I think he should delegate the government shut down chore to Ted Cruz and then
fire him if nothing gets accomplished. LOL!
It is appropriate to remember that illegal immigration from our southern border,
both direct and indirect /delayed, have added over 30 million to the ranks of
Hispanics in America. All the way along that wild and irresponsible path,
Democrats have maneuvered and manipulated and stonewalled to make political hay
for themselves, all to our country's detriment.Here we are at
the tail end of that long treasonous process, with a President who seriously
intends to stop the problems there, come hell or high water. Not
surprisingly, there are many who still want to make political hay for
"progressives" and Democrats. Even more still want to enjoy the repeat
opportunity to emote synchronously with border-stormers and legal/ illegal
entrants.So, remember again the long incompetent road to border
control with 30 million emigres who came without consent or control. We still
have 10.7 MILLION illegals who don't want to go back. We still have
Democrats who want to give citizenship to millions more, out of pure
compassion.So, which will it be, compassion or control?
Herbert Gravy "President Trump tried to explain over and over to Ms. Pelosi
that 60 votes are required."I missed the part where the current
Republican majority in the House passed full approval of Donald Trump's
wild wall spending spree only to be thwarted by those pesky Democrats in the
Senate. What was the House Bill Number which was resoundingly defeated in the
@moderatePresident Trump tried to explain over and over to Ms.
Pelosi that 60 votes are required in the Senate.Last time I checked,
the Republicans had somewhat less than 60 senators.Again, who are
VP Pence looked like every 5 year old watching mom and dad fight. I
felt sorry for him.
Herbert Gravy "Typical Pelosi obstructionism."The Republicans
still control the House and Senate until January. Why are they not giving Trump
the money that he wants? Typical Republican obstructionism.patriot
"both Pelosi and Schumer going on record saying they want open
borders."They didn't say that, so its not "on record".
You simply made that up.The borders are not open now. The Democrats
prefer to continue CONTROLLED borders, as we have today. Clearly controlled
borders work, because the caravan stopped. The Republicans didn't buy
Trump's wall shtick. Why should the Democrats?
A few points:Overstayed visas is by far the largest source of
illegal aliens in the US. The Border Patrol has only picked up ~ 130K Mexico
border crossers this year compared to over 1 million in 2000.Illegal
aliens come to the US to work. And they do. Even at Trump properties. More than 60% of all illegal aliens have been here over 10 years.Source: The Pew StudiesBottomline: Seriously crack down on
employers and track visitors via GPS if we're serious about curbing illegal
immigration. As has been pointed out repeatedly, lock and walls
keep honest people honest.
@Cougar: "take down the fence around your house. Allow whomever to enter
your property at will."@Patriot: "Now people see and hear
both Pelosi and Schumer going on record saying they want open borders. Yikes!!
Pelosi kept pleading to turn the camera off" Nobody has said
they don't want any borders or that they don't want border security.
Watch the video - Trump accuses "Dems" of wanting "open borders"
but that just isn't true. Democrats have supported, voted for, and
championed border security funding and laws. They are proposing the exact same
funding for border security as last year. They just don't want
to spend Billions on a wall that experts agree is not the best way to secure the
border. Besides, Trump vowed that Mexico would pay for it. It was
pretty underhanded of Trump to call the press in last minute and put on a show
of arguing with, talking over and interrupting Pelosi and Schumer. They
respectfully called him "Mr. President" while he called them
"Nancy" and "Chuck." He loved it - his chest puffed up and he
got a gleam in his eye. He loves contention. Pelosi and Schumer
didn't want to degrade The Office of the President. Too late for that.
@ patriot - Cedar Hills, UT If you had actually followed the
conversation in the meeting, Pelosi and Schumer said they are not for open
borders and favor enhanced border security, but not a wall, which they said
would costly (about 30 billion to build and another 8 billion over ten years to
maintain) and would be virtually ineffective anyway. Trump has falsely accused
those of opposing his wall as favoring open borders. That is a false narrative.
And to claim that he won the election because the American people wanted a
border wall is ridiculous. The wall was a low priority with voters. And Trump
only won 46.1% of the popular vote compared to 48.2% for Hillary. Nationwide
Hillary had 2.9 million more popular votes than Trump. Also, most Americans do
not want a border wall along the length of our southern border. A Gallup poll in
June of 2018 found that 57% opposed such a wall, and only 41% support it (2% had
no opinion). As for the other sticking point, DACA, 83% of Americans approve of
allowing them to have a pathway to citizenship.
