Sex illegal can't vote how does that benefit Democrats maybe some voter
fraud but not of that magnitude
Google----- "President Clinton's State of the Union address of
1995......standing ovation for Rhetoric on Illegal Immigration""President Clinton's State of the Union address of 1996....we are a
nation of laws"."Candidate H. Clinton brags about her vote
for a border fence to keep illegal Immigrants out of America".I
support the Clintons stand on Illegal Immigration.
"Abolish ICE so that my friends and compatriots can freely move across the
border".......signed by well known Latino activists and businesses who want
low labor costs (and throw in a few politicians and Chambers).
There is a common misconception with the issue of separating children from
detained illegal alien parents, and it needs to be cleared up. First, not every
child accompanied by an adult is actually with their parent, or even a
relative.ICE policies don't state that they must separate
children. Trump didn't tell ICE to separate children from the adults they
traveled with. Neither did Obama or Bush, but it happened under their
administrations as well.The courts told ICE that they could not
incarcerate children with their adult companions in facilities not specifically
built to properly handle adults and children. No one wanted to build such
facilities, so the courts directed that the children go into Child Protective
Services or foster care.All Trump did was tell ICE to enforce
immigration law on every person who has broken it.There are two
possible solutions to the illegal immigration problem. Change the law, and stop
trying to have a sovereign nation. Or make it so difficult to get in the US and
stay illegally that people stop doing it.
Yes, abolish ICE and replace it with something much more strict and
effective.Something that actually protects the borders and provides
a legal path to citizenship.
As the former head of ICE has pointed out in the news many times in the past
month, 89% of those arrested this past year had a criminal record. They are
doing a great job.
@ 2 bits"Nobody on the Left so far has even tried to answer
BleedCougarBlue's question...Why is nobody even trying to answer
it?"Because it's a red herring.Because
it's hyperbolic.Because it doesn't reflect reality.Because it's campaign rhetoric and campaign rhetoric is just that -
rhetoric. It over-simplifies, overstates and casts positions in the starkest
terms possible. But it's rhetoric. Unfortunately, because we are now
always in campaign mode, it never stops and apparently mere repetition has led
some to believe it's true.It isn't. Most things cast in
binary black/white or either/or terms aren't. Humans and human problems
aren't that simplistic. So please approach with healthy skepticism anyone
that attempts to present issues that way. They're either mistaken or
trying to exploit something for their own good.
We need to also remember the C stands for customs. I image drug smugglers would
like to get rid of ice as would the sex traffickers and coyotes. It makes
illegal activity much easier. Maybe ice needs to attend these demonstrations
with police to see how many foreign nationals are trying to influence our
process. There might be Russians in there. If you dont like the laws
get congress to change them in the meantime enforce them completely.
any reasonable person knows we need our borders secure. Do we really
want a repeat of the 911 hijackings???
siloA misdemeanor can include a year in jail. So yes we do separate
parents from children here. You are ignoring the felonies many
commit by working here illegally.
No just abolish liberal foolishness
Abolish ICE and replace it with what? Yes we've had our Social Security
number used fraudulently in Florida, had a credit card acct used fraudulently in
Southern Cal to purchase cell phones from Spain (what the?) had friend's
houses broken into in San Diego...We live far enough from the porous borders in
Utah that we are somewhat immune to the crimes in areas closer. If ICE can help
protect U.S. citizens from the illegal activities that may accompany illegal
aliens why is anyone complaining? Keep ICE; obey the laws of this country and
you have no reason to worry or protest.
silo:"The issue is that per Federal code, illegal entry by a foreign
national is a simple misdemeanor, and is not a crime that justifies
incarceration, nor seizure of children and separation."The
process is called 'catch (arrest) and release.' While illegal
immigrants are incarcerated and taken to court to plead their case, or to set a
court date, the children are separated. If the illegal had not crossed the
border but had followed the proper and appropriate procedure to gain access to
America, the children would not be separated. "Not to mention it
runs afoul of the Constitution's 8th amendment position on punishment
fitting the crime."Neither children or illegal immigrant parents
are being punished. They're simply being separated for a spell while
Government laws for illegal entry are being executed."We
don't separate the children of US citizens when they commit simple
misdemeanors because our society would never tolerate it. Why should it be
different with foreign nationals."It's gotta be more than a
misdemeanor. People don't get arrested and detained for a misdemeanor
(speeding ticket, for example). But, they do get arrested for illegal entry.
