Trump threatens shutdown in wild encounter with Democrats

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  • "Hakuna Matata" Vernal, UT
    Dec. 16, 2018 3:28 p.m.

    I think he should delegate the government shut down chore to Ted Cruz and then fire him if nothing gets accomplished. LOL!

  • TerraPack Sandy, UT
    Dec. 16, 2018 2:28 a.m.

    It is appropriate to remember that illegal immigration from our southern border, both direct and indirect /delayed, have added over 30 million to the ranks of Hispanics in America. All the way along that wild and irresponsible path, Democrats have maneuvered and manipulated and stonewalled to make political hay for themselves, all to our country's detriment.

    Here we are at the tail end of that long treasonous process, with a President who seriously intends to stop the problems there, come hell or high water.

    Not surprisingly, there are many who still want to make political hay for "progressives" and Democrats. Even more still want to enjoy the repeat opportunity to emote synchronously with border-stormers and legal/ illegal entrants.

    So, remember again the long incompetent road to border control with 30 million emigres who came without consent or control. We still have 10.7 MILLION illegals who don't want to go back. We still have Democrats who want to give citizenship to millions more, out of pure compassion.

    So, which will it be, compassion or control?

  • Moderate Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 2:30 p.m.

    Herbert Gravy "President Trump tried to explain over and over to Ms. Pelosi that 60 votes are required."
    I missed the part where the current Republican majority in the House passed full approval of Donald Trump's wild wall spending spree only to be thwarted by those pesky Democrats in the Senate. What was the House Bill Number which was resoundingly defeated in the Senate?

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 2:18 p.m.

    @moderate

    President Trump tried to explain over and over to Ms. Pelosi that 60 votes are required in the Senate.

    Last time I checked, the Republicans had somewhat less than 60 senators.

    Again, who are the "obstructionists"?

    🤔

  • joewillie12 Corpus Christi, TX
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:48 p.m.

    VP Pence looked like every 5 year old watching mom and dad fight.

    I felt sorry for him.

  • Moderate Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:29 p.m.

    Herbert Gravy "Typical Pelosi obstructionism."
    The Republicans still control the House and Senate until January. Why are they not giving Trump the money that he wants? Typical Republican obstructionism.

    patriot "both Pelosi and Schumer going on record saying they want open borders."
    They didn't say that, so its not "on record". You simply made that up.
    The borders are not open now. The Democrats prefer to continue CONTROLLED borders, as we have today. Clearly controlled borders work, because the caravan stopped. The Republicans didn't buy Trump's wall shtick. Why should the Democrats?

  • joewillie12 Corpus Christi, TX
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:20 p.m.

    A few points:

    Overstayed visas is by far the largest source of illegal aliens in the US. The Border Patrol has only picked up ~ 130K Mexico border crossers this year compared to over 1 million in 2000.

    Illegal aliens come to the US to work. And they do. Even at Trump properties.

    More than 60% of all illegal aliens have been here over 10 years.
    Source: The Pew Studies

    Bottomline: Seriously crack down on employers and track visitors via GPS if we're serious about curbing illegal immigration.

    As has been pointed out repeatedly, lock and walls keep honest people honest.

  • wgirl Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:07 p.m.

    @Cougar: "take down the fence around your house. Allow whomever to enter your property at will."

    @Patriot: "Now people see and hear both Pelosi and Schumer going on record saying they want open borders. Yikes!! Pelosi kept pleading to turn the camera off"

    Nobody has said they don't want any borders or that they don't want border security. Watch the video - Trump accuses "Dems" of wanting "open borders" but that just isn't true. Democrats have supported, voted for, and championed border security funding and laws. They are proposing the exact same funding for border security as last year.

    They just don't want to spend Billions on a wall that experts agree is not the best way to secure the border. Besides, Trump vowed that Mexico would pay for it.

    It was pretty underhanded of Trump to call the press in last minute and put on a show of arguing with, talking over and interrupting Pelosi and Schumer. They respectfully called him "Mr. President" while he called them "Nancy" and "Chuck." He loved it - his chest puffed up and he got a gleam in his eye. He loves contention.

    Pelosi and Schumer didn't want to degrade The Office of the President. Too late for that.

  • nonceleb Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:01 p.m.

