After taking 'big step forward' in 2018, can the Utah Utes take another in 2019?

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  • Just the FAX Olympus Cove, Utah
    Jan. 18, 2019 9:03 p.m.

    Utemythology

    “"BYU remains the last school from outside of today's major conferences to win a national title. In 1984, "strength of schedule" was not the hot-button subject it is today. If it had been, BYU may never have made it to No. 1."

    -- Stewart Mandel (Sports Illustrated)

    Stewart Mandel was about 10 years old in 1984, so he obviously has no personal knowledge of the factors voters used in ranking teams and it’s doubtful he’s ever interviewed any of the voters, but there’s plenty of evidence that SOS was absolutely one if the factors considered, or Bryant Gumbel wouldn’t have made his famous “bo diddly tech” comment.

  • BlueCoug Provo, UT
    Jan. 18, 2019 8:36 p.m.

    ArizonaUte

    "Also what seems NOT debatable, yet gets debated some, is the following:

    1) BYU of 1984 would NOT have won a National Championship in the BCS era and honestly would not have made the CFP.

    Look at UCF in this era. They are discussed but aren't making it. And independence makes it every harder. No conference to win."

    Applying the BCS/CFP rules to 1984, BYU would have been a lock for a BCS championship or CFP berth.

    When has the #1 team in both final regular season polls ever been left out of the BCS or CFP.

    Remember that the exact same voters would who voted BYU #1 in November 1984 would have still been voting.

    What is certain is BYU would have played much better post season opponents.

    Your comparison with UCF is fundamentally flawed because UCF lacked BYU's build up to 1984:

    - 5 top 12 finishes in 6 seasons.
    - 6 straight conference championships
    - 4 consecutive QBs that finished in the Heisman Top 3
    - 2 best QBs in the country
    - 4 best passers in the country
    - 24 game win streak

    And, yes, I remember the Holiday Bowl games with SMU, Missouri, and Michigan very well, because I watched all 3 in person.

    BYU would have beaten Washington or Nebraska.

  • BlueCoug Provo, UT
    Jan. 18, 2019 8:26 p.m.

    re:

    1984 BYU SOS #82*
    2008 Utah SOS #80
    2004 Utah SOS #70

    *sports-reference.com

    Sagarin didn’t exist in 1984,
    so sports-reference is the only legitimate apples to apples comparison.

    -----------

    utemythology

    "No it is not. Math existed in 1984.

    Opponent Winning Percentage:

    2008 NC Florida: 62%
    2008 Utah: 52%
    2004 Utah: 45%
    1984 BYU: 42%"

    -----------

    yawn

    opponent winning % is a very subjective stat
    Team A could play five 11-1 and five 1-11 teams = 50%
    Team B could play ten 6-6 teams = 50%
    Same opponent winning %, vastly different SOS

    -----------

    utemythology

    "1984 BYU SOS was in the 90s."

    Nope, you have no valid, verifiable source for that.

    But, we have an absolutely verifiable source for this:

    AP #1 votes
    1984 - BYU 38, Washington 16, Florida 6
    2004 - USC 62, Auburn 3, Oklahoma 0, Utah 0
    2008 - Florida 48, Utah 16, USC 1

    #1 BYU 1984 received more than twice as many 1st place votes as #2 Washington
    #4 Utah 2004 didn't receive a single 1st place vote
    #1 Florida 2008 received three times as many 1st place votes as #2 Utah

    Unfortunately for U, the most authoritative stats are the ones that none of your spin will ever change.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 18, 2019 11:26 a.m.

    I have no idea how BYU of yesteryear (1984) became a topic on this thread. Other than BYU fans brought it up as they are on every comment section of Utah related articles. As are Utah fans on BYU related articles.

    But for those who are debating this:

    No question BYU won the National Championship in 1984. It's a great accomplishment, and for BYU fans probably great memories. (Although at this point, you'd have to be pretty old to actually remember it).

    Also what seems NOT debatable, yet gets debated some, is the following:

    1) BYU of 1984 would NOT have won a National Championship in the BCS era and honestly would not have made the CFP.

    Look at UCF in this era. They are discussed but aren't making it. And independence makes it every harder. No conference to win.

    2) Utah of 2008 achieved more than BYU of 1984 did. Just did it at a different time.
    a) 08' = Utah's 2nd undefeated in 4 yrs. BYU = 1, ever.
    b) Utah beat 4 teams who finished ranked. 3, top 15, 2, top 10. In 1984, no BYU
    opponent finished ranked.
    c) Bama was the highest ranked opponent BYU or Utah has ever faced in a bowl game.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 18, 2019 10:55 a.m.

    1984 BYU SOS #82*
    2008 Utah SOS #80
    2004 Utah SOS #70

    *sports-reference.com

    Sagarin didn’t exist in 1984,
    so sports-reference is the only legitimate apples to apples comparison.

    -----------

    No it is not. Math existed in 1984.

