Is it possible that many of our elected politicians have taken bribes and made
our country pay more tariffs than other nations? Could this be why we have a
huge trade deficit?Do we have equal tariffs among all countries?Could Trump be making things fair and it's stirring resentment?
So Utah politicians are naysayers on this particular action, but want to
name a road after trump?? How typical....
Many economists place some of the blame for the great depression on the Smoot
Hawley tariff act. As far as how the rust got that way how about automation
replacing factory jobs as opposed to trade policies.
We have an area in the United States, known as the rust belt! Any of you nay
Sayers and never Trumpers remember what this rust belt is and and how it got
Article: "Sen. Mike Lee, R-Utah, noted the proposal could very well place
burdens...on Trump's base constituency...'I think this would harm many
of the same people who worked so hard to get him elected'"And this is stated as if it is a bad thing?The "people who
worked so hard to get [Trump] elected" deserve all the "burdens" and
"harm" that are heading their way as a result of Trump's actions.
@james d. morrison;"kolob1 - a union does move a factory overseas
indirectly when they drive costs up so high that the company has no other choice
but to go overseas."That is so patently false. The driven up
costs aren't a few dollars an hour. American companies were allowed (with
no tariffs) to offshore labor to countries that paid wages for a week that
Americans earned in a day. With zero benefits. Would you be willing to take an
80% pay cut? Could you live on 20% of your salary? The CEO's, Board of
Directors, and Upper Management didn't take pay cuts, they multiplied their
salaries 10 fold. Now, American workers are having to work for stagnant wages
and diminishing benefits to compete. It's not the unions. It's Wall
Street that's killing America.
Typical, everyone complains about everything and has no solutions We need to
have our own metals ( steel and aluminum for the defense of our freedom.
Places tanks and ship's are built with met@metals, if we import them from
any other country and a war does happen then where do we get our met@ls from?
@rmk writes, After watching any WW2 movies how many think having all
of our steel imported is a good idea?Good point. We are buying
steel from China, Korea, Taiwan, Brazil, and Mexico. We may lose them all as
allies at the rate Trump is making enemies and / or threatening wars.
Whatever our Utah elected official contingent's other faults may be, they
at least have the good sense (for the most part) to acknowledge what is almost
universally accepted by economists of all stripes; that tariffs and trade wars
are bad for the economy, and that the harm they cause far outweighs any
perceived good.To those pro-tariff "conservative"
capitalists-in-name-only, you might want to google "Smoot-Hawley Tariff
Act" and read up on what the economic effects of Smoot-Hawley were.
"all Trump is saying is that we fight back"Like buying
Ivanka Trump's dresses from China Indonesia and the Phillip[ines? Is that how we fight back ?Fight back ! Buy America and support
your local Unions!!
kolob1 - a union does move a factory overseas indirectly when they drive costs
up so high that the company has no other choice but to go overseas.
That's rich, they were fine when he mocked a disabled reporter, said
nothing about his grab em by the ...... tape with Billy Bush, more silence
accompanied the Stormy Daniels revelations, yet they're offended by his
steel and aluminum tariffs?
For all of you anti-union far righters "Have you ever heard of an Union
moving a factory overseas?"
Long term memory loss? Catch these Deseret News Articles about Steel and
tariffs. Chinese firm gets OK to buy Geneva assetsBy Dave Anderton
Deseret Morning News February 5, 2004 A federal bankruptcy judge sealed Geneva
Steel's fate Wednesday, approving a $40 million sale of its core assets to
a Chinese company.The sale to Qingdao Iron & Steel Group Co. is the
beginning of the end of one of Utah's largest bankruptcy cases and prepares
the way for Geneva's equipment to be dismantled and shipped to the Chinese
coastal province of Shandong. Wow! shipped the equipment to China.so 3
weeks later?Dumped foreign steel is no boon to American consumersGreg Mastel February 28, 1999A chorus of critics has attacked the recent
decision by the U.S. Commerce Department to offset the impact of dumped imports
of steel from Japan, Brazil and Russia, imports sold at below their cost of
production or below their home market price. The critics argue that this
unfairly priced steel should be accepted as a gift to consumers. Rather than
imposing duties or taking other measures to raise the price to reflect its true
market value, the US should accept dumped steel gladly and congratulate itself.
trump is getting advice from people ill-equipped to do so...his family.We
need a REAL president...we need a White House not buried in scandal, infighting,
and utter chaos.The GOP, in it's current state, is an unmitigated
Gary Cohn follows Hope Hicks out the door and after doing the important work of
engaging in a 6AM twitter fight with Alec Baldwin our wise leader does
this---because he can and he's mighty teed off with life right about now.
