Mormon background helped 5 BYU grads make list of world's 50 most important management thinkers

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  • SLCWatch Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 5, 2016 7:16 p.m.

    @2close2call
    Well from your statements I have to point out you don't understand the religious position and your science statements are also ill defined. I'll just suggest that you take time to try and see what the LDS position really is and that you try to look at it from a view point that both positions can be factual and look for proofs from that position. Good luck with your study.

  • 2close2call Los Angeles, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 5:04 p.m.

    @london_josh "If you want to go point by point - choose a proper forum with people who are here to argue point by point with you."

    Why? There is no need to go point by point and argue. It is either correct how it is written or not correct. Anything else is just rationalization to make it somehow fit with science. Your comment makes my point that some people cannot see past their religion when studying science.

  • Herbert Gravy Salinas, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 3:58 p.m.

    @2close2call:

    Ever heard of the great LDS scientist named Henry Eyring?

  • london_josh lincoln, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 12:17 p.m.

    Perhaps an article about how 5 of the 50 business influencers are Mormons from BYU, showing BYU and Mormons in the educated mainstream isn't the best introduction to personal views on why Mormons are uneducated in general. That point of view pretty much conflicts with the article in the first place and is by basic definition a very broad brushed and bigoted viewpoint.

  • RedShirtCalTech Pasedena, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 12:16 p.m.

    I think I know why BYU is over-represented in the list.

    As has been mentioned already, we start training the YM/YW for leadership early in their lives.

    You also have the fact that we teach our children to study the scriptures and figure out on their own if the LDS church is true.

    We also teach our children to seek out God's advice when faced with problems. The Scriptures are full of stories from people who were faced with new problems and were given innovative solutions.

    Here is probably the biggest difference, we have the Gift of the Holy Ghost, which means constant companionship by the Holy Ghost and a source of constant inspiration.

  • london_josh lincoln, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 12:14 p.m.

    2cloe2call

    I think that there are forums like beliefnet where you can go back and forth all day long on this stuff. I don't think that people reading the deseretnews about some success from BYU grads want the entire story to be surpassed by back and forth comments about how the flood might have been local and is a story told by every population group on earth, or how the swords are never said to have been made of steel and specifically were stained by other's blood similar to swords used by aztec, or how most of us Mormons don't think that God changed the skin tone of people but rather that it's a matter of genetic mixing of populations, or why you suppose that the Jaredites were in wooden submarines rather than boats with roofs.

    If you want to go point by point - choose a proper forum with people who are here to argue point by point with you.

  • 2close2call Los Angeles, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 10:42 a.m.

    @SLCWatch " I don't think It conflicts with actual science either. Perhaps you're missing an understanding of what the sciences say."

    I suppose you would then stipulate the following:

    Human beings did not begin just over 6000 years ago with Adam and Eve as there have been humans existing throughout the world for well over 100,000 proven by science.

    There was no worldwide flood as mentioned in the Bible as there are trees still living that are older than the time period of the supposed flood.

    Many of the wars with steel swords etc in the Book of Mormon did not happen or exist as there was no evidence of steel being processed in the America's during the BOM times and a people that numerous that had such major battles would have artifacts or remains.

    God did not change peoples skin color at any time(we know how that process occurs though science.

    A few Jewish people did not ride in a wooden submarine to leave and go across the ocean (as mentioned in the BOM) as it is scientifically impossible in several ways.

  • london_josh lincoln, CA
    Jan. 5, 2016 10:19 a.m.

    "However, in my opinion, once you delve into other subject areas like history or anthropology, (particularly in the Americas) LDS struggle because they are unable to look past their faith beliefs that conflict with the actual science."

    Did you research that or just make general assumptions?

    There is a massive amount of LDS research on American anthropology due to a heightened interest in it with a lot of broad contributions. The amount of LDS people in central America and those who go back to places where they served missions to do research and humanitarian work is amazing.

    History has the same heavy influencers.

    I think you left off things like genetics as well, which BYU has a highly ranked genetics program, despite views from some who assume that the science conflicts with LDS theology - research is research, religion is religion, there are some who mix the two and in so doing get a bad result, there are many allow the two to enhance each other to a more full result.

    Your comment was absolutely incorrect, unfounded, and bigoted in the assumption.

    Why not just congratulate these men and assume the best of others?

