
there is far less racism than the perception we are led to believe.
Donovan Mitchell seems genuinely interested in putting down roots here, unlike
the last savior. Judging by a lot of comments here, too many local
“fans” don’t really care to make it worth his while. It
won’t be his loss.
If you listen the right reverse racism is the bigger problem. The
study, “Healing our Divided Society: Investing in America Fifty Years
After the Kerner Report” by the Milton Eisenhower Foundation, disagrees
with the conservative movement.It says, "We made progress on
virtually every aspect of race and poverty for nearly a decade after the Kerner
Report and then that progress slowed, then stopped and in many ways was
reversed, so that today racial and ethnic discrimination is again
Racism is just another word for prejudice, and we have all felt that at some
time in our lives. There is only one solution, and that is to raise your own
standards of performance through better education, working harder, being more
responsible, and most of all by being more charitable and kind to every one else
you come in contact with. Confrontation, name calling, finding reasons to
justify hate, or blaming others for your own failures will never make things
right. And being rich, no matter what race or ethnicity you belong to does not
make you better than anyone else.
Frozen FractalsI've heard whites called those names also. During slavery whites lost their jobs to slaves. Many whites were just
as poor in the south, and unlike slaves, many had no housing or food provided to
them."We call things racism just to get attention. We reduce
complicated problems to racism, not because it is racism, but because it
works." --- Alfredo Gutierrez, political consultant, as quoted by
Richard de Uriarte, The Phoenix Gazette, March 14, 1992
Great article. Spot on Kyle, and thank you. I fully support you and the Jazz
organization. Well done.
I don’t think people in this community have the right to say how
minority’s should feel. If you have never faced or have been exposed to
racism then can’t have any empathy for what they have gone through.
Reading these comments I see a comment thread and viewpoint that also manifested
on a previous article about blackface. I think if people spent some time reading
and learning about the history of racism in America they would have a different
view. And I don't mean slavery or the civil rights movements. For instance,
there are some great essays and videos that go into detail on blackface, its
history and application and so on. After I spent some time studying this I came
away with a very different perspective. I think one area where we don't
have to worry about becoming too politically correct is racism. It still exists
and we as good citizens need to fight everyday to prevent it from raising its
Loved the article! Having been born and raised in Utah and subsequently living
all my adult life between S America and the southern US, Kyle articulated many
of the emotions and thoughts I too have had in sharing and comparing my
experiences with those of my friends of color. This article and viewpoint was
VERY much appreciated by this Jazz fan who became an even bigger Kyle Korver fan
@RRB"Lots of poor whites have no idea what white privilege is."There's several types of privilege. Wealth is one of them. Race is
another. Even poor white people have some advantages over poor black people from
things as fundamental as how people view them and their situations (lazy?
moochers? welfare queens?).@Sportsfan123"At that point I
was hating on them for their behaviour, but what if they were of a minority
group, would that make me a racist?"You'd be consistent.
But the thing about white privilege is that it is mentioned because it does
exist. One of those two groups in your hypothetical is much more likely than the
other to get the cops called on them, not by you, but by people on average.
Several people here are mentioning racism directed from minorities at white
people, but there's a disconnect here, which comes from people having two
different definitions of racism. A common one is to treat racism and
prejudice as the same thing, with racism just being a category of prejudice, and
can be pointed in any direction. The other one treats them as
different. Prejudice being something anyone can be doing pointed in any
direction, and racial prejudice being the race based version that people of any
race might have. But racism itself with this definition refers to systemic
biases in society that point from those with more power to those without and in
the US that only comes from white people.
@water rocket" Is he trying to ingratiate himself to the black
community by criticizing the white race?"He's been in the
NBA over 15 years, and has been quite popular across the teams he's been
with in his career; he doesn't need to do anything for that. The only thing
he's doing here is acknowledging reality that many white people ignore,
that there are still disparities that linger in society that haven't been
fully healed. Disproportionate sentencing for the same crime, disproportionately
low rates of being called for an interview if your name sounds like you're
probably black, we have lots of underlying biases that still shift things so
that black and white people still aren't treated the same.
Kudos to Korver for his personal commitment to changing his behavior. And
that's where this story should end. Celebs and sports stars have no more
credibility in their opinions than do your neighbor or the greeter at Wal-Mart.