@SMcloud - 12:08RE: "I do find separating families from children for
months abominable and shameful though"...---You are aware that
children were often separated when Obama was President also... right?There were lots of "unaccompanied Minors" entering when he was
President too. Google it.Clinton admin too.Google
"Illegal Immigration Reform and Immigrant Responsibility Act of
1996"...Wikipedia:"This act states that immigrants
unlawfully present in the United States for 180 days but less than 365 days must
remain outside the United States for three years unless they obtain a pardon. If
they are in the United States for 365 days or more, they must stay outside the
United States for ten years unless they obtain a waiver. If they return to the
United States without the pardon, they may not apply for a waiver for a period
of ten years.Among other things, it explicitly gave the Attorney
General broad authority to construct barriers along the US-Mexico border and
authorized the construction of a secondary layer of border fencing to buttress
the already completed 14 mile primary fence"...If Trump proposed
this law... you would flip out.Clinton does it... that's fine.
RE: "BleedCougarBlue 7:51's question"...---Nobody on
the Left so far has even tried to answer BleedCougarBlue's question.It's a valid question.It's a simple question.It's a serious question.Why is nobody even trying to
answer it?He asks a simple question. "Why is it ok for every
single country in the world EXCEPT America to protect their borders?"...In other words... Why is it only wrong for the USA to enforce their
borders and their laws Democrats?I'll be waiting to hear the
answer.Should no countries in the world have immigration laws, or
enforce them? Why just us?Other countries have immigration laws,
and they enforce them. Why are they not vilified by the Left?
Harrison Bergeron 10:52 has a good point.I also encourage all
Democrats to run on the abolishment of ICE. Open borders should also be adopted
as a central feature of their platform. Because then they will lose more
elections the would have won otherwise.I think Trump's being
firmer on Immigration Reform was the main reason he won the Republican Primary,
and the 2016 election.Well that, and... contracting with Vladimir
Putin and ex-FBI director Comey to make Hillary Clinton look bad. It was a
"Right-Wing-Conspiracy" I tell you (words or Hillary Clinton back when
her husband was getting impeached).Take this one and run with it
RE: "Ocasio-Cortez’s immigration platform was especially influential,
calling for the abolishment of Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), the
agency tasked with enforcing the immigration laws of the United
States"...---So what's the rational for abolishing ICE?
They have a legitimate job to do.Democrats may not like how ICE is
doing it's job. But it has a job to do, and they are trying to do it.You can't abolish ICE without abolishing the laws they are tasked
with enforcing. Are we ready to do that? Are Democrats ready to completely
get rid of our Immigration Laws?They talk about it a lot, but I
don't think Democrats, or even people like Bernie Sanders are ready to
abolish any and all Immigration Laws in the United States. She's WAY out
in Left-Field. Even further than Bernie Sanders and his fans.As
long as we have immigration laws (and we do need immigration laws)... we will
need an agency to enforce those laws. Unless... we let Police, or States do it
(which even just talking about it got Arizona in a HEAP of trouble with the
Federal Government).Unless you come up with a replacement for ICE...
or get rid of our laws... it won't work Democrats.
siloIt's a civil infraction and a crime (misdemeanor) to cross
the border, once here working, I-9 perjury, id theft and social security fraud
are all felonies. Not to mention it's a felony to hire a person
here illegally, and a misdemeanor to supply housing (Federal law).The problem would be solved by making e-verify mandatory with stiff fines. A
wall would be a second deterrent. From the article, it sounds like most
Americans know this, so when will our leaders act on it?
