Boyd Matheson: Freedom of association is still a powerful characteristic of a unique nation

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  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Dec. 1, 2018 9:42 p.m.

    The people are certainly free to assemble. If they choose to do so and acclaim the supremacy of the flying spaghetti monster, so be it.

    Just don't ask me to accept their beliefs, nor codify them, nor tolerate them.

  • A Scientist Provo, UT
    Dec. 1, 2018 8:40 a.m.

    Very good responses.

    The hypocrisy is explicit!

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 30, 2018 10:59 p.m.

    @Scientist makes good points.

    Religion can offer opinions and create voting blocs... as can the local Farmers Cooperative, the "People who want a better America", "Teachers for Students" and other organizations covered by our freedoms.

    Religions have the same power as Physicians seeking to improve health for children.

    As it should be.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Nov. 30, 2018 2:35 p.m.

    To "A Scientist" the freedom of association is what is meant by "the right of the people peaceably to assemble". The government can't restrict who you peaceably assemble with, that is also known as freedom of assembly.

    Now, a church can request things of the government also under the 1st amendment. You see, it says that people (a church is a group of people) can "petition the government for a redress of grievances."

    Now, since you claim to be a scientist, lets look at this. If there is a separation between church and state, why can the state interfere with religion? You claim they should be separate yet the government is constantly interfering with religion.

  • NoNamesAccepted St. George, UT
    Nov. 30, 2018 1:37 p.m.

    @A Scientist: "freedom of association" is not mentioned anywhere in the Constitution! "

    The right of the people to peaceably assemble is, as are the "free exercise" of religion, freedom of speech, and the right of the people to petition government for redress of grievance.

    To wit:

    "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

    Rather than quibbling over how freedom of assembly is materially different than freedom of association, please explain how anyone or any peaceful assembly can be prohibited from using their speech, press, or petition rights simply because you think their desired views are too religious in nature?

    It is notable that the "free exercise" of religion is explicitly protected while some mythical "freedom from religion" is not protected. Neither is the "free exercise of secular behavior that is hostile to religion" expressly protected. Much as it galls anti-theists, religion enjoys a constitutionally protected position in our nation.

  • The-Antidote Highland, UT
    Nov. 30, 2018 1:14 p.m.

    A Scientist

    "or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble": If that doesn't scream freedom of association, I don't know what does.

    I sympathize with your frustration of church meddling in State (certainly in Utah). But to be anti freedom of association is B A N A N A S......Bananas!

  • OlderGreg USA, CA
    Nov. 30, 2018 12:45 p.m.

    A Scientist:
    The Constitution spells out what the government can/ cannot do. It specifically says all else is for the states and the people to decide.

    Religion is in there twice:

    The first says that no religious test will be required for someone in government. (eg Violated by a Democrat asking a Trump nominee if he believed in God)

    The second says the government will not establish a church. Like the Church of England -- or like Portugals former Roman Catholic Church only laws.

    Just how does that translate to censoring discussion of religion/ principles/ standards in the public square?

  • A Scientist Provo, UT
    Nov. 30, 2018 11:38 a.m.

    Let's pull a conservative trick: the "freedom of association" is not mentioned anywhere in the Constitution!

    So, now tell me again where "freedom from religion" or "the separation of Church and State" are not found in the Constitution?! -- and try to justify your religion meddling in government...