trump claimed he shut down the government. Now it's the dem's fault.
Tomorrow who knows who he will blame.But, the GOP controlled House and
Senate did not give him the money for the wall so this whole mess is the
@lostindc"I notice you’re not denying the drain illegals are on
our system, yet you argue against a means to prevent more from coming.
Why?"Because the data does not support the need.The
number of illegals in the country has been flat at around 11+ million for more
than a decade. That mathematically can only lead to one conclusion, we are not
seeing an increase of illegals getting into the country. Not from the southern
border and not from any other source.If we had a large number of
illegals coming across the southern border every year, the number in country
would have to increase year over year. It hasn't.So, either
we're turning back an equal amount that try to cross currently, or
we're deporting an equal number to those coming across. That is only way
that the math works with the data we have.If we are already stopping
or deporting an equal number, then there literally is no justification to now
build a wall.That money and effort should be spent deporting the 11+
million that are already costing us, instead of throwing billions to solve a
mythical 'flood of illegals' problem that doesn't actually exist
@mcclark "Why do Thid and Worf ignore Trumps promise that Mexico will pay
for the wall?"True believers. The sunken cost logical
fallacy. If you voted for Trump in spite of a life-long, well documented
history of fraud and infidelity, you are pretty much locked in *no matter what*
Trump does or says. That whole thing where Trump claimed he could
shoot somebody on 5th avenue and he wouldn't lose any voters? That was
It’s time for the CIA to do the heavy lifting to save our Country &
Why do Thid and Worf ignore Trumps promise that Mexico will pay for the wall?
And dont try the Tariff thing, Mexico does not pay them, we do.
@lost in dcThis shutdown is on Trump. Just like the shutdown was on
Obama when he was president.Trump should agree to open the
government today and negotiate separately for border security.
It's an all out campaign to generate fear.
I'd like to make a prediction -- Based on his own previous disregard
for the rule of law, I reckon Trump will:1. Go on TV and
falsely declare his "National Emergency"2. Will order the military
to immediately start building his wall3. Tries to save face by ending his
government shutdown without backing down4. Double dog dares Congress and
the Courts to stop him5. He will be sued in court for it6. The
Courts will of course order him to stop7. Trump will then blames the
Courts for his own mistakeTo Trump, it's all about Trump...
I hope the networks will include fact checking along with the speech. This
president has not garnered a reputation for telling the truth.
For the past 2 years, Trump has controlled the Executive Branch and all the
policy decisions over immigration enforcement. During the same time, the GOP
controlled both the House and Senate.Yet we are on the cusp of Trump
declaring a state of emergency related to immigration issues he/GOP failed or
chose not to address.America needs to point Trump to that classic
sticker/magnet that hangs by the desks in many HR/admin departments: "Lack
of Planning on Your Part, Does Not Constitute an Emergency on My Part"
It is certainly interesting, as well as disappointing, to see how the Democrats
and MSM are treating this subject. It is evident they see some political
advantage for the liberal agenda in taking the position of opposing border
security. They are even quoting Ronald Reagan on his view of the
southern border. The one thing they don't understand (evidently) is that
Reagan was in favor of easy crossing of the border as long as the US knew who
was coming and going. With our current immigration laws and loopholes this is
impossible to know.
When BO and clinton shut down the government, the GOP passed a plethora of bills
to open the government, but BO and bill ignored them till they got what they
wanted. Trump should do the same.Too bad the dems put the interests
of illegal immigrants ahead of our interests.chuck talks about
bullies and not letting them win – the GOP let bill win so BO bullied
more. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. chuck and nancy
seemed to have learned nothing from the past 2 years. trump’s not like the
prior GOP, you cannot bully him and he won’t cave.Jane Bchuck’s idea of negotiating is offer .001 and take .999, then walk out
when you don't get 100FTThe shutdown is not about a wall,
but the dems’ desire to diminish trump – at the expense of us
all.FrozenThis is the dems’ shutdown. He has called for
a wall for years, that’s nothing new.SiloI notice
you’re not denying the drain illegals are on our system, yet you argue
against a means to prevent more from coming. Why?Ralphchuck
and nancy host a reality show?Utah Girlthey should not air the
dem response of fear, misinformation, and propagandajoewillie12see my 1st paragraph – this is a dem shutdown
Frequent poster Worf asks, " Why does Trump want a wall"?It
requires little or no research!Trump see's the wall should it
get built, as a 2000 mile edifice of his legacy of greatness. It in actuality
has little or nothing to do with security of the country.In his
fairy tale world of narcissism and self aggrandizement, he fails to see that in
reality, it would be nothing more than a 2000 mile reminder to the country and
the world of the worst POTUS in history!
