'This is not BYU football'; Cougars assured of 1st losing season since 2004

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  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Nov. 8, 2017 1:23 p.m.

    re:Jello is Good

    This is not just a losing season. BYU had some bad seasons under Edwards -- I think the worst was 6-6 -- however BYU was either in the WAC or MWC and the NCAA had not changed so dramatically with these new super-conferences that they have now. BYU is even worse now than when they were in the MWC since almost ALL their hard games are on the road -- no good team wants to come to Provo and risk playing in the thin air and losing. The fact is BYU can't recruit even close to what it used to do. The best players want to play in a BCS conference where all the exposure is and the medicore or average then get served out to the small conferences. BYU I doubt even recruits as good as the MWC does anymore because the MWC at least has some guaranteed bowl aggreements and better home schedules. The players the Y gets now are only those that really want to attend BYU for the LDS culture for the most part. An LDS player with NFL potential will go to the U of U most likely (due to the PAC12). Bottom line -- things aren't going to get better recruiting wise like they used to in the Edwards era. 2018 could be a repeat of 2017. Not Sitaki's fault.

  • Ronald Uharriet Menifee, CA
    Nov. 8, 2017 12:20 p.m.

    Stage 4 cancer can be beat. It is not easy. Many experimental programs must be tried. By the time it reaches stage 4, desperate measures must be tried, proven or not, but while offering some hope, without the change in methods for cure, there is little or no hope.

    Our football team, this 2017 season has reached stage 4 failure. It is time to try something different if we are to survive. The Cougars are worth it. The coaches are worth it. The fans are worth it. Don’t quit on us now.

  • EightOhOne St. George, UT
    Nov. 8, 2017 11:44 a.m.

    @ Jello is good

    "Yes we envy you being in the PAC 12, but this is the best we can do until NCAA football is overhauled."

    just curious what you feel needs to be overhauled in college football??

  • Chamberlain Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 7, 2017 12:14 p.m.

    Ute fans should either admit that BYU is a challenging OOC opponent, or they should stop claiming that BYU is an automatic win.

  • Lone*Star Austin, TX
    Nov. 7, 2017 12:04 p.m.

    Jello is Good

    I have no problem with the scheduling smack because Utah fans are constantly whining about BYU’s SOS, while the Utes rely entirely on their conference to determine whether Utah plays a CFP worthy schedule.

    USC, UCLA, Stanford and other PAC 12 teams play challenging OOC opponents. The Utes haven’t done anything to “upgrade” their schedule save whining about being forced to play BYU, even though BYU, except for this season, is almost always BETTER than several of Utah’s PAC 12 opponents.

    If BYU is really an automatic win, why are the Utes so reluctant to also schedule a more challenging OOC opponent?

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 7, 2017 10:45 a.m.

    @Mack2828 - Ft Thomas, KY
    Nov. 7, 2017 9:58 a.m.

    "In his interviews Kalani Sitaki sounds like a great guy. Someone you would love to have as a neighbor or the coach of your son's little league team. What he does not sound like is the coach of a D1 Football team. He's in way over his head."

    And you are qualified to make this assessment because.....

  • Mack2828 Ft Thomas, KY
    Nov. 7, 2017 9:58 a.m.

    In his interviews Kalani Sitaki sounds like a great guy. Someone you would love to have as a neighbor or the coach of your son's little league team. What he does not sound like is the coach of a D1 Football team. He's in way over his head.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 7, 2017 9:17 a.m.

    All this "scheduling" smack talk is ridicules. Some realities:

    Utah is in a conference and is required to play the games scheduled. Those conference games are difficult for sure.

    BYU is on the schedule because it is usually an entertaining game that helps both teams SOS. (Not this year) It also pays well for an OOC game for Utah. (Better than SUU, SJSU or ND) Legislature as nothing to do with it.

    Utah has played other P5's as OOC games, but does not need to. I have no problem with their schedule.

    BYU is not in a conference. No games are guaranteed. They must work to schedule all their games which is even more difficult once most teams start their conference schedule.

    They must schedule some tough P5's to get the SOS needed to be televised and, if they win, be considered for the NC. This means a front loaded schedule and a home schedule of usually weak teams. This is the price of independence.

    So BYU fans, stop making excuses. This is what we chose and what we must deal with and this is not Utah's fault.

    Utah fans, give it a rest. Yes we envy you being in the PAC 12, but this is the best we can do until NCAA football is overhauled.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    Nov. 7, 2017 9:05 a.m.

    Spokane Ute

    re: Why would U rather play Fresno St, San Jose St, N. Illinois,...

    ---------
    "Simple; recruiting. I hope that helps"

    LOL at that lame excuse.

    Even you understood how lame, since you intentionally omitted Wyoming from the list.

    Utah already plays one or two games in California every year, so playing Fresno St or San Jose St does NOTHING for Utah recruiting.

    If Utah was really scheduling for recruiting, they'd be playing teams from Texas and Florida.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 7, 2017 9:02 a.m.

    @KH

    "After 7 straight losses you wouldn't imagine that the losing team would still be talking trash about the winning team, especially if said losing team is 2-7 this year, but you have surprised me."

    Not hear to say BYU is good this year or that they have been better than Utah in any of the last 7 years. But I do remember Going 19-3 against the utes at one point and during the 1986 season with the Utes in the middle of a 2-9 season being outscored on average 40-25 hearing Ute fans throwing stones at our "paltry" 8-5 record and 2nd place conference finish that year.

    Yes it is in bad form to mock somebody who is doing or has done something you are not this year or may never have done.

    Utah is better than BYU this year and for the past 7 years. No amount of comparisons changes that.

    With that being said, BYU is a member of a small club consisting of college football teams that have won a National Championship. No amount of comparisons or smack talk or rationalization can change that.

    And yes, every time I think about that year and that final game it makes my heart warm. Probably similar to the way you feel about your undefeated season. (But not the same.)

  • Spokane Ute Spokane, WA
    Nov. 7, 2017 8:52 a.m.

