Wyoming cougar:Houston, Cincinnati, UConn, and UCF are
"midmajors", and it appears as though it's going to take you FIVE
YEARS just to get to travel to Mississippi, Texas, Ga. Tech, Virginia,
Wisconsin, Nebraska, Michigan, and Notre Dame. And of those 8 locations, only 2
were Home-&-Homes. Four were one-offs, and the rest 2-for-1s. Plus, since
2011, you'd only be averaging 4.2 games per season vs. Power 5/BCS
opponents....and that's only IF you included all those AAC teams from 2013,
who were only grandfathered in as BCS teams. Plus, if you count going forward
only, to 2015, you have 5 games...or 2.5 per season.So like I
said...you AREN'T "traveling the country to play real big boy teams in
real stadiums". And THAT's why you should bite the bullet, swallow you
misplaced pride, and accept a 2-for-1, or risk playing a more
naval vet:"Because you're NOT traveling the country to play real
big boy teams in real stadiums. You're only going to Austin and
Berkeley."Really? Let's see, just since becoming
Independent BYU has been or will be within the next couple of years at
Mississippi, Texas, Georgia Tech, Virginia, Houston, Notre Dame (several times),
Wisconsin, Nebraska, Michigan, Cincinatti, UConn, UCF, etc and several Pac-10
teams not named utah.Not all of these teams have the best records
(and there have been some other smaller teams along the way) but most of them
are big boy teams, all from automatic qualifying conferences, and all over the
country. Much better in my book than being stuck in an annual series with utah.
phoenix:What's the point of those random statistics? Which
Washington teams that Bronco had faced had also faced the Utes? And which
Washington teams that Kyle had faced had also faced the cougars?Besides, Utah's lifetime record against the cougars favors Utah, and
similarly, Kyle's lifetime record against Bronco favors Kyle. And
that's all one really needs to know as to which is the superior
team/program/coach.Edge: Utah/Kyle Whittingham
phoenix:And the Y is 0-forever vs. USC, whereas Utah is not. So
what? We already know what the lifetime record of Utah vs. the Provo cougs is,
and that it favors Utah by nearly a quarter century. So I guess that ultimately
settles that, doesn't it? Utah is the better team/program. Case closed.
UteologyBronco 9-9 (50%) versus PAC 12 teams, including 2-1 versus
Washington.Kyle 13-21 (38%) versus PAC 12 teams, including 0-2
versus Washington.Lifetime, BYU is 4-5, Utah 0-8, versus Washington.
wyoming cougar:"Why go 2-for-1 with a local 'big
conference' bottom-feeder when you can travel the country and play real big
boy teams in real stadiums."Because you're NOT traveling
the country to play real big boy teams in real stadiums. You're only going
to Austin and Berkeley.
BYU would be foolish to ever schedule a 2-for-1 with the utes. There are so many
other, high profile teams in the country that would meet BYU's goals of
exposure than utah. (Like Texas, Notre Dame, and other pac-10 schools and
eastern schools). Why go 2-for-1 with a local "big
conference" bottom-feeder when you can travel the country and play real big
boy teams in real stadiums. Win or lose, I'd much rather see BYU play teams
that consistently go to bowl games and give players and fans the chance to
travel the country than go to salt lake. In fact, better to go
2-for-1 with those other programs than even 1-for-1 with utah in my opinion- the
ugliness in this rivalry has just gotten out of control.
We shall see. If this year's team still cannot punch the ball into the end
zone, from the RED ZONE, their no huddle offense will, once again, be a mere
SportsFanOrem, UTnavelvet"Bronco all time: ...
3 wins vs teams with winning record"LOL at your hyperbole.Kyle is 13-21 (38%) lifetime versus PAC opponents, only THREE wins
versus teams with winning records, only ONE since joining the conference.Remind us that last time the Utes won a road game against a PAC team
with a winning record...-----------It was you, not me,
that made the claim the you would beat 6-7 Washington, when you haven't
beat such a team since 1997. It was you that made a claim that BYU
would be competitive in the PAC-12 even though Utah and TCU have struggled in a
tougher league with MWC talent.
SportsFan:"LOL at your disingenuous spin."How is
"Whoops! I stand corrected" disingenuous? Don't be so frantic and
emotional."Bronco and Kyle both have THREE wins over PAC teams
with winning records, the biggest difference, Kyle has played nearly TWICE as
many PAC opponents as Bronco."OR...the biggest difference was
that the 3 Pac-12 teams Kyle beat averaged 9-wins, whereas the 3 Bronco beat
averaged 7. Kyle's wins > Bronco's.