    Opponent Winning Percentage:

    2008 NC Florida: 62%
    2008 Utah: 52%
    2004 Utah: 45%
    1984 BYU: 42%

    1984 BYU SOS was in the 90s.

    "BYU remains the last school from outside of today's major conferences to win a national title. In 1984, "strength of schedule" was not the hot-button subject it is today. If it had been, BYU may never have made it to No. 1."

    -- Stewart Mandel (Sports Illustrated)

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 18, 2019 10:33 a.m.

    Gandalph - Sandy, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:40 p.m.
    Utemythology

    “It is absolutely clear, the 1984 BYU NC doesn't stand up to the smell test under tougher BCS/CFP standards.”

    What tougher standards??

    Utah busted the BCS in 2004 by beating only THREE teams with winning records, NONE better than 7-5.

    BYU 1984 rose to #1 in the final regular season game after winning 23 straight games, including beating THREE Top 25 teams on the road.

    -----------

    Utah busted the 2004 BCS by auto-qualifying as BCS Top 6 by beating then ranked Texas A&M. The 1984 BYU team beat ZERO ranked teams.

    The same tough standards where 2018 UCF won 25 straight games including FOUR top 25 including #10 Auburn. UCF never cracked the CFP top 5.

  • everything is awesome Cedar City, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:22 p.m.

    “After taking 'big step forward' in 2018, can the Utah Utes take another in 2019?”

    In a word...

    NO!

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:49 p.m.

    Correct you are AZUTE1. Utah seems to be doing pretty well with the "transfer" kids. Sure we lost Jack Tuttle (QB) to Indiana, but we gain Cameron Rising (QB-transfer, Texas), Manny Bowen (LB-transfer, Penn St), and Sione Lund (LB-transfer, Stanford) -- the latter two being eligible for the 2019 season. Plus, we've retained Zack Moss, Leki Fotu, Bradlee Anae, and Julian Blackmon. So we can't complain.

    GO UTES!!!

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:44 p.m.

    The ubiquitous byu fan spin machine notwithstanding—

    Welcome aboard Cameron Rising!

    First Ludwig & now Rising—Who’s next? Wilmore? Nacua?

    Jack who?

    Jaylen who?

    Go Utes!

  • Gandalph Sandy, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:40 p.m.

    Utemythology

    “It is absolutely clear, the 1984 BYU NC doesn't stand up to the smell test under tougher BCS/CFP standards.”

    What tougher standards??

    Utah busted the BCS in 2004 by beating only THREE teams with winning records, NONE better than 7-5.

    BYU 1984 rose to #1 in the final regular season game after winning 23 straight games, including beating THREE Top 25 teams on the road.

    In 1984, #24 Air Force, which BYU beat on the road, finished higher in the final AP poll than Utah’s 2004 Fiesta Bowl opponent, #25 Pitt.

    1984 BYU SOS #82*
    2008 Utah SOS #80
    2004 Utah SOS #70

    *sports-reference.com

    Sagarin didn’t exist in 1984,
    so sports-reference is the only legitimate apples to apples comparison.

  • Sparkley Briefs New York, NY
    Jan. 17, 2019 5:16 p.m.

    So the topic of the article is whether or not the Utes can take another step forward next year, and most of the comments are stepping back to bask in the glories of yore. It’s like a conversation with that batty washed up movie star in Sunset Boulevard. We’re still big, it’s the rest of college football that got small!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 4:39 p.m.

    "With the way the [BCS] system is now, there's no question we wouldn't have been No. 1. We probably would have gone to a better bowl, and that would have been great, but there would have been four teams higher than us in the polls." -- Robbie Bosco

    It is absolutely clear, the 1984 BYU NC doesn't stand up to the smell test under tougher BCS/CFP standards.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 4:14 p.m.

    @MRM - Layton, UT

    Two things. About two responses to me.

    1) You must have missed where I state very clearly that I don't count the Utah listing as a National Championship. Funny because it's in the very post you are referencing when you say you "hate to burst my crimson bubble".

    No bubble. Just showing where it's listed in the NCAA record books. Again, I don't count it and don't know any Ute that does. (you could probably find one who does, but MOST don't)

    2) Great memory of yesteryear for your Cougs. But Utah's 2008 season was FAR more impressive than BYU's 1984 season. That's not even debatable.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 4:06 p.m.

    @Gandalph

    BYU is still the best bowl opponent Utah has beaten since joining the PAC 12, and it took 5 gift TDs in the first 8 minutes from BYU in order to build enough of a cushion for Utah to weather doninating beatdown that BYU laid on U the remainder of the game.

    ------

    Are you still doing victory lap for margin of defeat 5 years later? SAD!!!

    Utah is still the best bowl opponent BYU has had the honor of losing to this century.

  • Rusty Filter ,
    Jan. 17, 2019 4:03 p.m.

    BYU is recognized as a P5 program by the P5 Conferences. BYU has and always will have a stronger National Presence then the u. Is uTAH playing big name programs in the east coast. That’s how you build a National Presence.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 3:55 p.m.

    @muss

    There’s absolutely NO DIFFERENCE between the AP’s standards for being ranked #1 in 1984 and being ranked #1 during the BCS/CFP era.

    -------

    Yes there is a difference.