  • Tomboy Canada, 00
    Jan. 5, 2016 10:03 a.m.

    @marxism.I lived in Russia for 9 years so I am not at all interested in the Marxist perspective on economics. I have witnessed the diabolical results of Marxism first hand.

  • Palmetto Bug Columbia, SC
    Jan. 5, 2016 5:21 a.m.

    And now the comments are degenerating into into cheap shots at the Church. Good grief.

    Congrats again to the five men and women who were recognized on this list.

  • SLCWatch Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 11:54 p.m.

    @2close2call
    I disagree with your premise that LDS people can't look into the sciences, history and anthropology. My experience is just the opposite and doctrinally speaking you don't understand the commandment to seek out of the best books wisdom and knowledge. I don't think It conflicts with actual science either. Perhaps you're missing an understanding of what the sciences say. Science is no more fool proof than any other discipline if it becomes dogmatic. I accept truth. Much of science is best guess to date. It seems to hold up until it doesn't then the next best guess is good until it's replaced again. I love science and I'm amazed all the time at the daily discoveries that change the last best guess. I invite you to look into science deeper and see how the hand of god is greater than we ever thought.

  • mightymite DRAPER, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 9:36 p.m.

    Not surprising at all. The church is a business first and foremost so why wouldn't its flagship university turnout such keen business men -- multi-level marketing and all.

  • 2close2call Los Angeles, CA
    Jan. 4, 2016 8:16 p.m.

    "Mormon background helped 5 BYU grads make list of world's 50 most important management thinkers"

    I agree with this statement. The only problem is the most important "thinking" is limited to certain subjects like business, accounting, etc. However, in my opinion, once you delve into other subject areas like history or anthropology, (particularly in the Americas) LDS struggle because they are unable to look past their faith beliefs that conflict with the actual science.

  • christoph Brigham City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 8:13 p.m.

    The Prophet Joseph Smith was a uniter of good people, yet a disrupter to the educated and those who love money; he would not have made this list however, declaring bankruptcy in 1842 (which I first learned in Rough Stone Rolling---a book that builds faith, and reminds us how commonly special the prophet was) ; clearly to build temples, send out ministers, print materials, feed the poor, and manage a poor church in Ohio and Missouri was too much on the budget, and the Lord judges management differently than we do, thankfully. And the church and the Lord don't need money, which ironically, is what makes people prosper. Was it Hugh Nibley that said money serves us best when we think of it the least?

  • Bluto Sandy, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 5:01 p.m.

    @laggie

    Deal with it.
    The truth shall set you free.

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Jan. 4, 2016 2:38 p.m.

    @ One human family: My experience in the LDS church have been just the opposite of your take. My religion teaches me that truth is knowledge of things as they really are, as they always have been and as they always will be. In my religion, I am constantly encouraged to study, think and pray to the being who has perfect knowlege. My religion does not and has never required me to believe anything that isn't true! I think that is wonderful!

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 2:28 p.m.

    @John Locke "Don't get wrapped up in whether capitalism or communism is better. It not much more than thinking in circles...it never ends. Also, I am part of the 160,000,000 and don't care. It is the individualism and independence from Government control for which I strive. I gain happiness from that."

    OK, I get where you're coming from. But wealth concentration is a technical matter in economics - the grist of the sub-discipline "welfare economics." Wealth concentration if it continues will choke the current system, I am convinced. This matter needs to be aired out - especially on campus - but it isn't because most on campus are afraid to do so.

  • Ray E. LITTLETON, CO
    Jan. 4, 2016 1:32 p.m.

    I haven't read all of the comments, so I don't know if it's been mentioned yet. BYU places more graduates in dental school than any other undergrad program in America. I suspect that GPA and DAT scores, while important, are not the only measuring tools that explain this level of excellence. Here in Denver, you can't swing a dead cat without hitting an LDS dentist.

  • shirl Reno, NV
    Jan. 4, 2016 1:22 p.m.

    Shamrock dad....

    I too wish Nibley could weigh in. Just finished "The Essential Nibley"...a great refresher course in the workings of a great mind.
    ssjackson

  • John Locke Ivins, , UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 1:15 p.m.