    @ patriot - Cedar Hills, UT
    If you had actually followed the conversation in the meeting, Pelosi and Schumer said they are not for open borders and favor enhanced border security, but not a wall, which they said would costly (about 30 billion to build and another 8 billion over ten years to maintain) and would be virtually ineffective anyway. Trump has falsely accused those of opposing his wall as favoring open borders. That is a false narrative. And to claim that he won the election because the American people wanted a border wall is ridiculous. The wall was a low priority with voters. And Trump only won 46.1% of the popular vote compared to 48.2% for Hillary. Nationwide Hillary had 2.9 million more popular votes than Trump. Also, most Americans do not want a border wall along the length of our southern border. A Gallup poll in June of 2018 found that 57% opposed such a wall, and only 41% support it (2% had no opinion). As for the other sticking point, DACA, 83% of Americans approve of allowing them to have a pathway to citizenship.

  • Cougar_Trojan_Spurs_Fan San Diego, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 12:19 p.m.

    I have two thoughts on the border wall and the government shutdown:

    For the wall, my only thought, or suggestion rather, would be to those that oppose it:

    Then take down the fence around your house. Allow whomever to enter your property at will.

    And for the government shutdown:

    The last time it happened, all those who did not get paid during the shutdown got paid once the budget was passed and government was re-opened for business. For those who say that if the government shuts down, there will be an economic collapse, or depression even, I say to them that those same fears were expressed the last time around that this happened. There was no economic collapse, or depression, then, and there won't be one now!

    Build the wall!

    And shut 'er down if necessary!

    Trump 2020

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 11:56 a.m.

    Smart move by the president. One thing Pelosi hates more than anything is a public conversation for all to see. Now people see and hear both Pelosi and Schumer going on record saying they want open borders. Yikes!! Pelosi kept pleading to turn the camera off -- sorry Nancy but the public has the right to see and hear. The president has nothing to hide regarding his immigration policy but the Democrats sure do. Also president Trump made it clear that he won the 2016 election because people in the US wanted a safe border and according to our own border patrol that means a wall must be built. Border control agents all say they can't secure the border without a wall. The president said that a government shut down would be worth protecting the American people. Right on! By the way -- during a shut down 75% of the government is funded regardless -- the essential parts. Trump is 100% right to stand firm. Democrats want an open border to ensure their power and money stay intact even if drugs and human trafficking and terrorism explode.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 11:32 a.m.

    Where is Cohen when you need him.

  • Bob Tanner Price, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 11:27 a.m.

    About Pelosi...I fail to see how building a wall to keep illegal aliens from entering our country is "immoral." In what way is a border wall Immoral?
    Not following our immigration laws might be immoral. During the early part of the 1900's every immigrant had to pass through Ellis Island. They had to agree to support our constitution, Flag and learn to speak English. They agree. And our nation was enhanced by their determination. Today's "illegal aliens" want to live in close knit groups, live under their own laws and they do not want to learn English and they continue to speak using their native language. Our constitution means absolutely nothing to them. Build the wall.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    Dec. 12, 2018 11:05 a.m.

    worf,
    "A president with grit fighting for the safety of our country is marvelous! I'm sure these Democrats lock their doors at night. Does it make them racist or mean spirited?"
    ____________________
    I recall when before the 2016 election, Trump celebrated one Cinco de Mayo day by publicly eating a taco salad making sure there were news cameras galore on hand to broadcast the event. That cynical image has stuck in my mind.

    Trump is entitled to his views even though I regard them as ignorant and a remnant of a past America yet struggles to transcend. I have my own views on Hispanics based on my own actual experience. Yes, they have their bad elements, as does white America. And just like white America, they have their own culture and traditions in which they take pride. But I refuse to see Hispanics or any other ethnic groups as malefactors, parasites, or any other mean-spirited stereotype that some in our country won't stop trying to breathe new life into.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 10:17 a.m.

    @unrepentant

    Puerile? Oh, my.

    And Pelosi wasn't?

    🤔

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 10:17 a.m.

    @ one old man

    An improvement?

    Nope. Not so much.

    🤔🤗

  • worf McAllen, TX
    Dec. 12, 2018 9:57 a.m.

    Very refreshing!

    A president with grit fighting for the safety of our country is marvelous!

    I'm sure these Democrats lock their doors at night. Does it make them racist or mean spirited?

  • Vermonter Plymouth, MI
    Dec. 12, 2018 9:20 a.m.

    @Utah Blue Devil.
    Did a little research on Israel’s border security. I know it’s all relative, but it appears terrorist attacks are down substantially in the past ten years in areas where fences and walls have been erected.

    And I agree with you about Trump. Oddly enough he is quite dogged about keeping his campaign promises on trade and immigration, even if he gets the “bad guy” or “bully” label.

