Letter: Remember tolerance

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  • RFLASH Salt Lake City, UT
    June 18, 2014 10:10 a.m.

    You know, if people would take one simple idea from their religion and live it, we wouldn't have to tolerate so much. " Love one another " is that simple idea that Jesus taught. It isn't that hard! One of the other comments mentioned gay hatred. You should try being on the gay end of it! You want to know hatred then get your windows smashed out in your car! I had a good Mormon neighbor who threatned me with a gun! I have friends who have not spoken to me in over 25 years! When we try to make something good of our lives, people say that we are attacking them! All I hear is " Why should I help that person? " or " They should get a job! "
    Sorry, there were no good old days! Not for gay people and other minorities and people were certainly not tolerant! I hate the word tolerant! It more or less says that you will put up with someone even though you can't stand them!
    I still love and miss those friends from long ago! They can't even tolerate me! Is it that hard to care and to love?

  • Bob K Davis, CA
    June 17, 2014 2:15 a.m.

    Orem, UT
    ordinary folks: "...Tolerance is indeed in short supply."
    "What we need to do is stop demonizing people who disagree with a point of view we support. Saying as you did about those who support traditional marriage as "...an avalanche of gay hatred, full of untruth..." would put you in the intolerant camp in my opinion."

    --- People should be intolerant about lies and blocking of freedom.
    Certainly the anti-marriage equality side has told monstrous lies over and over.
    "Gays want to change or eliminate religions, they want to ruin marriage, they are all about sex, etc etc etc". Personally, I lived through the Prop 8 TV ads, which were malicious attempts to scare parents that Gays would take over the moral education of their children.
    Without the mormon invasion of Califonia, Prop 8 would have lost, and would go down by 20 points today.

    And you see, "I love you, but I don't want you to live as your heart tells you" is hatred in a thin disguise.

    If I am denying people equality, they do not need to demonize me: I am already a demon.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    June 16, 2014 1:18 p.m.

    Here is how tolerance works these days.

    For the conservative, tolerance is given until you use government to force them to conform with your point of view.

    For the liberals/progressives/collectivists, tolerance is given as long as you agree with their point of view.

    Tolerance is like discrimination. It can be used for both good and evil. Tolerating your neighbor with a lifestyle different than yours is good. Tolerating your neighbor who is running the drug and prostitution ring out of their home is bad.

    I only ask that people learn when to tolerate something and when to fight it.

  • UtahBlueDevil Durham, NC
    June 16, 2014 10:20 a.m.

    Ok... I missed something. How did this become about SSM again? Was it the hungry children comment? Or the comment about the poor? Are all of these euphemisms for SSM?

    I have to agree with the author. From my travels around the world working in Energy, I see both extremes regularly. From starting projects where the budgets are in the billions, to driving down roads where the nice houses are ones lucky enough to have corrugated metal siding. There is an endless stream of need amongst our fellow brothers and sister of this world.

    Our responsibilities have two levels. One, as a citizen of our nation. The other, as a Christian, and a fellow traveler through this life. Providing for our family is just the minimum requirement... loosing ourselves in the service of others as Christ taught the ultimate. I fall far short of this.

    When you see the acrimony even within conservatives, calling others RINOs, you do wonder if we seek to divide more than we do to help. Pius self promotion seems to rule the day. Adams and Jefferson disagreed upon much, but respected each other greatly. We can, and should too.

  • Maudine SLC, UT
    June 16, 2014 8:32 a.m.

    @ Pendergast: The shows you list are all shows that emphasized negative stereotypes and relied on that emphasis to attract an audience.

    The fact that such shows are no longer allowed does indeed show a moving forward toward tolerance for those who are different than us.

    We still have a long way to go (such as eliminating shows that get their humor from appealing to stereotypes of men), but we are slowly making progress.

  • JoeCapitalist2 Orem, UT
    June 16, 2014 8:18 a.m.


    It is also undeniable that a great many untruths have been told by the pro SSM marriage crowd. If you can only see blame and intolerance when it is committed by the "other side" then you need to take your blinders off.

    I didn't call you intolerant because you acknowledged untruths being told by those you disagree with, it was because you seem to see everyone who disagrees with you as bigots and everyone who agrees with you as completely tolerant even though they are not.

  • ordinaryfolks seattle, WA
    June 16, 2014 6:53 a.m.

    Joe C...

    you said that my claim "..."an avalanche of gay hatred, full of untruth..." would put you in the intolerant camp in my opinion.'"

    It is undeniable that a great many untruths have been told by the anti same sex marriage campaign(s). If acknowledging that there is untruth told is intolerant, call me intolerant.

  • JoeCapitalist2 Orem, UT
    June 15, 2014 12:02 p.m.

    ordinary folks: "...Tolerance is indeed in short supply."

    I agree. There are at least a dozen controversial issues (abortion, same-sex marriage, Obamacare, immigration laws, tax policy, minimum wage, affirmative action, etc.) that deeply divide huge sections of our population.

    I find it interesting that you only seem to see the intolerance from people who disagree with your side of several arguments. The truth is, there are many acts of intolerance from both sides on all these issues.

