Letter: Society puzzles

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  • TheProudDuck Newport Beach, CA
    Sept. 2, 2014 1:55 p.m.

    Sort of "My president, right or wrong," eh?

  • Mister J Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 31, 2014 2:27 p.m.

    to Jcs on Friday morning...

    Great Croc wearing hordes? Needless to say, I'm reminded of a David Lee Roth - Sensibe Shoes - but I digress.

    Western Civ has reached its Nadir; has it? How exactly is being a serf in Feudal Europe where Religion called the shots better than 21st Century America? Do Tell.

    Aug. 29, 2014 10:13 p.m.

    When a person takes over a position of authority, the job comes with a degree of respect. It's up to him to keep it or lose it.

  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    Aug. 29, 2014 9:36 p.m.


    Please enlighten us about the past 2 times bho attended church, since you claim he goes regularly. Maybe he does, but once a month would be a minimum for regularly. The man is a liar. He lied in the debates to get elected. lied about Benghazi and what he claimed to be the cause of the crisis. Lied about obamacare and what it would cost and how much it would save and what plan you could have. Work ethic, I think there is nothing he words harder at then his golf game. He avoids national/world security issues, because they are difficult, and he doesn't have a clue. Back to the gold course!

  • Emerger Magna, Salt Lake, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 7:33 p.m.

    Re: SuperNova
    All those things you say are noteworthy, and I agree with you in regard to his marriage, family, and work ethic. I also rate presidents on such things. But most importantly, as Mike Richards has pointed out so well, I rate presidents first and foremost on how well they uphold their oath of office. In this case, Mr. Obama has, in my opinion, been a total failure, as was his predecessor, George W. Bush.

  • ECR Burke, VA
    Aug. 29, 2014 4:56 p.m.

    happy2bhere - I also wonder why all Republicans voted against the ACA when most of them supported programs virtually the same as the ACA before Obama got behind it. First of all I did not say they voted against it because he was the first black president I just mentioned that he WAS the first black president. But your response to my comment says a lot.

    Yes, many presidents (all of them) have been called names by their opposition but tell me how many of them have been interrupted during an address to Congress, in the House chamber, with somebody calling them a liar. When did that ever happen previously and what circumstance gave Congressman Wilson permission to say that, to be that disruptive in that chamber when it never happened before? What is it in our culture that has changed since 2008 that would make it appropriate for a Congressman to do show such disrespect for the office of the president? Answer that question honestly and you'll find the answer to the other questions you asked.

    What horrible stuff did anybody say about Romney that would compare with the disrespect they have shown Obama?

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 4:03 p.m.

    The picture of the United States may look like a puzzle. But that's where the similarity ends. Those lines separating individual states are only imaginary and don't really exist. America is one nation, made up of individual but completely imaginary political kingdoms.

    Good, bad, honest, or dishonest, the man or woman elected President of the United States of America is deserving and it is demanded by our Constitution that he be given the honor and respect of the American people. He does not have to "earn" that respect.

    You don't have to agree with the man or the majority who elect elected him but the rules say that you have to let him do his job.

    The people who disrespect and actively work against the man who is the president are criminals and have done great harm to America. Our government and our nation are noticeable weaker and less important to the world because of them. It will be all the people of America that will suffer the lose of the American nation.

  • Kent C. DeForrest Provo, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 3:29 p.m.

    Silly letter. It's hard to fix our uniquely American mess when one party (GOP) keeps trying to put dozens of pieces in the wrong puzzle. They keep trying to put supply-side pieces into a puzzle where those pieces simply don't fit. The last thing we need is more inequality, but that is all the Republicans have offered. The latest? Krauthammer's (and other Repubs') call to reduce corporate tax rates immediately. Sure, let's just keep reducing taxes while the Baby Boom generation retires without any savings. That's a great recipe for economic health. Oh, and did I mention keeping the minimum wage at 1950 levels?

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 2:30 p.m.


    To respond.

    If the ACA was so bi-partisan, as you seem to imply, which I don't agree with, then why did no Republican vote for it? And why did Harry Reid and the Democrats practically have to twist arms, threaten, and force it through? To say it is because Republicans did not like a black President is so silly, and insulting to all Republicans, that you shouldn't use that, even if you believe it. I can think of several black people I'd like to see as President, and I'm sure most Republicans would agree. It was the ACA as a whole and the politics of Mr. Obama that Republicans disagreed with, not his skin color.