The Cougar's offensive and defensive lines are lacking in speed and
quickness. Robert Anae needs to address this issue in order to be successful.
Naval VetLOL at your disingenuous spin."Lifetime,
Whittingham is 12-16 (.429), and has wins over the following Pac-10/12 teams
with winning records:1. 8-5 Oregon (2003)2. 8-6 Cal (2003)3. 9-4 Ore St (2008)4. 8-5 Cal (2009)5. 11-3 Stanford
(2013)"Urban Meyer, NOT, Kyle Whittingham, was Utah's head
coach in 2003.Don't know where you're getting your made up
figures from, but since 2005 when Bronco and Kyle became head coaches of BYU and
Utah respectively, BYU has played 18 games versus PAC teams, Utah has played
34.Bronco and Kyle both have THREE wins over PAC teams with winning
records, the biggest difference, Kyle has played nearly TWICE as many PAC
opponents as Bronco.
Whoops! I stand corrected again. Kyle was not credited for beating Oregon and
Cal back in 2003. That was Meyer's team.
Whoops! I stand corrected: Kyle Whittingham IS 13-21 lifetime vs. the
Pac-10/12.But I was not wrong about him having beaten more than 3
teams with a winning record.
SportsFan:You're not quoting me. How frantic and emotional of
you."Remind us that last time the Utes won a road game against a
PAC team with a winning record...hint: It hasn't happened THIS
CENTURY!"And neither had it happened this century for our little
brother, so what was your point? Were you trying to hold Utah to a higher
standard than our little brother? Because I thought we'd already met that
"higher" standard. We HAD won nearly 70% of our head-to-head matchups
you know."Kyle is 13-21 lifetime versus PAC opponents, only
THREE wins versus teams with winning records, only ONE since joining the
conference."Not by my count. Lifetime, Whittingham is 12-16
(.429), and has wins over the following Pac-10/12 teams with winning records:1. 8-5 Oregon (2003)2. 8-6 Cal (2003)3. 9-4 Ore St (2008)4. 8-5 Cal (2009)5. 11-3 Stanford (2013)Bronco, on the other
hand, is the one with wins over only 3 Pac-10/12 teams with winning records:1. 7-6 Oregon (2006)2. 8-5 Ore St (2009)3. 7-6 Wash (2010)
navelvet"Bronco all time: ... 3 wins vs teams with winning
record"LOL at your hyperbole.Kyle is 13-21 (38%)
lifetime versus PAC opponents, only THREE wins versus teams with winning
records, only ONE since joining the conference.Remind us that last
time the Utes won a road game against a PAC team with a winning record...hint: It hasn't happened THIS CENTURY!
navelvet"Playing and beating you does very little for our
recruiting and national profile,..."Playing and beating BYU
certainly does more for your recruiting and national profile than being a
conference bottom dweller and losing to the likes of Washington State and
Steven,We stormed the field just to rub in it byu fans faces that we
COULD storm the field(by having won yet again). You guys
haven't even had that option lately haven you?I've been
saying for years now what Navel is saying. If byu wants to play us, and then
need the game more than we do, it'll be a 2 for 1.We play a
great schedule and adding byu doesn't help that schedule. So why would we
want to play byu? We'd rather play Fresno or Michigan
@Naval VetIF what you said was truly correct than why are you still
hung up on the game. All the Ute fans that stormed the field after the game two
years are of the same mentality. Winning that game was huge for the the Utes.
Dick: I think the better question should be, is the Spring 2013 version of the
offense any better than the November/December 2013 version? You gave all the
evident reasons why it had to be better than last year's spring version and
even last year's September version -- so, that's not even an issue.
But are they improved enough to beat a good team like Wisconsin or Notre Dame or
even a pretty good team like Washington? They could beat none of these with
last fall's version of the offense. How about now? There is only one team
on Fall 2014's schedule that will rise to the level of Washington, let
alone Wisconsin or Notre Dame: Texas. Central Florida graduated its NFL 1st
round pick QB - lucky for BYU. Boise State will be better than last year but
lost its mastermind head coach to Washington. USU will have Chuckie back, but
won't be Top 25. Texas is it. So, can they beat Texas? If the offense
looks against Texas like it did against Wisconsin and Notre Dame, then you will
have your answer about improvement. Only then.
