Dick Harmon: You have to feel for Tanner Mangum and the spot he's in as BYU picks a starting QB

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  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Aug. 24, 2018 9:17 a.m.

    @notsorealute

    "We all viewed what Taysom Hill had to offer the other night, the first time, vs a starting NFL defense(Arizona Cardinals) that isn't very good by NFL measure in fact. Hill was so awful"

    ***
    I'm surprised, I didn't think that you would follow a former Coug QB in the NFL.

    Hill had a bad night Friday night, no doubt... He had a tough time hanging on to the snaps (2 fumbles)... His 2 INTs that he threw were unfortunate but not terrible... The first one the receiver had the ball in both hands and bobbled it (Hill then came 10 to 15 yards from his QB spot to tackle the the interceptor for no return yards)... it was a good throw. The second one was on a 40 to 50 yard fly route that was unfortunate but as good as a punt.

    You must have missed his 42 yard run and his 11 for 15 passing performance. For the second game in a row he had the most passing yards and the most rushing yards for the Saints and this time it was against a first team Defense. He pretty much moved the team down the field at will except for the miscues. I feel bad for him but sometimes those type of things happen. I noticed the Saints Coaches kept him on the field the entire first half despite the TOs.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Aug. 21, 2018 2:22 p.m.

    If a just graduated high school kid is up for the starting job at QB you know Mangum isn't much anymore. Being injured is rough but all QB's have to deal with it. Mangum looks lost most of the time on the field. His freshman year he had zero pressure plus they usually just rolled him out and let him throw as hard as he could to those 2 big 6'3 receivers. Having said that BYU really should start Mangum because he does have alot of experience playing in the most hostile of places. A freshman will be eaten alive by most of BYU opponents but bring him in IF Tanner gets hurt. Bottom line BYU just doesn't have much talent and to no fault of the coaching staff or the athletic director or university. If you can't recruit you can't compete. College Football locked BYU out because they don't like their Christian values -- period. This last fact is perhaps the saddest of all....for College Football not BYU.

  • CountryCoug Parker, CO
    Aug. 20, 2018 5:13 p.m.

    Have a hard time blaming all of Mangum's struggles last year on poor coaching. I would blame in this order: 1) Mangum, 2) Offensive line and 3) poor coaching and mentoring. I am rooting for him and want him to show well. At the same time, if Wilson has a better natural feel for the game, please start him. Mangum does not appear to have that. He looked very average against Wyoming in the Bowl game the year before. Just that deer in the headlight look all season long. Get the darn first down. Scared of him starting.. . He was not in shape to move well. Did not read the field well and go through his progressions. The Offensive Line looked and played horrendously against the better teams. Penalties and weak blocking. Glad Hoge is hear.

  • Gruncle Ralph Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 20, 2018 4:42 p.m.

    @brave sir robin

    No I don't. He could've gone to a different school, one that has coaches who have a clue. He's made his own bed.

    ------------------

    hahaha...sez the fan of the team that started a TE at QB for 4 yrs (the Giraffe) and entered their first Pac12 season thinking that a frail, fragile broken down MWC QB backed up by a DII reject QB was sufficient talent and depth at the QB position.

    de·lu·sion·al
    dlooZH()nl
    (adj)
    based on or having faulty judgment; mistaken

    You have NO room to talk on this subject. Whittingham's repeated failures in recruiting and developing talent at the QB position is the primary reason you guys have never won your division. Whitt's total lack of intelligence or judgement on the subject was never more evident than 2011.

  • london_josh Lincoln, CA
    Aug. 20, 2018 2:03 p.m.

    Mike,

    I know exactly what you are talking about - I don't need to agree with you to see your point.

    The thing is, your point is a certain point of view that certainly has merit to you and others.

    Football, ultimately is a huge business where everybody makes money except the players who wind up hurting themselves, but they get scholarships and their own reasons for playing the game. Why do schools do it - money, either directly or indirectly the derivative of having a football team for a school is money. As you know, a large amount of P5 programs operate in the red, but by operating they bring in money indirectly, enough that at the end of the day it's worth it to play football.

    From a cost perspective I just don't see Utah passing up BYU for USU. Other teams could eventually make a rivalry game with the Utes, for example BSU, but that's probably the only team in the western US that Utah could have an ongoing series with other than BYU for a similar financial benefit.

    As for the social reasons - we agree to disagree - but with roughly half of Utah students LDS and state funding coming from an LDS populous, it simply won't happen for those reasons.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Aug. 20, 2018 12:53 p.m.

    @Gruncle Ralph

    Ha ha. You are right. Back in the day, California kids would not come to the Y.

    The boys from Utah and Idaho would just CLAIM they were from California so they could get a date, or more dates.

    Fess up all of you Grandpas out there.

    🤗

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 12:52 p.m.

    @Gruncle Ralph,

    You made statement that I wasn't accepted to BYU? Dude, they begged me and both of my lil' brothers to attend BYU.......full ride schollies and other benefits galore. We didn't give it one thought. We wanted/demanded real educations. I remember asking my dad to read the BYU "honor code" to me because I couldn't actually believe it after I read it. I thought it was casual folly? I told dad "I won't talk to BYU again." He told them "no!"

  • Gruncle Ralph Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 20, 2018 11:54 a.m.

    @Fake Ute

    All of the studio musicians, unlike I, came from BYU back in the day. Then, nobody from California would attend BYU. Politics and policy from BYU's owners curtailed it all.

    Things are no different today. It is sad, but well-deserved.