    Why would U rather play Fresno St, San Jose St, N. Illinois,...
    ---------
    Simple; recruiting.

    I hope that helps

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 7, 2017 8:30 a.m.

    @patriot
    "BYU should opt out of the NCAA. Too political and not fit for a religious school anymore. Concentrate just on academics. It was fun while it lasted."

    Yes you are right. After over 100 years of football because of one losing season we should just quit.

    Because we have had 5 losing seasons in the last 50 years, we should just quit.

    Despite going to 35 bowl games in the past 50 years and for the past 12 years in a row., we should just quit.

    Because we are "different" than others and have principles which we refuse to compromise making it difficult to be invited to join a P5 conference despite our performance on the field proving otherwise, we should just quit.

    Despite our football team being on national TV almost every week and hearing announcers not only laud our school for its rich and successful football heritage and our competitiveness, but also speak well of our character and our beliefs, we should just quit.

    Yes, despite our sports program being in the black and self sufficient with all funds coming from sports revenue and donations by alumni and supporters specifically to support the sports program, we should just quit.

    Don't you see how silly that sounds?

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 7, 2017 8:12 a.m.

    @AZUTE1

    "Again, record alone w/out considering Sos is straight ridiculous."

    Wait, you always tell us it doesn't matter how close the score is. A Win is a Win.

    "Colorado barely beat us in a game we very easily should’ve won. Dominated is what we did to byu that identical year on their homefield, to the tune of 54-10. Furthermore, how would byu have fared against Cu’s P5 Sos, particularly considering our 54-10 road W?"

    Again, score doesn't matter, right? Otherwise you are only 6 points better than us this year and 1 point better last year. Which is it? How about this: If Utah had played Colorado in September and BYU and played Colorado in November we both would have won.

    "How many P5 division/conference championships has byu ever won?"

    Same as Utah, zero. See how much alike we are?

    "In fact, byu has never ever beat us since we joined The PAC-12."

    Using your rationale since BYU beat Utah like a drum for the better part of 20 years one could say Utah would never be better than BYU. But history has shown how flawed that thinking would have been. We are in a down year, but at some point the worm will turn.

  • northern_lights Layton, UT
    Nov. 7, 2017 8:04 a.m.

    re: killarney - "If Utah St is so "terrible", why is Utah too scared to schedule the Aggies home-and-home, instead of scheduling MWC bottom dwellers like San Jose State?"

    re: motorbike = "Simple answer. Utah plays a 9-game conference schedule leaving only 3 out of conference games to schedule. "

    Talk about a lame excuse.

    Why would U rather play Fresno St, San Jose St, No Illinois, or Wyoming, than Utah St?

    It certainly can't be because the Utes have a huge number of fans in Illinois or Wyoming, and the Utes already play in California at least once or twice per year.

    The simple truth is, Utah is scared to death to play the Aggies in Logan since they embarrassed U the last time you played there. That's why you paid the Aggies to come to SLC in 2015, and have refused to schedule them since.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:21 p.m.

    killarney

    If Utah St is so "terrible", why is Utah too scared to schedule the Aggies home-and-home, instead of scheduling MWC bottom dwellers like San Jose State?
    ---------------
    Simple answer. Utah plays a 9-game conference schedule leaving only 3 out of conference games to schedule. Due to meddling state legislators Utah is stuck playing BYU every year so those three games are down to two. One of the two is going to be a warm-up game which makes sense for any team with a P5 schedule. So you tell me, with just that one remaining spot to work with would you schedule another instate game? I know I'd rather see Utah line up games in Utah's out of state recruiting footprint. This gives new recruits a chance to attend a Utah game in or near their home town and is also a chance to get current Ute players an opportunity to play a collegiate game in front of family and friends.
    Bottom line, playing USU would often be more fun for us Utahns to watch, but playing teams like San Jose State and Fresno State is a lot more positive for recruiting purposes. The best solution would be rotating BYU and USU every year but legislators apparently don't like USU enough to let that happen.

  • omsdave Visalia, CA
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:47 p.m.

    Let me see if I can get may point across without getting censored into oblivion. The players performance often reflect the quality of the coaching. Being a good player doesn't mean your going to be a good coach. The team's record speaks for itself and its coaches.

  • IrieUte west valley, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:55 p.m.

    Do byu fans still want this game played in November?

    Go Utes!

  • SoonerUte Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:53 p.m.

    BlueCoug "For those of you correctly blaming this on Independence, how do you explain?
    The schedule is front-loaded because it has to be. In the past, BYU has fortunate to play some P5 teams on down years. That luck caused fans to incorrectly believe that they should regularly beat 1/2 of their P5 opponents. The truth is, they might upset one. The biggest challenge for the coaching staff is guiding their players through the September slump.

    "Several P5 teams that had disappointing seasons and turned things around."
    What do you see as a "turn around" for BYU football? Bowl eligibility? An 8 win season? Several fans predicted this year would be a 10 or 11 win season. What is the expected norm for independent BYU football?

  • SIMPLICITY Denver, CO
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:07 p.m.

    It truly is astounding...

    After over a decade of domination by their rival, byu-p still claims to be equal or better. Records don't lie, 7 in a row doesn't lie, facts are facts.

    This is byu football. Mediocrity and losing is the norm unless they schedule majority G5 teams. A winning season would be possible in the WAC or Sun Belt

    After 10 loses in a row to their rival will the byu alumni accept their reality? Of course not.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:05 p.m.

    LonestarRunner

    "If traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season isn't a huge disadvantage, why do the Utes only schedule MWC bottom dwellers and Big Sky teams to pad their OOC schedule every year, instead of scheduling home-and-home series versus good G5 or even P5 opponents located outside of the PAC 12 geographic footprint?"
    ----------------
    A BYU fan like yourself should know the answer to your question. Utah plays 9 conference games whereas most conferences play 8. On top of the 9 conference games Utah has essentially been forced to play BYU which leaves just 2 games a year for Chris Hill to schedule other teams. BYU has typically been a strong team (though trending a different direction) so with those two remaining games it becomes almost idiotic to schedule anything other than a warm-up game and a G5 opponent within Utah's recruiting footprint (typically).
    Since joining the Pac 12 Utah played Pittsburgh at their place while also playing Michigan home and away. I think it's pretty clear Utah would like to play teams of that variety but when forced to play BYU it'll always make doing so a challenge.

