Old maids are still being stigmatized.
some of us have wanted stricter guidelines on divorce for a long while now...
kinda sad it took the sideshow of gay marriage to eventually get around to
No fault divorce was legalized in California in 1969 - at which time it
immediately came under attack as destroying marriage and families.I
really don't think you can blame opposition to no-fault divorce on same-sex
marriage proponents.@ jamescmeyer: One of the biggest problems
marriage faces is the idea that "[i]t's a goal in and of itself."
If your marriage goal consists solely of getting married, you have failed before
you have even begun because the questions you are focusing on are, "Do I
want to marry this person? Does this person want to marry me?" There is no
focus on anything beyond that and no plan for success.The goal
should not be to just get married - the goal should be to have a happy,
successful marriage. The questions should be, "Can I be happy spending the
rest of my life with this person? Can I make this person happy for the rest of
their life? Do we have shared interests? How is this person at handling
adversity? What does a successful marriage look like? If we marry and some of
our goals prove unattainable, will we be able to work through it?"
@Jamescmeyer;LGBT couples have families too. You're quite
selfish to deny these families the same legal protections you enjoy. BTW, did
you marry for love or did you only marry to have children? If that's the
case, pity your wife.
A large part of marriage is touched on by the very end of this article; marriage
isn't incidental, it's not meant to satisfy individuals, and it
can't just be quit out of if things don't magically work out.It's a goal in and of itself. It and raising children are the final step
to adulthood. It's not about two people; it's about uniting two
families, and continuing them on. It's something you dedicate yourself to
and work toward forever.People now consider marriage optional, not
desirable, and there is nothing to be had in marriage that they don't take
without it if they want it. Regardless of whatever arguments silver-tongued
conservative-bashers try to argue, it is a plainly observed fact that
promiscuity and easy divorce are a large part of why people think it's okay
to simply change what marriage is altogether, focusing on their sexual
"orientation".Finally, they clamor about how we should
"shore up marriage", yet it is largely them letting it down.
Its amazing how much good a marriage counselor can do if brought in early enough
in the process. Usually once the parties are trying to get a divorce things have
gone too far to redeem, unfortunately. I don't know how you can get people
to seek help before things get out of hand, though. I would hope helping
marriages succeed will not be thought of in liberal v conservative terms. If
there is one social ill that plagues everyone, its divorce.
@RedWings"So, first the left argues that conservatives should focus on
restrcting divorce in order to preserve traditional marriage rather than fight
SSM. "Actually, the left usually just focuses on pointing out
the hypocrisy of only fighting SSM when the right doesn't care about other
things, or suggests that reducing divorce rates should be a priority. They
generally don't advocate restricting divorce. Much like how I frequently
invoke single people being able to adopt in this state pointing out that if the
"children need a mother and father" arguments are nonsense because
nobody seems to care that single people can adopt. That doesn't actually
mean I want there to be restrictions on that. I'm just pointing out
@RedWings 4:13 p.m. April 18, 2014We are in total agreement. Thank
@tedwings "So, first the left argues that conservatives should focus
on restrcting divorce in order to preserve traditional marriage rather than
fight SSM. Then when they do, it is an "alarming trend"?"Imagine that apparently "the left" actually does not fit into one
stereotype and don't all think exactly the same. This is why it may help
your arguments to just focus on making your point instead of trying disparage
Furry:I agree fully. So, let's put an end to the constant
barrage of sexual images thrown in front of us. Outlaw sex as a marketing tool.
Why do we need almost-naked women to sell hamburgers?If we dispense
with this hyper-sexualized culture, men will start to respect women instead of
turning them into objects of pleasure. I would love to see us go in that
direction. That should truly be the feminist agenda...
@Jon W. 9:08 a.m. April 18, 2014Contrary to feminist dogma, most men
are not rapists, so the tried and proven method for encouraging marriage needs
to be reimplemented: that is, a woman should not grant sexual access to any man
to whom she is not married.---------------------So, in
other words, blame the woman. If you wish to use that argument, I would also
suggest that another tried and proven method for encouraging marriage needs to
be reimplemented: that is, a man should not seek sexual access to any woman to
whom he is not married.