    ------------------

    I laugh at so many of your posts because they're nonsensical and utterly impossible to take seriously, but I think this is your piÈce de rÉsistance.

    It's been easy to see that your posts aren't based in reality and this post is no different. There was a running joke about the number of California students who came to BYU when I was a student there, BYU was referred to as Cal-State Provo.

    Even today students from California makes up the 2nd largest group by state at BYU.

    Let me give you some advice, don't run with your emotions all the time, you paint yourself into a corner and make yourself look bad. We get most of your comments ("yah...BYU is dumb", "BYU is stupid", "BYU is slow" etc etc blah blah) are because you're not reeeeeeally a ute fan and instead are a BYU hater. Many of your kind are that way because you couldn't get into BYU and had to go to Utah St-SLC instead. Don't be bitter.

  • 65TossPowerTrap Salmon, ID
    Aug. 20, 2018 11:51 a.m.

    I'm with Little Mitt - no more BYU-Utah games. That rivalry really brings out the worst in Utah fans.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 11:25 a.m.

    @ Josh,

    I learn from you sir. I ain't as bright as you are. I know my stuff in certain areas, but I expect you to see what I say and learn from it as well. You are my "brother."

  • london_josh Lincoln, CA
    Aug. 20, 2018 11:02 a.m.

    Mike,

    " We Utes would rather play Utah State, a respectful, fine state school."

    Bit of bias in your statement, which is okay, I know how you feel. Removing the bias:

    Utah cuttenly plays 2 cupcakes for OC games and BYU is a well known team that Utah beats - huge upside to continue with BYU unless Utah wants to pad a resume which, frankly, wouldn't matter since Utah hasn't contended for a playoff spot or even won a CCG. The SOS drops considerably without BYU in a typical year.

    BYU has a massive fanbase compared to USU in regions that don't overlap, the game is far more watched compared to USU.

    Injuries would be more common with a BYU game than a USU game due to bigger players.

    Also the battle of the brothers has previously been interrupted and isn't a current fixture, when the holy war was interrupted fans (from both sides) demanded rather loudly that it be reinstated.

    Mike - without the bias against BYU and who BYU is - would you really believe your own statement?

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 10:54 a.m.

    Can we please not schedule the Y ever again? Back when I was a kid in high school, I was the finest lead trumpet player in the state of Utah, professionally and otherwise, and was also the lead player in the elite U of U jazz band as well. Before 1978, the Y "Synthesis" jazz band was one of the best in the nation. All of the studio musicians, unlike I, came from BYU back in the day. Then, nobody from California would attend BYU. Politics and policy from BYU's owners curtailed it all.

    Things are no different today. It is sad, but well-deserved.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 9:47 a.m.

    @ Y's little brother,

    Fair enough kind sir! Please call the BYU Holmoe to stop scheduling any game/sport with my frUtes. I can assure U, we Utes would be so grateful if that came to fruition.

    Life moves on......relish in it my friend.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 9:36 a.m.

    @Rockwell,

    With total respect to your claim.........how is Utah beating up on BYU helping us? We Utes would rather play Utah State, a respectful, fine state school. If you would be so kind to do so, please call the BYU Holmoe and request that he no longer demands games in any sport vs Utah. Utah, and their loyal fans, are really enjoying the PAC and I'm hoping that our continual building process of premier athletes will enable us to have more great games, maybe win more PAC titles in the future. Thank you so much for your valuable time Rockwell!

    Cheers to U my friend!

  • Y's little brother Sandy, UT
    Aug. 20, 2018 9:27 a.m.

    Real Ute

    “I think it is "high-time" for BYU fans to stop bringing up meaningless stuff in an effort of validation, especially at it relates to the U of U. The ship sailed long ago for BYU hoops and football. We Utes are concerned about PAC12 play and strong OOC games to strengthen our national profile. BYU is not an asset to any Utah schedule.”

    For rival-obsessed fans constantly comparing themselves to another program for validation, see crimson bubble on the hill.

    You’re absolutely incapable of going through an entire season without constantly making comparisons to BYU. Even during seasons when U ran away from BYU, EVERY single BYU article was spammed with cred mnents from the hill dwellers.

    btw, BYU has owned U in basketball for more than a decade, including last season’s double-digit blowout.

  • Y's little brother Sandy, UT
    Aug. 20, 2018 9:28 a.m.

    Real Ute

    “I think it is "high-time" for BYU fans to stop bringing up meaningless stuff in an effort of validation, especially at it relates to the U of U. The ship sailed long ago for BYU hoops and football. We Utes are concerned about PAC12 play and strong OOC games to strengthen our national profile. BYU is not an asset to any Utah schedule.”

    For rival-obsessed fans constantly comparing themselves to another program for validation, see crimson bubble on the hill.

    You’re absolutely incapable of going through an entire season without constantly making comparisons to BYU. Even during seasons when U ran away from BYU, EVERY single BYU article was spammed with cred mnents from the hill dwellers.

    btw, BYU has owned U in basketball for more than a decade, including last season’s double-digit blowout.

  • Stringer Bell Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 20, 2018 9:11 a.m.

    Last year, the big concern in Provo was Mangum going to the NFL after the season. The only way he's going to the NFL now will be in the family car. Wilson/Mangum, doesn't make any difference. Repeat last year hoping for a different outcome versus throwing in an inexperienced freshman with a brand new OC and offensive system and a mediocre, at best, supporting cast and coaching. Good luck with that.

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    Aug. 20, 2018 8:58 a.m.

    utemythology

    “Except I didn't bring up the 6 point win, YOU did.”

