@ LDS Liberal. Before the 2012 election I was watching CNN and they were
admiring how Obama had "evolved" by changing his mind about gay
marriage. Even before this I had noticed that people kept saying that Romney
flip flopped, but any time Obama changed his mind he had "evolved". As
I screamed at the television that this was a double standard, one of the CNN
news commentators said, "Hey, why when Romney changes his mind we call it
'flip-flopping' but when Obama does it we say he's
'evolved'" You could hear crickets chirping as the others just
stared like deer in headlights.People change. People evolve. I
hate to admit it, but in 2008 I voted for Obama. Now? I can't even begin
to describe how I feel about him because it doesn't involve polite language
and the NSA might be reading this. I would hope that as one gains
experience, meets new people, discovers how complicated issues really can be
that they can be intelligent enough to re-examine their opinions on certain
subjects. (It's. Called. LEARNING). You might want to try it sometime and
give Romney and other 'evolvers' a break.
Mitt? Barack? W? HW? Bill C?Stop electing or considering Ivy
Leaguers for POTUS and get someone like Gary Johnson in the White House and alot
of problems may get solved.There is still congress and special
interesting to foul up the process.
2 bitsPresidents in both parties have enforced the laws. With over
72% of the American people wanting enforcement before amnesty, it has to happen.
It might not happen with this President or the next, but the pendulum will
swing. The thought of 12 million lawbreakers being rewarded has flooded Congress
and the Presidents email inboxes this year. We can't afford
them taking American jobs that can't be exported like hospitality, service,
and construction. Amnesty is out of the question, the only long term solution is
to stop it now. Millions are still coming, it's going to get worse, as the
word is out on Obama, and ICE not turning people back. Instead they are sending
them to other states.
‘Join the discussion: Does religion affect Mitt Romney's view on
immigration?’======== No.The LDS
Church has consistently supported immigration reform.Mitt Romney has
changed position on it 3 different times now.First he was for it.Then he was against.Now he is for it, again.
Can you be a Mormon and believe in countries having borders? Seems the Catholic
church doesn't. Attrition through enforcement was a good ides. Barbra
Jordan proposed in under Bill Clinton. There has been a record number of
illegals rushing the borders (they aren't all kids). The word has gotten
out. If you have a kid, 2, 3,,+ you can stay. This is what happens with every
promise of amnesty. DACAs, those whose deportation hearings were cancelled,
those who got "relief" have told their countrymen to run for the border
because even if you don't stay, the longer you're here , the less
likely you'll ever have to leave...Even if you came illegally.
The only real job out Government has, is to protect our borders and our economy.
It's easy to make things complicated, hard to make things simple.
Romney's position on immigration has evolved. HIs religion's position
on immigration has evolved as well. I don't know if Romney's position
lines up with his religion's position, but they've probably at least
crossed paths at some point. I suppose you could say the same thing about gay
@RichardB,NO American President is willing to use the enforcement
provisions already in place.... Because it would cost his PARTY too many
votes.It's NEVER going to happen. EVER.They
(Party politicians) don't look at this situation the way normal Americans
do. When they see people... they see votes. And they must find a way to get
those votes... MOST politicians will do ANYTHING to get those votes.Getting serious about enforcement just doesn't test well... it
doesn't bring in enough potential votes to offset the backlash from a
certain minority group.The media's telling all politicians they
need that minority group to win... so Politicians will do NOTHING that may
offend that group. Something we need to get used to. That
minority is the "Majority" in some States already. It's for sure
not getting smaller...
There should be no reform until we have a President that is willing to use the
enforcement provisions already in place. We can't let in 12-18
million people all at once, that's more than our legal immigration numbers
over 10 years (11 million). We already have a surplus of labor, and the 32
million (congressional budget office numbers for amnesty and families over the
next ten years) would destroy our social services, social security (32 million
retiring in 20-30 years after not paying into the system much of their lives)
our culture and our political system. It would be the destruction of America.
Is business really that greedy. Other media is reporting that ICE is
shipping people arriving here illegally from Texas to Arizona as the flood of
people arriving is overloading the social services of south Texas. It seems that
people from central and south America have been told to come here illegally,
that we are not enforcing our laws. We can't afford to not
enforce our laws any longer. The long period of high unemployment has shown the
cost of surplus labor.
I don't care if people change their mind. But when they change it, and
then they change it, and then they change it again, depending on the audience
they are speaking to, then I tend to think they are pandering.
What exactly are Romney's views on immigration? They change from day to
I actually think someone being willing to change their mind shows signs of
personal integrity and that they take the issues serious. No one knows
everything about everything.... and we all can stand to learn more. If that
learning doesn't result in evolving positions, you really haven't
learned anything.I respect someone far more that says they got it
wrong and are changing their opinion, than someone who stubbornly stands by an
opinion despite all reasoning. Stubbornness and inflexibility is not a positive
attribute. And neither of these has anything to do with being true to your
convictions and faith.