    * BCS Title game

    * CFP playoffs

    Sorry you're having a difficult time understanding why Bosco agrees the 1984 team would have finished 5th today.

    But who really cares, this old news. Let's move on to this century.

    Utah is a P12 contender and your team is looking at 3rd in State again.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 3:04 p.m.

    Totally funny how the ute fans turned this into a BYU article. Makes me chuckle.

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 2:13 p.m.

    "I'm fully content with BYU's historical accomplishments and improving status as an Independent"

    rockcoog:

    Funny!

    All the listed historical accomplishments (measured against Utah, the team that owns yours 58-31-4, 13 of 16, 8-in-a-row) were "realized" when BYU-P was in a conference. You've got nothing to base your claimed "improving status" as an indy mid-major, unless you're pleased the coogs got out of 2017's Bottom 25 ranking.

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Jan. 17, 2019 2:05 p.m.

    jskm1232

    "How many of BYU's 11 + win seasons were against ranked teams??"

    More than Utah-SLC.

    11+ win seasons, playing Final Top 25 teams

    BYU (8)
    1979 - Indiana (19/16)
    1980 - SMU (20/20)
    1983 - Air Force (17/13), UCLA (13/15)
    1984 - Air Force (24)
    1996 - Washington (16/15), Wyoming (22/22), Kansas St (17/17)
    2001 - Louisville (17/16)
    2006 - Boston College (20/20), TCU (22/21)
    2009 - TCU (6/6), Utah (18/18)

    Utah (2)
    2004 - Pitt (25)
    2008 - Oregon St (18/19), TCU (7/7), BYU (25/21) Alabama (6/6)

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:49 p.m.

    rfrmac - South Jordan, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:40 p.m.
    "I have to laugh at some of the BYU fan comments. Only one question needs to be asked. Would you rather be in Utah's position or your own?"

    I'm fully content with BYU's historical accomplishments and improving status as an Independent:

    National Championships
    BYU 1 > Utah 0

    Heisman Trophies
    BYU 1 > Utah 0

    National HOF Players
    BYU 6 > Utah 0

    Nation's Best QB
    BYU 2 > Utah 0

    Nation's Best Passer
    BYU 7 > Utah 0

    Nation's Best RB
    BYU 1 > Utah 0

    AP Top 25 Finishes
    BYU 17 > Utah 8

    11+ Win Seasons
    BYU 11 > Utah 2

    Returning Sophomore QB with the most completions in a bowl (18) without an incompletion.

    Recent wins over big name teams like Oklahoma, Texas, Nebraska, and Wisconsin.

    Improving Independent schedule that will create even more opportunities for wins over big name opponents.

  • rfrmac South Jordan, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:40 p.m.

    I have to laugh at some of the BYU fan comments. Only one question needs to be asked. Would you rather be in Utah's position or your own? Enough said.

  • Gandalph Sandy, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:32 p.m.

    Spokane Ute - Spokane, WA
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:51 p.m.
    At MRM

    Fact

    Utah 35
    BYU 28

    Check Mate!

    ———

    BYU wasn’t a P5 division champion representing the “conference of champions” as the 2nd best team in the PAC 12.

    How embarrassing for the conference.

    BYU is still the best bowl opponent Utah has beaten since joining the PAC 12, and it took 5 gift TDs in the first 8 minutes from BYU in order to build enough of a cushion for Utah to weather doninating beatdown that BYU laid on U the remainder of the game.

    One more BYU possession, and Utah 2015 would have suffered the same bowl fate as Utah 2018.

  • KimmyP Grantsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:28 p.m.

    @sanefan

    Fact: The record is 8-0.

    Fact: because the record is 8-0, the blue faithful must try to find a way to overcome the bitterness and they think trying to disparage the P12 is the way to do it.

    Fact: byu is not in a P5 conference, and won't be anytime soon. Comparing conferences will not get byu an invitation, but it's all there is left.

    Fact: did I mention it's been 9 years since Utah has tasted defeat at the hands of byu? 😹

  • ND95CA Lincoln Park, IL
    Jan. 17, 2019 1:11 p.m.

    Utemythology

    “The vast difference was higher BCS/CFP standards.”

    The final regular season rankings of totally disprove your claim.

    If having an unblemished record was the only factor in 1979, BYU would have been ranked 4th, higher than any team with a blemished record:

    1979 Final Regular Season AP Poll
    #1 Ohio St (11-0)
    #2 Alabama (11-0)
    #3 USC (10-0-1)
    #4 Florida St (11-0)
    #5 Oklahoma (10-1)
    #6 Arkansas (10-1)
    #7 Nebraska (10-1)
    #8 Houston (10-1)
    #9 BYU (11-0)

    1979 proves that a 1-loss team could have finished ahead of BYU in 1984, but the poll voters selected BYU as the Consensus National Champion.

  • MRM Layton, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:55 p.m.

    ArizonaUte

    “In 2008, Utah played 4 teams who finished ranked. 3 of those teams finished in the top 15, 2 finished in the top 10. Alabama was the highest ranked team either of our teams have ever played in a bowl game.