    It’s hilarious how you can’t see the hypocrisy in mocking BYU fans for celebrating a 59-0 win over a 4-8 team, while Utah fans were celebrating a 19-13 win over a 4-9 team.

    ——

    Real Ute

    It’s equally hilarious how Utah fans try to pretend that beating BYU is no longer meaningful to the Utes, all the while being so obsessed with BYU that you track the exact number of wins/losses in the last 20 years.

    The truth is, without looking it, there isn’t another team on the planet that you could cite your exact record against with such precision.

  • 65TossPowerTrap Salmon, ID
    Aug. 20, 2018 8:57 a.m.

    "We Utes are concerned about PAC12 play and strong OOC games to strengthen our national profile. "

    I guess that explains why you and your ilk comment more on BYU sports more than on Utah sports. Admit it Little Mitt - BYU is your obsession.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 8:47 a.m.

    I think it is "high-time" for BYU fans to stop bringing up meaningless stuff in an effort of validation, especially at it relates to the U of U. The ship sailed long ago for BYU hoops and football. We Utes are concerned about PAC12 play and strong OOC games to strengthen our national profile. BYU is not an asset to any Utah schedule.

    Try to be fair and realize the truth as it stands as of today BYU fans.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    Aug. 20, 2018 8:41 a.m.

    Real delusional ute

    “As of this very moment, 99% of Utah fans realize that BYU was a rivalry last century and would like our OOC SOS improved greatly by scheduling other teams, and let BYU pursue other options.”

    LOL at your delusional spin.

    If the Utes were really interested in increasing theor OOC SOS, they’d start by eliminating FCS opponents from their schedule.

    BYU is ALWAYS better than some of Utah’s conference opponents, and even in their worst season in the last 50 years, BYU was the best OOC opponent Utah played in 2017.

    Have a nice day, but try to understand that your fantasies aren’t reality.

  • 65TossPowerTrap Salmon, ID
    Aug. 20, 2018 8:37 a.m.

    May the best man play. Frankly, I suspect that Mangum will be named the starter with a short leash. I would love to see Magnum have a great year and leave the program on a high note.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 7:01 a.m.

    @ Lone*Star,

    Kind sir, BYU is no longer in the same league with Utah literally and figuratively. The last three U-Y football games, the Y was down two TDs or more going into the 4th quarter in each contest. The BYU desperation and "garbage time" scores are not reflective of Utah's utter domination. In the last 15 U-Y games, BYU is 3-12 vs Utah. In all three Y wins, they were frantic scores, come from behind miracles in fact, at the very end of those contests.

    As of this very moment, 99% of Utah fans realize that BYU was a rivalry last century and would like our OOC SOS improved greatly by scheduling other teams, and let BYU pursue other options.

    All the best to U!

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Aug. 20, 2018 6:24 a.m.

    Lone*Star - Austin, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 7:42 p.m.
    utemythology

    “What's laughable is you doing cartwheels for beating 4-8 UCLA.”

    What’s really laughable is Utah doing cartwheels for beating 4-9 BYU...

    by SIX points.

    The hypocrisy on the hill knows no limits.

    ------

    Except I didn't bring up the 6 point win, YOU did.

    BYU "fans" obsession with margin of defeat while thier team sits at 5th in state.

    SAD!

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 20, 2018 5:05 a.m.

    @Poyman,

    Snack PAC was talking about the 2008 game, not 2015. BYU 59 UCLA 0 = "beat-down"

    Maybe you shouldn't criticize me and then fail to recognize the correct game in your long-winded rant?

    Keep your chin up my friend!

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Aug. 20, 2018 12:26 a.m.

    “What’s really laughable is Utah doing cartwheels for beating 4-9 BYU...

    by SIX points.“

    Actually, the only cartwheels performed were those by byu-p applauding/celebrating margin of defeat—Moral Victory U

    😂

    Zero self-respect on their part, particularly after getting statistically destroyed by us.....That game wasn’t even remotely as close as the final score would otherwise indicate.....Thank our multitude of unforced mental errors via penalties for the final margin.

    8 straight & counting is soon upon us.

    Go Utes!

  • Lone*Star Austin, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 7:42 p.m.

    utemythology

    “What's laughable is you doing cartwheels for beating 4-8 UCLA.”

    What’s really laughable is Utah doing cartwheels for beating 4-9 BYU...

    by SIX points.

    The hypocrisy on the hill knows no limits.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Aug. 19, 2018 7:08 p.m.

    @realute

    "...Thanks for posting the UCLA beat-down years ago. How does that finite aberration help, or is reflective of, BYU football today?"

    ****************

    You just can't help yourself... You refuse to do any homework before you post comments that make zero sense. It's clear that FB and especially FB at BYU is not your strong suit. But I'm guessing you're not embarrassed despite the fact that you should be.

    Here's the 2015 Box Score:

    MatchupBYU UCLA
    1st Downs2618
    3rd down efficiency8-191-9
    4th down efficiency1-31-1
    Total Yards405402
    Passing244106
    Comp-Att30-4711-23
    Yards per pass5.24.6
    Interceptions thrown13
    Rushing161296
    Rushing Attempts4138
    Yards per rush3.97.8
    Penalties5-356-75
    Turnovers13
    Fumbles lost00
    Interceptions thrown13
    Possession40:3719:23

    Final Score 23 24

    After trailing the entire game in Pasadena UCLA comes back and scores in the 4th quarter and holds off BYU on their last drive to win by one point...