IMO... There were problems with Romney's immigration plan (just as there
are problems with EVERY immigration plan since Ronald Reagan's). There is
no perfect immigration plan. That's why I believe that it should be
handled and delivered in several small chunks (over time). So we can try a
LITTLE piece of what we THINK is "Progress", see how it works, maybe
undo it if it doesn't work or make changes, and try something else. Trying to combine everything into one HUGE Immigration Reform bill... is
a recipe for failure for the bill, and disaster for those affected (and we are
ALL affected in one way or another).
I'm sorry, but Mitt Romney is simply not relevant. Who cares about this
question. He can't deliver his party's conservative wing. The
moderate wing is treading water and afraid to cross the conservatives. And the
Dems know they will never get a single ounce of cooperation from the GOP because
of the GOPs irrational hatred of the President. @ Thid, this
isn't about Obama. It's about Romney. Can you back off the bashing
for 10 minutes?
IMO this severe Democrat upset with Mitt changing his position on things is
mostly partisan posturing. If it wasn't... they would be equally upset
with Barack (but they aren't).In 2008, he said: "I believe
marriage is between a man and a woman. I am not in favor of gay
marriage."... May 9, 2012 ABC broke into its daytime lineup, to announce
the president of the United States declaring his personal support for gay
marriage....Barack Obama has changed his position on a LOT of
things. For one... Afghanistan. There are many... but I just
wanted to point out that Obama changes his position too... lest Democrats think
can criticize Romney for it... but not Obama.
LDS Liberal. Which Mitt Romney???? Which Barrack Obama? The campaigning Obama or
the real Obama? The ACA promises Obama or what we got Obamacare lies Obama,
period?The VA Obama or the real VA scandal where veterans died Obama?The most open administration in history or the real lies, secrecy and
cover-ups Obama?The IRS abuses that outraged Obama or the real covering up
and denying Obama?The Benghazi Obama(we will find and punish those who did
this and the tape lies) or the real Obama?The fast and furious Obama or
the real covering up Obama?The Syria "red line" Obama or the
Putin's stooge Obama? The 5 war criminals back on the battlefield
Obama or the excuses Obama?I fear your liberal ideology has poisoned your
view of the real Obama! What Obama says and what he does is usually totally
OK DN monitor -- I didn't see what was wrong the last 2 times, but I'll try again anyway...Flip-Flop-and back to Flip.This was why I could support him in 2008, but could not in
2012.Which Mitt Romney?
Instead of deporting the illegal immigrants, how about we deport Americans who
know the immigration laws yet still employ illegally? They value money over
following the rules and laws of our country.Deport the illegal
business owners and the illegal immigrants will have no incentive to come and
Obama doesn't enforce the immigration laws we have now! What good will MORE
useless laws do? Don't tell me how Obama has deported more illegals than
any other President because its another lie! Obama just released thousands of
illegal aliens from prisons, most with criminal records onto the streets! Where
did he get the authority to do that?
Many of those posting comments here have rightfully expressed frustration and
even anger at the idea of granting a pathway to citizenship for those who have
entered the country illegally. There is certainly justification for those
feelings and those who have stated that our current laws should be enforced are
absolutely right.But there is a larger problem that needs our
attention and upholding laws and taking a hard stance toward those who have
broken the law in the past will not solve that problem. Some estimates are that
as many as 12 million illegals currently reside in our country. Many of them
work in jobs that serve our needs and we are happy they are there to do those
jobs. My expereince is that these are some of the hardest working people I
know. But how long will we force them to live in the shadows, allowing them to
use our government services without allowing them to pay legal taxes on the
money they make in order to support those servicews. A pathway to citizenship
is the ONLY way to resolve such a huge problem. What is the alternative?
Rounding up 12 Million people and bussing them back to the border?
I think the Mitt you see now is the real Mitt, because he isn't being
advised by Neocons trying to appease the far right fringe. I am willing to bet
he doesn't care if he is branded as a RINO.... in fact, if he is, he should
wear it as a badge of honor. The Republican Party needs to be led
by pragmatic people who understand how to get things done.... not talking heads
trying to excite peoples emotions by emphasizing feelings of self superiority.
Mit became a good business many by knowing to get, you must give a little as
well. Something the current Republican leaders just doesn't get.
Lots of comments saying "enforce the existing laws".If that
is your position then you are advocating deporting over 11 million people.
PERIOD.Is that reasonable? Is it even doable? Think about it. Bumper sticker positions are easy. But not always realistic.=====Immigration reform will NOT get done before the 2016
election. It would be seen as a win for Obama. And we know that will never be
allowed.Heck, I predict we will be talking about Immigration reform
in 5 years. Neither side will get everything they want, and hence, nothing will
Flip flop flip flop!I have no idea what Romney's view on
immigration is. What time is it? This morning it was one way, this afternoon was
another, and tonight? Boy it's changed again.Mitt will do and
say anything to get people to like him.