    It would be nice if Pelosi and Schumer finally realized Trump’s not bluffing.

  • Vermonter Plymouth, MI
    Dec. 12, 2018 9:01 a.m.

    “It’s called transparency.”

    Actually I think it was a good negotiating session (albeit Manhattan real estate developer style). Trump, Pelosi and Schumer understand each other a lot better now and will come to an agreement a lot sooner.

    Will the government shut down? I think so. But it will be a lot shorter now.

  • RC in WJ WEST JORDAN, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 8:19 a.m.

    A classic display of leadership! Unfortunately it wasn't by the person who sits in the oval office!

    Trump all along planned to call in the media at the last minute, in hopes of trying to make the Dems. look bad. Unfortunately it was Pelosi, who in a short 15 minutes reduced Trump to a petulant child, throwing an epic tantrum.

    It was a massive meltdown in front of the world, induced by a woman no less, who has forgotten more about leadership and governing than Trump will ever know.

    I am no fan of Pelosi, but it was amazing watching her push Trumps buttons, and ensuing childish reactions. I can only imagine what would have happened if he had sat before Muellers team. He would be in a sanitarium under sedation!

    Even Trump knew he had been played and fell for it. Following the meeting, as he, in a fit of anger, stomped out of the room, throwing a sheaf of papers. Fortunately the Football was not close at hand!

    People complain Pence did nothing, said nothing. Actually, he picked up the papers Trump threw around the room.

    This country is in trouble, but not as much trouble as Trump!

  • one old man MSC, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 8:13 a.m.

    Herbert Gravy - Salinas, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 6:24 a.m.
    Typical Pelosi obstructionism.

    And, we want folks like her to be in charge of our government?

    =====

    Even she would be a yuge improvement over what we have now . . .

  • UtahBlueDevil Alpine, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 7:24 a.m.

    The problem is that even in Israel we have seen that Walls don't solve much. Just this week a second Hamas tunnel was discovered. There are locations it could work. There are locations we already have it. There are locations where we have a wall that tunnels have been discovered.

    So I see this as more about political posturing rather than a real attempt at a solution. And two things we have learned about Trump.

    1) If he said he is going to do something, he is going to do it - regardless of the logic or even changing circumstances. Coal is a great example. Japan announced they are shuttering 1/2 their coal plants because it is now more expensive than other forms of carbon energy.

    2) Trump will follow through on his threats. Our trade wars are a great example. US heavy manufacturing exports are down because of tariffs. In some areas by 20%. Caterpillar just announced layoffs. Doesn't matter. He is a man determined to do it his way regardless.... so you can take him at his word on threats.

    The wall or parts of it will be built - even if it shuts the government down - and has little real impact. He will do it. Mexico just isn't paying for it.

  • Hockey Fan Miles City, MT
    Dec. 12, 2018 6:46 a.m.

    "I'm [still] proud to be an American," but this is so embarrassing. Washington gridlock is one thing, but this type of behavior is an insult human dignity and civil decency.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Dec. 12, 2018 6:24 a.m.

    Typical Pelosi obstructionism.

    With her "skunk" comment after the meeting, she also demonstrated that she doesn't know much about skunks.

    She also did a huge share of the "bickering" although the headline of the article would lead one to believe otherwise.

    And, we want folks like her to be in charge of our government?

    🤔

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 12, 2018 1:05 a.m.

    If he wants to own something this foolish, let the Donald trump government shutdown and tantrum begin.

  • silo Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 10:49 p.m.

    @bamaphone
    "so such a reversal suggests that they don’t care if the southern border is trampled."

    Actually, it suggests that they grasp basic logic and math, and realize the border wall has nothing to do with anything but Trump's ego.

  • majmajor Layton, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 9:24 p.m.

    All three acted like children. Can't vote for two of them, and will never vote for the third.

  • "Hakuna Matata" Vernal, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 8:59 p.m.

    "Trump questioned Pelosi's ability to count votes in her own House. She questioned his manhood — after she left the building."

    Really Nancy? This is the best you could come up with? "His manhood?" How about his impulsiveness?

  • one old man MSC, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 6:30 p.m.

    Daedalus, Stephen - ARVADA, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:13 p.m.
    It is clear watching the video of this meeting that Pelosi has raised children.
    ========

    Good point, Stephen. Agreed. But even a good mother may not be able to cope with a disturbed child without competent help from expert psychologists.