This is why I appreciate Independent voices that have made a differentiation
between liberals and "leftists". Most born and dyed in the wool
Democrats/Liberals do not want ICE to be abolished and want fair and consistent
immigration laws.As a Libertarian, it is the alt-right and
antifa/ultralib fringes that I think are dangerous to the harmony and unity of
our country. Take the time to read and truly evaluate the issues on both sides
rather than be tempted to resort to knee-jerk responses we see far too often in
these comment threads. The truth is most frequently found somewhere between the
polar opposites of an issue.
The whole topic of not allowing children to be held in detention while amnesty
requests are processed could be easily solved. Simply require that any amnesty
requests be submitted at the U.S. Consulate in their country of origin and the
hearings held there. They can wait with their children in their own home.
This is the core of the problem.---“The real grievance here
... is the way ICE is going about its work, and that’s a matter of policy
and priorities that have shifted dramatically from the prior
administration,”---US Immigration law should take in to
account the long standing 'open door' policy of the US, and in the
case of the neighboring countries of Canada and Mexico, not only the long
standing association, but the innumerable cross border connections between the
US and these two neighbor countries.Part of the failure of NAFTA was
the lack of provisions for freer cross border activities by citizens of all 3
countries.Trump and Co. with their go it alone policies, will only
exacerbate the problems along the borders, and especially the southern border
with Mexico.As for the current population of undocumented aliens,
amnesty and bringing them into documented status. ICE should be returned to
'Immigration and Naturalization', and 'Customs'. The later
is far more of a policing situation. The combined functions, the policing
function has become more the policy and style than previously, to the detriment
of those persons seeking to live and work in the US in a peaceful way.
So the left is pushing for unlimited illegal immigration by abolishing our
border patrol and allowing any and all to pour across our borders; especially Al
Qaeda and Isis and MS-13. And then the left argues that illegal
immigrants should get unlimited benefits too--welfare, health care, free
everything, as long as they vote Democrat, naturally (Funny how Cuban and
Vietnamese immigrants, who tend to vote Republican, are actually punished by the
left). So the left wants unlimited illegal immigration for an
unlimited welfare state. How are we supposed to pay for all of this, leftists?
When asked a similar question, the Democrat politician said something like
"Just give the illegals the unlimited health care now, and we'll figure
out how to pay for it later." How about we just put a tax on
movie star salaries to pay for everything an illegal immigrant gets to soak the
taxpayer for? Plus a tax on abortions. If the left wants illegals to get
unlimited everything, let the left pay for it, not the rest of us.
ICE is not the problem. Pathetic political leadership is. The problem is
sitting behind the Resolute Desk in the Oval Office composing another Tweet.
Abolish ICE? Of course not.I do find separating families from
children for months abominable and shameful though. Immigrants need to be
handled with dignity, no matter their situation.America needs to be
the leader in human rights. Immigrants are humans too.
Of course the only people pushing for this are illegals and the democrats who
can't win an election without their votes. I say ICE needs to ramp up, work
harder, and rid this country of more illegal criminals than ever before.
I just found out that someone's been using my SS#. Yeah, someone in New
Jersey is working at a burger joint using my SS#. Wish me luck as I try to clean
this mess up.*broaden the authority and power of ICE*build a
@vanceone"If Trump is putting fear into the hearts of the illegals,
and they are self deporting... isn't that great?"If it runs
counter to our federal laws and violates our Constitution? Absolutely not.
@Neanderthal"Family separation is not caused by ICE or any other
government agency. Family separation is caused by illegal parents trying to
enter the US illegally."100% false.Prior to Jeff
Session's enforcement memo written in April of this year, family separation
for first time offenders was never performed. The policy was enacted as a
'deterrent', and WH Chief of Staff Kelly used that exact wording in
interviews.The issue is that per Federal code, illegal entry by a
foreign national is a simple misdemeanor, and is not a crime that justifies
incarceration, nor seizure of children and separation. Not to mention it runs
afoul of the Constitution's 8th amendment position on punishment fitting
the crime.This policy was put in place by the Trump administration
in April, bragged about as a deterrent in May, and rescinded a few months later
by Executive Order when challenged in court.We don't separate
the children of US citizens when they commit simple misdemeanors because our
society would never tolerate it. Why should it be different with foreign
@saynotoBO"Very credible analyses have put the number at 20 million in
2005 (Robert Justich and Betty Ng)."Robert Justich and Betty Ng
were both analysts at Bear Stearns. The same Bear Stearns that failed in the
financial crisis, requested $25 billion from the US government in the form of a
bailout, only to be purchased by JP Morgan. Not much credibility there."Of course, for 8 years of that decade, Obama was keeping score
using Napolitano and Johnson. "The same dataset goes back to
2001. Obama wasn't president then, so how did Napolitano and Johnson skew
those numbers prior to Obama's presidency starting in 2009?