@HemlockIt's a little like asking: "Does a person's
worldview have an impact on their views of the world?"
Beginning of sarcasm and fake outrage // He is free to believe in empathy but it
should not affect his policy views. We aren't a theocracy. If he wants to
live in a theocracy he should go to Iran! / End of sarcasm and fake outrage.
The headline is a very naive question. Does Rev. Jeremiah Wright affect Barach
Obama's view on releasing Sgt. Bergdahl? One's philosophy, be it
religious or secular, determines one's position on everything. There is no
hegemony on immigration issues within LDS doctrine so if you want to know, ask
Mitt Romney, but don't take a poll.
Holy cow I'm going to agree with 2 bits. How could religion not
affect his views on immigration. A persons religious views would affect almost
everything they have a view on. A persons nonreligious views will affect almost
all of the views they have. A persons deeply held views on great movies likely
affects their views. A persons favorite music will affect their views.I don't know 2 bits, did we just answer the headline with too much of a
meta answer? I mean it seems obvious that his views are reflected by his
religion. Perhaps we were too literal in our answer.
You can't reward people here illegally with jobs, or you invite millions
more to bypass our laws, come here illegally, and steal id's, social
security numbers and perjury. Not to mention the people dying in the desert and
breaking up of more families. Only enforcement of the laws will
solve these problems in a compassionate way for everyone.
I like Romney, but I disagree with him immigration position. We don't need
reform, we just want the laws enforced. What is wrong with enforcing the laws?
I'd rather in go in the red protecting our country from the invasion of
illegals than letting them stay. I don't buy into the anchor babies or the
young children (from infant to young adult)that it's not their fault.
Tough. They are illegally here. Their parents knew exactly what they were doing
when they snuck into our country. It is NOT our responsibility to give them a
better life if they can't find it in their own country. They should remain
in theirs and take steps into making it a better place rather than come here and
turn America into one of their own countries. As far as Romney's religion
playing a part in his switch...of course it is apparent by all accounts made by
the Church leaders that we are told to be more Christ-like and understanding in
our approach to immigration. Those of us who love this country believe in the
adherence of its laws.
It's easy to call for "immigration reform" without specifying the
details.I thought self-deportation was the central pillar of
Romney's plan. Or has he flip-flopped again?
I'm a human... Romney's a human.Religion affects MY views... I
would assume it affects HIS views.====I think he loves
everybody, including Hispanics (I've heard him say that). That does NOT
mean he will disregard our laws so they can break them if they want.
That's not love. That's pandering.He said we need to have
a "path to citizenship"... I assume that would be a LEGAL path. Not
just sustaining the status quo and let them skirt the law as long as they can
without getting caught, and IF they get caught... just set a court date and let
them move to another community and do the same thing.==== I think he understands how the economy works, how businesses work, how jobs
work. He realizes that when we have a glut of illegal workers
willing to accept lower wages and get paid under the table (so it doesn't
have to be reported to the Government)... it tends lower EVERYBODY's wages
AND Lower the government's tax revenue (because they dont pay taxes on
income paid under the table, and they need a valid SS# to pay income taxes, SS
I would say that the fact that his father immigrated from Mexico the the US,
lived on government assistance for a good portion of his youth, that those
factors probably weigh on his opinion and position. It could be also as a
church leader he understands that borders are constructs created by man, not
God, and that our stewardship to each other is not limited by some artificial
line drawn across a map.But I get it that such a notion is very
offensive to some who think because they live north of this line, they think
they are a blessed people, and have no responsibility to those who live outside
these lines. Were all Gods children, just that God loves and cares about some
more than others.... or something along those lines.
Which of Romney's positions on immigration shall we compare it to?There's the pre-2012 position.Then there's the 2012 campaign
position.And now there's the Utah Compact position.I suppose it
depends on the audience.
It seems ridiculously disingenuous for people to be spouting off about the need
to "provide a path to citizenship" when there is and always has been
such a path.The problem is that, like many other functions of our
bloated, inefficient and ineffective federal government, the process to navigate
and actually take that path is overly complicated, time consuming and cumbersome
in many other ways. Which, of course, is one reasons desperately poor but
normally law-abiding people (and many others who are NOT law-abiding) justify
breaking the immigration laws as currently constituted. That is a shame and one
part of why we desperately need real, intelligent and comprehensive immigration
reform.Nevertheless, in the meantime, we **must** enforce our
current laws, if only to preserve the sanctity of law that has formed the basis
of our country and helped us make it a place where other people are desperate to
Not that I've seen. From what I have seen, the only thing that affects
Romney's view on anything is how much money he can make from it.