There are still people in this nation who think he's got it all under
control and is a pretty smooth operator and negotiator. And that folks--is why
we are quickly becoming second rate and a bit of a joke in the eyes of the
world. You'll notice that I wrote "Quickly" rather than "slowly
but surely". The US and it's Presidency stood tall in the eyes of the
world under Mr. Obama, his Cabinet and his family. That's just undeniable.
President Trump has barely been at this game a year and what many predicted
would come true has come true. The rest of the world does not differentiate
between Donald Trump and Americans. He is what he is---and we are the ones who
put him in office. Nov '18? Please come soon and save us!
Every single one of Utah's Republican Congressional folks are made of mush.
They will huff and puff a little, then fold like a cheap house of cards. They
have the power to act, to enact legislation. But watch, they will wring their
hands a little for the benefit of certain contributors, and nothing whatsoever
American is in and has been in a trade war for at least a generation.Japan
has subsidized their industries (auto and steel for example) if they would
target US industries. This has allowed Japanese manufacturers to dump product
on the domestic market and drive these industries to their knees.The US
steel industry is a fraction of the size it was.Same with the US Aluminum
industry.Same with the US consumer electronics industry.We
used to have a trade surplus with every nation on earth.We now have a
trade deficit with every nation on earth.I own a manufacturing
business. I use an aluminum extruder in Utah. They have two multi-million
dollar extrusion presses. China has one extrusion plant with 55 extrusion
presses. Fifty Five. That exceeds the entire North American capacity.Their MO is to drive domestic industries out of business (made possible with
subsidies) that then charge what they want.All Trump is proposing is
that we finally fight back.
Wait now conservatives want the steel industry back? I remember when
they cheered their victory over the "evil" Unions and their strangle
hold on the "corporations and owners." They then celebrated sending our
steel overseas where reasonable (cheap) labor and, a certain casualness towards
the environment was much admired.Remember after 911, the GOP leaders
couldn't ship that steel off to China fast enough.Nope,
he's not bringing anything home, and the tariffs will hurt us far more than
his fan club understands.
Don’t worry I’m sure Utah Republicans will come around, I’m
sure that 2 years ago almost no Utah Republicans would have approved of any of
the things Trump has done so far either. But now Utah is more supportive of
Trump than just about any other state.Utah’s turn around on
all things Trump reminds me of this poem:“Vice is a monster of
so frightful mien. As to be hated needs but to be seen; Yet seen too oft,
familiar with her face, We first endure, then pity, then embrace.” ―
History shows that tariffs - especially dramatic ones that invite reciprocal
tariffs - are foolish ideas. In many cases, recessions and depressions were
triggered by tariff wars. The mark of a country in decline is to close borders
and start imposing tariffs. We have a president who famously does
not read much and now that fact will harm the country. Of all of the
destructive acts committed thus far by this president - and there are quite a
few - this one will stand out the most.
Here is the thing. Nothing matters anymore. Facts are not facts. In depth
analysis is frowned upon. Intellectualism is verboten. All this brought on by
the GOP in its 40 year attempt to convince the mostly poor religious right to
vote for regressive policies against their best interests. Trump is
just using the same pandering technique the reich has perfected. If it doesnt
agree with what I wish were true then it is 'fake news'.
The Steel companies should just get a trillion dollar subsidy to rebuild over
ten years. It will be interesting when car companies in Red states layoff people
when steel goes up twenty-five percent.
I have been in the steel pipe business and pipe fitting mfg. business for over
45 years. I have seen the past effect of government intervention and lack of
fair tariffs in the past. These has resulted in the closing of most of the
domestic steel mfg. companies, including Geneva Steel.Most states, because
of US EPA laws don't want "dirty" industries. The steel pipe
mills closed in US are not come back. Not possible. This is a tax on the
American people. Do away with the tariffs on steel, but increase the tariffs on
finished goods manufactured in Asia countries. Example: steel pipe nipples,
malleable pipe fittings. Most steel pipe imported today comes from Thailand,
Korea, or Vietnam. The raw materials (coils) are mostly produced in China.