Describing same-sex marriage as hedonism is preposterous, and an affront to
public discourse.There is nothing less hedonistic than two people
who love each other making a commitment to share their lives together. You may
not be able to empathize with people who only feel romantic attraction to their
own sex, and I may not be able to imagine myself in that position, either, but
we all understand what romantic attraction is in general.I try not
to think about other people's sex lives, gay or straight. It's none
of my business. But, I understand what marriage is, and that's settling
down and forming a household. That's not hedonism. It's an important
undertaking that if properly done improves both partners, whichever neighborhood
they live in, and society at large.The wrong individuals ruin
everything, though. This Reuters story, today: " A [straight] Florida man
annoyed that his 16-month-old crying son was preventing him from playing video
games suffocated the toddler and left him to die in a playpen, police said on
Friday."That's hedonism.Divorce is necessary.
Some marriages are beyond redemption.
I do firmly believe marriage is a cornerstone of our society and I find it sad
that so many end in divorce. That said wouldn't it be better to have
marriage classes before people get married? Catholic church requires anyone who
wish to marry in the church (building) to take classes, make sure their
compatible, understand the wants and needs of each other. Instead of forcing
people into a miserable corner?Old adage : Marry in haste, repent in
Should not marriage be harder to get into than easier to get out of? If a young
couple had a "cooling off" period from their lustful courtship before
entering into the legal contract of marriage, wouldn't it make more sense?
What about mandated counseling before marriage? I don't think many young
couples really know what kinds of comprises and hurdles their new married life
will entail. I don't think most couples decide in advance many of the big
issues facing all married couples must face, nor discuss how to negotiate
differences of opinions about these problems. And our current government
policies don't make things any easier on the stressed young couples
attempting to make ends meet.Any fool in Utah can go to the County
Clerk, and get licensed to get married (unless you happen to be marrying someone
of your same gender). We ought to consider other options that a check and a
signature on a form for the commencement of a marriage.
I have two pretty good friends currently going through divorces. Neither involve
cheating or abuse, both are long broken situations that counseling has not
helped. One divorce is reaching the one-year mark of legal shenanigans and
maneuvering and bills. Lots of legal bills. And they have months until a court
date. The other is at the six month mark and seems to be headed down
a similar path, including mounting legal bills. In both cases the
kids are suffering, my friends are miserable and stuck in limbo and, while I
have no contact with either of the soon-to-be-ex-husbands, from what I am
hearing they are pretty miserable, too. The only ones who benefit
from the system are the lawyers. And by the way - two people giving
their opinion on an issue does not mean the "liberals are confused" or
the "conservatives can't win."Opinions. Individual
opinions. From different individuals. Not dictated from a central authority that
requires group-think or you get kicked out into the wilderness. Me? Divorce should be discouraged and hard. And my friend's situation is
long, hard, and stupid.
Contrary to feminist dogma, most men are not rapists, so the tried and proven
method for encouraging marriage needs to be reimplemented: that is, a woman
should not grant sexual access to any man to whom she is not married.
After four marriages, my friend commented to me that would have been better off
just working out the problems in his first marriage. It is sad
people think it is a solution to run.
"Amanda Marcotte at Slate calls this an "alarming trend." "So, first the left argues that conservatives should focus on restrcting
divorce in order to preserve traditional marriage rather than fight SSM. Then
when they do, it is an "alarming trend"?No-fault divorce was
the first attack on the family. This should never have been allowed. In some
situations (abuse, adultery, etc.), divorce is necessary and should be done
quickly to protect all involved. However, in our current society, most divorces
are caused by simple selfishness. If Ms. Marcotte is concerned
about the "petty squabbling" that is involved in divorce, making it
harder to get one will help. If the couple knows that they need to work out
their differences as loving adults and can't run to the nearest court to
end the relationship, they will have to be more committed to each other.Marriage is about putting another's needs above your own. This is
something most of us need to learn....
Because it is natural for women to want children and biological drives being
what they are; marriage is valuable institution for society. What could be done
better is educating people to be prepared for the stresses and responsibilities
that come with marriage. Dealing with interpersonal problems is difficult for
the best of us; and, obviously, some do better than others. But education and
training help. Family and marriage relation classes are invaluable. As is
example in the home, where children learn from the examp0le of their parents-
good or bad.