    A real "Beat Down".

    Do us all a favor and do a little homework before you start pounding on the key board on a BYU article on a BYU thread. Unless you continue to not want people to take your comments seriously.

  • TKB Provo, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 6:17 p.m.

    Each year modern helmeted gladiators walk out onto the green turf of the modern coliseum in front of a rambunctious crowd anticipating that their team will annihilate the visitor. In a contest where among other things, banging, hitting, swearing, and protesting take place, the chief gladiator (the QB) becomes the focal point of the crowds attention. Depending on his on-field performance in the next 60 minutes of play and recalling the thumbs up (spare him) or the thumbs down (kill him) gestures of ancient Rome, he may be booed, cursed, and condemned, or cheered and immortalized until the next contest. Whatever the choice, I express my admiration for anyone who is willing to place himself in the crosshairs of the modern critics, most of whom are clueless as to what courage is required of the athletes who place themselves in such a situation. Ultimately when the crowd noise has dissipated into silence, the young man will go on with his life, possibility taking on far more significant character challenges in his life. Whatever the outcome, I wish Tanner well. He is a fine young man and regardless of the outcome he will be successful in life.

  • utahmtnman Park City, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 5:21 p.m.

    Mangum or Wilson?
    The decision should be based on how good the O-line is. During Detmer's first year as O.C., the team did pretty well going 9-4. So why did they do so poorly last year? The answer is easy--they did not have Taysom Hill! Hill's prowess as a run-option QB made up for a mediocre team, especially on the O-line. So if this year's team has a great O-line, give Mangum the reins. If they don't, hand them to Wilson, who can pose the dual threat.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 4:24 p.m.

    RE :water rocket - Magna, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 5:52 p.m.

    "I would go with Mangum and Critchlow or Hall as backup, then play Wilson where possible, but reserve the possibility of a red shirt year. Now that would be building for the future!"

    I concur. That is a great idea, if the two are neck and neck. If Wildon is far superior, go with him.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 3:41 p.m.

    I'll answer Harmon's question.

    It means that the coaches picked the best prepared QB, one that they feel will get the job done. If it is not Mangum, then the QB was not picked because he only had seniority. Whether that be Mangum or Wilson, it doesn't matter. If it is Mangum, then his seniority perhaps helped him get the nod, if it otherwise a toss up between the two.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 3:03 p.m.

    Snack PAC - Olympus Cove, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:07 p.m.
    Real Ute

    Remind us the last time Utah won a Consensus National Championship or shut out UCLA 59-0.

    ------

    Remind us how is that going to help you being an underdog at Utah State at home?

    What's laughable is you doing cartwheels for beating 4-8 UCLA.

  • pacmidmajor Springville, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:59 p.m.

    Contrary to the dubious comments from Cougar naysayers , the Cougs have their share of quality 3 star and some 4 star players if you actually believe in the star rating system which I do not always agree with ...... hopefully they will play to their abilities ! Time to show up this year ! Go Cougs !!

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:59 p.m.

    @DeepBlue,

    You are correct! BYU's WAC dominance decades ago is "legacy greatness" for sure.

    I hope you are enjoying your season tickets at BYU since the "indy" debacle. Those games make everyone envious. I try to keep awake.......

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:56 p.m.

    Snack PAC - Olympus Cove, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:34 p.m.
    utemythology

    BYU 59, UCLA 0 (under Chow)

    UCLA’s 2nd largest shutout loss ever.

    -----

    Weak! What's your point, you beat 4-8 team? Congrats!

    Chow is well known for developing quarterbacks. During his time as an assistant football coach, Chow has helped coach 8 of the top 14 career passing-efficiency leaders and 13 quarterbacks who rank among the top 30 in NCAA history for single-season passing yardage. The list of players he coached includes Jim McMahon, Steve Young, and Philip Rivers, as well as Heisman Trophy winners Ty Detmer, Carson Palmer, and Matt Leinart.

    He also took MWC talent including a D2 QB and went 8-5 in P12, 4th in league, in season 1.

    ARod has ZERO history of developing QBs. Which is why he was fired. Good luck!

  • DeepBlue Anaheim, CA
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:15 p.m.

    Real Ute

    How did Utah’s win over Alabama help the Utes qualify for a bowl in 2012 and 2013?

    Utah fans don’t have any qualms spouting off about Utah’s past accomplishments, but whine when those accomplishments don’t compare to BYU’s past accomplishments.

  • Snack PAC Olympus Cove, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:07 p.m.

    Real Ute

    Remind us the last time Utah won a Consensus National Championship or shut out UCLA 59-0.

    It’s laughable how much Utah fans whine about the “age” of BYU accomplishments that the Utes have never and will never achieve.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:53 p.m.

    @ Snack PAC,

    Thanks for posting the UCLA beat-down years ago. How does that finite aberration help, or is reflective of, BYU football today? What will you post next......the 1984 "GLORY?"

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:49 p.m.

    We all viewed what Taysom Hill had to offer the other night, the first time, vs a starting NFL defense(Arizona Cardinals) that isn't very good by NFL measure in fact. Hill was so awful.......no words. Now, we have BYU's Mangum or Wilson that will face 7 okay, some unreal D1 defenses........ what will happen? Not good as I see it.

  • Snack PAC Olympus Cove, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:34 p.m.

    utemythology

    BYU 59, UCLA 0 (under Chow)

    UCLA’s 2nd largest shutout loss ever.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:32 p.m.