    In 1984, BYU played one team ranked at the time (Pitt) and zero teams who finished ranked. In fact, BYU's opponents in 1984 had a combined losing record. Pitt, finished with 3 total wins.”

    SOS Rankings per sports-reference.com

    1984 BYU #82
    2008 Utah #80
    2004 Utah #70

    BYU beat AP #24 Air Force on the road in 1984, which finished higher in the Final AP poll, than Utah’s Fiesta Bowl opponent, Pittsburgh, which finished AP #25 in 2008.

    Unfortunately for U, the Utes were never a legitimate NC contender in 2008.

    The were #6 in the final BCS standings and #7 in both final regular season polls.

    No team ranked that low at the end of the regular season has ever won a national championship in the AP or Coaches polls.

    Utah finished a distant 2nd in AP with only 1/3rd as many 1st place votes as Florida; U finished 4th in Coaches, the official BCS final poll.

    BYU 1984 received more than a 2 to 1 majority of 1st place votes in both major polls.

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:51 p.m.

    At MRM

    Fact

    Utah 35
    BYU 28

    Check Mate!
    Thanks for playing, that was too easy

  • JSKM1232 Sandy, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:48 p.m.

    @mussingaround - Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 17, 2019 11:24 a.m.
    Jskm

    “1984 was 3-1/2 decades ago. Haven't you got anything more recent? Say, this century not the last.”

    Sure, four straight AP Top 25 finishes and three 11+ win, Top 15 finishes from 2006 to 2009, accomplishments that Utah has never achieved in their entire football history.

    All time 11+ Win, Top 15 finishes
    BYU - 9
    Utah - 2

    Whittingham era 11+ win, Top 15 finishes
    BYU - 3
    Utah - 1
    = = = = =
    How many of BYU-P's 11 + win seasons were against ranked teams?? I know in 1984 it was one (1) ranked (AT THE TIME) team.

  • MRM Layton, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:39 p.m.

    ArizonaUte

    “In the NCAA Major Poll Championship section on NCAA.org in the record books...”

    1984 shows BYU, Washington, Florida, Nebraska.
    2008 shows Florida and Utah.”

    I hate to burst your crimson bubble, but on the NCAA’s main College Football Championship History webpage, there’s no mention of Utah. It does recognize the LSU/USC split national championship in the major polls in 2003.

    Year | Team | Selecting Organization
    1984 | BYU | AP, FWAA, NFF, USA/CNN, UPI
    2003 | LSU, USC | BCS, AP, FWAA
    2008 | Florida | BCS

    In other words, Utah’s “championship” is nothing more than a footnote for 2008.

  • MRM Layton, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:11 p.m.

    FACT: Best 2018 Win (per Sagarin)

    Utah @ #24 Stanford
    BYU @ #25 Wisconsin

    FACT: versus Big Ten

    Utah: 0-1
    BYU: 1-0

    btw,

    Utah struggled mightily to beat the MAC team that Utah fans are chiding BYU for losing to by a single point.

    As far as Utah losing to Northwestern, let’s not forget that Utah blew a 20-3 halftime lead with an embarrassing 2nd half meltdown, giving up a Holiday Bowl record 28 points in the 3rd quarter.

  • Lester L. Wester , 00
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:08 p.m.

    The gift for us sports fans today is the BYU-P and street cred-thing. Was this "street cred" reputation developed on the mean streets of Provo?

  • Lester L. Wester , 00
    Jan. 17, 2019 12:00 p.m.

    Sanefan: "Fact: The AAC was better than the PAC 12 this year!"

    Fact: the ACC is another conference that BYU-P can't get an invite to.

    Fact: your team has a cumulative losing record for the past three years

    Fact: your team cannot get get an invite from a major conference

    Fact: your team has lost to your rival the last eight straight games and has a 3-13 record against them the last 16 games.

    So what's left? You attempt to make fun of and denigrate a conference you are so jealous of and would give anything if your team could get invited to. Your team had a 20 year blip of success and relevance that occurred generations ago. Now, you're on the outside looking in.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 11:37 a.m.

    @mussingaround - Palo Alto, CA

    I'm not debating the 1984 championship. It's legit and certainly for the structure of college football at the time.

    In the NCAA Major Poll Championship section on NCAA.org in the record books:

    1984 shows BYU, Washington, Florida, Nebraska.
    2008 shows Florida and Utah.

    It's literally in the books like that. But I don't count it as Utah having an NC. Again, I do count BYU as being 1984 National Champs.

    Something to consider:

    Utah was the only undefeated team in D-1 football after the 2008 season.
    BYU was the only undefeated team in D-1 football after the 1984 season.

    In 2008, Utah played 4 teams who finished ranked. 3 of those teams finished in the top 15, 2 finished in the top 10. Alabama was the highest ranked team either of our teams have ever played in a bowl game.

    In 1984, BYU played one team ranked at the time (Pitt) and zero teams who finished ranked. In fact, BYU's opponents in 1984 had a combined losing record. Pitt, finished with 3 total wins.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 17, 2019 11:24 a.m.

    Jskm

    “1984 was 3-1/2 decades ago. Haven't you got anything more recent? Say, this century not the last.”