  • Hugo West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 4:40 p.m.

    BYU fans really shouldn't despair because of this season.

    I know it isn't apples-to-apples but compare this BYU football season to what happened to the Runnin' Utes in the 2011/12 season. They hit rock bottom and I can tell you that it didn't feel like they'd ever get better. But four years later they were a Sweet 16 team.

    BYU will be just fine. Don't know when they'll turn it around but they will.

  • LonestarRunner Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 3:46 p.m.

    motorbike

    If traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season isn't a huge disadvantage,

    why do the Utes only schedule MWC bottom dwellers and Big Sky teams to pad their OOC schedule every year, instead of scheduling home-and-home series versus good G5 or even P5 opponents located outside of the PAC 12 geographic footprint?

    Chris Hill ALWAYS schedules two of Utah's three OOC opponents at home.

  • SportsFan Provo, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 3:37 p.m.

    motorbike

    "And let’s not forget the huge disadvantage of traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season."

    Until this season, most of the "automatic wins" against G5 teams that BYU has lost to since 2011 have come on the road to teams BYU hasn't played before.

    Since Utah has never played an unfamiliar G5 opponent, in an unfamiliar venue, since 2011, you have no basis for comparison.

    Even your only P5 OOC road opponent was your 2nd game in Ann Arbor in 6 years, a continuation of your 2-for-1 series with the Wolverines.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 3:07 p.m.

    "And let’s not forget the huge disadvantage of traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season."
    ------------
    I love this latest go-to excuse. Question though, if it's legitimate then doesn't it favor BYU when the same teams travel to BYU? Wouldn't that make it wash? And we've certainly heard plenty over the years about how well BYU fans travel, so the one-off games in neutral locations should almost always favor BYU right? I certainly realize it didn't work out as planned against LSU this year with the game being moved but that's not the typical scenario, right?
    I don't know, it's starting to seem like BYU fans are running out of excuses.

  • KH Holladay, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 3:05 p.m.

    "Utah's paltry list of only FIVE conference championships won in the last 50+ years, is proof that there are no automatic wins for the little red engine that couldn't."

    Except byu is an automatic win for the Utes, right midmajor?

    Not sure what 50 years in the past has anything to do with the Utes now.

    After 7 straight losses you wouldn't imagine that the losing team would still be talking trash about the winning team, especially if said losing team is 2-7 this year, but you have surprised me.

  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 3:05 p.m.

    I remember when 2 losses in a season was considered mediocre. Wow - times have changed. I think the new norm will be just hoping for 6-6 season. Acutally, I can seen next year being a repeat of 2017 unless something changes. Maybe they will just cancel the program? Seriously -- BYU should opt out of the NCAA. Too political and not fit for a religious school anymore. Concentrate just on academics. It was fun while it lasted.

  • midpacmajor Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 2:53 p.m.

    KH

    Utah's paltry list of only FIVE conference championships won in the last 50+ years, is proof that there are no automatic wins for the little red engine that couldn't.

    Perennial losses to conference bottom dwellers are the main reason the Utes are incapable of winning conference championships.

    Kyle has only won ONE conference championship in 13 seasons.

    BYU won back-to-back conference championships in 2006 and 2007.

  • Christy B Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 2:38 p.m.

    re: "despite getting dominated on their home field by one of the worst teams in the country."

    re: AZUTE1 "Cu barely beat us in a game we very easily should’ve won."

    Typical selective memory.

    Colorado dominated U from the start. At halftime, the Buffs led 10-0 and held a 254-39 total-yardage advantage and 11½-minute edge in time of possession.

    The Utes didn't get their initial first down until the 2:56 mark of the second quarter, eliciting mock cheers from the crowd of 45,026.

    With 4:47 left in the third quarter, the Buffs capped an 11-play, 82-yard drive with a 1-yard touchdown pass to put Colorado ahead 17-7.

    The Utes never got closer than the final 17-14 score.

    And, let's not forget, that was Utah playing at home against a team that hadn't won a road game in 4 years.

  • KH Holladay, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 2:37 p.m.

    "The truth is, there are no "automatic wins"."

    You're certainly right mid-major. Byu proved there are absolutely no automatic wins anymore for them as they lost to 1-6 East Carolina.

    As for Utah, they have at least one automatic win every year against a certain team. Can you guess who that is?

    "When was the last time Utah played LSU, Arizona, W Virginia, Missouri, Oklahoma or Houston in an NFL stadium."

    No way, your team played in an NFL stadium? That's so cool! Not really sure what your point is though.

    "When was the last time Utah played at Michigan St, at Nebraska, at Ole Miss, at Miss St, at Virginia, at Texas, or at Wisconsin."

    I'm not sure, but I know the Utes play teams of the same caliber, or better, than these teams you listed. And they play them every single year. Again, I'm not sure what point you're trying to make...that byu plays different teams than Utah?

  • Shawnm750 Sandy, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 2:31 p.m.

    “When (offensive coordinator Ty) Detmer calls a play, we’ve got to execute, no matter what the play is called. No matter if anybody disagrees, it’s upon us to execute. We’ve got to do better at execution.”

    Sounds like there is some dissension on the team. The program is in pretty deep trouble and they're going to need to make some serious changes in the off season. I think the Ty Detmer experiment has run its course and they need to find an actual offensive coordinator.

    Sadly, I don't think a conference affiliation is in the cards for them, so I think that regardless of whatever coaching changes they do make, the program's still going to suffer so long as they're independent.

  • midpacmajor Salt Lake City, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 2:13 p.m.