Of course, this is beyond ridiculous. But look at all the other ridiculous
things the far left are pushing for including-open borders-weak
(defund) military, -a free ride through college for every person-free (socialist) healthcare for all-free public transportation-free internet-shorter work weeks, more benefits-free blah, blah,
blah....Yes, get, get, get... no responsibility for taking care of
yourself or your family. Everything must be provided and insured on top of
that. Sounds good to me!
silo wrote: "Per ICE themselves, the number of illegals in country has
remained constant at 11 million for the past decade. There is no 'flood of
illegal immigrants'."Of course, for 8 years of that decade,
Obama was keeping score using Napolitano and Johnson. Data on illegal aliens has
always been elusive. Very credible analyses have put the number at 20 million in
2005 (Robert Justich and Betty Ng). The incentive to move from the
third world to developed nations is a global problem. Ten percent of the
world's population wants to live in the US, Canada, UK, France, Germany,
Saudi Arabia, Australia and Singapore (Gallup 2009).Does anyone
think that urge somehow abated in 2008?The pressure is real. The
border is porous. Let us not believe there is no open border threat today.
Can conservatives be any more dense?Apparently so!
@SLars:"Why does the press keep running down Trump?"The reason is... the press is mostly Liberal, i.e., Democrat. And they hate
Trump. The hate stems from their presidential candidate, Hillary, being beaten
in the last election. They thought they had a shoo-in candidate. Before the
election, the press probably couldn't care about Trump.@BleedCougarBlue:"Why is it ok for every single country in the world
EXCEPT America to protect their borders?"Many European nations
didn't have strict border policies... until the Muslims from the Middle
East began pouring in. Those countries now see that, if they leave open borders
they will soon become a Muslim nation controlled by Islam's Shariah Law."Yes, that's an honest question. A civil question and I will
check back to see your answer."The Democrats mostly want open
borders because they need more Democrat voters. If they can get more supporters
(via the illegal immigrant process) they can count on an ever increasing voter
@SAS:"Should we abolish an agency that had no problem separating kids
from their families, and which still hasn't managed to reunite some of
those kids? Heck yes."Family separation is not caused by ICE or
any other government agency. Family separation is caused by illegal parents
trying to enter the US illegally."We need a new agency, with a
different institutional culture, before people will trust that our laws are
being enforced in a reasonable, fair, and humane way."Our
current immigration laws are reasonable. If someone wishes to come to the US
and become a US citizen, What's required is to fill out the appropriate
paperwork, get interviewed by the authoritative agency, and get in line.
Thousands have done it and succeeded. Any other way may spell doom to the
American way of life.We need ICE and strong/controlled borders. Let
in enough illegals from 3rd world countries and the US would soon become a 3rd
LibsHow about abolishing the IRS as they target conservative groups and
separate families when they prosecute tax “evaders”.
Ask yourself this: When we hear of the "inhumane" and "Brutal"
and "terrifying ICE enforcement", and how the illegal immigrant
community is scared and are fleeing and going back home in fear they will be
arrested and separated from their family, etc etc and all the rest of the fear
mongering.....Isn't this a good thing? If Trump is putting fear
into the hearts of the illegals, and they are self deporting... isn't that
great? If he's scaring these people into leaving without having to deport
them--I say, good job!And if you say, "that's horrible"
then I ask: why do you want to destroy the concept of America? We have borders,
and you are sad that Trump is protecting them? Well, I guess when
it comes to the Wall, Trump and conservatives have different ideas of what walls
are for from the left. The left loves walls, too: They build them to keep
people from fleeing "the people's paradise". The right has to
build walls to keep people out of the societies we build. Today,
Democrats still mourn the fall of the Berlin wall.