    Marxist: Happiness is not measured by the number of cars, homes or bank accounts you have, but by having "sufficient for your needs," which, after obtaining that (getting a sound education and going to work), equates to dedicating yourself to your happiness and the happiness of your family and others. It's simple: Don't get wrapped up in whether capitalism or communism is better. It not much more than thinking in circles...it never ends. Also, I am part of the 160,000,000 and don't care. It is the individualism and independence from Government control for which I strive. I gain happiness from that.

  • Owen Heber City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 12:38 p.m.

    @ shamrock dad - I, too, would love to hear what Hugh would have to say. He spoke at BYU about a fatal shift from leaders to managers. Looks like the shift is complete.

  • OneHumanFamily Provo, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 12:34 p.m.

    I do think BYU is a good school and I am glad I went there. I am not surprised that there are some BYU grads in the list.

    What I don't think it is accurate is the connection to the church. In my experience, the church discourages thinking and intellectualism. When you have an environment where you are expected to obey without question, there is no room for debate.

  • jbbevan Heber City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 12:07 p.m.

    Now retired, but an MBA graduate from BYU, I was once asked to take over an ailing manufacturing plant of over 400 people as Director of Operations. My boss, a good Catholic man from Chicago, came to visit and have dinner early in my tenure there. In the conversation I said, "Ken, in order to understand me, you need to understand the Mormon Church." He expressed willingness to listen. I began by explaining that starting at age 12 I was taught how to be a leader and how to be a follower and how to tell the difference!" I explained that as a 12 year old I "managed" (obviously with help) fast offering collections. He was amazed. So I believe Dave Ulrich is absolutely right. It's not about BYU as much as about Mormon Culture and the spin-off benefits of activity. My MBA was invaluable in my career, but only because "I once was a deacon."

  • shamrock dad Yuma, AZ
    Jan. 4, 2016 11:59 a.m.

    Wish Hugh Nibley was around to weigh in !

  • shirl Reno, NV
    Jan. 4, 2016 11:21 a.m.

    Marxist....your insights in the following paragraph are interesting and spot on...but where is the "so what statement" that should follow this excellent premise? ssj.

    Quote from Marxist:
    "On a typical university campus there are in effect two economics departments. On the one hand there is an economics department proper, whose job is to sing the praises of capitalism. And then there is the business school which is concerned with the actual operation of a business. These guys are part of the latter department. I know of no other discipline where this sort of split occurs. For example, there aren't two English departments, or two mechanical engineering departments etc".

  • shirl Reno, NV
    Jan. 4, 2016 11:06 a.m.

    Anonymous User...The thinkers50 ranking is followed and applauded by none other than the "Financial Times" one of the leading financial publications in the world. That should be prestigious enough for the most skeptical. Sorry you haven't heard of it, (Thinkers50) but that fact hardly diminishes its value. I have been involved with mult-national companies for 45 years. I assure you the list is well known and admired in the highest of business circles.
    ssj.

  • 1aggie SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 10:32 a.m.

    The LDS church excels at producing salesmen/women through its missionary program and at providing youth and young adults opportunities to develop leadership and public speaking skills. Additionally, a majority of college-bound LDS youth attend BYU. It doesn't necessarily translate that BYU has the best business management programs. in fact, how many, if any, of these management stars went on to earn an MBA at BYU? How many, if any, of these management stars are employed by BYU?

  • Anonymous User ARLINGTON, VA
    Jan. 4, 2016 10:22 a.m.

    Who has ever even heard of this ranking? It's one thing if some well-respected institution or publication comes out with a ranking like this, but I suspect most people have never even heard of this organization.

  • Palmetto Bug Columbia, SC
    Jan. 4, 2016 10:13 a.m.

    I'm surprised at some of the negative-toned comments from people who are unfamiliar with what these 'thinkers' have written and who haven't read the methodology of the thinkers50. There are no doubt some problems with the list but it has strong face validity of representing the key thought leaders in the business world.

    This is a tremendous accomplishment for each of the people on the list and a great (albeit indirect) accomplishment for BYU.

  • Tekakaromatagi Dammam, Saudi Arabia
    Jan. 4, 2016 9:45 a.m.

    BYU has an honor code, which hopefully, will be manifest as business ethics. Ethical behavior forces an individual to avoid ethical shortcuts and they have to develop better skills and understanding.

    Dishonesty is the road to incompetence.

  • Seneca Falls Salt Lake, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 8:50 a.m.