    KH

    When was the last time Utah played LSU, Arizona, W Virginia, Missouri, Oklahoma or Houston in an NFL stadium.

    When was the last time Utah played at Michigan St, at Nebraska, at Ole Miss, at Miss St, at Virginia, at Texas, or at Wisconsin.

    The truth is, there are no "automatic wins".

    The Utes aren't even capable of automatically beating PAC 12 bottom dwellers,

    which is why the Utes are incapable of even winning their own division, let alone winning a conference championship.

  • KH Holladay, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:48 p.m.

    "And let’s not forget the huge disadvantage of traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season."

    You're right, cause it's so much easier playing USC every year, rather than play East Carolina one year, then Savannah State the next, then.....

    I think you get my point.

    "There is really not that much difference between the Y and the U."

    "But in the end, there is not much difference between the two Utah schools."

    Says a fan of the team who hasn't beaten Utah in 8 years.

  • Reality ! Wellsville, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:46 p.m.

    All this rant about independence, tough schedules, injuries, comparisons to the Utes, play selection, the coaches, athletic director and administration is ridiculous. It is about this year, the players on the field in a highly physical, competitive event. It comes down to eleven vs. eleven players, offensive and defensive. From the statistics and scores this year, no matter who is on the field for either side, the players on opposing teams are just outplaying the BYU players. Why is that? Look at the turnovers, physicality, and breakdowns in critical situations. It is all about when ‘the rubber meets the road’. Fix the problem where the problem is ON THE FIELD OF PLAY. Each individual player has to do his job on every play, if not make the change to another that will perform.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:44 p.m.

    AZUTE1

    "BYU plays against a familiar opponent in familiar venues, annually, meaning us, but can never ever beat us, ever."

    Except for when U run away from the rivalry...

    and, of course,

    you're rarely able to win by more than a touchdown.

    btw, playing ONE familiar opponent in a familiar venue annually is hardly equivalent to playing 10 or 11 familiar opponents in familiar venues every year.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:38 p.m.

    AZUTE1

    "Again, record alone w/out considering Sos is straight ridiculous."

    Says a Utah fan who has constantly mocked any BYU win over a P5 team that wasn't ranked or didn't win more than 7 games. And, of course, any win over a non-P5 team was immediately dismissed as meaningless, even if that team was ranked - see Utah State.

    Your inconsistency is absolutely hysterical.

    According to your standard, although you'd never admit it, Utah's 2004 and 2008 seasons were meaningless, because the Utes only had one or two wins versus P5 teams.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:30 p.m.

    itswhatithink

    Without understanding history, there is no context with which to evaluate the present.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:25 p.m.

    “Utah plays 11 or 12 familiar opponents in familiar venues every season.”

    byu plays against a familiar opponent in familiar venues, annually, meaning us, but can never ever beat us, ever.

  • AZUTE1 Mesa, AZ
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:22 p.m.

    “Any BYU win over any opponent that had a record that was equal to or better than the record of the worst opponent Utah lost to in a given season, cannot be considered an ‘automatic win’. regardless of how U spin it.”

    Again, record alone w/out considering Sos is straight ridiculous.

    “despite getting dominated on their home field by one of the worst teams in the country.”

    Cu barely beat us in a game we very easily should’ve won. Dominated is what we did to byu that identical year on their homefield, to the tune of 54-10.

    Furthermore, how would byu have fared against Cu’s P5 Sos, particularly considering our 54-10 road W?

    “and since joining the PAC 12,

    you’re not even capable of winning a division championship.”

    How many P5 division/conference championships has byu ever won?

    In fact, byu has never ever beat us even one single game since we joined The PAC-12, not even once.

  • itswhatithink West Jordan, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:20 p.m.

    I wish many posters on the forum would get a life. Quoting statistics up to 50 years ago will not change the current status of any team in Utah. The only stat that is significant right now is what is your W/L record for 2017.

    Doesn't matter what happened before because NO team keeps every player. They leave, graduate, quit or are injured. So there are no apples to apples.

    BYU won a NC many many years ago. Detmer won a heisman 20+ years ago. What happened then doesn't make a difference to how the game is played today. Many rules have changed, uniforms have changed, coaching and reffing has changed - in reality EVERYTHING has changed.

    Utah is not going to win the NC this year nor is BYU! I don't get it why individuals spend hours doing research on past records to try to score a point that won't change standings in any poll or will it change a win/loss record this year.

  • killarney Lincoln Park, IL
    Nov. 6, 2017 1:19 p.m.

    motorbike

    If Utah St is so "terrible", why is Utah too scared to schedule the Aggies home-and-home, instead of scheduling MWC bottom dwellers like San Jose State?

    "before anyone wants to say yeah but what about the strength of the other 6 BYU has played? Those 6 would be par for the course for all of those D1 championship teams in the last"

    Don't kid yourself.

    In 2011, every team in the PAC 12 South, except Utah and USC, finished with a losing record, yet the Utes were so pathetic that they couldn't beat one of the worst teams in the country, 10-loss Colorado, to win the PAC 12 South, even though USC was ineligible.

    The truth is, the Utes hide behind the skirts of the PAC 12, relying entirely on the conference to determine whether the Utes play anybody of consequence.

    This season, the Utes only play 5 road games, only 4 outside the state of Utah, and only 3 versus opponents with winning records, yet the Utes are still struggling to qualify for a bowl.

  • Voodohound-WIS Waukesha, WI
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:49 p.m.

    BYU's bad season won't affect my level of fandom. Still will watch and be a fan the rest of this year, next year, the year after that..... until dead. I love BYU and I love college football, even though the system is ruining the game. The separation between the have's and have-nots is widening, even within the P5 cohort. It's unfortunately that it seems that only a handful of teams in the country really have a shot at a NC. And if your basis for being a fan is hitched to them one day competing for a NC, then 95% of all fans should just pack it up.

    In the current system Utah will NEVER win a NC. BYU will never win a NC again. There is really not that much difference between the Y and the U. Utah is just the Star bellied Sneetch and BYU is not. And U fans look down their noses because we don't have a "P5" next to our name. But in the end, there is not much difference between the two Utah schools.

