I loved the caucus/convention system when I actually participated. When I knew
nothing about it except what I heard from Doug Wright, I was upset I didn't
have more choices. When I participated, I realized that the
delegate positions were filled by my neighbors who invited my input, but also
went and met personally with each candidate, spent hours and hours doing
research, and would give feedback to the other caucus attendees after going to
the convention and voting. Sure, they didn't vote exactly like I would
have, but I didn't spend the time they did, so I might have voted/thought
differently if I had spent the time they did.Now we get 30-second
radio ads to vet the candidates. That and the zillion mailers that come to our
doors.I like the caucus/convention system because regular people
spent a LOT of time vetting the candidates and chose the one they liked the
best. Money would only take a candidate so far if their message didn't
resonate. Now it is impossible to win a race without a very large advertising
"Arturo Morales-LLan is a member of the Utah Republican State Central
Committee, a state delegate"Really? This power holder wants to
keep his power? I am not surprised.The caucus system nominates
extremists. The party power brokers (that means they sell power) know it and
they like it. Utahns as a whole arent nearly as extreme as our representation.
Count My Vote IS Buy My Vote.
@neadThe new CMV will require additional runoff primaries. Who does that
help since candidates will need more campaign money? Lobbyists. You
did notice the new CMV gives the #utleg a blank check vote as you will need to
decide to run or help someone run against them prior to the end of the
legislative session, before most votes are cast. If you don't like their
votes you really want people to remember for an additional 2 years?
@Utah_1"The Buy My Ballot Spot with paid signature gatherers
favors the rich and famous."You're right. It's not
fair that Count My Vote requires candidates to spend money gathering signatures,
when we could simply have primary elections directly. The Utah Republican party
should wake up and realize that this is what the vast majority of their voters
So one of the issues I have with the current caucus system is the meetings are
held in peoples homes. On the surface that seems very homie and all that. But
the reality is those are not open environments. These meetings need to be in a
place that is open to all - libraries, schools, government offices.... but it
should be in a venue where even "not friends" feels open to attend.One of my buds is a delegate for American Fork. He was invited to
another friends house to participate. And he did. But he would have never
considered going to a stranger's home. Maybe he should have. But you
have to wonder how many actually even know when these meetings are going on.It's got to move beyond a friends of friends system.
It is funny to see people defend the CMV initiative. The ironic thing is that
it doesn't create a "new" path to getting on the ballot. That
path has always existed, it is called the INDEPENDENT candidate. If those
people have so much support, why can't they get on the ballot without
forcing the party to back them.Now, I know that there are those of
you who say that since the government pays for the election, they should control
how candidates get on the ballot. Have you considered what the ballot would
look like if the cost of the election was spread around to each political party?
Would there be anything but a D or R to choose from? You would kill 3rd party
or independent candidates. Government paying for the election is the only
"fair" thing for all candidates.To "Impartial7" how
is the deligate system out of touch with mainstream voters? The Republicans
elected a candidate that reflects their values.
There is a very simple solution. Parties should finance and administer the
primary elections. Then they can set whatever rules they like. Taxpayer money
should not be wasted on private entity candidate selection. State should not
collect election funds on behalf of parties on income tax and would have no need
to know a persons political affiliation.
SB 54 has made big money a bigger influence on Utah elections. With
SB 54 and it's high signature thresholds, only incumbents (who get large
donations from lobbyists) and the rich have a chance to gather number of
signatures needed. Entire companies have been created to support this new
industry. County My Vote gave large donations to incumbents to gather
signatures.Tanner Ainges spent a reported $80,000 on signature
gathering.Our caucus/primary system has served us well. We have the
best managed state in the nation. The little guy has a chance to make an
input.Now the little guy, has little if any chance of being elected.
Government will get bigger as candidates have to repay favors for the big
donations they have received. Let's hope Utah will return to
the idea of smaller government. Allowing private organizations to have a say in
how they choose their candidates. Let us return to liberty.
Wow, the myopic rantings of a GOP insider. It’s scary to think someone
like Chris Herrod could represent ME in Congress. Sorry Art, your message rings
hollow. P.S. The entire GOP is a joke. Go Kathie Allen!
We should always be suspicious when leaders try to tell us "Don't
worry, we will just figure it out for you"Count My Vote is a way
to keep the party elite responsive to the people.
John Curtis has done a great job in Provo. The fact that he is considered
"too liberal" to some shows how far down the rabbit hole we have fallen.
I am voting for the man, and John Curtis is the clear choice.
The freedom of association argument falls apart at the point where the
group's endorsement is placed on the public election ballot. Remove the
straight ticket voting option, and listing of candidates' party affiliation
on ballots, and then the freedom of association argument starts to have merit.
The Republican party can't have it both ways. If they choose to have their
party endorsement listed next to a candidate on the ballot, they are then
subject to state election laws.