    I'm always a little skeptical of lists like this. What was the criteria used to choose and rank these "leaders"? Is a Latter-day Saint on the selection board?

    What the list seems to reveal is the importance of mentorship. It is no accident that two of these authors have worked closely with Christensen, who may choose to work with LDS colleagues more often. It is arguably LDS social networks more than LDS principles that have influenced and benefited these "thinkers"

  • LiveFreeOrDieAmerica Kaysville, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 8:41 a.m.

    There is yet another LDS author that absolutely belongs on this list. Greg McKeown - author of "Essentialism" belongs on this list. He is consulted by heads of state, top business leaders, and is changing the lives of many through his powerful and simple leadership. Look for him to make the list soon, but he should have made the list this year.

  • Granny Saint George, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 8:05 a.m.

    Not sure why this comment was disregarded by the DN police yesterday, as there is certainly nothing offensive about it. So, I'll try it again...

    This list should include James (Jim) Quigley, a USU graduate and former GLOBAL CEO of Deloitte Touche.

    He is a published author on the subject and has the "real world" experience that some readers state is lacking in the B-school professors.

  • pragmatistferlife salt lake city, utah
    Jan. 4, 2016 7:47 a.m.

    Ahh the art of stating the obvious or the known, in a crafty and tantalizing way.

    I actually have only read Ulrich and that was decades ago, but having consumed a mountain of other "management" books (mostly on command from others), I would hardly call management writers "great thinkers".

    Besides getting the most out yourself and those who work for you is pretty much just a lead in to getting as much money out of others as you can. Hardly great thinking.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 7:25 a.m.

    As a woman who is also a graduate of the Marriott School of Management, I am really proud of these individuals. BYU is also over represented in the U.S. Senate and U.S. House. We are also over represented in a lot of other areas. I'm really proud of that. GO COUGARS!

  • Palmetto Bug Columbia, SC
    Jan. 4, 2016 5:20 a.m.

    Also impressive that 2/5 BYU grads are women.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 1:04 a.m.

    On a typical university campus there are in effect two economics departments. On the one hand there is an economics department proper, whose job is to sing the praises of capitalism. And then there is the business school which is concerned with the actual operation of a business. These guys are part of the latter department. I know of no other discipline where this sort of split occurs. For example, there aren't two English departments, or two mechanical engineering departments etc.

    I know these business school heavyweights don't concern themselves for the most part with macroeconomics. But since there is a major crisis brewing in the macroeconomy because of the hyper-concentration of wealth in few hands, I was wondering if any of them would comment on this developing situation. For example, we now have a regime where 20 INDIVIDUALS own more wealth than the bottom 160,000,000 people (I am a proud member of the latter). It seems to me this should be of urgent interest to these men.

    I'm sure they have a valuable perspective different from my own.

  • FanOfTheSith Vernal, UT
    Jan. 4, 2016 12:21 a.m.

    Sure, religious principles within a person is good solid foundation background and the people mentioned in this article are in no doubt some of the best successful thinkers and strategists out there. From their books and lectures, three words comes to mind, "knowledge" and "common sense." They possessed the "knowledge" and have the "common sense" on how to put it to work. "Knowledge and common sense" seems to be diminishing in society nowadays.

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 3, 2016 9:55 p.m.

    "LDS culture has given birth to "a professional elite." In 2012, Harvard Business Review published a piece titled, "How Mormons Have Shaped Modern Management."

    Well this is indeed impressive. One of the reasons for this preeminence is the pro-business attitudes of the LDS faith. That faith is the most business oriented of all faiths. Some have even speculated that the LDS Church is destined to become THE religion of capitalism.

    But it also appears that this pro-business orientation prevents any negative analysis or speculation about the glaring faults of contemporary capitalism, specifically the massive concentration of equity ownership we are seeing today. I wonder if any of these business theorist heavyweights would inveigh on this critical matter.

    I believe capitalism is heading for a crackup because of this concentration of wealth. I would like to hear what any of these guys have to say on this issue.

  • blackattack Orem, UT
    Jan. 3, 2016 9:49 p.m.

    Way to represent the Marriott School of Management!

  • Granny Saint George, UT
    Jan. 3, 2016 9:31 p.m.

    The list should include James (Jim) Quigley, USU grad and former GLOBAL CEO of Deloitte Touche.

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Jan. 3, 2016 9:28 p.m.

    What an incredible article!