  • No playoff for U Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:49 p.m.

    motorbike

    Regardless of how you spin it, a home game versus a 4-8 team should be considered an automatic win.

    And let’s not forget the huge disadvantage of traveling great distances to play unfamiliar teams in unfamiliar venues several times every season.

    Utah plays 11 or 12 familiar opponents in familiar venues every season.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:47 p.m.

    "Has any D1 program that has won a NC in the last 50 years fallen a low as the Cougars?"
    ----------
    This question/conversation/comparison is a ridiculous one to have/make. To make it a fair comparison one would first have to ask if any D1 National Championship teams had even one season in the past 50 years that included 7 teams ranked 112-232.

    Latest Sagarin:
    --------------------
    232 - Portland State
    212 - San Jose State
    177 - UMass
    176 - Hawaii
    139 - UNLV
    134 - East Carolina
    112 - USU

    And before anyone wants to say yeah but what about the strength of the other 6 BYU has played? Those 6 would be par for the course for all of those D1 championship teams in the last 50 seasons...though you'd need to add another 3-4 games to bring that total closer to 9 or 10.

    That ought to put an end to that silly comparison - not apples to oranges. Not even close.

  • Chamberlain Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:33 p.m.

    motorbike

    BYU was 9-4 versus a similarly difficult schedule in 2016.

    It’s not the schedule, but BYU’s 2017 team that is responsible for BYU’s miserable record this season.

  • MRM Layton, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:22 p.m.

    Stringer Bell

    Unfortunately for U,

    Utah’s dream season didn’t even come close to winning a national championship,

    and since joining the PAC 12,

    you’re not even capable of winning a division championship.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:23 p.m.

    @red.diehard - Central, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:34 a.m.

    "Having the bowl streak end has one great benefit, the blue fans touting that going to x number of sequential bowls games = we are a great program. I guess we will find out when the sequence starts again. I am guessing not until 2019, at the soonest."

    That is exactly how I feel about the Ute faithful hanging on to the streak of being ranked in every single FBS poll. Guess that ended this year. Does that also start again in 2019?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:22 p.m.

    everything is awesome

    "As far as losing to gimmes, how many 7- to 10-loss teams have the Utes lost to since 2011?"
    -------------
    Surely you realize that not all 7-10 loss teams are the same. Generally speaking the 7-10 loss teams from P5 conferences still beat the G5 teams they play in out of conference games.
    For example, Utah has lost ONE non-conference game since joining the Pac 12. That game was on the road against a very good USU team and a game where Utah's starting quarterback was injured and taken out of the game in the first quarter. Utah was 4-1 in non-conference games at that point and is 19-0 since. That is of course a grand total of 23-1 since joining the Pac 12.
    Now granted some of those wins were against FCS teams and non-Pac 12 P5 teams. But most were G5 teams and Independent BYU. So yeah, it certainly shows that wins over G5's and BYU come easier than wins over P5 teams of ANY record good or bad.

  • FACTchequer Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:14 p.m.

    tdute

    If you’re going to spout off about “remembering” this season in comparison to previous seasons, you should at least use real facts instead your own made up facts.

    Utah played in a bowl in their first season in the PAC 12,

    despite getting dominated on their home field by one of the worst teams in the country.

  • EightOhOne St. George, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:12 p.m.

    This IS byu football! This is what it will look like from now on until they finally scrap the program :-)

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:06 p.m.

    @xert - Santa Monica, CA
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:42 a.m.

    "Has any D1 program that has won a NC in the last 50 years fallen a low as the Cougars? "

    Since you asked the question...

    ND 2016 4-8
    Miami 2014 6-7
    Florida 2008 4-8
    Texas 2015&2016 5-7
    USC 2005 0-0 (Forfeited Season)

    FSU 2006 2-6
    2007 0-6 (Forfeited parts of 2 seasons)
    Nebraska 2004 5-6
    Georgia Tech 2015 3-9
    Penn St 2003 3-9

    And my favorite...

    Colorado 2012 1-11 (This was in the middle of 10 straight losing seasons from 2006 - 2016. Interesting that this record somehow qualified them for entrance to the PAC 12.)

    I wanted to include Utah, but they have never won a NC. Oh well...here are some of their fine records since 1984:

    1986 2-9
    1987 5-7
    1989 4-8
    1990 4-7
    2000 4-7
    2002 5-6
    2012 5-7
    2013 5-7

    BYU will be just fine.

  • everything is awesome Cedar City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 12:06 p.m.

    red.diehard

    You claim that point spread is meaningless, yet Ute fans beat their chests incessantly every time the Utes win a blowout.

    Here’s a clue:

    Any BYU win over any opponent that had a record that was equal to or better than the record of the worst opponent Utah lost to in a given season, cannot be considered an “automatic win”, regardless of how U spin it.

  • TouchdownUtes Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:46 a.m.

    I'm going to remember this season....BYU fans mocked Utah for not achieving a bowl game in the first 2 years of the PAC-12, all while knowing that they were beaten by Utah the same years. As a Ute fan, it would be easy to throw a little ribbing of the horrible season BYU has had....but out of respect for Coach Sitake, I'm not going to go there. Perhaps this is where being independent leads BYU....and with the lack of success this year, it has a trickling effect.....especially in terms of recruiting. The article is right.....this is not BYU football.....at least not the BYU football I grew up with. One thing's for sure, I don't think BYU will ever achieve the level of success they once gained.....not being independent, non P5, etc. Just my opinion....

  • Stringer Bell Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:45 a.m.

    Estreetshuffle: “As fans I hope we can be like the fans of the NY Mets that were the laughing stock of Pro Baseball until the miracle year 1969.”

    BYU-P has already had their “miracle”, in 1984. I wouldn’t hold my breath on the chances of another one happening. Bad knee-jerk decision to go independent, poor coaching, mediocre players, and goofy schedules. It will take more than a miracle to fix that.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:41 a.m.