I'm not a Jazz fan and couldn't pick Korver out of a lineup--unless it
was on the basketball court and then my odds would have improved. The cynic in
me is thinking that had Jimmer taken the same approach he might have had a
better start in the NBA. But then, after seeing him stink it up for the Suns
it's pretty clear it wouldn't have mattered if he wrote 100 essays on
white privilege. It is pretty funny when those bagging on white republican
Mormons in Utah can keep a straight face about the perils of generalizing
behavior. I guess we all look alike to those ain't like us?
I dont necessarily disagree with Korvers statementsWhat I do
disagree with is buying into the new highly politicised term "white
privilege" which I find racist and serves to give reason to hate white
people.Like what others have stated, treat others how you want to be
treated, most often it is the behavior of others that stokes the fire of hate,
and it doesn't have to be because of skin color. For example :A
group a white folk pulled into a parking lot where I used to work. These folks
get out of their car sit on the grass near the curb and proceed to eat their
fast food, when they are done they left all of their trash on the ground and
took off. At that point I was hating on them for their behaviour, but what if
they were of a minority group, would that make me a racist?Or better
yet try serving a 2 year LDS mission on the west and south side of chicago, a
white man walking in gang infested neighborhood's you can only imagine the
racial slure's I recieved and there were plenty.Point is, it
goes both ways and to point a finger at one race as the problem relinquishes the
reaponsibility of other groups to do the same, wich is to treat others how they
want to be treated.
Individuals are racist, entire races are not. Lots of poor whites
have no idea what white privilege is.
It’s important to not categorize demographics or groups as victims. It
creates an entitlement among the groups because they perceive oppression when
none may exist. It’s also very disparaging because it implies that
demographics and groups aren’t capable so they need special help,
protection, rules, policies just to give them an equal chance. Many of the
African Americans that have saluted Korver have achieved the pinnacle of their
craft and are being paid millions of dollars to play a game, rep a brand or make
remarks on social media. LeBron and Donovan didn’t need any special law,
protection, attention, help, to achieve greatness. I applaud them for that. I
don’t think any African American needs “special” help or
protection or rules and laws to make them as capable as whites, Asians or any
other race. They are all perfectly capable as they have shown in every area of
our society. Sports, politics, entertainment, medical field etc. Instead of
looking for victims and grievances let’s celebrate the incredible,
inspiring contributions to this world by every gender, race, religion and or
@water rocketYou totally missed the point, try reading Korver's
"Kyle, don't make this more complicated than it is. Treat others as you
would like them to treat you. I do this and it as good as it gets for
me."You're missing the whole point, that's not good
enough.I firmly believe that Utah is not a racist community. But at
the same time, our culture here often allows for the fringe believers to be
racist without much of any repercussions. There are little ways that people
treat each other unequally (he had some great examples in the article), but we
don't call each other out on it.
If one carefully examines the world you will find racism in all races. We tend
to only see that racism in caucasins in the USA and ignore it in other races.
If we would love each other, universally, these problems would soon disappear.
Most people recognize that we previously had a President that set race relations
back possibly a half century. The solution is not to put one race above others;
but to make all men & women equal!
Kyle, don't make this more complicated than it is. Treat others as you
would like them to treat you. I do this and it as good as it gets for me.
The problem with Kyle article and others is they look only on one side of the
ledger.There is racism in this country, but it seems to be only focused on
racism coming from the whites. There has been several articles on how blacks
attacked a white person, but the word racism came up. If that had been two white
men attacking a black, you bet, you would here the word racism. Both sides are
racist, some on both sides are taught that from their youth. What bothers
me about this whole issue is that people will use the racist card at the drop of
a hat, when real racism is being ignored. Korver's right, a black is 5
times more likely to go to jail than a white. That is a problem in the
judiciary, not law enforcement. White are more likely to get arrested than a
black according to the FBI statistics.What bothers me about
Westbrook, is that he is known to provoke people, I have yet seen any video of
the full interaction between the fan and Westbrook. In this day and age of
phones. I find that interesting.