    When I was teaching, I would have been required to refer any student to school psychologists if they acted in ways we've seen trump acting. I'd have been required to inform law enforcement personnel if any of them had engaged in sexual misconduct similar to that he has actually bragged about. I'd have been required to seek counseling for any who demonstrated constant pathological lying, bullying, and insulting others.

    But the White House is not a school, and there are no responsible adults available to seek help for a very troubled and immature person who is acting out constantly in very inappropriate ways.

    What is happening is shameful. Thank goodness our schools can at least try to help troubled students.

    But where is help when we need it so badly now in another important place?

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 5:57 p.m.

    @bamafone
    "Democrat leaders are all on record previously as wanting a wall"

    Reluctantly agreeing to a wall in exchange for DACA is not the same as wanting a wall.

  • Fabulous Jen Eagle Mountain, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 4:51 p.m.

    "We've recently caught many bad guys at the border. They've all claimed to be the boogieman."

    Trump base: *wild cheers*

  • bamafone Salem, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 4:40 p.m.

    Trump took it to them. Democrat leaders are all on record previously as wanting a wall, so such a reversal suggests that they don’t care if the southern border is trampled. They need the votes.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 3:43 p.m.

    Tolstoy,
    "Why do Trump and his supporters insist on basing their arguments on out right lies...."
    ____________________
    Truthful arguments stand on their own merits with no need to feign rationality, logic, and facts. That Trump chooses to create his own 'truth' is the single greatest evidence of how empty and vaporous his signature causes and ideas are.

  • Lia Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:56 p.m.

    Really?

    He bickered?
    Threatened a government shutdown?

    I can't believe it.

    Certainly not THAT great scholar and gentleman...I'll not buy that for a second...

  • Tolstoy salt lake, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:34 p.m.

    @flip phone
    Why do Trump and his supporters insist on basing their arguments on out right lies (illigeal immigration has dramatically dropped we are not “being invaded”) and straw man arguments claiming Democrats don’t want border security?

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:36 p.m.

    Were this a serious conference, it would have been behind closed doors. It wasn't. It was televised for political show.

  • my_two_cents_worth university place, WA
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:33 p.m.

    So, a border wall is so essential to our security that the Commander in Chief is willing to furlough those charged with securing it to get it? Is the border wall more important than paying the troops or making sure homeland security can continue to operate? Is the border wall more imoprtant than keeping medical services running for our veterans?

  • Unreconstructed Reb BE, 00
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:14 p.m.

    I think Pence was doing his best impression of a wall during the entire argument.

  • silo Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:10 p.m.

    @flipphone
    "Why don't you democrats want a secured border?"

    Why do Trump supporters resort to strawman arguments.

    Resisting the wall has zero to do with wanting a secured border. Resisting the wall has to do with striking a balance between wants, needs and costs.

    Currently, the want for the wall is only from Trump and his supporters. The need for the wall doesn't exist in reality. The cost of the wall has shifted from Mexico to the US taxpayer. Thus the resistance.

    US taxpayers should not be asked to pay for something that isn't needed simply because Trump wants it.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:01 p.m.

    trump accomplished absolutely nothing with a majority in the house and senate. Now that he'll face opposition to his awful ideas it's going to get even more difficult.

  • Joe Leaphorn Scottsdale, AZ
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:59 p.m.

    Flipphone - Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:19 p.m.

    "Why don't you democrats want a secured border?"

    Who said Democrats don't want a secure border? Donald Trump?

    You source of information is in error. This topic has been debated ad absurdum in these threads. But a Wall is not going to guarantee a secure border. It's only going to be a multi-billion dollar boondoggle to salve Trump's ego. There are other ways, supported by both Democrats and Republicans that will do much better. History will teach you this. The Great Chinese Wall didn't keep the Mongols out and Trump's Wall will not stop illegal crossings. The either go over, under, around, or through any Wall.

    And then there are all those ranchers in Texas who don't want any part of a Wall on their land. So, think it through before making further unsubstantiated statements about what Democrats want. Don't fall for the ranting nd fearmongering of a con man.

  • FT salt lake city, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 2:00 p.m.

    As I watched this debacle, there was one person who sat stoned faced and he probably was thinking the whole time in just a few more months his job will be mine. Trump gave me the impression of a baseball manager who had been thrown out of the game but wasn't leaving without kicking some dirt and calling people a few names.

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:43 p.m.

    Usually, a shutdown involves making sure the other side gets the blame. This time, trump wants to own it. That's good, it is his mess.
    Through it all, I've never seen a man try to evaporate as much as Pence did to get out of that room.
    Your move, Donald.

  • Craig Clark Boulder, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:32 p.m.

