Dick, observance of the Sabbath Day is not designed to enhance your golf score.
You're missing out if you think so.
@top of the world@Deep BlueTOTW, I "liked" your
comment and totally agree. However, I don't see how it applies to my
comment (Please show me otherwise.)Here is what I said, "This
article caused me to think...." There was no implication it had anything to
do with what anyone else said...etc. (Actually when I said that I was quite
surprised that a Harmon article led to me think more in depth! I believe this
should happen more often!) When BYU played the Thursday round never did I think
about a golf rules authority and an official scorer needed. This led me to
think of other consequences that I believe result from BYU's no play on
Sunday policy. (Note: Deep Blue - I did not "mock" BYU or their
personal beliefs. (I defended their right to do so for 3 years in the Viet Naum
War era!) What I hoped to say was BYU has the right; however, others do not
have to suffer as a result. They may choose to do so but that must be their
choice. I guess in your mind because I identified some of these consequences
you claim I am "whining" So be it and play your "religious
bigot" card. As an active member in my faith, I just smile and know that
card does not trump mine!)
Who Am I Sir? Let's see, you seem to be drawing the conclusion that
because 'someone' commented on the unfairness of having the Y team
play a round of golf alone, this comment needs to be attributed not to he/she
who offered the comment, but to BYU, the Church, the players or the coaches.Too many of those who are obviously anything but Y fans treat comments
as if they were proof-read by the First Presidency, the President of BYU or at
least those in the Athletic Director's Office. Those who analyze comments
in this manner are as wrong as wrong can be. Pro-Y commenters are offering
their personal opinions, most of which have no factual base.Good
Having grown up in Missouri with uniform Blue laws and only filling stations
open on Sunday, it is refreshing to have those laws revoked. Many folks wanted
to not slavishly follow the more restricted religionists, but be able to enjoy
Sundays when they desired with something other than church and visiting
relatives. Obviously some have taken this idea to extremes.
Others, like several comments here, don't want others to live life the way
they want to. . . Thankfully, they don't totally control Utah and the rest
of the country. Just keep your religion to yourselves and leave the rest of us
It is sad that the NCAA has made the jump to holding championship-related games,
matches, rounds, events on Sundays. Unfortunately, our society is moving toward
the day when the policies governing intercollegiate athletics just don't
work for BYU given its mission statement. I am sure that makes many readers
overjoyed. Such an attitude fails to miss what the loss of Christian values
means for the future of our country given the purpose for which it was founded
by people who respected God and came to America to freely practice their
Who am I sir? Anyone who mocks another person or organization for
"living their religion" or who whines about an organization's
religious beliefs being accommodated by another organization is a religious
The beggar in Fiddler on the roof said You've had a bad day. So why should
I suffer?This article caused me to think of some of the implications
to both BYU and others due to BYU's "no play on Sunday" policy.
"...accompanied by an official scorer and a rules official." That means
one additional day, and costs, for these individuals. And what about the golf
course? That means an additional day for tournament play. What about others
ie. broadcast coverage/film etc. for possible replay during regular coverage?
Consider these and possible other effects in golf and other sports
resulting from one school's self imposed policy. As mentioned:
facilities: stadium, court, pool, etc. Administrative costs: One extra day for
all. Costs to all participants: ie. fans, players, universities, etc. - extra
time from school, away from work, travel, accommodations, etc. effect on
scheduling: more/or less time between this event and other scheduled events
affects preparation etc. These are just some of the consequences. Yes
many affect BYU as well as others; however, it is a result on only BYU's
policy. So again, why should I suffer? Think conference affiliation!
Football, Baseball, Basketball, Softball, Volleyball and now Golf....I do think
BYU will win the 10.000 meters in track and field with 4 qualifications....but
the nice guy image, find your wife while at the Y and tone down the killer
instinct has become a disease of losing and sub par play. Get out and see how
real D 1 athletes play the game.... they get in your face, knock your teeth out
and don't help you up. It's real. Utah will always own BYU in
Football because coach Whit knows this...he knows they can't handle the
heat in the fire....instead they settle for being average and sadly enough
believe it's good enough. You see it in every sports program the Y has.