    As for calling the President all those names, which I agree have been used, then one could apply them to every President I've ever known of. The opposition party always tries to make a President a "one-term" President. Just because the Republicans admitted it, what, that is somehow an insult? Look at the horrible stuff they said about Romney. How come it is only Obama who we should treat differently? Because he's black?

  • SuperNova Eagle, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 1:59 p.m.

    @lost in DC

    On what grounds would you call him nonreligious? He is a self-professed Christian, and regularly attends Church.

    Jesus also associated with known criminals (a woman guilty of adultery, the robber on the cross, his disciples breaking the then understood Law of the Sabbath...)

    What duty has he shirked to accuse him of a weak work ethic?

    What lie did he tell to get elected? What lie did he tell to get Obamacare passed? What lie has he told about the GOP? Specific examples please.

    As for President Clinton...I was 15 at the time. At the time (I was much, much more conservative) I thought he deserved what he got. If he had immediately confessed to his actions with Ms. Lewinsky I would say today he would have had no grounds for impeachment.

    Again, you can disagree with his policies and views; but they have nothing to do with the man.

  • SharpHooks Lake Sammamish, WA
    Aug. 29, 2014 1:20 p.m.

    Our esteemed President has multiple times the honesty and integrity of his predecessor.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 1:04 p.m.

    strong work ethic - I would disagree
    religious man - I would disagree
    Harvard Law grad - so? the unibomber had a graduate degree from Harvard.
    was a senator from Ill - so, Tailgunner Joe MacCarthy also held elected office

    he associated with known criminals - weather underground
    unimpeachable character - you mean lying to get elected, lying to get Obamacare passed, lying about the GOP - lying is OK for someone with unimpeachable character?

    were you one calling for slick willy's ouster because he obviously did NOT have many of those personal traits you called unimpeachable, or were you vociferously defending him, too?

    Granted, his personal morals appear better than slick's, but we cannot know for sure because of how much time he spent with the irreverand wright and members of the weather undeground, but his policies and politics are beyond horrible and extra-constitutional.

  • SuperNova Eagle, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 12:13 p.m.

    I apologize, I said impeachable character, should have said unimpeachable character.

  • SuperNova Eagle, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 12:12 p.m.


    "The office is only as respectable as the man who holds it."


    Well, let's look at the man...

    Nothing has been shown whatsoever to indicate infidelity to to his wife.
    He values and loves his family as any father would. I have read he even tries to have dinner every night with his family (when possible)
    Has two intelligent, beautiful daughters, and tremendous class in whom he has chosen for his wife.
    Has a strong work ethic (easily demonstrated by the amount of "vacation days" he has taken)
    Religious man
    Has tried to better himself as a person (He is no longer a smoker)
    Harvard Law School graduate
    Professor of Constitutional Law at a prestigious law school
    Was one of two people to represent the People of Illinois in the US Senate.
    Ran a successful grass roots campaign to become President (if not the first to do this, probably the second)

    You may disagree with his policies and politics, but the man himself has shown impeachable character.

  • ECR Burke, VA
    Aug. 29, 2014 11:54 a.m.

    happy2bhere said "we conservative/Republicans are glad that nothing is getting done. What Obama wanted we did not want. So, for us, nothing getting done is better than bad things (like ACA) getting done."

    Most pragmatists would disagree with you. Getting something done would always be better, even if it is not perfectly in line with your political conscience, than doing nothing at all. President Obama made several concessions regarding the ACA before it was passed. And many of the elements in the ACA were previously supported, even championed, by Republicans until they became part of the legislation proposed by our first black president.

    Compromise and find common ground. That is how Congress worked for most of our history. You are right to compliment Newt Gingrich. As much as I disagree with his philosophies, I admit that he understood what the current Republican leadership doesn't understand today, that working with, rather against the president is the way to make good things happen. Our economy soared after they worked together.

    The words spoken in public - "liar" "one term president" etc. - will not endear the president to the Congress, not now, not anytime in the future.