"Stop being dishonest and divisive! Fake comments = fake news!" Wow...The story isn't really about the protesters, it's about
the Democratic party and their desire to open the borders, and the (sad?) fact
that most of their constituents don't want that. So, the question is, how
can they highlight any ICE initiatives in a negative way to slowly move their
base to agree with the party leadership? Trust me, they will find a way...
@mainly me"The only reason Democrats want to eliminate ICE is so the
country can be flooded with illegal immigrants."Per ICE
themselves, the number of illegals in country has remained constant at 11
million for the past decade. There is no 'flood of illegal
immigrants'.Should we eliminate ICE? No.Should we
hold them accountable to enforce the laws with transparency and accountability?
Dumb question? If you abolish ICE, what are you going to replace it with? If you
say nothing, then you're saying our current illegal immigration situation
is acceptable. It isn't! Are you going to replace it with another agency
with a different name with basically the same functions? What's the point?
If there are abuses within ICE, fix them, but don't get rid of the agency.
It exists for a purpose--to enforce immigration laws. And they need to be
enforced more than ever. I have no problem with immigration. It just needs to
be legal and controlled.
This illustrates the idiocy and illegitimacy of the leftist, progressive liberal
democrats. Look at the pictures and see who is demonstrating - those that want
to open the borders entirely to “everyone.” The Democrats support
this so that they can get more votes from people that immediately become
dependent on government welfare programs.
This story intimate that ICE was a creation of Homeland Security after 9/11. Not
so."La Migra" and "Los Federales" have existed for
decades. INS used to be their name.Truth be told, the new
organization of ICE actually WEAKENED immigration enforcement by adding Customs
to their plate. Instead of worksite raids they now had the duty of tracking down
bogus Gucci handbags.Trump was the first to actually give ICE the
duty of enforcing the law. GWB was pro-amnesty and practiced de facto amnesty
enforcement (or lack of it.) Obama was even less interested and ended the few
worksite raids.Stategically, Trump rightly believed that it would be
good to discourage people from even making the attempt to come here. Obama had
made a mess of things at the border with DACA and illegals quickly learned to
claim asylum.Once you strip away the hype, the question is open
borders. We officially have a body of law that spells out an orderly process,
allowing 1 million green cards a year from all over the world. Preserving that
requires enforcement.We have allowed about a million more a year to
come here outside the system.Open up or crack down?
@kolobBut, there are no "blanks".I for one think
the name "ICE" is very "cool".🤗
Is this a real story?I think we should abolish 80% of government
You may not be aware, but a large portion of arrests by ICE deal with human
trafficking. This agency leads all others, including Interpol, the FBI, and all
other agencies in enforcement. I have seen 2 separate reports, both with
similar numbers of children and adults being rescued from this horrendous life
by ICE. But this does not fit into the narrative being pushed by the
main-stream media, or those in the left-wing socialists group, that most folks
refer to as the democratic party. Additionally, those that castigate this
agency probably couldn't tell you (without an electronic device to read)
what ICE stands for. This agency does NOT make the rules, Congress (or the
previous occupant of the WH - by fiat) does.
Question for the liberals out there:Why is it ok for every single
country in the world EXCEPT America to protect their borders?Yes,
that's an honest question. A civil question and I will check back to see
I would recommend an overhaul with an emphasis on a new name and eliminating the
gestapo look alikes.. The anagram ICE is horrible. Can we design an anagram and
then write the name of the organization. IE LOVE , or SAFE or God's Country
???? ( you fill in the blanks ).
Kill the messenger! They are only following the law as it is. Get rid of them
and we will still have the law. It's the law that needs changed. Most of
the Democrats voted for it in the first place.
"the Democrats not wanting to enforce immigration laws""Democrats want to eliminate ICE"Do any of you actually
read the story?"the majority of Democrats aren’t in favor
of abolishing ICE""There was little difference across
partisan lines, with similar minorities of Democrats, independents and
Republicans favoring abolishing the agency"Stop being dishonest
and divisive! Fake comments = fake news!