    Sure, four straight AP Top 25 finishes and three 11+ win, Top 15 finishes from 2006 to 2009, accomplishments that Utah has never achieved in their entire football history.

    All time 11+ Win, Top 15 finishes
    BYU - 9
    Utah - 2

    Whittingham era 11+ win, Top 15 finishes
    BYU - 3
    Utah - 1

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 17, 2019 11:01 a.m.

    The vast difference between a team that had built street cred with FIVE top 12 finishes from 1979 to 1984, versus a flash-in-the-pan team that was unranked in 2005, 2006, and 2007, and had no street cred after getting shut out by 10-loss UNLV 0-27 in 2007.

    ——

    Nope!

    The vast difference was higher BCS/CFP standards.

    ——

    FALSE!

    There’s absolutely NO DIFFERENCE between the AP’s standards for being ranked #1 in 1984 and being ranked #1 during the BCS/CFP era.

    USC proved this by winning the AP national championship without even playing in the BCS championship game.

  • JSKM1232 Sandy, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 10:20 a.m.

    @BlueCoug - Provo, UT

    "Utemythology

    "The only reason BYU got the NC was because literally very other team lost and they had to give the title to someone."

    Nope!

    The reason BYU won the CONSENSUS 1984 National Championship was because of the street cred BYU had built with the poll voters:

    . . . . . .
    1984 was 3-1/2 decades ago. Haven't you got anything more recent? Say, this century not the last.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:44 a.m.

    @muss

    The vast difference between a team that had built street cred with FIVE top 12 finishes from 1979 to 1984, versus a flash-in-the-pan team that was unranked in 2005, 2006, and 2007, and had no street cred after getting shut out by 10-loss UNLV 0-27 in 2007.

    ------------

    Nope!

    The vast difference was higher BCS/CFP standards.

    * Which is why 2007-2011 TCU, with much better street cred than 1979-1984 BYU, never matched 2008 Utah with 16 AP 1st place votes.

    * Which is why 25 straight wins by UCF, including 3 top 25, didn't get UCF into CFP top 5.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:40 a.m.

    @Sanefan - Wellsville, UT

    Fact: The AAC being better than the PAC 12 is your opinion. It isn't fact.

    Fact: BYU lost to Utah in 2018. The same Utah team who lost a bowl game to the 4th place (?)Big Ten team. NWU was actually the runner up in the Big Ten. Losing to tOSU in the Big Ten Championship.

    Fact: BYU went 1-3 v. the PAC 12 in 2018. Half of BYU's losses came at the hands of the PAC12. Is the PAC12 really as bad as you say they are?

    Fact: BYU went 1-2 v. the MWC.

    Fact: BYU went 0-1 against the MAC conference in the regular season.

    Since you seem to be ranking conferences, where does the MAC rank?

  • Flipphone , 00
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:35 a.m.

    What big step? loosing a 20-3 lead at half time and losing the Holiday bowl?Come on Ute fans, we are beginning to sound like BYU fans.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:28 a.m.

    ArizonaUte

    “In fact, one poll did have Utah #1 and somehow now Utah has a claim to being NC that yr. as well. It is literally official in the NCAA record books.”

    Utah isn’t even mentioned on the NCAA’s FBS National Champions page.

    The fact that Utah was ranked #1 in one minor poll, doesn’t change the fact that Utah finished 4th in the official final BCS championship poll, the Coaches poll.

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:16 a.m.

    ArizonaUte - SLC, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:33 a.m.
    @mussingaround - Palo Alto, CA

    “One point that needs to be fact checked in your comments.

    Utah was ranked #4 in the BCS...”

    Nope!

    Utah was ranked #6 in the final BCS poll in both 2004 and 2008.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:22 a.m.

    BlueCoug - Provo, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 3:27 p.m.
    Utemythology

    "The only reason BYU got the NC was because literally very other team lost and they had to give the title to someone."

    Nope!

    The reason BYU won the CONSENSUS 1984 National Championship was because of the street cred BYU had built with the poll voters

    ----------------

    Nope!

    Had there been another undefeated team in 1984, BYU would never have been ranked #1.

    Today, the 1984 team wouldn't even sniff a playoff berth.

    Besides, who cares the point was BYU fans have no room to talk about weak SOS to Utah.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 9:12 a.m.

    Sanefan - Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:25 a.m.
    Fact: At the end of the season, the lowly MWC had more teams ranked in the top 25 than the Pac 12

    ----------------

    So? Are you claiming MWC is a better conference?

    Teams in the Top 50:
    PAC-12: 7
    MWC: 3

    Teams ranked 100+:
    PAC-12: 1
    MWC: 6

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:56 a.m.

    Sanefan - Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:19 a.m.
    FACT: Utah got creamed, embarrassed, crushed, by the 4th best team in the Big 10 the 4th best P 5 Conference!

    --------------

    No that is not a fact, that is called SPIN.

    Utah didn't get beat by a conference, Utah lost to the #21 team in the nation by 11 points, which by definition is not being "crushed".

