@Nate""The amount of funding for border security is negotiable.
Why isn't anyone negotiating?"The reason is... that the
President's opposition does not want to give him anything that looks like
accomplishments. They continue to be upset, and worse, at his win over their
candidate in the 2016 presidential elections.
@Missellear71"The ACA was never a law and never established as a law.
The ACA was and Obama and Romney written document as a presidential executive
order and was never voted on by the house and senate."That's a total and complete lie. A healthcare bill passed the
House 11/7/2009 by a 220-215 vote. Then the Senate passed the Patient Protection
and Affordable Care Act 12/24/2009 by a 60-39 vote, but it included an amendment
to the original bill so they had to go to conference to merge the two together.
However, Democrats lost their 60th seat so what they ended up having
to do is have the House pass basically the Senate version with the only
adjustments in conference having to be budgetary so it could pass by
reconciliation and avoid a filibuster, and that's what they did with the
House passing the Health Care and Education Reconciliation Act 3/21/2010, the
Senate 4 days later, and Obama signing it the 30th.
To "Frozen Fractals" but the US borders were established long ago, and
the Oath of Office as prescribed by the US constitution mandate that he defend
the US and enforce its laws.In 2006 a law was passed that a fence
was to be built along the border, so he is enforcing that law. Border Patrol and
Law Enforcement agencies have said they need walls along the border to defend
the US from people hostile to the US.So, apparently what trump wants
is based in the Constitution, which is older than the laws Obama was wanting
enforced.So again, Trump did exactly the same thing that Obama did.
One you hated one you praised despite their actions being the same.
The ACA was never a law and never established as a law. The ACA was and Obama
and Romney written document as a presidential executive order and was never
voted on by the house and senate. Unless a law or document is voted on by the
house and senate it cannot become or be enacted as a law. Executive orders only
apply to the executive branch of government and that's why they can be
erased and eradicated by a new president to suit his way of operating a
government of the people or a single Socialist government. Obama/Romney had
illegally created this ACA documented without any authority and illegally tax
all americans with an executive order, also unconstitutional. When the ACA was
declared unconstitutional by a federal judge it abolished the law in its
entirety as well. The recent addition of an "increased medicaid
tax authorization" in the Utah health care exchange was also made
unconstitutional since its funding is by the ACA funds. Americans don't
have to spy the government extra medicare funds to get health care benefits from
insurance companies. The IRS can no longer fine americans or collect taxes or
funds for medicare or medicaid which is now handled by the SSA again.
All good points. But we need fewer federal employees and expenses. The private
sector is constantly challenged to do much more with much less, and it does;
that standard doesn't apply to government--and it's just far too
@RedShirt"back a few years ago that is exactly what the Republicans
wanted to do with the ACA and the government shutdown. You cheered Obama on for
refusing to sign anything that didn't include the ACA funding. Trump is
just acting like Obama, so why is that so bad?"Trump is not
acting like Obama. The ACA was already established law and in effect for a
couple years at that point, it wasn't something new. The Trump
like scenario in 2013 would be if there was a shutdown in 2010 in the middle of
the healthcare debate because Obama was demanding passage of the ACA; that would
be a Democratic shutdown since the President would be demanding something
new.Today the equivalent to what Republicans did in 2013 would be if
Democrats refused to sign a continuing resolution because they wanted ICE to be
defunded. That would be a Democratic shutdown.Blame goes to whoever
is looking to depart from continuing resolution conditions. In 2013
that was Republicans wanting to defund the ACA. In early 2018 that was
Democrats looking to reinstate DACA. In this shutdown it's Trump
wanting a wall. That's who is responsible for each of those.
This is what you get when you have a congress that is more interested in their
own bottom line and perks than in the security of its citizens. Pelosi needs to
come to a compromise instead of running off on useless junkets.
To "ConservativeCommonTater" and Pelosi wouldn't even show up to
negotiate. Now what?You complain about the parties not working
together, but you now have Pelosi and the democrats acting like spoiled brats
and refusing to even come up with a compromise.