I would imagine only the truly radical liberals want to abolish ICE. Tweak it,
sure. Every agency has issues. These same liberals that want to abolish ICE just
want open borders. I'm all for legal immigration. I have 3 nephews that
have married girls from other countries. All 3 did it legally. Of course it
would have been much faster, and cheaper, to do it illegally, but if we
don't follow the law, we're not the US anymore.
I have the solution.If the illegal immigrants want to have ICE
abolished, what they need to do is eliminate the need for ICE. If there were no
illegal immigrants in the US, there would be no need for ICE.So, I
say to the illegals here that want to abolish ICE. Please become legal US
residents or return to your country of origin.
Do away with ICE, do away with border security, do away with anything that
stands in the way of “progressives” turning our Constitutional
Republic into a socialist cesspool.I say NO!
Great idea. Then let's get rid of the Hiway Patrol and then local PDs and
then Sheriffs. No law enforcement get that word (enforcement ) wanted. More
hysterical whining from the left. I say expand ICE and turn em loose.
This whole "discussion" about abolishing a major law enforcement agency
is ridiculous. It is nothing but the democrat leadership attempting
to do anything but focus on their failed policies. As you put in your article,
even the rank and file democrats do not want ICE abolished.
Of course we should abolish ICE. Then, let's abolish the FBI and the
CIA.It follows that we should abolish all police departments and all
branches of the military.Of course, we should do away with any
semblance of an immigration policy and declare "open borders".Why not? Sounds like a totally rational approach? Agree?🤔
I had the impression that most Hispanics illegal immigrants living here were law
abiding. Also that deporting them was not a priority for Trump, after all there
are over 10 million of then and deportations are around 200,000. Perhaps many
of these deportations are unnecessary and of otherwise good people. Many are
people who were in a DUI, MS13, felons, etc. who have a criminal record. I would
like to see them go. One way or another I would like to see a merit
based immigration system maybe 2 million per year. I see a wall as a good idea
not so much to keep immigrants out, but to restrain the opioid epidemic which
costs $500 billion a year and 90% of the heroin walking in. Just a 10%
reduction would pay for two walls. A merit based system might slow the STD
epidemic and reduce the enormous costs of illegal immigration.
We need to keep ICE. They have proven to be instrumental in taking down
criminals. These criminals don't belong here and as long as we have
sanctuary cities, we need people whose job is to keep track of illegal aliens
who take advantage of our country and get them deported.
The only reason Democrats want to eliminate ICE is so the country can be flooded
with illegal immigrants. This would change the very fabric of the country and
not necessarily for the better. We cannot afford to care for millions more
immigrants let alone care for the poor of the country who were born here.
When the stories broke about separating the children, pictures followed, along
with the explanation that they were taken during Obamas Presidency (a day
later). Why does the press keep running down Trump? And how can John
Sandweg blame Trump when he did the same thing, and was over ICE when many of
the pictures were taken.
Should we abolish border controls and a system of regulating immigration?
No.Should we abolish an agency that had no problem separating kids
from their families, and which still hasn't managed to reunite some of
those kids? Heck yes.We need a new agency, with a different
institutional culture, before people will trust that our laws are being enforced
in a reasonable, fair, and humane way.
Abolish ICE?And people will take immigration enforcement into their
own hands. This is asking for another civil war. Every Republican
candidate has won the white vote, Ford 52% to Carter 48%, Reagan 56% to 36%,
Reagan 66% to 34%, Bush 60% to 40%, Bush 41% to 39%, Dole 46% to 44%, G.W, Bush
55% to 42%, G W Bush 58% to 41%, McCain 55% to 43%, Romney 59% to 39%. That's the driving force behind the Democrats not wanting to
enforce immigration laws. They need a constant influx of legal and illegal
immigrants and amnesties to build their voter base.
No, of course not.
I would encourage all Democrats to run on the abolishment of ICE. Open borders
should also be adopted as a central feature of their platform. Both the midterms
and the 2020 elections should be referendums on whether or not to keep bringing
illegal aliens into the country.