@TheSportsAuthority UteologyBYU wouldn't have lost
to Washington State in 2013.--------------BYU was 0-2 vs
PAC-12 in 2013, including a loss at home to 5-7 Utah. BYU hasn't
beat a single PAC-12 team with 4 or more wins on the road since 1997 under
Edwards.Bronco is 0-3 on the road vs P12 teams with 4-6 wins (3-0 vs teams
with 3 or less wins)BYU would have lost at 6-7 Washington State,
they might of pulled of a miracle win just like they did at 0-12 Washington on a
missed extra point.
@TheSportsAuthority Bronco also has a better record vs. Big 12
compared to Patterson at TCU. Are you claiming that BYU has P12/B12
depth to compete in those conferences? Laughable! Kyle pre-P12
schedule:vs P12 – 4-3 (57%) … since joining PAC 12 9-18
(33%)vs BCS – 11-5 (68%)Bronco all time:vs P12 -
9-9 (50%) ... 3 wins vs teams with winning recordvs BCS – 11-15
The key phrase in this article was "Anae made the statement that if you
punched last year’s offensive line, it'd fall down and not get back
up, but that this year’s version would jump back up and duke it
out."This years group needs to prove that they can counter
punch. The offense lacked the mental toughness to win big plays consistently. If
the offensive line can dominate the line of scrimmage, then BYU has a shot as
something special. If they don't then they'll have another
Naval, I was getting on here to help make your case.Utah has had
BYU's number the past 4 years. The scoreboard is all that
matters.Then you post "They're "biting our
ankles".???You just lost credability. You should have stopped
while you were making a strong argument. IMHO
maq:You forgot about the cougars goal of "Beat Utah".
Don't deny it. It's not "just another game on your
schedule"."It is huge. This is like the Super Bowl...Coach
Mendenhall will have us prepared to play Utah." -- LB Kyle Van Noy"In previous years, I think it's been the biggest motivation
we've had, playing Utah and trying to beat our in-state rival". -- OL
Ryker Mathews"We grew up watching the rivalry and that's
why a lot of us came to BYU...Honestly, that's lot of the motivation we
had...every day we remind ourselves, 'Hey, we've got to beat
Utah.'" -- DB Drew ReillyAnd yes, it was a fail.
Tajemnica:"Too bad utah only showed up to the BYU and Stanford
games. If they cared about the rest as much as the BYU games they could have
been decent."I don't know how many times I have to tell you
cougar fans, but THAT game is YOUR "Super Bowl". Not ours. And it isn't that Utah "doesn't care" about the other teams
in the Pac-12. It's that those other teams in the Pac-12 are much harder
to beat than the Y.Make no mistake. The Y isn't "breathing
down [our] necks". They're "biting our ankles". There's
a big difference. You've just confused the two. The former implies that
there'd be some kind of threat; which considering the history of this
series these past dozen years, just isn't there. The latter implies that
you're some kind of nuisance who's completely irrelevant to our goal
of winning the Pac-12 South; which clearly is the situation in this case.
Tators, Tajemnica, Max & Ducky: Does 54-10 hurt that much?
Does 4 wins in a row, 9 out of 12 ruin your day? Relax it is only a football
game. Things will look much brighter next year when play your
teams from the AMERICAN ATHLETIC, MT. WEST, CONFERENCE USA & THE ATLANTIC
COST conferences. Wait one, I forgot the MID-EASTERN ATHLETIC
CONFERENCE. They are represented by the Savannah ST. Tigers. The Tigers beat
Fort Valley St., A Div. II school, by 7 points for their only win last year.AS I said relax, I see a bowl game for you next year.
@ Naval Vet"Playing and beating you does very little for our
recruiting and national profile"You make a good point in that. utah
has nothing to gain or lose when they play BYU. In 2004 and 2008 if BYU had
defeated utah, NO BCS bowls for utah. Nowadays it doesn't make a
difference. If BYU had beat utah last year and utah won all the other games -
BCS bowl. Possible National Championship appearance though not likely with the
SEC. So why all the fuss and bragging about beating BYU? It boils down to
this... BYU could have defeated utah but they didn't that is a fact so
congrats on winning a pointless game. If you want to start bragging about how
high and mighty utah is, start winning games that matter. There is no longer any
relevance to utah in beating BYU and utah will never be any better until they
prove themselves against competition that makes a difference. Goals for BYU:
1:Play in the postseason. 2: win a national championship. Goals for utah: 1:
play in the postseason. 2: win the PAC 12* championship. 3: win a national
championship. At least BYU accomplished one goal last season. How close has utah
come recently these?