Why is our federal government even involved in this negotiation? The Donald is
on record over and over again saying that Mexico is going to pay for it!
@fred44I agree, republicans always talk about the constitution but
want to ignore the process over campaign rally promises. Trump
can’t demand a wall. He isn’t king.
Is $5 Billion enough to build the wall? I understand it will require much more
than that. So why is Trump asking and fighting for $5 B, when it wouldn't
even be enough?I am convinced Trump is using immigration and the
wall as a way to energize his base. I do not believe he really cares that much
about the wall--it is a vehicle to keep him in power and influence the news
around the nation. Trump is shutting down government for enough
money to build a small section of his wall. And for a man that is supposed to
be a great negotiator, he is a terrible negotiator.
Welcome to McAllen Texas.
@NoNamesAccepted "President Trump has made clear he will
negotiate."President Trump made it clear that he will force
Mexico to pay the bill."Methinks $3b"Me thinks
Trump should stick to his campaign promise.
NoNamesAccepted:Please note House Democrats aren't demanding or
obstructing anything. They passed a bill to reopen the government last week.Senate Republicans (who perfected obstruction politics) are your true
I'm not going to tune into Trump's Reichstag Fire....
President Trump and Mike Pence should go to Mexico to start soliciting funds for
the wall. They can go door to door or set up a stand at the street market. They might not collect a lot but every Peso counts!
Let's hope the major networks ignore Trump's infomercial request(of
course, Trump state television will be happy to air his fictional narrative) and
shun his photo op on the border. Better yet, have the president of Mexico hand
over a check to cover the 5 billion dollar cost to the US taxpayer while Trump
parades around looking self important.
Pelosi and Schumer should actually go to our southern border and talk to border
patrol agents about this issue? Guaranteed they will not because they don't
want to hear the truth, they want to hear themselves blather about that which
they know nothing about!
I fear he's not going to have to work too hard to convince those that have
never been out of the country, his base, that there's some kind of
emergency or crisis.
How about we try to have the Constitution work here like it is suppose to work.
I keep waiting for Mike to give us a lesson in the Constitution. Spending bills
originate in the House. The House has passed a spending bill. The Senate
should take up that spending bill and debate it, and give it an up or down vote.
If it passes in the Senate it should go the President where he can choose to
sign it or veto it. This shutdown was caused by Rush Limbaugh and
Ann Coulter, but it is now the fault of Mitch McConnell. Rather than refuse to
bring a bill passed in the House to the floor, how about we let the Constitution
work as it was intended? If the Senate and House can't agree, then get a
conference committee and get it figured out. McConnell has allowed Trump to be
a dictator by saying he won't sign the bill, so he won't even bring it
to a vote. That is not how the Founding Fathers envisioned the Constitution
working. Neither the Senate nor the President should be able to
marginalize the House by telling them what they can and cannot pass.
The TV networks have no moral obligation to broadcast fear, misinformation, and
propaganda to the delight of xenophobes everywhere.
More political theater from the Reality Show Host.The Republicans
are pushing an ineffective solution to a fabricated problem.
@thid"Steven A. Camarota, research director at the Center for
Immigration Studies, crunched the numbers and found that the current population
of illegal immigrants will drain nearly $750 billion from taxpayers over their
lifetimes "Again Thid, the data you're producing validates
that Trump is completely wrong on the issue, and that money should be spent on
things other than the wall.The key in your citation is this "the
current population of illegal immigrants". The entire $750 billion you
claim comes from the "current population of illegal immigrants".If you spent a $100 billion tomorrow to build a full length,
impenetrable wall on our southern border complete with gun turrets and infrared
scanners, it would not save a single penny of Steven Camarota's estimated
costs because those illegals are ALREADY here.Building a wall will
not reduce the costs of those already here. You only reduce those costs by
deporting those illegals already in the country. Why is that so difficult to
Silo: We are already paying hundreds of billions for illegal aliens! How many
more illegal aliens are you willing to pay for? Or should I say force American
taxpayers to pay for? President Trump has spent his life EARNING money while
Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer have invested their careers in SPENDING other
people's money! Logically, who should we trust when it comes to saving
taxpayer's money? There are many reasons we need to build the wall and
saving taxpayer's money is one of them. Something with which President
Trump is concerned while his critics could not care less about taxpayers! Why
would any rational, logical taxpayer oppose the wall? Really logical after all,
@thid"The nearly $135 billion paid out by federal and state and local
taxpayers to cover the cost of the presence of 12.5 million illegal aliens and
their 4.2 million citizen children amounts to approximately $8,075 per illegal
alien. "Thid. Your logic is severely flawed. You
cannot justify the cost of building a wall by using cost data from illegals who
are already in the country. Building a wall saves nothing against ANY of those
claimed costs. Not a single penny.Building a wall does not deport
any of those illegals nor does it address their citizen children who cannot
legally be deported.