  • Mike Richards South Jordan, Utah
    Aug. 29, 2014 11:39 a.m.

    What is the duty of the President? Is he in office to implement HIS plans or is he there to execute the laws passed by Congress? (Hint: The President cannot legislate. The Constitution forbids any branch of government except Congress to legislate.)

    If he can't legislate, then how do we judge him? How can he earn our respect? He can earn it by faithfully honoring his oath of office where he swore that he would protect and defend the Constitution. Has he done that or has he stomped all over the Constitution?

    We don't respect him because he does not respect us. He should be the one person in America who can be counted upon to uphold the Constitution - as written. He has refused to do that.

    He has used the "Chicago political model" where his only purpose in office is to keep Democrats in power. Who can respect someone who has done that?

  • Emerger Magna, Salt Lake, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 11:24 a.m.

    The office is only as respectable as the man who holds it.

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 10:41 a.m.


    Just so that you and others understand what has happened, we conservative/Republicans are glad that nothing is getting done. What Obama wanted we did not want. So, for us, nothing getting done is better than bad things (like ACA) getting done. The system is working great for us right now. A President who does not have the ego strength or experience to understand how to approach the opposition and work out a deal of compromise. Most all of the House and Senate have done that now for years. Both in Congress and in their previous political offices. It is Obama who doesn't seem to understand the political game. And all he needs to do is ask Bill Clinton who had to deal with a much tougher Republican than anyone in the House now, Newt Gingrich. Clinton made it work, even when Congress went against him. Obama pouts because he does not get everything his way. That is the problem with electing a President who had everything handed to him all his life and no one ever told him no, until he became President.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 10:31 a.m.

    The blah, blah, blah, in this forum is amusing. When I criticized Bushes Middle East fiascos I was labeled a traitor. I was hit from all sides that the best policy for America was watching Osama Bin Laden manipulate our destruction and distract us from the real threats to our security. Since Bush's train wreck we have had little of pulling up the old boots by the bootstraps and fixing things as a nation, ie the well documented strategy of seditious obstructionism, and consistent whine of conservative parrots that yearn for the good ole days of starting wars and their fear that the path to oligarchy will be derailed. No, I don't want to hear anymore of the fact-less hyperbole that POTUS is doing anything other than what anyone else would have done under the same circumstances because this is a first. I wonder what else about Obama was a first? You're intelligent. You figure it out.

  • There You Go Again Saint George, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 10:25 a.m.

    These types of kinder, gentler appeals appear as the Republicans sense a three way Republican stranglehold, of the government, is on the horizon.

    The kinder, gentler Republican model implemented over the last 6 years will not be soon forgotten by the opposition.

  • SEY Sandy, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 9:40 a.m.

    So here's another analogy: if the pilot of the aircraft we're flying decides to land us in a live volcano, should we encourage him "because his methods are different than most people?" Are we obligated to "accept him" so that he can "complete the puzzle his way?" I can apply this to George W. Bush or just about any other past president, so this isn't a Republican vs. Democrat thing for me.

  • Mark B Eureka, CA
    Aug. 29, 2014 9:08 a.m.

    Just what would JCS 7:22 think of an Obama effort to reverse the trend (according to JCS) towards a new Dark Age? Would he support a plan to reform and regenerate society, or would he insist in these posts that Obama is no doubt a tyrant who wants to use "reform" as an excuse for total government domination?

  • Thid Barker Victor, ID
    Aug. 29, 2014 8:55 a.m.

    Dose the author (Michael) mean like how the liberals accept and respect President Bush? Or does he infer that only Democrat presidents are worthy of respect?

  • ECR Burke, VA
    Aug. 29, 2014 8:53 a.m.

    JCS - The "great croc-wearling hordes" are now responsible for the degradation of all of society? Isee you've used that term in previous posts related to other articles. What is it about a specific type of shoe that has led to that down fall? What the letter writer is suggesting, and nothing more, is that it is perfectly acceptable to disagree with the president while allowing him to do his job. In lieu of any meaningful action by the Republicans in Congress, the president is doing what he legally can to move things forward.