@joe5 Of course individual experiences differ but collectively, at a
societal level (not an individual one) factors like race, region, etc. play a
huge role in our cultural understanding. This is why intersectionality is so
vital. Being white of course does not make you a de facto racist
anymore than being republican or LDS does, BUT in the context of a strong
monolithic culture (such as found in Utah) you further the risk of fostering
ideological echo chambers where individuals surround themselves exclusively with
those who have mirroring points of view (Mormons only living around and
associating with other Mormons, republicans curating their news-feeds to receive
only conservative-leaning sources, etc..). You see it in left-leaning circles
too; it's a natural part of the human condition psychologists call
confirmation bias. The danger with these echo chambers is that it
becomes really tricky to try and recognize other points of view as being
legitimateWhen people speak about the good diversity brings,
it's not because it's a catch phrase or buzzword -Diversity helps us
empathize with and better understand the wide variety of experiences that make
this country great.
This is so funny coming from a guy who plays in the NBA, an organization
predominately black. Is he trying to ingratiate himself to the black community
by criticizing the white race? Is he lumping ALL white people in with the one
Jazz "fan" who caused a stir recently? I am NOT a fan of people
"drawing a line in the sand" but do support erasing ALL "lines"
to differentiate each other. How about we all look at others for what they add
to society, and not how they diminish it.
last postTMoney: You missed the point of the criticism. You say you
are just quoting statistical facts but the truth is that every single person has
unique life experiences. I fit into each of the demographics you described but
what you choose to overlook is that I was raised by a single mother in poverty
in a racially mixed neighborhood (1/3 white, 1/3 mexican, 1/3 black) in southern
california.I was christianed into the Catholic church before I was
ever baptized into the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.I
didn't move to Utah until I was 29 and, among other experiences, had spent
6 years as an enlisted man in the Navy.I was the first person in my
family to ever attend college and to finally earn a degree at age 33 due to
financial constraints. By the time I graduated, I was married and had four
children.It goes on and on but you just lumped me in with everybody
else in the demographics. But they don't tell the whole story, do they? And
just as my life experience is unique, I suggest that each of the people you
stereotyped into a single glob also has unique life experiences which have
shaped their thinking, attitudes, and behavior.
Nobody likes being thought of as unaware, insensitive, rude, and especially
racist. I don't think people here (for the most part) are intentionally
rude or racist. Having lived in Utah most of my life, I want to think that we
aren't any of those things, but I think the first two, unaware and
insensitive, probably fit. The number of people who honestly didn't seem
to know why the term "boy" (that the fan yelled at Westbrook) would be
offensive was eye-opening. I wonder how many people here in Utah know very many
details of segregation and the Civil Rights movement. That is something that
needs to be taught better.
@Jello is Good No, I didn't label or generalize anybody - I
highlighted demographic facts. According to the latest census Utah is indeed
majority white (88%) Republican (62 % from the most recent election) and Mormon
(about 60% according to a 2014 survey from the Tribune). Frankly,
it's naive to think those three data points don't have an influence on
one's perspective towards race relations
Just came to the comment section to lose my faith in humanity...again.
I read what Kyle had to say. I appreciate his words and sentiment. Here is a
paragraph that stood out:"The fact that black Americans are more
than five times as likely to be incarcerated as white Americans is wrong. The
fact that black Americans are more than twice as likely to live in poverty as
white Americans is wrong. The fact that black unemployment rates nationally are
double that of overall unemployment rates is wrong. The fact that black
imprisonment rates for drug charges are almost six times higher nationally than
white imprisonment rates for drug charges is wrong. The fact that black
Americans own approximately one-tenth of the wealth that white Americans own is
wrong."This is a problem. No question. The flipside of this
coin nobody is talking about is that the out of wedlock birth rate in the black
community. It's 75%. That's a big problem. You can talk about
equality and privilege all you want. Unless that number goes down, there is
very little "awareness" or legislation can do to solve the problem. The
real privilege is having a stable home, but that isn't in vogue in politics
or the "woke" community.
The main problem that Kyle and other like-thinkers have is that they only look
at the negative side of the equation. Instead of seeing countless acts of
kindness from white to black (and vice versa for that matter) which are frankly
far more prevalent than racist acts, they choose to focus on the negative.How many fans were in the arena the night of the Russell Westbrook
incident? How many of them were Westbrook fans? How many were fans of Mitchell
(who also happens to be black)? But these guys choose to focus on the acts of
the aberration rather than the norm.Kyle would be well-served to
spend a good deal of the time he promised to listen and learn in searching out
the stories of people who have gone out of their way to assist or help or in
some way bless people of another race. Instead of taking the corner case and
painting the entire canvass with it, perhaps he could get some perspective by
also looking at the other side of the coin and weighing them in the balance. I
think he would find that there is far more humanity than racism in our society.