    Marked it Down

    "IF Independence was really the culprit, how do you explain BYU's SIX previous 8+ win Independent seasons, compared to Utah's FOUR 8+ win PAC 12 seasons?"
    --------------
    It's rather funny to me that you don't see the problem with the comparison you're trying to make. You've just witnessed the one season among the last 7 that closest compares to the schedule Utah faced in every one of those seasons - therein lies the answer to your question.
    Sorry to point this out but BYU's schedule is similar if not more difficult next year...brace yourself for a further dose of reality.

  • Juice Box Eureka, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:36 a.m.

    Slump buster teams are built into BYU's schedule. More than half of their opponents could be considered "slump busters".

    I mean, BYU couldn't get bowl eligible even though bowl eligibility was built into the schedule.

  • red.diehard Central, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:34 a.m.

    @everything is awesome

    "If Utah is really as superior and dominant as you claim."

    I have not claimed that Utah is awesome, superior, nor dominant. I was merely answering a question explaining the supposed success that byu has had since independence. byu has scheduled enough incredibly poor teams to become bowl eligible that past several years. Point spread is meaningless to me, a win is a win...1 pt or 50 pts... .01 seconds or 1 second...get my drift?

    Having the bowl streak end has one great benefit, the blue fans touting that going to x number of sequential bowls games = we are a great program. I guess we will find out when the sequence starts again. I am guessing not until 2019, at the soonest.

    Here is a question for any of you blue fans: Since independence, what is the very best victory byu has had on the football field? We will exclude the Miami Beach Brawl as there was no determined winner.

  • talkinsports Gilbert, AZ
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:31 a.m.

    red.diehard

    "BYU has scheduled 6-8 automatic wins every year"

    PROVE it!

    Name every one of the 6-8 automatic wins BYU has scheduled every season since 2011,

    along with Utah's worst loss each of those seasons.

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:22 a.m.

    65TossPowerTrap

    "BYU needs to play a slump-buster team - you know - somebody like UCLA."
    ------------
    Gotta give props for your comment. Realistic Ute fans have to be able to laugh and admit that you're observation is correct, UCLA really is terrible this year. I'm hoping it gave Utah some needed confidence but also hope they don't spend much time patting themselves on the back for beating a pretty terrible team.

  • everything is awesome Cedar City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:19 a.m.

    red.diehard

    SOS doesn't prove how good or bad a team is, it only proves how good or bad their opponents are.

    If you took the defending National Champions and had them play the weakest SOS in the country, would that prove that they weren't any good?

    If Utah is really as superior and dominant as you claim,

    why have the Utes only beaten BYU by more than a touchdown ONCE since 2011?

    Why was BYU's point spread this season versus Utah (13-19) less than the point spread versus Fresno St. (13-20)?

    As far as losing to gimmes, how many 7- to 10-loss teams have the Utes lost to since 2011?

    How many 7- to 10-loss teams have the Utes barely beaten by less than a touchdown since 2011?

    Even in your 2016 bowl, U barely beat an Indiana team that finished with a losing record and hasn't won a bowl game in THIRTY years.

  • Dave Brarrington Salem, ID
    Nov. 6, 2017 11:08 a.m.

    The most disappointing thing about this season will be burning a Red-Shirt year for Critchlow for only a few minutes on the field! That is the only reason I would consider this season a failure. Losses disappointing, yes. Not developing talent = Failure!

  • red.diehard Central, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 10:30 a.m.

    @Marked it Down

    "IF Independence was really the culprit, how do you explain BYU's SIX previous 8+ win Independent seasons, compared to Utah's FOUR 8+ win PAC 12 seasons?"

    You could ask a slightly difficult question.

    Strength of Schedule, byu has been in the 4th-5th quintile since independence. Currently, according to Sag, Utah and byu are the same (54th and 58th respectively). And just like last year and the year before and the year before...byu will be in the 4th-5th quintile and Utah will be in the 1st or 2nd quintile at seasons end (Utah will move into the 2nd after Saturday).

    byu has scheduled 6-8 automatic wins every year. Granted in the first couple of years in was a scramble to play anybody. This year, how many were 'automatic' wins? Enough to get to a bowl game, except this year the wheels came off...just like Bronco predicted.

  • KimmyP Grantsville, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 10:16 a.m.

    @65powderpuff

    "byu needs to play a slump buster team"... What those like powderpuff can't recognize is byu is now the slump buster team. I'm sure ECU, USU, BSU and FSU would agree.

    And, you can rest assured, UCLA would not lose to the Cougs.

  • Wise-sage pleasant grove, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 10:13 a.m.

    Towards the end of the first half when they showed that BYU passed the ball 25 times completed 65% of the passes for a total of.......109 yards that proves how pathetic and awful Detmer's offence is. It was that way last year but we have 2 beast Hill and Williams that hid Detmer's terrible offence. To be honest it does make me feel bad to say this cause he was the best QB ever at the Y. But he is a bad QB coach as well. Has any QBs improved under Detmer?? NO. He doesn't even teach the QBs how to audible when there are 9 guys in the box. He just looks at his sheet and calls a play w/o looking over the defense.

  • Samwise Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 10:11 a.m.

    To the haters saying "this is BYU football", look at the history. This season is an anomaly historically and is quite obviously NOT BYU football. With that said, if the right changes are not made I admit that this very well could become BYU football. But as any sports fan knows, teams can have down years, make the right changes, and then be very good again within a few years. I just hope BYU has what it takes to make the right changes. Time will tell.

  • Road Runner Cedar City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:42 a.m.

    Despite the panic attack some fair-weather BYU fans are suffering,

    and the dancing in the streets gloating of the haters,

    one disastrous season does not prove that the sky is falling and this is the end of BYU football.

  • mdp Bountiful, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:34 a.m.

    This is the new BYU football- the result of independence and the resulting recruiting limitations it forces on an already difficult situation.

  • DeepBlue Anaheim, CA
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:28 a.m.

    xert

    "Has any D1 program that has won a NC in the last 50 years fallen a low as the Cougars?"