I have two thoughts on the border wall and the government shutdown:For the wall, my only thought, or suggestion rather, would be to those that
oppose it:Then take down the fence around your house. Allow whomever
to enter your property at will.And for the government shutdown:The last time it happened, all those who did not get paid during the
shutdown got paid once the budget was passed and government was re-opened for
business. For those who say that if the government shuts down, there will be an
economic collapse, or depression even, I say to them that those same fears were
expressed the last time around that this happened. There was no economic
collapse, or depression, then, and there won't be one now!Build
the wall! And shut 'er down if necessary!Trump 2020
Smart move by the president. One thing Pelosi hates more than anything is a
public conversation for all to see. Now people see and hear both Pelosi and
Schumer going on record saying they want open borders. Yikes!! Pelosi kept
pleading to turn the camera off -- sorry Nancy but the public has the right to
see and hear. The president has nothing to hide regarding his immigration policy
but the Democrats sure do. Also president Trump made it clear that he won the
2016 election because people in the US wanted a safe border and according to our
own border patrol that means a wall must be built. Border control agents all say
they can't secure the border without a wall. The president said that a
government shut down would be worth protecting the American people. Right on! By
the way -- during a shut down 75% of the government is funded regardless -- the
essential parts. Trump is 100% right to stand firm. Democrats want an open
border to ensure their power and money stay intact even if drugs and human
trafficking and terrorism explode.
Where is Cohen when you need him.
About Pelosi...I fail to see how building a wall to keep illegal aliens from
entering our country is "immoral." In what way is a border wall
Immoral?Not following our immigration laws might be immoral. During the
early part of the 1900's every immigrant had to pass through Ellis Island.
They had to agree to support our constitution, Flag and learn to speak English.
They agree. And our nation was enhanced by their determination. Today's
"illegal aliens" want to live in close knit groups, live under their own
laws and they do not want to learn English and they continue to speak using
their native language. Our constitution means absolutely nothing to them.
Build the wall.
worf,"A president with grit fighting for the safety of our country is
marvelous! I'm sure these Democrats lock their doors at night. Does it make
them racist or mean spirited?"____________________I recall when
before the 2016 election, Trump celebrated one Cinco de Mayo day by publicly
eating a taco salad making sure there were news cameras galore on hand to
broadcast the event. That cynical image has stuck in my mind.Trump
is entitled to his views even though I regard them as ignorant and a remnant of
a past America yet struggles to transcend. I have my own views on Hispanics
based on my own actual experience. Yes, they have their bad elements, as does
white America. And just like white America, they have their own culture and
traditions in which they take pride. But I refuse to see Hispanics or any other
ethnic groups as malefactors, parasites, or any other mean-spirited stereotype
that some in our country won't stop trying to breathe new life into.
@unrepentantPuerile? Oh, my.And Pelosi wasn't?🤔
@ one old manAn improvement?Nope. Not so much.🤔🤗
Very refreshing!A president with grit fighting for the safety of our
country is marvelous!I'm sure these Democrats lock their doors
at night. Does it make them racist or mean spirited?
@Utah Blue Devil. Did a little research on Israel’s border security.
I know it’s all relative, but it appears terrorist attacks are down
substantially in the past ten years in areas where fences and walls have been
erected. And I agree with you about Trump. Oddly enough he is quite
dogged about keeping his campaign promises on trade and immigration, even if he
gets the “bad guy” or “bully” label. It
would be nice if Pelosi and Schumer finally realized Trump’s not bluffing.
“It’s called transparency.”Actually I think it was
a good negotiating session (albeit Manhattan real estate developer style).
Trump, Pelosi and Schumer understand each other a lot better now and will come
to an agreement a lot sooner. Will the government shut down? I think
so. But it will be a lot shorter now.
A classic display of leadership! Unfortunately it wasn't by the person who
sits in the oval office!Trump all along planned to call in the media
at the last minute, in hopes of trying to make the Dems. look bad.
Unfortunately it was Pelosi, who in a short 15 minutes reduced Trump to a
petulant child, throwing an epic tantrum. It was a massive
meltdown in front of the world, induced by a woman no less, who has forgotten
more about leadership and governing than Trump will ever know.I am
no fan of Pelosi, but it was amazing watching her push Trumps buttons, and
ensuing childish reactions. I can only imagine what would have happened if he
had sat before Muellers team. He would be in a sanitarium under sedation!Even Trump knew he had been played and fell for it. Following the
meeting, as he, in a fit of anger, stomped out of the room, throwing a sheaf of
papers. Fortunately the Football was not close at hand!People
complain Pence did nothing, said nothing. Actually, he picked up the papers
Trump threw around the room.This country is in trouble, but not as
much trouble as Trump!
Herbert Gravy - Salinas, CADec. 12, 2018 6:24 a.m.Typical Pelosi
obstructionism.And, we want folks like her to be in charge of our
government?=====Even she would be a yuge improvement
over what we have now . . .
