Kolob1,If we didn't allow teachers to come back into the
profession after retirement and "double dip", we would have an even
bigger teacher shortage. We can't get enough people to even apply for the
jobs that are open and you are complaining that they are taking someone
else's job? Please, good teachers, after you retire, come back
and teach my kids and grand kids! We need you!
My local legislator just posted about how wise our past legislators were when
they made this "brave" decision to cut out the pensions of teachers,
police, and fire. What he still can't and probably never will
see is that it has destroyed the teaching profession for men. When I started
teaching over 25 years ago, there were several men teachers at the jr. high and
high school plus a few at the elementary school. Now it is a rare thing to have
any man stay in the profession for longer than 3 years. Maybe that
is what they wanted but I always liked when my kids had a good male teacher that
could serve as another positive role model. Not saying that women can't do
that as well but it would be nice to have more men in the profession. The teachers coming into the profession now are seeing it more as a temporary
job than a profession. Most are gone within 5 years. The quality of applicants
continues to decline and we are accepting more and more "alternative"
teachers with little training. So while my legislator can proclaim
it was a good thing, the teacher shortage, lack of men in the profession, and
less qualified applicants all suggest otherwise.
"Lawmakers also put new restrictions on so-called "double dipping"
or post-retirement income, making those who retire wait at least a year after
retirement before they can go back to work for a local or state government
entity."Should be ten years instead of one year. Double dipping
talkes another's job. Why should someone getting a pension and social
security being employed in a third endeavor. Goes to show that the greed in our
society doesn't only belong to the 1%ers.
Kathleen5r - ,Jan. 1, 2019 12:32 p.m.Utah is poor place to live in
retirement years due to the tax burden on the elderly. VEry true. Utah needs to
adjust their tax rates and property taxes for older people that make less $.
Some people are well off financially in their older years but more often than
not, they are struggling to live on a fixed income. We shouldn't be pushing
them out of their homes with high property taxes and other taxes after they have
worked hard all their lives. This is not right. We should help them be
independent and stay in their homes as long as they possibly can.
thebig1:I don't mean to be any way offensive but as a teacher
for 30 years I served the taxpayers of Utah. I took less wage for benefits like
health insurance (that were much better when I started than it is now) and a
promised pension. I feel no guilt in taking the pension that I was promised if
I completed my years of service. I guess going forward we could take pensions
away from fire fighters, police officers, teachers and other public employees
but I'm sure a much higher wage would be demanded. Pensions were adjusted
for government workers and this by the way has led to a shortage of potential
workers for police officers and teachers. But by no means should any government
worker feel guilty or shamed for taking something that was promised or
contracted and the government through its people should honor this contract or
we don't have much of a government.
Retire in Evanston? Brrrrrrrr!
The simple way to avoid pension problems is to simply fund pensions at 100% each
year as you go along. Then, make reasonable and realistic assumptions about
investment rates of return and properly manage the portion of the fund in
higher-growth, higher-risk instruments like stocks, vs the amount held in
lower-risk accounts. Don't over-promise and under-fund.Frankly, I prefer a 401(k) or Roth over a pension. I own the former and they
are fully portable allowing me to move from one job to another as my situation
over my life may dictate. The latter is owned by my employer. I both have to
trust him to do the right thing for many decades, but I am also locked into
working for one employer my entire career.We should encourage
employees and employers to fund these privately owned retirement vehicles and to
provide a wide variety of investment choices. A generous employer match and an
"opt out" (rather than the typical "opt in") for new employees
greatly increase retirement savings.Consistently saving 15% over a
40 year career, results in a very comfy retirement. But too many of us start too
late, save too little, and then want to retire too early.
Utah is one of the best managed States the the nation.It's too
bad I have to choose between Utah government and California weather.