    Here's an example of embarrassing:

    #83 NIU 7
    BYU 6
    at LES

    That was a game where both Kaufusi "cousins" and Heisman Wilson playing the entire game.

  • Mr. Boris Layton, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:47 a.m.

    What big step forward? The only reason there was a perceived step forward is because the rest of the PAC 12 is so horrible.

    This is a Ute team that barely beat a horrible BYU team and a horrible Northern Illinois team. That being said those I guess those teams are better than the PAC 12 south.

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:41 a.m.

    azute1

    "And BYU only shot up into the rankings following their Pitt game because people wouldn’t know how blatantly awful 3-7-1 Pitt was ‘til 2 weeks later..."

    LOL at your fantasies.

    BYU began 1979 beating pre-season #14 Texas A&M on the road, yet BYU wasn't even ranked in the AP poll until week 4 when BYU barely slipped into the poll at #20.

    Despite never losing a game during the regular season, BYU didn't crack the Top 10 until week 10 and finished #9 in final regular season poll.

    After losing their bowl game to #19/#16 Indiana by 1 point, 37-38, BYU (11-1) finished 1979 ranked #13/#12, behind FIVE teams with 2 or more losses.

    Your theory that record was the only thing pollsters looked at in the 70's and 80's is nothing but your own made up fantasy.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:33 a.m.

    @mussingaround - Palo Alto, CA

    One point that needs to be fact checked in your comments.

    Utah was ranked #4 in the BCS, before the bowls and is why Utah was in the Sugar Bowl in the first place. The rules had changed by then and it was harder to get into the BCS bowls.

    They also ended #4 in the BCS as they seemed to only change #1 and #2 after bowl games.

    Utah finished #2 in the AP with 16 1st place votes. And being #2 was controversial, with many, many, many articles written about it, talk shows discussing it, etc. stating that the real champ was Utah. As they were the only undefeated team in D-1 football.

    In fact, one poll did have Utah #1 and somehow now Utah has a claim to being NC that yr. as well. It is literally official in the NCAA record books.

    BYU shares the 1984 NC with 3 other teams according to the NCAA record book.

  • chicagoborn Philadelphia, PA
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:20 a.m.

    Fact: Just because you state something is a fact, doesn't make it so. Top to bottom, the Pac 12 is much better than the MWC and the AAC. Go look at Sagarin's conference ratings, and if you don't agree with Sagarin, show me a rating that has the AAC and MWC ahead of the Pac 12. I don't care about your opinion on which conference is better, show me the numbers.

  • BlueCoug Provo, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 8:17 a.m.

    azute1

    "And BYU only shot up into the rankings following their Pitt game because people wouldn’t know how blatantly awful 3-7-1 Pitt was ‘til 2 weeks later"

    You made that up; how frantic and emotional of you.

    We see early season upsets of Top 10 teams every year, yet when was the last time we saw a non-power conference team jump from unranked to ranked in the Top 10 in only two weeks.

    Pollsters had an entire season to correct their "mistake", yet BYU continued to rise in the polls until the Cougars reached #1 in the 12th week.

    Even then, pollsters had an entire month to carefully analyze every legitimate contender, yet even then, the majority of AP and Coaches voters chose BYU as the #1 team in the country, as did all the other three major college football national championship selecting organizations.

    If record was the only factor in the polls, why wasn't BYU ranked higher in the final regular season poll in 1979?

    1979 Final Regular Season AP Poll
    #1 Ohio St (11-0)
    #2 Alabama (11-0)
    #3 USC (10-0-1)
    #4 Florida St (11-0)
    #5 Oklahoma (10-1)
    #6 Arkansas (10-1)
    #7 Nebraska (10-1)
    #8 Houston (10-1)
    #9 BYU (11-0)

    Undefeated BYU was ranked behind 5 teams with blemished records.

  • Sanefan Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:25 a.m.

    Fact: At the end of the season, the lowly MWC had more teams ranked in the top 25 than the Pac 12.

  • Sanefan Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:24 a.m.

    Fact: The AAC was better than the PAC 12 this year!

  • Sanefan Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 17, 2019 7:19 a.m.

    FACT: Utah got creamed, embarrassed, crushed, by the 4th best team in the Big 10 the 4th best P 5 Conference!

  • mussingaround Palo Alto, CA
    Jan. 16, 2019 11:46 p.m.

    azute1

    “So much “street cred” that they started ‘84 UNranked”

    BYU started 1984 in the Top 25 in others receiving votes only because of the uncertainty of having to replace Steve Young at QB.

    BYU 1984 was ranked #13/#12 in the first regular season poll, and jumped to #8/#6 in the 2nd week; and reached #1 in both major polls on November 20th, the 12th week of the season.

    By comparison, it took Utah 2008 TEN weeks to crack the Top 10 in both polls, and the Utes didn’t climb above #7 in either poll until until AFTER the bowls.

    The vast difference between a team that had built street cred with FIVE top 12 finishes from 1979 to 1984, versus a flash-in-the-pan team that was unranked in 2005, 2006, and 2007, and had no street cred after getting shut out by 10-loss UNLV 0-27 in 2007.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Jan. 16, 2019 10:11 p.m.