Well, I expected that reparations would eventually make their appearance into
this discussion. Someone said facts matter. Well, 500,000 Union soliders paid
with their lives for 350,000 slaves. Is half a million lives not reparation
Perhaps this guy can focus on the rate of black on white crime vs the amount of
white on black crime. Society has become so caught up in race and racism that
it has forgotten how to be rational about facts instead of the picture painted
in our schools and the media. The US has gone well beyond making an even
playing filed to employing the law to enforce reverse discrimination.
I applaud Kyle for working to correct the issue, though I disagree with the
solutions he mentioned. Affirmative action/reparations are anathema to
democratic society.We don't have the same socioeconomic
starting point in our upward mobility, but we do have access to the same rights.
We have rights to public education, to free speech/assembly, to the courts
system, etc. Thabo himself sued the NYPD and won after having his leg broken.
We should strive for equality of opportunity. Where there is no equality of
opportunity, that's where government should step in. If access to the
courts is unequal based on race, something needs fixing. Same with access to
education. We need equality of opportunity, not equality of outcomes.Affirmative action destroys equality of opportunity as select students are
favored based on nothing more than skin color. We should focus instead on
fixing disparities observed in K12 schools (in teacher/facility quality in white
vs. black districts, access to funding, etc.).And why should my tax
dollars pay reparations for a sin I have never committed? We need to be
accountable, as Kyle says, but I refuse to pay for something I've not
@RiDal - Sandy, UTApril 8, 2019 12:54 p.m."Well, I guess
the Jazz is another professional sports team I can save money on by not
supporting."And they will be better for your decision.
@T-money$$$ - Salt Lake City, UTApril 8, 2019 12:45 p.m."Well said Kyle!! The inability to stand up and call out acts
of racism is what enables racist incidents to continue to perpetuate in the
future. It's a concept that many here in the Utah (a
majority-white, republican, and religious bubble) fail to grasp"Kyle is spot on and your generalizations and stereotypes are counter to his
comments. Labels applied to someone based on race, gender, age, and yes,
religion are wrong.
Lets confront racism where we find it. Lets stop with the white privilege
nonsense. What they really mean by white privilege is that your opinion does
not count or does not count as much. It is just a way of trying to silence
anyone who might disagree with a racial policy.
@strom thurmond - taylorsville, UTApril 8, 2019 12:26 p.m.I
don't go in for collective guilt or collective salvation."I
don't take responsibility for, or beg anyone's pardon for, someone
else's actions."Living up to that Strom Thurmond reputation
@T-money$$$ - Salt Lake City, UTwhat "Racism"?
@Anthony - Alpine, UTWrong, nothing supports Kyles position,
it's more of the usual fake outrage at things that don't exist.
If anyone suffers from privilege it's non-whites. They are given more
opportunities because of their race and perception of non-existent "systemic
There is no such thing as "white privlege" it's an excuse used by
those who suffer from success envy.Most of the racism in America
comes from black americans against whites.
Well, I guess the Jazz is another professional sports team I can save money on
by not supporting.
Before commenting, it would be a good idea to actually read Korver's essay.
It's an impressive effort. He asks more questions than he
answers. That is a lot more credible than spouting a bunch of pre-conceived
notions about yourself.I'm glad Korver wrote this honest and
thoughtful essay, and I'm glad that he's back with the Jazz.
Well said Kyle!! The inability to stand up and call out acts of
racism is what enables racist incidents to continue to perpetuate in the future.
It's a concept that many here in the Utah (a majority-white,
republican, and religious bubble) fail to grasp
I don't go in for collective guilt or collective salvation.I
don't take responsibility for, or beg anyone's pardon for, someone
@tothemoonYour unidentified statistics, if true, only support
Kyle's position that we all [and I would add, especially white males who
are under-educated, less responsible, and emotionally challenged] need to take
greater responsibility in noticing the prejudices and even unintentional
discrimination that continues to occur among us. We can, and indeed should do
Kyle hit the nail on the head, "We all have to be accountable - period. Not
just for our own actions, but also for the ways that our inaction can create a
'safe' space for toxic behavior." Doing nothing condones what is
happening. Very sad, and very well said.
Good on Kyle. One hopes he is prepared for the outcry he'll hear from a
wide swath of our community.