    So Tanner Mangum will be awarded the starting job...........and this other guy, a lil' kid freshman from Utah County, who's never faced D1 speed is being considered? Yeah, Zach faced BYU's defense in practice..........what is he gonna do when he faces lightning speed and takes huge hits by real athletes?

    BYU is not a winner in any D1 game as I see it.

  • Caddis Terry, MT
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:32 p.m.

    Zippadee... the guy holds the record for yards passing as a freshman at BYU. There was more than the 2 hail marys

  • pacmidmajor Springville, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:23 p.m.

    This is the most talented group of QB’s that the Y has had for years ! Looking for some great things to happen in the next couple of years !

  • xert Santa Monica, CA
    Aug. 19, 2018 11:55 a.m.

    This is a good article. What should be added to it is a little recognition of the fact that the Des News itself probably overhyped this kid. Nothing huge—maybe just something like—“Hey, we ourselves may have gone a little nuts when he did those last play passes...our bad.” It never hurts to self examine. I would know—I’ve looked deep into the depths of my soul and discovered that I’m a wonderful person. Thank you for your time.

  • idablu Idaho Falls, ID
    Aug. 19, 2018 11:11 a.m.

    @caleby
    You make a good point. If you have protection from an O-line like Alabama’s, it’s not hard to shine as a quarterback. If our O-line leaks like last year, it won’t matter who starts at QB, it will be another dismal season.
    I want the coaches to play the guy who gives them the best chance to win, independent of what year they are. Based on last season Mangum was mediocre at best. Hopefully he has demonstrated a drastic improvement. In an ideal world Mangum would step up as the best choice for this year and Wilson and Hall fight it out for the starting job next year.

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 11:02 a.m.

    The "ideal" crowning of the new BYU quarterback in the 21st century means nothing of note. The last decent D1 BYU QB produced was John Beck, well over a decade ago. And, the last legit NFL QB the Y produced was Steve Young in 82', 36 long years ago. Things have changed dramatically since the "analog era" when BYU produced quality players. Try to be kindly realistic Y fans.

  • zipadeedoodah Lehi, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 10:36 a.m.

    Dick Harmon says about Tanner: " It wasn’t all his fault that BYU’s offense faltered a year ago. He’s had golden moments, highlights like game-winning TD passes against Nebraska and Boise State."

    Amazing that the best that can be said about Tanner is that he had some freshman "highlights". Holy smokes, pathetic!

    No, not all his fault.. but he certainly has his huge share of "fault" if you want to call it that. He has stood over the ball for the past threes seasons and much of that, especially the last two, his face showed it all... confusion, anxiety, doubt. If we call this "experience" or "seasoned", it is not.

    Look, as a person I love Tanner. He's a very good man. But I hope that the coaches don't think that seniority is what counts. It doesn't. And I think we should invest in the future of BYU, not just make a senior happy. That is ridiculous.

    The QB must have confidence in himself and be quick in his mind and step. Tanner is not these.

    Personally... I have always felt BYU should have two starters... and for every game. There are many arguments for it. (And I am not suggesting that Tanner should be one of them either.)

    Here's to better days... go Cougs!

  • Real Ute Dallas, TX
    Aug. 19, 2018 9:53 a.m.

    It really seems like the irrational Y fans are trying to make a mountain out of a mole hill. I say that kindly, but the speed and talent level at BYU football is just not even close to being able to win big games vs okay teams. I think Utah State is gonna beat BYU badly yet again......and NIU has better players.......then there is the road game at UMass?????? I've read some Y fans think they are gonna beat Utah? Oh, exactly how is that gonna happen.......it will not!

    My best wishes go to my fine, astute, realistic Y fan friends!

  • Laxman taylorsville, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 9:16 a.m.

    I feel sorry for Mangum is for different reasons. As a freshman his two hero moments at Nebraska and against Boise State were over hyped by the media and the fans. 1) If it takes a last second pass to win a game is that really greatness or luck. 2) Completing last second passes is that really showing how great you are? I think Mangum and the team was very lucky to win those games and not skill. You created the over hype for him. Talking Hiesman for him as a freshman was way overboard.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Aug. 19, 2018 9:12 a.m.

    As the Italians say, "Que sera, sera". (Whatever will be, will be).

    🤗

  • Caddis Terry, MT
    Aug. 19, 2018 8:58 a.m.

    Clarification... Concerning my previous post. The former player felt that the "players" were not afraid of those they were accountable to.

  • bluesmule Sandy, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 8:45 a.m.

    It was evident that Ty Detmer had Mangum Haywired last year. The old adage goes "those who can't do, teach." Well, Detmer was one of those guys that could do, and I just don't know if he can coach at this level. You could tell after every series when the camera would pan to Detmer talking to Mangum that Detmer was saying the wrong things to him.

    I'm tired of hearing how Tanner didn't have a good freshmen season. It wasn't the best, but it was pretty dang good. Ute fans claim that all we remember are the two hails maries, but that's precisely all they remember too. Does anybody remember the UCLA game? Tanner was near perfect in that game. What about the Utah game? So many of those turn overs were not his fault, and if I remember correctly, once that season was fresh over, many Ute fans were wishing they could have Mangum. Now they've all forgotten, especially after last season, how poised and accurate Mangum was his freshman season.

    I don't put Michigan on him either. The staff didn't prepare the whole team for inside passing when a real defense could take away the outside throw (unlike Utah.) That was the coaching staff's fault, not Mangum's.

  • Bluefan AMERICAN CANYON, CA
    Aug. 19, 2018 8:15 a.m.