There is ONE domestic steel pipe mill to produce "gas pipe sizes" from
1/2" thru 2" Dia. They cannot handle extra business as their
production is at full production now. Domestic steel producers have announced
two price increases since Trumps announcement. I stand with our
representatives. Forget the steel/aluminum tariffs. Too late to do any good.
This will only create foreign trade wars, inflation, and increase tensions.
I can't decide which is worse, Trump's ignorance or his arrogance. Or maybe it's the GOP's ignorant arrogance!
We have lived far too long under this misguided notion of "free" trade.
It has actually been very unfair to America and American workers, and our
industrial working middle class has been gutted as a result. Yes, change in the
economy is inevitable, but foreign governments have long engaged in heavily
subsidizing industries such as steel, aluminum, automobile manufacturing, etc.
Does this lower the cost of goods for Americans? Of course, but this is a
superficial cost in light of the millions of jobs lost and the the real cost of
lives needlessly disrupted, and in some cases, destroyed. And what about our
national security that is necessarily built on a robust domestic manufacturing
base? Our foreign competitors understand this principle and are extremely
protective of certain industries. This is no secret. They speak openly of it in
policy papers. We finally have a president willing to call it what it really is,
and it is unfair trade. It is anything but free. And @Fullypresent...it is clear
you don't understand our government. Trump has been given the authority,
same as other presidents. You may not like it, but that doesn't make him a
Wow, reasoned, principled dissent on policies. Mr. Raymond must be new here.
Utah Republicans don't understand what motivates this president.Instead of proposing a new Trump highway in southern Utah, maybe they could
invite Trump out and propose a 200 foot high statue of Trump, to be placed on
top of the Utah capitol building.*THAT* might impress him enough to
back down from the tariffs.
To fullypresent:Re: “People need to keep standing up to the
dictator who has forgotten we have a democracy.”What does an
unsupported claim that Donald Trump is a dictator have to do with this story, or
anything for that matter? Theses are the same silly comments the far right was
making about Obama for eight years. It is sad that a frivolous comment like
this would get any “likes” at all, noneless eight of them.We need less tribalism, fewer emotion, unsupported arguments, and more real
dialogue and discussion on important policy matters. Instead we end up throwing
tomatoes at each other with ridiculous, hollow arguments.
I suppose Deseret News should run an article about Kobe Steel. Our Military
needs only the highest quality steel for its ships and tanks. Think about our
defense. We need a thriving local made steel industry.
Utah republicans are up in arms against Trump's trade policies!Does this mean they won't name the highway after him?
Aha.Trump is now revealing himself for what he really is, a
socialist.So if I was an American steel worker I might at first be
excited about this. Until I remembered that by hurting the economy of the
countries buying my product I am also hurting their ability to buy my
product.I would also realize that other countries would be less
likely to buy my product because the tarrifed countries would now be looking at
selling at lower rates to my clients.And it increases the likelihood
of reciprocal tarrifs.In the end everybody's industries become
less profitable. Except the government has more money in its coffers to provide
welfare for the now unemployed steel workers.Of course Utahns, most
of whom voted against Trump, think this is a dumb idea.
So what will happen when trump's actions destroy our economy and middle
class Americans lose everything we've worked for?Simple. Just
use the usual trumpian tactic and blame it all on Obama.Make America
Sane (and Safe) Again
Wonder how many ex-geneva works think allowing cheap steel to be imported
doesn't hurt American jobs? After watching any WW2 movies how many think
having all of our steel imported is a good idea?
Hey, there are few people more for free-trade than I am. But Trump actually has
a legitimate point. Free trade shouldn't be freer for one party than for
another. We also need fair trade. That means that the market is not unduly
distorted by unfair trading practices, subsidies, taxes, currency manipulation,
etc. The past two+ administrations have buckled at the trading table and have
given our trade partners better deals than they should have. This has helped
consumers (particularly those who kept their jobs!) at the expense of labor,
capital providers in our domestic industries, and even workers in countries that
manipulate their currency to gain a trade advantage. These workers face weaker
currency, higher inflation, reduced purchasing power and a lower standard of
living. The foreign workers rarely recognize this hidden tax but their
governments get credit for full employment and economic growth which allows them
to retain power.Bad trade policy hurts many stakeholders, and
transfers power and wealth to others. There is a reason nations pursue bad
trade policies, and it generally isn't for the common good. At least Trump
is trying to level the playing field.
People need to keep standing up to the dictator who has forgotten we have a
Gee. Like they didn't see this coming. But, we're still going to name
a Utah Highway for Trump-right?