    Since BYU won its National Championship in 1984, every single National Champion has suffered one or more losing, bowl less seasons, including all three PAC 12 teams:

    Clemson (3-8)
    Alabama (3-8)
    Ohio St (4-6-1)
    Florida St (currently 3-5)
    Florida (4-8)
    LSU (2-9)
    Texas (4-7)
    USC (4-6-1)
    Miami (5-7)
    Oklahoma (3-8)
    Tennessee (5-7)
    Michigan (3-9)
    Nebraska (5-7)
    Washington (0-12)
    Colorado (1-11)
    Notre Dame (3-9)
    Penn St (3-9)

  • DonO Draper, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:24 a.m.

    Unfortunately for them, this IS Byu football, now and for the foreseeable future. They can't recruit and so they can't compete against talented D-1 programs. If by some chance they were able to get into a mid-level conference it might throw the program a life line. But I believe even that would be too little, too late.

  • Thidder MAPLETON, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:17 a.m.

    Click your heals together, Dorothy, and repeat: We will get better, We will get better....

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 9:01 a.m.

    red.diehard

    One word describes your "Independence" rant: delusional

    IF Independence was really the culprit, how do you explain BYU's SIX previous 8+ win Independent seasons, compared to Utah's FOUR 8+ win PAC 12 seasons?

    BYU / Utah
    10-3 / 8-5
    8-5 / 5-7
    8-5 / 5-7
    8-5 / 8-5
    9-4 / 9-4
    9-4 / 10-3

  • BlueCoug Provo, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:49 a.m.

    As BYU fans, we've gotten spoiled with twelve straight winning, bowl seasons with some big wins and a few disappointing losses tossed in.

    How quickly some have forgotten that only a year ago, BYU was 9-4 and won a bowl game playing a similarly difficult schedule. All four losses were by a combined 8 points.

    It's incredibly unfair to Sitake and Detmer to be calling for them to be fired because of one bad season.

    For those of you cluelessly blaming this on Independence, how do you explain?

    Florida St (3-5) - Seminoles had 6 straight 10+ win seasons, including a 14-0 National Championship season in 2013, but may not even get a bowl invite this year, even they have the same head coach?

    Florida (3-5)
    No Caro (1-8)
    Baylor (1-8)
    Kansas (1-8)
    Indiana (3-6)
    Illinois (2-7)
    Ore St (1-8)
    UCLA (4-5)

    Several P5 teams that had disappointing seasons last year have turned things around this year.

    Michigan St (7-2)
    Virginia (6-3)
    Miss St (7-2)

    Things are always cyclical in major college football and no program is immune to suffering awful seasons.

    Even mighty Alabama has had two 8+ loss seasons this century.

  • xert Santa Monica, CA
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:42 a.m.

    Has any D1 program that has won a NC in the last 50 years fallen a low as the Cougars? Most who win NC's have riches and rewards and stellar seasons to follow and really establish a base and though they may have down years, they are down years against stellar competition. Even through tough times, they don't lose games to the kind of opponents that these Cougars are losing to. Perhaps the 84 NC meant very little in the great scheme of things. Miami fell on tough times, but they were playing the best. ND fell on a few tough seasons, but were playing against the toughest schedule in the nation. If losing to ECU, Fresno and Utah State is what followed in it's wake, perhaps playing a non ranked Michigan team in the Holiday Bowl wasn't really anything that laid any kind of foundation at all.

  • red.diehard Central, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:21 a.m.

    One word describes the fans: delusional
    One workd describes coaches/players: delusional

    I was (still am) ambivalent toward Bronco Mendenhall however, he hit the nail on the head twice:
    1. byu fanbase football knowledge
    2. sustainability of independence (the rapid decline bears out his timeline perfectly)

    Before the, 'Holmoe is the devil' rants begin, I have a question. Keeping in mind #1 above, do you really believe that the decision to go independent was Mr. Holmoe's and his alone?

  • IQ92 hi, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:20 a.m.

    "I see know reason to get out of the WAC." — Lavell Edwards

  • cjd1 Draper, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:20 a.m.

    The sad thing is BYU is bringing the same players next year (minus Troy Warner and others) so expect the same season.

  • CodyCougar Salt Lake City, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:21 a.m.

    This team is an embarrassment to a great institution and tradition. Players need coaches who will teach and hold them accountable. Not buddies, "bra's" and "home boys."

  • DSattheU Ogden, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:19 a.m.

    @eaststreetshuffle - as a lifelong Mets fan, the problem with your analogy is this: they were a laughing stock before they won the WS in '69. There have also been long stretches of being a laughing stock after that time. BYU had their miracle season in '84 and unless time starts going backward, that's not coming any time soon.

  • goosehuntr Tooele, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 8:15 a.m.

    Sione Takitaki. “Even though the season’s going rough, we’re going to get back on Monday and get back to work. It’s not the end of the world. We’re blessed to play this game, we’re blessed to be at this beautiful institution at BYU, we’re blessed with family members. Football is not all of life. We’re blessed to play this game.”

    Now that is a kid I want on my team. What a great attitude and perspective. What a leader.
    That is gold amidst the dross.

  • Pale Bear Orem, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 7:48 a.m.

    Canada said, "When (offensive coordinator Ty) Detmer calls a play, we’ve got to execute, no matter what the play is called. No matter if anybody disagrees, it’s upon us to execute."

    Players disagree with Detmer? Is that an issue or is that just the way he happened to word it?

    I wouldn't want the coaches every week to say, "We've had lots of injuries. Oh well--we'll get 'em next year." But they have had a lot of injuries. There are times of rebuilding. It's sad to see the coach beating himself up. There is only so much you can do.

    We play a weird schedule each season without predictability. When you are in a conference, you know the style of coaching and general abilities of the team. That's hot to be an advantage.

  • CDM1525 West Point, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 7:48 a.m.