    Hopefully, the coaches will not make a decision based on emotion. There are deserving players at every position on the team that are battling to be starters. Some of them are hoping to play at the next level. While we don't want our coaches to be heartless, they would be doing Tanner and the rest of the team a disservice by picking starters that had been through the toughest challenge or that had the hardest road to get here or who had the a scheme that didn't fit their game, etc. If they want to be prepared to play at the next level, they have to compete, adapt, and overcome challenges. Nothing will be handed to them at the next level. The coaches have chosen their offensive and defensive schemes. It is incumbent upon the players to learn it, execute it, and show it on the field so that the coaches have no other choice than to play them. The coaches have to play the players that will give them the best chance to win. If Tanner, as a senior, can't standout against a freshman with only months of practice under his belt, why should he be handed the starting job? The coaches have to avoid an "entitlement" philosophy if they want to be successful.

  • Captain Bracegirdle Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 7:48 a.m.

    Tanner is a class act. Either way, he'll accept the decision with grace and courage like he always has.

  • mikes_goY Orem, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 7:46 a.m.

    Whoever the QB is going to be, the O line has to stay on a block, the receivers have to get some space between them and the defenders, and backs have to find some holes for more than 2 yard average gains. Otherwise, no matter who the QB is, it will be the same as the last few years. The QB has had to over extend himself and try to carry the team until he is inevitably injured. Year after year after year.

  • Aggielove Caldwell, ID
    Aug. 19, 2018 6:44 a.m.

    Mangum doesn’t have the stuff.

  • don jackson Atlanta, GA
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:45 a.m.

    Because of the disasterous season last year, it doesn't matter who starts QB. Unfortunately this season's schedule looks like another train wreck. Holmoe & Sitake are both in the hot seat. With the offense the talent at BYU isn't there to qualify for a bowl game and even sadder is the coaching isn't there to make make up the talent difference on the field. Last season on defense BYU played competitively most of the season. As always the season boils down to the performance of the O line. Last year they were so slow in execution it didn't matter who the QB was. Six wins this season will be a huge success from last year.

  • One of Vai's Cousins DC, Washington
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:28 a.m.

    Poyman following the Elite 11 is fun but far from a predictor of future success. Jake Heaps was one of 12 invited to the Elite 11 in 2009 and we saw how that turned out. Incidentally, only 1/12 out of that group were eventually even drafted into the NFL. Ben Olsen also made noise in the Elite 11. He is probably the most physically talented QB recruit to step foot in Provo with tremendous skills but just could never shake injuries after transferring to UCLA.

    I hope Mangum shows the talent this season that he obviously flashed at the Elite 11 and throughout a great HS career. For various reasons he has yet to perform to the same level at BYU. I truly hope this is his year and it allows our freshmen to wait and continue learning while finally seeing Mangum play to the level we all have hoped for.

    But if Wilson is clearly better in camp, give the dude the ball!!

  • Caddis Terry, MT
    Aug. 19, 2018 2:21 a.m.

    Very insightful article. My take from last year was that there was a nearly complete breakdown. Most alarmingly the fire and desire was largely gone.
    On TV I heard an ex linebacker speak of standing on the sideline during a game and watching our team horsing around on the sideline, not focused, not showing fire. He said, “Those guys are not afraid of anyone”. He was referring to the coaching staff. I was one of the loudest critics of firing Detmer but I now believe it had to be.
    I watched Tanner taped so heavily he could not avoid a rush. Hopping around. That is going to eventually get to a guy. He gave it a super effort. The whole house of cards came down.
    I’m hoping it is Tanner. I quarantee the discipline and fire is back this year! Grimes seems a whole different critter.

  • Uteology East Salt Lake City, Utah
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:56 a.m.

    "Whether fair or not, earned or not, Wilson represents the ever-popular new face at a position that has produced All-Americans, Hall of Famers, and two Super Bowl champions in Jim McMahon and Steve Young." -- DH

    ------

    Yes under Norm Chow not the guy who was fired at Utah.

    Wilson represents same QB hype every year since Chow left.

    It's debatable if Wilson is the 3rd best QB in the state. Believe me, after 2/3-years under ARod, he'll be worse.

  • caleby Bountiful, UT
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:41 a.m.

    Alabama can start a freshman QB because they can
    completely surround him with studs. BYU has nothing like that to surround Wilson. Starting a Freshman QB at BYU would be a mistake.

  • london_josh Lincoln, CA
    Aug. 19, 2018 12:15 a.m.

    I don't think wins are imparative in the first 4 games, I expect to go between 2-2 and 0-4, likely 1-3. It's going to be what kind of competitive drive was shown in those games.

    Tanner had no chance last year, it was Matt bushman and a bunch of guys dropping passes with no OL protection. Running game was super inconsistent - he didn't play well but the system was broken and even if he did great it would have been nearly the same result. For example, byu was making a late game against Utah and the final drive had 2 perfect dropped passes. Fresno had a turnaround opportunity as well and passes hit dropped. With no protection there was little he could have done to deliver the ball to receivers who wouldn't pull it in.

    I think it's tanner this year, hope he has a great year and we'll see hall and Wilson in 4 games each.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Aug. 18, 2018 11:46 p.m.

    Correction...

    Wilson's team "Corner Canyon" lost to Skyridge HS of Lehi in the semi finals, and Sky ridge HS was then pasted by Lehi HS in the 4A finals by a score of 55-17...

    Sorry for the type-os.

  • toosmartforyou Kaysville, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 11:34 p.m.