Just wow. In golf it's called "the rub of the green". Sometimes
those who tee off in the morning suffer much worse weather conditions than those
who tee off in the afternoon. If that's the case, they would be
well-served to not complain about how they were disadvantaged. It
seems to me that BYU has two choices to make: 1) continue with the accommodation
that the NCAA has generously provided but then don't complain about the
accommodation not exactly being to the Cougars' taste; or 2) don't
take the accommodation thereby forfeiting the chance for its golf team to even
compete but thereafter have a mythical national championship banner made
proclaiming that the Cougars would have won had they been able to compete on a
level playing field.
A lot of people seem to assume the article was written with a complaining tone.
It's not how I read it. I thought it was an interesting article describing
how the NCAA accommodation works. It's not inherently complaining to point
out that BYU really struggled in the round used to score the Sunday round.
It's also not inherently complaining to point out some of the differences
between that round and others where they scored better. I'm not saying
Harmon and the coach aren't complaining, because perhaps they are.
I'm just saying the tone can be read a different way.Harmon did
write, "The no-Sunday-play accommodation for BYU by the NCAA championship
committee has done the Cougars a big favor since it was instituted three years
ago. On one hand, it is a worthy gesture by the NCAA to give BYU’s
athletes a chance to compete because the LDS Church-sponsored school is not
going to compete on Sundays period. This is fair." That's where I got
the positive tone then. Harmon does then go into how it's not
necessarily an advantage. I can see how someone can read it as complaining,
it's just not how it came across to me.
Scores - you need to get a better definition of “unfair”. You
should also look up accommodation in the dictionary. Playing alone on
Thursday could be a real advantage if the weather was great and the Sunday round
had massive wind gusts. BYU should find another school that won’t
play on Sunday if they are concerned about playing alone. Otherwise quit
complaining about a special situation made just for one school.
Not longer an issue for Bro. Fishburn; as a professional, he can play on Sundays
all he wants.
"The Cougar team had to play alone, without competitors beside them, one
player to a hole, accompanied by an official scorer and a rules official. ...If
you play alone, you don’t see other players putt, thus gain a read or
speed knowledge. You aren’t pushed by natural competitive head-to-head
chemistry, a natural outbreak of a three or foursome format"There you go, NCAA. You bend over backwards for one team and then find out,
according to them, you have placed then they are at a disadvantage. Only fair
way is to make no concession. Treat all teams the same. Then its up to them.
Play or don't play.
Playing alone is a big disadvantage--but it's a small price to pay for
Poor BYU. They just can’t get a break.
Scores: "It's unfair to BYU to play alone."So the
entire college sports world should bend to meet the special needs of BYU-P? It
is entertaining to hear all of the excuses though. Can the margin of victory be
applied to losses in golf?
@let's rollI agree. The NCAA doesn't have to do anything
and you would think this article would be more appreciative of that. I can see
where BYU gets the reputation of being difficult to deal with when their Golf
Coach is complaining like this.
I agree with Keyser. The NCAA accommodation either helps BYU or hurts them. In
my opinion, there should be no accommodation in a sport like golf.
As a Cougar, I thank the NCAA for allowing the players to honor their commitment
as representatives of the University to not compete on Sunday.All
the rest is just noise.
Sounds to me like it could go either way: An advantage OR a disadvantage
depending on the weather. This time it didn't go BYU's way. Next
time it might. The NCAA is being more than fair in making the "Sunday
Accommodation" available to BYU. Dick is right. It could backfire on them
at some future tournament and they will have to deal with the flack. Sorry
Scores but I don't buy the "playing alone" argument.
These are not excuses. It's just what Dick says it is. It's unfair
to BYU to play alone. Just ask any other team to do what this accommodation
rule applies, and they wouldn't like it either. The whole format does not
do BYU any favors. The NCAA golf tournament is not going to change the format,
so a team like BYU, that doesn't compete on Sunday, basically has no chance
to finish as a champion. But let's give credit where credit is due...this
group of guys has performed well this season and qualified to be
there...that's a lot more than most college teams in the country did.Go Cougars!
Wow Dick,The NCAA bends over backward to make a special accommodation for
BYU and their "no play on Sunday" stance, and all you can do is whine
and make excuses.
To quote Russell Larsen, byu basketball player, "It's not fair,
it's just not fair." Surely the NCAA can do more than just merely make
an "accommodation" for byu. How about subbing in their best scores of
the tournament for the Sunday scores. See how fair that would be. . .then if
that wasn't sufficient perhaps dropping the worst scores of the tournament.
Now, that would be fair, right? Even Dick could support this, I think.