The problem is that even in Israel we have seen that Walls don't solve
much. Just this week a second Hamas tunnel was discovered. There are
locations it could work. There are locations we already have it. There are
locations where we have a wall that tunnels have been discovered.So
I see this as more about political posturing rather than a real attempt at a
solution. And two things we have learned about Trump. 1) If he
said he is going to do something, he is going to do it - regardless of the logic
or even changing circumstances. Coal is a great example. Japan announced
they are shuttering 1/2 their coal plants because it is now more expensive than
other forms of carbon energy. 2) Trump will follow through on his
threats. Our trade wars are a great example. US heavy manufacturing exports
are down because of tariffs. In some areas by 20%. Caterpillar just announced
layoffs. Doesn't matter. He is a man determined to do it his way
regardless.... so you can take him at his word on threats.The wall
or parts of it will be built - even if it shuts the government down - and has
little real impact. He will do it. Mexico just isn't paying for it.
"I'm [still] proud to be an American," but this is so embarrassing.
Washington gridlock is one thing, but this type of behavior is an insult human
dignity and civil decency.
Typical Pelosi obstructionism.With her "skunk" comment after
the meeting, she also demonstrated that she doesn't know much about
skunks.She also did a huge share of the "bickering" although
the headline of the article would lead one to believe otherwise.And,
we want folks like her to be in charge of our government?🤔
If he wants to own something this foolish, let the Donald trump government
shutdown and tantrum begin.
@bamaphone"so such a reversal suggests that they don’t care if
the southern border is trampled."Actually, it suggests that they
grasp basic logic and math, and realize the border wall has nothing to do with
anything but Trump's ego.
All three acted like children. Can't vote for two of them, and will never
vote for the third.
"Trump questioned Pelosi's ability to count votes in her own House. She
questioned his manhood — after she left the building."Really Nancy? This is the best you could come up with? "His manhood?"
How about his impulsiveness?
Daedalus, Stephen - ARVADA, CODec. 11, 2018 1:13 p.m.It is clear
watching the video of this meeting that Pelosi has raised children.========Good point, Stephen. Agreed. But even a good mother may
not be able to cope with a disturbed child without competent help from expert
psychologists. When I was teaching, I would have been required to
refer any student to school psychologists if they acted in ways we've seen
trump acting. I'd have been required to inform law enforcement personnel
if any of them had engaged in sexual misconduct similar to that he has actually
bragged about. I'd have been required to seek counseling for any who
demonstrated constant pathological lying, bullying, and insulting others.But the White House is not a school, and there are no responsible adults
available to seek help for a very troubled and immature person who is acting out
constantly in very inappropriate ways.What is happening is shameful.
Thank goodness our schools can at least try to help troubled students. But where is help when we need it so badly now in another important
@bamafone"Democrat leaders are all on record previously as wanting a
wall"Reluctantly agreeing to a wall in exchange for DACA is not
the same as wanting a wall.
"We've recently caught many bad guys at the border. They've all
claimed to be the boogieman."Trump base: *wild cheers*
Trump took it to them. Democrat leaders are all on record previously as wanting
a wall, so such a reversal suggests that they don’t care if the southern
border is trampled. They need the votes.
Tolstoy,"Why do Trump and his supporters insist on basing their
arguments on out right lies...."____________________Truthful
arguments stand on their own merits with no need to feign rationality, logic,
and facts. That Trump chooses to create his own 'truth' is the single
greatest evidence of how empty and vaporous his signature causes and ideas are.
Really? He bickered?Threatened a government shutdown?I can't believe it.Certainly not THAT great scholar and
gentleman...I'll not buy that for a second...
@flip phone Why do Trump and his supporters insist on basing their
arguments on out right lies (illigeal immigration has dramatically dropped we
are not “being invaded”) and straw man arguments claiming Democrats
don’t want border security?
Were this a serious conference, it would have been behind closed doors. It
wasn't. It was televised for political show.
So, a border wall is so essential to our security that the Commander in Chief is
willing to furlough those charged with securing it to get it? Is the border wall
more important than paying the troops or making sure homeland security can
continue to operate? Is the border wall more imoprtant than keeping medical
services running for our veterans?
I think Pence was doing his best impression of a wall during the entire
@flipphone"Why don't you democrats want a secured border?"Why do Trump supporters resort to strawman arguments.Resisting the wall has zero to do with wanting a secured border. Resisting
the wall has to do with striking a balance between wants, needs and costs.Currently, the want for the wall is only from Trump and his supporters.
The need for the wall doesn't exist in reality. The cost of the wall has
shifted from Mexico to the US taxpayer. Thus the resistance. US
taxpayers should not be asked to pay for something that isn't needed simply
because Trump wants it.
trump accomplished absolutely nothing with a majority in the house and senate.
Now that he'll face opposition to his awful ideas it's going to get
even more difficult.