    All I know is last year when the TV coverage showed Tanner Mangum before each snap he looked unsure, filled with anxiety, and like "what do I do?" Hopefully all those feelings have evaporated with a new coach and offensive scheme. Being tentative just before you put the ball into play isn't something that makes the highlight reel after the game, that's for sure.

    I hope sports writers find some positives to write about this year and leave the coaching decisions to those who are hired to make them. And hopefully the team performs so well they won't be recognized as being part of a 4 - 9 team, rather more like the 9 - 4 team of the previous campaign. Let the utes worry about themselves if that is even possible.

  • poyman Lincoln City, OR
    Aug. 18, 2018 11:26 p.m.

    Agreed, The best player should win the QB position against AZ (and continuing... hopefully). But that is Tanner Mangum.

    The claim that the FR has a better arm and better footwork is total baloney (while Wilson might be good he didn't even make the Elite 11 let alone become an MVP... Last November Wilson was the QB of a team that lost to a Skyridge HS a in 4A semi-final game last year (a Skyridge team that was blown off the field by Lehi in the finals 55-1, and who's QB is headed to WSU).

    To even attempt to lay the failure of last season at the feet of Mangum is ridiculous. Young or McMahon wouldn't have done much better against LSU or Mississippi State or even Fresno State with the OL that we had, or the rotation of RBs that saw a new one behind the QB every week, or a corps of WRs that couldn't run routs, were as fast as slugs, and had mittens for hands. Throw in a new "O" and you get what we got.

    I think back on the 2016 season when many of these pro Wilson followers were loudly cheering on Mangum as a starter against Hill. The "what have you done for me lately crowd" always want the new and untested and it's sad.

    Mangum will be the Starter and he should be.

  • Mowgli54 Granite Bay, CA
    Aug. 18, 2018 11:00 p.m.

    I'm pulling for Tanner Mangum, and I concur with the author of this article. I do feel for him. He didn't play well last year, but we're not sure why. He's volunteered that he's struggled with depression. He's been physically injured. Either or both of those could explain poor performance.

    I believe he is determined, motivated to prove himself. I also agree that if he starts against Az, the coaches will give him 3 games to show us something. As much as the coaching staff like him and want him to succeed, the need to have a winning record pushes them even more. Go Cougs.

  • One of Vai's Cousins DC, Washington
    Aug. 18, 2018 10:42 p.m.

    Ideally Mangum plays this season while the two freshmen absorb the system and go head to head next year to see who is the future of BYU football.

    My worry, however, is that Mangum was just never as talented as the hype. I know last season was a mess but a top level QB would have risen above that at least to a higher level than Mangum did. We saw the same thing years ago with Jake Heaps. From what I am reading and hearing, Wilson as an 18 year-old throws a better ball and has superior footwork to Mangum who has been working on his craft at the college level for years now.

    If it truly is close, there are many reasons to let Mangum lead his senior year. But if Wilson is clearly the better QB, give him the ball and get out of his way.

    As Harmon noted, the QB position at BYU is simply a different animal. Would an article be devoted to the unfairness of an offensive lineman being beat out by a younger player? Of course not but such is life at BYU.

    I hope Mangum starts and plays to his potential. In the end that is probably the best scenario for him and our young QBs. Either way, 6-6 with a bowl invite is probably the ceiling for the Cougs.

  • Captain L Provo, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 10:29 p.m.

    Tanners problem last year was his inability to make the reads quickly and go from primary receiver to 2nd or 3rd receiver and do it quickly as efficiently. If he has learned how to do that and do it efficiently he should probably be named the starter but I question whether or not he can do that. He seemed to panic last year and focus only on his primary receiver. The other thing is his pocket presence. Tanners pocket presence isn't great, he is methodical and predictable. He doesn't move instinctively . Word has it that Wilson does move around in the pocket instinctively and to me that is the most important characteristic . McMahon & Detmer were our best at doing that and they were great because of that. They could sense the pressure and move just enough whether it was up in the pocket or alittle left or a little right , they would move enough to avoid the rush and they would make the play. Wilson seems to have that ability and considering he is a freshman and is more or less tied with Tanner, I think Wilson should get the nod. Wilson has more potential get him started.

  • Kralon HUNTINGTON BEACH, CA
    Aug. 18, 2018 10:03 p.m.

    I can't imagine a football season where both of the top two QBs get to play, mostly due to injuries. Not really worth worrying about now, both just need to do their best and everyone can evaluate at the end of the season. Go Cougars!

  • blue & white Boise, ID
    Aug. 18, 2018 9:48 p.m.

    Tanner should start if he and Zach are close due to TM experience. The coaches should not consider last years record due to injuries and KS putting together a poor offensive staff. It’s not all on Ty either. Zach will get his chance. If cougs go 1-4 start with Zach starting could set him back. It’s better in the long run for Tanner to go 1-4 but don’t wish it on him. Go Cougs

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    Aug. 18, 2018 9:26 p.m.

    Last year was not on Mangum. It was on the entire coaching staff. The offense schemed by Detmer was out of date. Coaches were doing interviews, shucking and jiving, and the team was ... relaxed. Mangum came in 25 pounds heavier than he is this year. The 39 or 40 injuries were due to poor conditioning. Somehow, after the good 1st year, everybody relaxed.

    None of the coaches or players are relaxed this year. The new OC, Jeff Grimes, is the real deal. Mangum's competition looked really really good, but Mangum is keeping up with him. Right now, the two QB contenders look pretty even. Then you start Mangum. There is something to be said for experience. If Mangum doesn't produce in the first half, bring in the freshman.