    @65TossPowerTrap

    I can’t believe you just said they need to play a slump buster team like UCLA? They’ve had a couple of you can’t remember. ECU, Fresno State and Utah State. As bad as UCLA is, they would work BYU. I get it, your season is so bad you have repressed most of it.

  • LDSAZ Casa Grande, AZ
    Nov. 6, 2017 7:30 a.m.

    I can't think of any part of the football program that excels. Every aspect of the game is just plain awful. Bushman is the only guy on the team who can catch a pass well. Play calling is just terrible. There are no RB's, 1 receiver, occasional defense when the play called goes to a spot where the defense happened to be. How many times does the OL create a hole? How many running plays go for more than -5 to +2 yards? How many sweeps? How many screens? How many delayed draws? How many crossing routes? How many passes to RB's? How many defensive gems? How many times do coaches review these items? How many coaches actually coach these things? How much fun do players, coaches, and fans have?

    I fear that the answer is too close to zero on each question. How very hard to watch is BYU football this year. Wake up Cougars. Bring it to the game. Don't leave it on the board in the gym.

  • Musketman Stansbury Park, UT
    Nov. 6, 2017 7:12 a.m.

    The last few games. BYU has the advantage on on all the offensive stats, except wining score. People, myself included, have been saying the defense, is only playing poorly because they are on the field too long. Well that hasn't been the case the last few games. The defense is horrid, with a full compliment of Bronco recruits(he recruited well for defense) The DC has NO style with his play calling. There are no sack threats, no blitzes, no take aways. It is no longer time to blame the offense, it time to see that the defense shares the equal load, if not just little more so than offense!

  • oddman ,
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:57 a.m.

    Let's not let the defense off the hook. Wide open receivers, I mean WIDE OPEN receivers for large gains. I watched to the bitter end and kept hoping Critchlow would get his chance to shine. I'll keep watching and hoping it all gets figured out before the end. I love following the Cougars, win , lose , or draw.

  • Jello is Good ,
    Nov. 6, 2017 6:50 a.m.

    I feel bad for Mangum's injury, but that was the last game he will ever start for BYU. Even if he comes back, he might be the 3rd best QB on the team.

  • SAWing Goodyear, AZ
    Nov. 6, 2017 4:32 a.m.

    Takitaki had the words that define a proper spirit for the team. Go Cougars !!!

  • Sore loser Oakland, CA
    Nov. 5, 2017 11:52 p.m.

    The only thing that inflames my knickers is when the QB throws a pick six from deep in their own territory, other than that I have no problem with BYU football, they aren’t cocky for the most part so that’s a lot easier to watch than dudes making gestures about how great they think they are all game long

  • estreetshuffle Window Rock, AZ
    Nov. 5, 2017 11:03 p.m.

    I remember when the loyal fans of the 1960's NY Mets suffered with their team until the Miracle Mets beat the Baltimore Orioles in 1969 World Series. As fans I hope we can be like the fans of the NY Mets that were the laughing stock of Pro Baseball until the miracle year 1969.

  • Caddis Terry, MT
    Nov. 5, 2017 10:55 p.m.

    This year is awful. For sure. But reading the comments one would think there had been no victories over P5 schools over the past 2 or 3 years. Y’all know that is not really true or fair. In coach polling a year or 2 ago, BYU was considered most most deserving of entry into a power conference.
    Again, this year is a train wreck. And just for the record, I personally would vote for getting into a conference next year. And of course that aint gonna be a P5 conference. We are most definitely down.

  • blue & white Boise, ID
    Nov. 5, 2017 10:33 p.m.

    Beau H needs to get healthier. Start Critchlow and Detmer as back up till Beau is 100%. Maybe schedule some lower tier P5 along with 1-2 top tier. Detmer play calling can improve along with the rest of them. Hope you win the final 3.

  • BYUalum South Jordan, UT
    Nov. 5, 2017 10:26 p.m.

    We are all scratching our heads in disappointment. I'm sure they will figure it out. I hope the fans will hang in there and support this much-beloved coach and team who suit up and give it their all each week. There may need to be some changes and adjustments for next season in staffing. These are all good people, just not clicking on all cylinders!

    One remark I agree with was we should not schedule such difficult games at the beginning of the season. That's on Tom Holmoe. It's difficult being Independent in this regard.

    We still bleed blue and love our Cougs! Get better Tanner!

  • 65TossPowerTrap Salmon, ID
    Nov. 5, 2017 10:07 p.m.

    "Mistakes, such as penalties, dropped passes and errant throws doomed BYU."

    You forgot to mention the puzzling play calling when Hoge came in the game. BYU had been successfully running the ball, but when an inexperienced qb entered the game who had not played in over a month - no more running plays - a steady diet of passing with very little success.

    BYU needs to play a slump-buster team - you know - somebody like UCLA.

  • at long last. . . Kirksville , MO
    Nov. 5, 2017 7:51 p.m.

    Actually, Sitake, after years of independence, this actually IS BYU football". Learn to live with it, by scheduling G5 teams and being happy with a mediocre record. It doesn't have to be a dumpster fire - stop scheduling hard teams; be satisfied with the UMass, Savannah State, Middle Tennessee's of the country.

  • Impartial7 DRAPER, UT
    Nov. 5, 2017 7:36 p.m.

    "'This is not BYU football'

    Yes, it is. Especially with Holmoe and Sitake staying in their current positions. Better get used to it.

  • Hey Baby Franklin, IN
    Nov. 5, 2017 7:31 p.m.

    2 of TDS losses came from top 25 teams. #6 Wisconsin and #18 Miss St.

    The other losses are from teams like East Carolina, Fresno St, Boise St.

    What is fair to you?

  • SIMPLICITY Denver, CO
    Nov. 5, 2017 6:15 p.m.

    This IS byu football if they continue playing 6 power 5 teams a year.

    Unless byu starts scheduling 10 G5 teams a season they will likely continue to have losing seasons. Byu played a tougher schedule this year, they played too many big dogs. Byu is a little puppy, it's not a fair fight.