Flipphone - Sandy, UTDec. 11, 2018 1:19 p.m."Why
don't you democrats want a secured border?"Who said
Democrats don't want a secure border? Donald Trump?You source
of information is in error. This topic has been debated ad absurdum in these
threads. But a Wall is not going to guarantee a secure border. It's only
going to be a multi-billion dollar boondoggle to salve Trump's ego. There
are other ways, supported by both Democrats and Republicans that will do much
better. History will teach you this. The Great Chinese Wall didn't keep the
Mongols out and Trump's Wall will not stop illegal crossings. The either go
over, under, around, or through any Wall.And then there are all
those ranchers in Texas who don't want any part of a Wall on their land.
So, think it through before making further unsubstantiated statements about what
Democrats want. Don't fall for the ranting nd fearmongering of a con man.
As I watched this debacle, there was one person who sat stoned faced and he
probably was thinking the whole time in just a few more months his job will be
mine. Trump gave me the impression of a baseball manager who had been thrown
out of the game but wasn't leaving without kicking some dirt and calling
people a few names.
Usually, a shutdown involves making sure the other side gets the blame. This
time, trump wants to own it. That's good, it is his mess. Through it
all, I've never seen a man try to evaporate as much as Pence did to get out
of that room. Your move, Donald.
"If we don't get what we want, one way or the other, whether it's
through you, through military, through anything you want to call, I will shut
down the government," Trump ultimately declared.____________________America itself held hostage by the President? Oh,
yeah. This is Donald Trump.
Pence never moved during this meeting. Not a muscle.He was like the
embarrassed kid dressed as the Christmas tree in the school play, with no lines.
Why don't you democrats want a secured border?
Although I'm a Republican, I don't support Trump's wall. Even
if I did, the promise was for Mexico to pay for it (from the beginning, I felt
like there was a greater likelihood of the earth crashing into the sun than
Mexico putting up funds for such a wall) and I don't feel it is a budgetary
It is clear watching the video of this meeting that Pelosi has raised children.
Trump bickers . . . Anyone watching this encounter will recognize
that Donald Trump continues to peddle fear to scare his base into confronting
non-existent problem. For those who see the deceit in Trump's fearmongering
and his lies about the Democratic policy on the border recognize that the
"invasion" was only theater to boost Republican turnout in the 2018
election. Now that the Republicans have lost and Trump is facing increasing
criticism for conspiring with the Russians to win the 2016 election, this
distraction is just coating the wall with more mud thrown to see what sticks.Time is getting short. January 3rd will finally allow the House to
conduct the investigations that it was supposed to do when Trump and his
campaign were first identified with possible links to the Russian government.
Where proper oversight was neglected in favor of partisan tribalism, the
increased scrutiny and possible release of a report from the Mueller team is
starting to make Trump more irrational by the day as evidenced by his Oval
Aah, the wall.Using the D News as your info source, you would miss
the Gallup Migration Study, published this week.The bad news: 750
million adults around the world want to move from their home country to the
developed world.Bad news, part two: The United States is by far the
preferred destination. About 159 million of them want to come here.And it appears we shall ignore truth for another year. This is apparently not
the year for action on the matter, despite the optics of caravans and assaults
on our Border Patrol.One has to wonder what it will take for us to
get the point.
I wonder if the DesNews will protect Trump more on his poor behaviour.
Can any reasonable person not see how unhinged, and how puerile, was the
President?Mrs Pelosi repeatedly asked to adjourn to a private
meeting without the Press, and was rebuffed by the President. These 3 people
obviously have little respect for one another, but Pelosi wanted to save the
country from seeing how bad relations are. What good did it do the President to
continue his rantings and mis-statements of truth to a national audience. And
why own any shutdown of the government. IMHO, Pelosi and Schumer showed more
presidential temperament than did the elected President.We all are
big boys and girls and know these kinds of meetings happen all the time, not
just in the White House. Yet, most of us big boys and girls know better than to
air our dirty laundry to the public on TV. And most of us grown-ups know a
temper tantrum worthy of a 2 year old when we see it.
Perfect, shut it down. Trump and Republican congress have exploded our massive
federal deficit, up 17%, and on the way to 1 trillion/year. Unfunding the border
wall is a small step to fiscal responsibility, but I can't think of a
better place to start.
Ten terrorists have recently been captured near the border? Proof please.
Wait a minute. Why does Trump need funding for his pipe dream of a wall? He
promised his supporters, and all Americans, that, "day one" we would
start building the wall and Mexico was going to pay for it all. Didn't they
pay up, as he promised? Now, he threatens to kill our economy, people's
livelihoods, businesses, and markets by throwing a tantrum and shutting down the
government? That's good for America. Some people are just recovering and
paying for the time when Utah's Mike Lee and Ted Cruz shut down the
government. Any GOP member that supports Trump and his foolishness, needs to be
A temper tantrum is not necessary because Mexico was going to pay for the wall
right away. The Trump Christmas shut down will not make Christmas great again
and may cause an economic depression.