  • BleedingBlue Provo, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 8:44 p.m.

    Don’t feel sorry for Tanner Mangum. His 2017 football game time performance was absolutely dreadful. The most 3 and outs & drive killing offense I have watched in past 40 years at BYU. Coach Detmer was fired for the Mangum disaster. If Sitake & Grimes have not learned from the past then we are doomed to repeat it, you can say goodbye to any hope of a bowl game, or winning season. If the coaches pick Mangum it will be the end of the Sitake coaching era.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Aug. 18, 2018 8:37 p.m.

    If Mangum plays like last year, it may only be a 4 win season. If he plays like his freshman year, which still was not good, we will be a little better, maybe 6 wins if we are lucky. If he is named the starter, I hope it is because he is finally showing the potential he had as a HS senior. I am sceptical.

  • Sukiyaki Pleasant Grove, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 8:27 p.m.

    Mangum certainly has the potential to start. Last year doesn't count for anything as every position group under-performed in that offense.

    I trust that Grimes and Roderick will make the right call. If it really is neck and neck then you give the nod to the senior just as you would any other position.

    I like the new redshirt rule that allows up to four games of play time. Even if Mangum does start, which I think he will, Wilson will be primed and ready for next year.

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 8:29 p.m.

    So much hand wringing over picking "the one". Like last year, more than one player will have an opportunity to start. Few teams have a 12 game starter anymore, especially when there is little separation in the talent.

  • Deanvrtc Vancouver, WA
    Aug. 18, 2018 7:36 p.m.

    Tanner is in a no win scenario. The first five games BYU will be fortunate to get two wins...maybe.....REGARDLESS of who starts. Tanner will get the blame, Wilson will come in after the schedule gets easier and produce better against easier teams. Tanner will be the goat, and Wilson anointed the new star.
    The only way Tanner keeps his job is if BYU wins three of the first five...and thats beyond a huge long shot.
    The cards don't look good if you are Tanner Mangum facing this schedule, after a TEAM disaster last year. Who says college sports are always fair? Nobody who has participated. I will hope he can pull off the improbable...or the team can.

  • cdchat5855 Meridian, ID
    Aug. 18, 2018 7:01 p.m.

    I like Tanner!!!!!! For you people who say that he had a hard year last year, let me say this John Elway would have not done any better than Tanner did. It was the terrible offense that the O.C. put together in 2017. I hope he is the starter and he should be. Have a great year Tanner and prove you are the best..... my take

  • Cinci Man FT MITCHELL, KY
    Aug. 18, 2018 6:52 p.m.

    Go Tanner. Play hard and play well. We have seen what you can do. You tried to learn a losing system and you learned it well. Now learn another winning system and return to be the winner that you are.

  • Rikitikitavi Cardston, Alberta
    Aug. 18, 2018 6:27 p.m.

    Go Cougs!!

    Go Mangum!!

  • Mowgli54 Granite Bay, CA
    Aug. 18, 2018 6:26 p.m.

    Brave Sir Robin:

    Interesting comment. If the problem is that coaches at BYU don't have a clue, given that the coaching staff changed at the end of his freshman season, I wonder how he made that "bed." I suppose, had he been clairvoyant, he could have foreseen the drop-off to 4-9 from 9-4 in Coach Sitake's first year. But I think that's putting a bit too much on him.

    I think we wait and see what the current coaching staff can do. Here's hoping that last year's rough road was an outlier, and that Coach Sitake and his band can win the games they should, and surprise some people by beating some teams they "shouldn't."

  • Sanefan Wellsville, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 6:24 p.m.

    I think Grimes/Sitaki will play the best player; Myers would, Saban would. With that said, I think they will start Magnum and give him 2-3 games. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wilson play in the first 3 games, but if it really is "neck and neck" as the coaches have stated, Tanner gets the start at Arizona.

  • Jimbo Low PLEASANT GROVE, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 6:15 p.m.

    Mangum seemed to have tremendous potential....and then last year happened. Tanner has to know if he is named the starter he may not have even a full game to show he is Tanner Mangum 2015 II....if we see any inkling of Tanner Mangum 2017 II it is time for byu.qb.moveon.now.

  • water rocket Magna, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 5:52 p.m.

    WOW, that is all I can say about that article, just WOW! Talk about a writer putting the hex on someone! Harmon, since you really painted Tanner with a black brush, are you also going to paint Sitaki with that same brush? With the way you wrote this article, if Mangum starts, and looses even one game, he would become the "wrong choice" at QB.

    I am thrilled to see Wilson doing so well, but I really feel he would benefit immensely from a year NOT starting. I suppose that there will be a lot of second guessing about the QB situation, but I would have to say that the second guessing should be more about the coaching than about the players. After all, Sitaki fired nearly all of the offensive coaching staff last year, didn't he? Apparently even he did not believe that the players were entirely to blame for the dismal season last year.

    I would go with Mangum and Critchlow or Hall as backup, then play Wilson where possible, but reserve the possibility of a red shirt year. Now that would be building for the future!

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    Aug. 18, 2018 5:33 p.m.

    "You have to feel for Tanner Mangum and the spot he's in"

    No I don't. He could've gone to a different school, one that has coaches who have a clue. He's made his own bed.

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    Aug. 18, 2018 5:27 p.m.

    Over the years BYU has lost games due to playing guys who had simply climbed the seniority ladder.
    Forget all that....Play the best players !

    Alabama does....

    Hopefully this Coaching staff has learned this lesson and will do just that.