    Unlike the letter writer, I think intolerance has always existed so I don't know if it was better or worse in the past. It is ok to be passionate about an issue without harboring ill feelings for everyone who does not share our ideology.

    What we need to do is stop demonizing people who disagree with a point of view we support. Saying as you did about those who support traditional marriage as "...an avalanche of gay hatred, full of untruth..." would put you in the intolerant camp in my opinion.

  • Pendergast Salt Lake City, UT
    June 15, 2014 10:30 a.m.

    to LDS Liberal moments ago

    Have we ever really moved forward & become more enlightened?

    In fact, I'd say we've gone backward. There is no way shows like Sanford & son, Night Court, or All in the family would be tolerated.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    June 15, 2014 9:40 a.m.

    I reflected again and again about this letter...

    I would seem that the author expects the freedom to speak and express his thoughts and opinion,
    does not want to allow others the same freedom to express their thoughts or opinions.

    I do not want to go back to that sort of time...

  • Bob K Davis, CA
    June 14, 2014 7:29 p.m.

    As others write, there is some confusing sentiment in the letter. I hope that the writer is not expressing what so many who comment on the DN, particularly those from small Utah cities, seem to say over and over.

    People who grew up in an unquestioning environment may have a lot of trouble with the way the world is today. Unfortunately, sometimes their frustration at being asked or pushed to re-think their positions can come out in odd and indirect ways.

    For instance:
    -- the current notion that blocking other citizens' rights and saying (sometimes) disgusting and untrue things about them is OK, and should be tolerated.
    -- the ridiculous blowing up of imagined consequences that will ensue if some group of citizens is allowed to sit at the table or ride on the bus, as equals, so to speak.

    It is our job as Americans and as Christians to respect differences, as long as they do not cause actual (not imagined) harm. Sometimes it may be hard to change my views, but that is my problem to handle.

    Tolerance is only a step along the way to acceptance, which is what Jesus told us to practice.

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    June 14, 2014 4:52 p.m.

    Weird letter.

    Go on a nice bike ride or something. Lighten up a li bit. There's no need to become depressed

  • Wonder Provo, UT
    June 14, 2014 4:37 p.m.

    This is truly the most confusing letter I have ever read. Does he want to hear people's opinions? Or not? Is he saying that he wants to hear opinions, but only if they don't make him feel guilty? I don't get it.

  • Maudine SLC, UT
    June 14, 2014 12:09 p.m.

    I'm a little confused here - the first part of your letter mentions people expressing their viewpoints, the second part mentions your personal discomfort with the viewpoints being presented, but the third part of your letter expresses your viewpoint that all viewpoints should be welcome in society and your sentiment that you miss the days when that was so.

    If you welcome all viewpoints, why are you bemoaning those that make you uncomfortable? How does the expression of viewpoints that make you uncomfortable have any bearing on whether or not other viewpoints are being oppressed? Have you been prevented from holding a sign or buying a billboard that expresses your viewpoint?

    How does the third part of your letter tie into the first two parts?

  • Irony Guy Bountiful, Utah
    June 14, 2014 9:53 a.m.

    Ah yes, "back in the day" when there was no tolerance for anyone who was different racially, ethnically, socially, religiously, or politically, especially in good ol' Utah. This writer longs to go back. I don't. Things are a lot better than they used to be, take it from an old man.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    June 14, 2014 8:54 a.m.

    I don't get it?

    Does he feels guilty for being selfish,
    and doesn't want other to remind him of it?


    That it is not politically correct to tell the poor, the sick , and the hungry to stop being stupid and lazy and get a job?

    I just not sure what it is --

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    June 14, 2014 8:47 a.m.

    I don't quite get the point. Is it that you're bothered because you feel guilty because you don't donate to every squeegee kid or radio appeal? You can't support 'em all...

  • george of the jungle goshen, UT
    June 14, 2014 6:44 a.m.

    I think it's how ya look at it, "What can I do", helpless or helpful.

  • ordinaryfolks seattle, WA
    June 14, 2014 6:32 a.m.

    I suspect we may not agree politically, but I certainly agree with the sentiment.

    The gay marriage debate that has raged for years in the country erupted an avalanche of gay hatred, full of untruth. Civil rights, illegal immigration and voting rights have exposed the ugly undertone of lingering racism in this country. Abortion opponents place wanted posters on abortion providers and kill them. And the fundamentalist religions declare their fellow citizens will spend their eternal life in damnation if they do not adhere to their religious dogma and political views.

    Tolerance is indeed in short supply.

  • Baccus0902 Leesburg, VA
    June 14, 2014 3:51 a.m.

    Wow David,
    You wrote: "In each of these situations I get the feeling that I am a person who does not care, love or support, and that my views and thinking are wrong."

    For what you wrote you indicated that is what "you feel". Nobody is mentioned as saying anything to you. You feel guilty of your accord.....it seems that the only one judging you is yourself.

    The one who needs to tolerate you is you buddy. Stop feeling sorry for yourself.

    Good luck with your introspection.