RedShirt - USS Enterprise, UTJan. 18, 2019 8:38 a.m."To
"Nate" the Democrats have stated no negotiations. It is either their way
or no way. Trump has already offered a compromise by lowering the amount from
$28 billion to just over $5 billion."Trump's
"negotiations" to reduce his demand from $28 Billion to $5.7 Billion,
isn't negotiating. It's indicating that he has no plans, no analysis,
no engineering studies, nothing! He just wants a blank check to fulfill the
promise he made to his base. That $5.7 Billion is still subject to cost
overruns, because there are no estimates from legitimate sources on what
anything would cost. It still means he doesn't have any plans, quotes or
studies to justify the $5.7 Billion.Remember, Trump walked out on
Pelosi and Schumer and refused to negotiate. It was his way or no way.
To "Frozen Fractals" funny thing, back a few years ago that is exactly
what the Republicans wanted to do with the ACA and the government shutdown. You
cheered Obama on for refusing to sign anything that didn't include the ACA
funding. Trump is just acting like Obama, so why is that so bad?
"Now state officials are engaged in long-term planning and reportedly could
begin drawing from the $820 million Rainy Day Fund if federal operations remain
closed past another six weeks or so. They would need to prioritize expenditures,
which could fuel hard debates and certainly place some deserving people at the
back of the line"For a State that claims it is the best managed
state, to come out and say they might actually have to "prioritize
expenditures" really makes me mad too. We are a taking state, we take money
from the federal government far in advance of what we give to the federal
government. Constantly begging them for money. And when they stop supplying
that money, only then does our government (with a constitutional "balanced
budget") feel that they should prioritize expenditures?Sorry,
but every single day of my life I have to "prioritize expenditures." I
am not rich like the Utah government and everyone in it. Perhaps they should
learn to be doing that every single day, instead of spend as if the money will
always be there attitude. A REAL budget is exactly that, a prioritization of
where money should be spent; and balancing it means only spend what comes in!
It is not appropriate to take federal workers hostage to try and extract
something from the other party. It was wrong when Democrats did it a year ago to
try and get DACA back (they realized the folly of it after only 3 days... and I
think that included a weekend), and it is wrong when Trump is doing it now to
try and get a wall. If you want wall funding, then you should be
taking up a separate immigration reform discussion that actually is a
negotiation where both sides get pieces of what they want. The reason Democrats
offered even more billions in wall funding months ago was because it was part of
a deal for DACA, you know, the one the Deseret News suggested. But
we should not be setting a precedent whereby shutting down the government and
hurting federal employees and others is a viable means to accomplish your goals.
That just invites more dysfunction later. That's why there cannot be a
deal. Trump must lose this fight just like Democrats had to lose the previous
Where are the moderate Dems and Republicans in Washington to pull together and
stop what Trump, McConnell, and Pelosi are doing?
The sad thing is that most people will not learn that this is what happens when
you become dependent on the Federal Government. You are stuck with whatever the
current winds are coming out of Washington.To "Nate" the
Democrats have stated no negotiations. It is either their way or no way. Trump
has already offered a compromise by lowering the amount from $28 billion to just
over $5 billion.
Poor governance has always been the trade-mark of the GOP. Utah has
a $1.3 BILLION surplus, plus an $820 million "rainy day fund."
That's over $2 BILLION in cash sitting around. In spite of this money,
Utah Republicans are looking for more taxes to raise.Utah won't
spend money on Medicaid for the poor and are trying to reverse the citizen
initiative. Utah won't spend money on education. Utah won't spend
money on cleaning up the air and water. Every major recession,
depression and periods of high unemployment have been at the hands of the
Republicans. The deficit has ballooned under Republicans; Raygun, GW Bush and
now Trump.The D-News is a big supporter of all things Republican,
but is now complaining about the actions and results of Trump and the GOP in DC.
"But should the shutdown persist, it’s unclear how much
the state could operate on its own."That's the argument
Against Utah spending money on message bills to "take back" Federal
lands Utah has never owned. Utah couldn't manage the lands without Federal
money.So Utahans and D-News, why do you support the Republican
agenda so strongly? They are causing the problems.
The amount of funding for border security is negotiable. Why isn't anyone
I'd rather see part of our surplus go to keeping parks open, helping the
poor and assisting others than the usual waste on defending the Utah
Legislature's unconstitutional message bills in court, paying developers
and giveaways to billion dollar corporations to move here.