Governor Herbert and most in office currently would never have been elected if
it were not for the Neighborhood Caucus Election / Convention system. Now,
because they have money, they don't want it anymore?We never
needed the Buy My Ballot Spot (2014 SB 54) for someone to get on the ballot if
they didn't want to go though the parties. Just get 300 signatures from
their friends or 1000 signatures for a state wide race and go directly to the
General Election as an Unaffiliated Candidate.The Buy My Ballot Spot
with paid signature gatherers favors the rich and famous. Why do they need State
Mandated help?Remember that hundreds of thousands of voters came out
to the 2016 caucus meetings including democrats. They elected the tens of
thousands of delegates. Democrats picked their nominee using the delegate
system. They had no primary. We get a couple of Buy My Ballot Spot candidates
that could have just as easily gone straight to the general election if they
didn't want to go though the caucus/convention system. That is costing us 3
months more not having 4 representatives in Congress. We could have been voting
among all candidates in August.
Sadly, when many candidates end up on the ballot, no one wins! Creating more
than one path to the ballot splits the votes, and as was the case with the CD3
Special Election, we ended up with two Conservatives splitting the conservative
vote, opening the path for the most liberal, progressive candidate to take the
race. Utah will not be served well with John Curtis! Watch his votes! He will
side with the RINOS at best and may even swing to the Democrats if he stays
there very long! We all lost when SB54 was passed and we're now reaping
the rewards of that effort!!
69% of Republicans voted against the caucus candidate in the recent Primary. The people who want it to stay are the party elite.
"For the first time in Utah, a candidate selected by the minority is
representing the majority of Republican voters. "No, this has
been happening for years. This is a pot calling the kettle black situation.
People are sick of their candidates being vetted by delegates that far too often
don't represent their views.
I don't know how Arturo Morales-LLan can point to convention votes that
were significantly different than real votes from the general populace and claim
that the convention got it right. I attended both conventions, and in my
opinion too many at the conventions were out of touch with the majority of
Republicans. Count My Vote was a neccessary way to avoid the control exercised
by the ultra conservative minority currently in the Republican party leadership.
"Second, on a special election, Herrod won with 55 percent of the vote where
John Curtis failed to make it to the final round; delegates voted for a
conservative candidate. Obviously, John Curtis message did not resonate with
delegates."Remember earlier on when it was noted that the 55%
thing was an example of it working with Johnson vs Herbert since neither got to
60% so the two went to a primary. How come second place didn't get to go to
the primary in the special election? Henderson got roughly the same portion of
delegates as Herbert did.
"It is remarkable to see establishment politicians and Count My Vote (CMV)
supporters rushing to criticize caucus and convention delegates"The caucus/convention system is establishment politics. Put the power in the
hands of a few people. Don't worry everyone else, they'll make the
decisions for you.
The author of this opinion piece is really grasping at straws. I support count
my vote and encourage others to listen to more sound reasoning as to why count
my vote is good for our state. Soon the caucus system will be totally done away
with in Utah, for the betterment of both parties and of the population of our
state . It will upset the status quo of the oligarchy that is the GOP
governing committee, but that will be a good thing.
Your opinion is clever, but not smart. The problem is that you want to keep the
power in the hads of the delegates, not in the hands of the people. If the
delegates actually represented the people who identify as republicans, you
wouldn't be in this mess. The central committee, if it wants the caucus
system to survive, needs to focus on getting delegates together that actually
represent the values of Utah, and not the power of the people running the
party.You are trying to cast this as the rich and powerful vs the
ordinary Utah citizen. Your problem is that it's the rich and powerful vs
the politically connected, when most of us are not interested in power. We want
to be left alone and have our votes count.
Curtis is a progressive, progressives =big govt., small citizen. I will not be
voting for Curtis.
Oh boy - Sour grapes here, Arturo. John Curtis won and will be getting 100% of
my support. He's the Republican nominee and needs yours also. Are you
voting for Kathie Allen, Arturo? Is she your candidate now? What about Jason
Christensen? Has he earned your vote?This is a silly discussion.
Curtis did very well in the primary for a candidate who had almost $1 million
spent against him and it still didn't move the numbers to Herrod.
"The CMV dual path was crafted to give a huge advantage to establishment
politicians — the political elite, the good ole boys club and wealthy
individuals. The caucus system is designed to level the playing field; it also
gives an opportunity to conservatives who can connect with voters.One
thing is for certain, the Republican 3rd Congressional District primary results
prove that convention delegates are in touch with the majority of Republican
voters in Utah."This makes zero sense. The delegates picked
Herrod, the voters wanted Curtis. The delegate system IS the good ole boys club.
The delegate system is so out of touch of mainstream voters. The Republican 3rd
District is exhibit A.