    “The reason BYU won the CONSENSUS 1984 National Championship was because of the street cred BYU had built with the poll voters:”

    So much “street cred” that they started ‘84 UNranked—LOL

    And nope, it wasn’t due to having an unproven QB....Nice try.

    And byu only shot up into the rankings following their Pitt game because people wouldn’t know how blatantly awful 3-7-1 Pitt was ‘til 2 weeks later when OU hit town & straight brutalized them [as opposed to byu barely squeaking out a W over them].

    Go Utes!

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Jan. 16, 2019 9:54 p.m.

    We were good in ‘18 & we’ll be GREAT in ‘19!

    Only concern is having playable depth at O-Line, but all the pieces are there & in Coach JH I trust!

    Go Utes!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 16, 2019 9:38 p.m.

    Sanefan - Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 7:56 p.m.
    Utah was not that good this year as demonstrated by their Bowl loss. It's not that they took a "big step forward" as much as the rest of the Conference and especially the South teams took a big step backwards.

    -----

    FACT: Utah played a #26 SOS.

    FACT: 2018 South was better than 2017 SEC-East

    Utah won the South, finished in the top 30 despite losing thier top 3 offensive players.

    In 2019, Utah has a great chance of winning the PAC-12.

    Go UTES!

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Jan. 16, 2019 7:58 p.m.

    BYU busting on Utah on a Utah article? I thought that only happened on BYU threads? Not even close. As far as the article goes I think next year will be a good year. 16 starters back. Utah lost some key players but it looks like depth is becoming a strength of the programgood. I’m very optimistic about he coming year I would put the over under at nine wins, I’ll take the over

  • Sanefan Wellsville, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 7:56 p.m.

    Utah was not that good this year as demonstrated by their Bowl loss. It's not that they took a "big step forward" as much as the rest of the Conference and especially the South teams took a big step backwards. The conference has been declining for several years now and you can expect that trend to continue.

  • wwookie Payson, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 6:32 p.m.

    All about the O Line.
    If that improves, Utah wins the division and strong contender to be in the Rose Bowl.

    PAC doesn't belong in National Playoff unless a team goes undefeated. Unlikely, but we can dream.

  • GoRed Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 6:36 p.m.

    Too many sour grapes coming out of Provo.

  • ArizonaUte SLC, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 6:11 p.m.

    @BlueCoug - Provo, UT

    BYU won the Natty all those yrs. ago and it's legit. I don't think anyone debates that. It's as legitimate as any before the BCS and CFP.

    Not body really debates that. Some Ute fans will try and get your dander up. But it's a nice accomplishment. Well over a quarter century ago. In fact a quarter century plus a decade.

    But BYU was definitely the new kid on the bock. It wasn't from yrs. of accomplishment.

    BYU fist time ever being ranked was 1977 and were ranked only 5 times, EVER, before 1984.

    BYU was not ranked in 1982. Were ranked in 1983 then won the Natty in 1984. They were the only undefeated team in the nation in 84'. The pollsters didn't have much choice really.

    Pitt had won like 7 Nation Championship by that time. No, BYU was not selected because of "street cred BYU had built with poll voters".

    That is one of the most entertaining statements I have ever read re: the rivalry.

    Honestly, 5 ranked seasons EVER, and not in a row. And not being ranked 2 season before you going undefeated in 1984?

    That wasn't too much "street cred" to go off of. Just say'n

  • kitsutsuki South Jordan, Utah
    Jan. 16, 2019 5:55 p.m.

    Big step forward? The south was as weak as it has EVER been.

  • KimmyP Grantsville, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 5:35 p.m.

    @vinceone,

    "November always dashes the hopes of August"... I know, losing a game after blowing two 20 point leads tends to do that. 😹

  • CO Ute , 00
    Jan. 16, 2019 4:19 p.m.

    Utes will get 5 home conference games in 2019 compared to 4 this year.
    Add Oregon State and Cal. Remove Stanford and Oregon.
    The schedule is much more favorable next year.
    All of the teams in the South could be better than this year, although ASU loses a 3 year starter at QB and the best receiver in the conference.
    On paper with no injuries, Utah will probably be picked to win the division. How the year plays out is just a guess.

  • But seriously folks! Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 3:39 p.m.

    Nah. They got lucky one year. One and done.

  • BlueCoug Provo, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 3:27 p.m.

    Utemythology

    "The only reason BYU got the NC was because literally very other team lost and they had to give the title to someone."

    Nope!

    The reason BYU won the CONSENSUS 1984 National Championship was because of the street cred BYU had built with the poll voters:

    - 5 Top 12 Finishes in 6 seasons -1979, 1980, 1981, 1983 and 1984

    - 5 Heisman Finalists in 6 seasons -1979 (3rd), 1980 (5th), 1981 (3rd), 1983 (2nd) and 1984 (3rd)

    - Nation's Best QB - 1981 and 1983

    - Nation's Best Passer - 1979, 1981, 1983, 1984

    - Back to back Top 7 Finishes - 1983 and 1984

    - 24-game win streak, including road wins over #13 Air Force, #13 UCLA and #24 Air Force

    - An electrifying passing attack that revolutionized the major college passing game

    All culminating in a 13-0 season in which BYU was chosen as THE most deserving team to be selected National Champion by all FIVE major college football national championship selectors, including the majority of sportswriters (AP) and coaches (Coaches) in the major polls.