Why President Trump is spot on correct about this issue! Steven A. Camarota,
research director at the Center for Immigration Studies, crunched the numbers
and found that the current population of illegal immigrants will drain nearly
$750 billion from taxpayers over their lifetimes — amounting to six times
the deportation costs. Build the wall and save taxpayer's money:
@worf: "Why is Trump wanting the wall and why are Democrats against it[?]
This requires research and study beyond the everyday news."About
as much research and study as it takes to determine that water is wet.There is nothing remarkable about being against erratic and irrational
decision-making. No research is required to know the vast majority of Americans
prefer to make decisions based upon rational, common-sense rather than
impulsive, ego-driven emotion. Our households and businesses would not function
if this were not so.And then there is Trump.
at long last. . . - Kirksville , MO"That is the story here for the
Democrats. . . Don't try to govern, just 'resist'. If the country
doesn't succeed and look good at things, then the Democrats win political
points."It worked for Republicans when Obama was in office.Trump as use all the money he gets from Mexico. No objections here.
I thought Trump was good at marketing? He's not doing a good job marketing
his wall to the public. His tweets are counterproductive, i.e. poor me, fake
state of emergency threat, etc. Sending out his top people to Sunday
shows didn't do much but expose them as disingenuous on border statistics.
Terrorists are not coming in through the southern border, and drugs are
primarily carried in vehicles at ports of entry.It's clear
Trump intends to offer nothing to Democrats, who know Americans don't like
the shutdown, and don't want the wall.
NoNamesAcceptedCompromise involves both groups getting something they
want. (Like last year there were wall for DACA discussions), not giving in to
half the hostage takers' demands. This is Trump's shutdown (and
McConnell's) because of insistence on new policy attempting to be jammed
into the budget. The shutdown last year was the Democrats fault
because they were trying to force in reinstatement of DACA. Would you think an
appropriate compromise to that shutdown would be Republicans reinstating DACA
for some of the Dreamers?
Why is Trump wanting the wall and why are Democrats against it.This
requires research and study beyond the everyday news.
Article: "Trump sought to frame a steel barrier as progress, saying
Democrats 'don't like concrete, so we'll give them
steel'".Trump might as well be saying Democrats
'don't like idiocy, so we'll give them stupidity.' Worse
still is that Trump may genuinely be confused why such his dubious concession is
dismissed out of hand.If only America had elected a successful
businessman rather than someone who only played one on tee-vee.
The shutdown is not about a wall but one man's insecurities and an opposing
political party's intent to clearly show the emperor is not wearing any
clothes. The reality is the majority of Americans already know about both and
don't think either is worth all the trouble. The GOP should have settled
all this while they controlled both branches of government.
Trump's idea of negotiating is offering steel rather than concrete.
Democrats said don't make us laugh. The walls are closing in on Mr.
Dealmaker. -R's are signaling they are ready to move on -Most Americans don't like the shutdown or the wall -Federal
workers are now entering a perilous financial situation -Delta and United
sent a letter to Trump (not to Democrats) and said "cut the nonsense":
"I am writing to urge you to take the necessary steps to
immediately end the shutdown of government agencies that is adversely affecting
the safety, security and efficiency of our national airspace system."Trump really has no where to go, but to declare a FAKE state of
emergency. We'll see how that works out for him.
The nearly $135 billion paid out by federal and state and local taxpayers to
cover the cost of the presence of 12.5 million illegal aliens and their 4.2
million citizen children amounts to approximately $8,075 per illegal alien. Pay
a paltry $5 billion (one time expense) now or continue to pay out $135 billion
every year into eternity! Actually, the "pressure" is on the
Democrats to explain why American taxpayers should continue suffer like this!
Folks, its YOUR money, not theirs! Build the wall!
Maybe he will do a 180 like he had to do on Syria. Impulsive not thought out
tweets may not be the best way to attempt to run a government.
That is the story here for the Democrats. . . Don't try to govern, just
'resist'. If the country doesn't succeed and look good at
things, then the Democrats win political points.
"Trump reaffirmed that he would consider declaring a national emergency to
circumvent Congress and spend money as he saw fit."If Trump can
make this stick, the Trump dictatorship which I have long predicted will be
Why pressure or play games?President Trump has made clear he will
negotiate. Methinks $3b for a border fence has the government open by close of
business.Demanding 0 for a fence or wall isn't negotiating. It
is partisan obstruction on the part of congressional democrats.