    "If we don't get what we want, one way or the other, whether it's through you, through military, through anything you want to call, I will shut down the government," Trump ultimately declared.
    ____________________
    America itself held hostage by the President? Oh, yeah. This is Donald Trump.

  • Lia Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:22 p.m.

    Pence never moved during this meeting. Not a muscle.
    He was like the embarrassed kid dressed as the Christmas tree in the school play, with no lines.

  • Flipphone Sandy, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:19 p.m.

    Why don't you democrats want a secured border?

  • conservative scientist Lindon, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:17 p.m.

    Although I'm a Republican, I don't support Trump's wall. Even if I did, the promise was for Mexico to pay for it (from the beginning, I felt like there was a greater likelihood of the earth crashing into the sun than Mexico putting up funds for such a wall) and I don't feel it is a budgetary priority.

  • Daedalus, Stephen ARVADA, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:13 p.m.

    It is clear watching the video of this meeting that Pelosi has raised children.

  • Mad Hatter Santa Fe, NM
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:07 p.m.

    Trump bickers . . .

    Anyone watching this encounter will recognize that Donald Trump continues to peddle fear to scare his base into confronting non-existent problem. For those who see the deceit in Trump's fearmongering and his lies about the Democratic policy on the border recognize that the "invasion" was only theater to boost Republican turnout in the 2018 election. Now that the Republicans have lost and Trump is facing increasing criticism for conspiring with the Russians to win the 2016 election, this distraction is just coating the wall with more mud thrown to see what sticks.

    Time is getting short. January 3rd will finally allow the House to conduct the investigations that it was supposed to do when Trump and his campaign were first identified with possible links to the Russian government. Where proper oversight was neglected in favor of partisan tribalism, the increased scrutiny and possible release of a report from the Mueller team is starting to make Trump more irrational by the day as evidenced by his Oval Office outburst.

  • Yuge Opportunity Here Mapleton, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 1:07 p.m.

    Aah, the wall.

    Using the D News as your info source, you would miss the Gallup Migration Study, published this week.

    The bad news: 750 million adults around the world want to move from their home country to the developed world.

    Bad news, part two: The United States is by far the preferred destination. About 159 million of them want to come here.

    And it appears we shall ignore truth for another year. This is apparently not the year for action on the matter, despite the optics of caravans and assaults on our Border Patrol.

    One has to wonder what it will take for us to get the point.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 12:35 p.m.

    I wonder if the DesNews will protect Trump more on his poor behaviour.

  • unrepentant progressive Bozeman, MT
    Dec. 11, 2018 12:25 p.m.

    Can any reasonable person not see how unhinged, and how puerile, was the President?

    Mrs Pelosi repeatedly asked to adjourn to a private meeting without the Press, and was rebuffed by the President. These 3 people obviously have little respect for one another, but Pelosi wanted to save the country from seeing how bad relations are. What good did it do the President to continue his rantings and mis-statements of truth to a national audience. And why own any shutdown of the government. IMHO, Pelosi and Schumer showed more presidential temperament than did the elected President.

    We all are big boys and girls and know these kinds of meetings happen all the time, not just in the White House. Yet, most of us big boys and girls know better than to air our dirty laundry to the public on TV. And most of us grown-ups know a temper tantrum worthy of a 2 year old when we see it.

  • Hugh1 Denver, CO
    Dec. 11, 2018 11:46 a.m.

    Perfect, shut it down. Trump and Republican congress have exploded our massive federal deficit, up 17%, and on the way to 1 trillion/year. Unfunding the border wall is a small step to fiscal responsibility, but I can't think of a better place to start.

  • Utah Girl Chronicles Eagle Mountain, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 11:42 a.m.

    Ten terrorists have recently been captured near the border? Proof please.

  • Impartial7 DRAPER, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 11:36 a.m.

    Wait a minute. Why does Trump need funding for his pipe dream of a wall? He promised his supporters, and all Americans, that, "day one" we would start building the wall and Mexico was going to pay for it all. Didn't they pay up, as he promised? Now, he threatens to kill our economy, people's livelihoods, businesses, and markets by throwing a tantrum and shutting down the government? That's good for America. Some people are just recovering and paying for the time when Utah's Mike Lee and Ted Cruz shut down the government. Any GOP member that supports Trump and his foolishness, needs to be sent packing.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 11, 2018 11:35 a.m.

    A temper tantrum is not necessary because Mexico was going to pay for the wall right away. The Trump Christmas shut down will not make Christmas great again and may cause an economic depression.