    BYU rose to #1 in the polls in November and critics had an entire month to scrutinize every legitimate national championship contender - BYU, Oklahoma, Washington, Florida and Nebraska

  • Highlight WEST VALLEY CITY, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 3:18 p.m.

    Just wondering why "every year" no matter what, the Utes are ALWAYS going to be better than the year before, regardless of record. (wish we all had that crystal ball)

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 2:53 p.m.

    "I really like ASU, though."

    red-jelly-squirtle:

    Why? They've got to break in a new QB and find a go-to receiver.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    Jan. 16, 2019 2:53 p.m.

    I hope we grab a few JUCO Offensive Linemen to help offset the losses of Agasiva, Barton, and Falamaka.

    I also hope Chayden Johnston hits the gym hard during the offseason. One of the reasons why our Kicking game has been so elite over the past decade is due to the fact that not only have they been "accurate" in their kicks, but also because they had "range".

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 2:45 p.m.

    "November will always dash the hopes of August."

    vancecoog:

    Wait, are you still bummed about the comeback Utes spoiling November for you?

  • JohnInSLC Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 2:47 p.m.

    "but I'm doubting"

    frankie:

    Of course, that's what coog fans do.

  • VegasUte Las Vegas, NV
    Jan. 16, 2019 2:24 p.m.

    @Frank Walters

    "lost players"

    Signed,
    Zack Moss
    Bradlee Anae
    Julian Blackmon
    Leki Fotu

    This will arguably be the most loaded team Utah has ever had. Utah lost some key players to graduation, and some third/fourth string players to transfers - just like every other school in the country. Who they are bringing back is the key, which is astounding. As far as the new OC goes, he already knows this team and Coach Whitt inside and out. He is a chameleon. Plus, Utah retains all it's other offensive coaches. They will not have to start over like they did when Taylor came in.

    When Utah came in to the PAC, most of the haters gave us a list of the many things Utah would never accomplish. One of the last ones was crossed off the list last year. This season will a great (realistic) opportunity to cross off one or two more.

    Quit looking at the negative. See what's been accomplished so far, and enjoy the ride.

    Go Utes!

  • JackRyanSLC Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 1:35 p.m.

    Haters should remember one thing. Think back where our program was in 2000 compared to now. Are we an SEC powerhouse? No...but we have become a legitimate contender and are are a real threat in every game that we play in a very competitive P5 league. Depth from top to bottom is better than it has ever been. Our facilities are light years ahead of where they were. We have sold out every game for years. Our recruiting is off the charts compared to the old days. We have national respect.

    Although we have a long way to go to be playoff contenders, people might want to remember how far we have come. If we were a stock, we are still an incredible bargain buying opportunity.

    To put it another way...remember when we would beat a P5 team one time per year and make such a big deal out of it? Now we regularly beat USC, Oregon, Stanford, etc...and it is just treated like another day at the office. We are regularly favored and expected to win many of these games today.

    For all of you BYU guys...take a chill.Many of us Utah fans are very content with the status of the program and the trajectory it seems to be headed. We know we haven't arrived, but we are "self aware" of our progress

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 16, 2019 1:23 p.m.

    Vanceone - Provo, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 12:36 p.m.
    Can they? In theory. Will they? It's Utah, cmon.... the place of endless hubris but never followthrough. November will always dash the hopes of August.

    The only reason they got the Pac-12 South this last year was because literally every other team was hot garbage, and they had to give the title to someone.

    -------------

    Actually, you just descried 1984. The only reason BYU got the NC was because literally very other team lost and they had to give the title to someone.

    BYU fans need to keep their fantasies about a weak SOS on their own boards.

    2018 Utah 9-5 was 6-3 in PAC-12 play
    2011 UCLA 6-7 (6-3)
    2015 USC 8-5 (6-3)

    The difference being in 2018 Utah's SOS was #26 in the nation.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Jan. 16, 2019 1:13 p.m.

    2019 Utah: 10-2 (7-2) and PAC-12 South Champions

    Utah could with the PAC-12 title, depends on how good Washington/Oregon/Stanford are. Hopefully USC starts winning as well.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Jan. 16, 2019 1:13 p.m.

    I actually think they have a real shot for at least a share of the PAC South for the 3rd time. I really like ASU, though. We will see.

  • Vanceone Provo, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 12:36 p.m.

    Can they? In theory. Will they? It's Utah, cmon.... the place of endless hubris but never followthrough. November will always dash the hopes of August.

    The only reason they got the Pac-12 South this last year was because literally every other team was hot garbage, and they had to give the title to someone.

  • Frank Walters Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 16, 2019 12:36 p.m.

    I'd love to see it but I'm doubting...new OC, lost players, who knows. We've lacked enough consistency to be able to say that things will be better next season.