To Those Who Have These Pension Benefits:The state pension fund has
been a huge home run to you. To fund this pension fund over the last 25+ years,
your monthly paycheck was lower than it otherwise would have been. However, that
difference has been invested in a sound, prudent way and has earned a very good
rate of return. The Utah Retirement System has done a very good job. As a
result, the pension fund is large enough to pay out your benefits throughout
your retirement. Let's turn back the clock and envision a
different scenario. No pension fund was established. You would have had a higher
paycheck each month (maybe 5% to 10% higher). You would have done one of two
things with that amount. You either would have spent that amount or you would
have invested that amount. And when Americans are left on their own
to invest, things so often don't go well. And if you go find investment
advice, the long-term return is way lower than what you would have earned with
the state pension fund. Advisers, insurance salespeople, and brokers have very,
very high fees and don't always give sound advice. This pension fund has
been a very good outcome for you.
Yes, URS pensions are among the best funded pensions in the nation; 86% funded.
And, Utah uses one of the lowest (most conservative) discount rates in the
nation. However, the discount rate is still too high. If you believe that the
long-term rate of return on pension investments will be 7.25%, I have some
beachfront property in Tabiona I’d sell you sight unseen.
Utah is poor place to live in retirement years due to the tax burden on the
They have the problem. Dig deeper. So do the school districts.
Why do government pension funds get a free pass on being fiscally sound, but
private’s ones don’t? To quote Wimpy from the old Popeye cartoons,
“I’ll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today.” And
guess what? He never comes around on Tuesday. This is the attitude of most
government retirement funds.Like everything else in life,
don’t obligate yourself to something you are not willing to pay for.
These pensions funds should be paid for currently, not out of future funds.
The "pension" now offered teachers is all 401K and takes 35 years of
service to get full benefit. So maybe that's a reason among many why there
is a teacher shortage in the Beehive State.
When I graduated from Weber in Law Enforcement in 1982 there were hundreds of
people applying for law enforcement positions. Over a thousand people showed up
at SLCC to test for SL CO Sheriff. I heard there were forty openings. Today
there is a crisis in law enforcement. I actually saw a billboard recruiting for
UHP. I blame it all on doing with a twenty year retirement and low pay. Utah
can do better.
Why do we even have pensions for govt workers? Makes no sense I have to fund
their pensions. It's a joke.
Blue HuskyI'm glad you love Utah. It's a great place to live and
raise your kids too. No Idea what your politics are but if they are typical
California then please don't bring them with you. There's a reason
Utah is so great. Its the culture that produces the conservative fiscally minded
lawmakers, and hardworking honest people that we have here. The scenery is a
huge bonus! Hope you and others keep that in mind when you go to the polls next
@ Fully present, You'e right, Utah is one of a handful of states that taxes
The other states promised too much. Utah does not allow pension benefits to be
calculated on overtime. Other state's employees will work overtime for the
last three years and have their benefits calculated on those figures. Also Utah
only gives cost of living increases on the initial pension at retirement, not
the current amount. You can ask people to work for the State but they say
"Oh, they don't pay enough." Well, that may be true but down the
road when they are ready to retire those people who chose not to work for the
state don't have a pension or are dealing with jockeying their money in
401K accounts. It is a Catch-22 decision.
My wife and I retired with a healthy IRA and we retired to Utah from California.
Utah taxes are comparatively lower and cost of living is much lower than
California. This is a major difference between Utah and many other states. Kudos
to Utah for its overall financial management. We love it here where we can ski
in the winter and play golf when we can't ski. Meanwhile we enjoy the
scenic beauty every day.
"Pensions, not a problem in Utah"This just isn't true.
Anything directly tied to the volatility of the stock market is a problem, in
particular one's retirement. Utah pensions are only funded at 86% with the
last few years of a parabolic stock market rise. You would think they would be
funded at 125-150% at this point. This is bad news for the future. Just because Illinois or California are much worse doesn't mean Utah
doesn't have a problem. The time will come when all pensions,
annuities, entitlements, etc will be put to the ultimate test. Hopefully Utah
pulls through with flying colors.
Agreed about the tax burden, but other factors overcome making it a poor place
to live in retirement. Go move to Evanston, WY or Mesquite, NV for less of a
tax burden, and still within striking distance of all the goodness that is Utah.