    And yes, higv, we all understand the constitutional makeup of our government. But when the Congress, by their own admission, deliberately tries to stifle any action in passing laws, they should expect the president to do whatever he can. So far, the only real action the Republicans have taken is to shut down the government and many of them are suggesting they will do that again. If you're planning to write to your Congressman please tell THEM to follow their constitutional duties and work for the common good of the nation and not just for the selfish interests of those that finance their campaigns.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 8:52 a.m.

    Spoken like a true Berliner of 1938.

    I guess Lech Walesa and the Solidarity movement in Poland in the late 80s and all those who fled the iron curtain were wrong?

    They all should have just accepted what they had and been happy and supportive until something better came along?

    No, we have a right and a RESPONSIBILITY to speak up when we don’t like what our elected officials are doing.

    It is not only HOW he is putting the pieces together that we decry, but the picture he is trying to create. His view for our future is horribly disturbing and his extra-constitutional methods are Stalinesque.

    In some cases we wish he DID have an idea – BO admitted having no strategy for ISIS. They have been around since 2013, and he doesn’t have a strategy how to deal with them? How many more Americans do they need to murder before he’ll bother with them? He has time and energy to demonize the GOP and try to grant amnesty to illegals, but none for ISIS? Maybe when ISIS starts sneaking across our borders? Oh well, he has secret service protection.

    Your call for blind subservience is extremely troubling.

  • happy2bhere clearfield, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 8:46 a.m.

    Michael, first of all you are a little late with this. Your sentiment should have come right after his re-election. Obama is now on the downside of his Presidency, and could be very lame duck beginning next January. And we are a very divided country right now. So, little gets done in an equally divided government in Washington D.C. And that is why we have frequent elections in America. Every two years for the whole House. So if things are stalled, elections can get thing moving, IF that is what the people want. We'll see in November.

    Aug. 29, 2014 8:05 a.m.

    IMO Mr. Lindstrom should get the "Letter to the editor of the year award". Not because he is a Democrat, Republican or Independent, but because of his common sense approach! Thats the good news! Bad new is that hatred, bigotry and selfishness all to often trumps common sense! We will more than likely witness some of this in following posts; as "SEY" posts "There will be no mercy for this letter. Sit back and watch the train wreck."

  • SEY Sandy, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 7:36 a.m.

    There will be no mercy for this letter. Sit back and watch the train wreck.

  • John Charity Spring Back Home in Davis County, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 7:22 a.m.

    Lindstrom's letter is absolute nonsense. We owe no duty to the President which requires us to ignore and even support tactics which are clearly designed to turn America into just another European-style post-Christian socialist state.

    Sadly, this letter is representative of the thought process of much of the public. In her seminal book Age of American Unreasonable, even a liberal writer like Jacoby recognized that much of the public has no critical thinking skills.

    No serious person can deny that Western Civilization has truly reached its lowest point in several millennia. Essentially, the great croc-wearing hordes are dragging society into depravity. Our society is rapidly approaching a new Dark Age. This process will soon reach the stage of being irreversible unless we act fast to protect what little refinement still exists in society.

  • RN St. George, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 7:20 a.m.

    Instead of constantly criticizing our current president we should be more concerned about the office of president itself. Many presidents, conservative and liberal have been expanding the presidential powers for decades. Many people abuse political power, this is an issue with our governmental/political culture, not with any specific president.

  • higv Dietrich, ID
    Aug. 29, 2014 7:07 a.m.

    Did you pass your American Government class? Did you realize there are 3 branches of government? The President can't get anything done without the consent of Congress. If so he would have too much power. I read where Teddy Roosevelt said Patriotism is supporting the President when he stands by the country. Something to that effect. We have a duty to contact our congress and tell them to support or not support what is in the best interest of the country. Not blindly follow what he wants. Besides there is a thing called freedom of speech and the press I will use that.

  • Curmudgeon Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 6:10 a.m.

    Puzzling analogy, but in any event Republicans want to take away as many puzzle pieces as possible and thus prevent the president from solving the puzzle in any way.

  • The Educator South Jordan , UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 5:36 a.m.

    Name one method our President has employed that hasn't been used by previous Presidents.

  • george of the jungle goshen, UT
    Aug. 29, 2014 1:17 a.m.

    Usually I try to get organized in salving a puzzle. Respect is earned, like the office of the President. the man still hasn't earned mine.