"That’s all hype until BYU meets UConn in the season opener at the end
of August.But if what was on display in the final practice is any
evidence, Kool-Aid pitcher, meet glass with ice." Well said Dick. Agreed.
Proof is in the pudding. They better knock Conn on its butt or it is more of
Tators (cont.):Playing and beating you does very little for our
recruiting and national profile, so there's nothing to gain by playing it.
If you want this game to continue on an annual basis, you're just gonna
have to meet us halfway by providing us a proper incentive. You need to bite
the bullet, swallow your pride, and accept an 2(RES)-for-1(LES).
Tators:"Utah's AD and coach would've kept BYU on their
schedule if they still had any confidence they could still beat BYU. Obviously,
they don't."Utah fears no cougar, as the Y hadn't
really posed much of a threat to us on the gridiron these past dozen years.
Look at it logically:If Utah had any reason to fear a cougar team,
wouldn't it be against the team with the advantage over these past dozen
years? Yet Utah Basketball continues to schedule the Y. If ever there was any
reason to NOT fear a cougar team, it's when that cougar team can't
measure up. Like your football team for example. You'd only won 25% of
those games, and you needed "luck" to win it. Don't be so frantic
@Naval VetToo bad utah only showed up to the BYU and Stanford games.
If they cared about the rest as much as the BYU games they could have been
decent. Now that they don't have BYU breathing down their necks maybe
they'll actually remember they have 12 games in which to play hard - not
My predications for the upcoming season:Highly likely (worst case
scenario) 9-3Definately doable 10-2My prediction 11-1 (one loss
could be to any of 3-4 teams)Somewhat challenging but still possible 12-0
(only problem with this scenario is due to BYUs fairly weak SOS it could be hard
to tell just how good they are/could be with this record)
Tators:"[Utah was] very fortunate to beat BYU last season. Most
objective observers will eadmit [sic] as much."Same old refrain,
year after year, and loss after loss to your big brother on the Hill. The
reason why Utah beat you guys 4 yrs in a row, and 9 of the past 12, was because
Utah was the better team. We also outrecruited the Y 4 yrs in a row, and 9 of
the past 12 recruiting seasons. So you see? It's no
"coincidence". It isn't "luck". And if ever there could
be a case made for "luck" winning the game, it would've been for
the team who'd only won 25% of the past dozen finally escaping with a
"W".Recognize.P.S.: You are not an
"unbiased" observer, so you can't predict what "unbiased"
observers would say. That said, I'd predict an "unbiased" observer
would have noted that one team -- the one with the better coaches and recruits
-- typically owns (and outrecruits) the other, and would thereby favor the
chances of the "winningest" team in this series.
Hey, TATORS: This was a article about BYU & Anae. Why all the
Utah hate.I think that you need to look into the recent BYU vs. Utah
football win loss records.
@ uteology:Go back and check all the stats from the last two BYU -
Utah football games and you will come away with a new appreciation of how
fortunate and lucky Utah was to somehow come away with wins in those particular
games.90% of the time, teams that wim the stat battle the way BYU
did in those games also wins the score stat. But because that didn't happen
with those particular games, any neutral observer would certainly conclude that
Utah was indeed fortunate and somewhat lucky to have pulled put victories... at
least in those 2 instances.@ big 12 call:Because things
tend to balance out the scales in the long run, and because of things the
article pointed out, my confidence is now stronger than ever before... and
rightfully so.As difficult as any Ute wins have been lately,
Utah's AD and coach would've kept BYU on their schedule if they still
had any confidence they could still beat BYU. Obviously, they don't. They
are obviously more intelligent than some of Utah's ultra-biased fans. And
for you, the shoe seems to fit.
Great article Dick. I never listen any more to what coaches say. Just wait and
see what happens on the field. For benefit of readers, Dick knows it's
spelled "acclimation," but typos are easy to come by, haha!
I think that we have learned from last season, that if we have a bye week, we
must use it to practice for the next game instead of going on family vacations
and family outings. The Utah game proved that to us. If the NCCA gives us 26
days to practice before a bowl game, we need to take all 26 days to practice
before playing that game. Washington game taught us that rule.Bottom line: If we want to be a significant football team, recognized as
being significant among the major teams in our Nation, we must make football
important enough during the season to hold off all family vacations and outings
until after the last game played. We must do our resting and recuperating after
the last game of the season.Unless we put more importance to
football at least during the football season, we will never be more than a
decent mid major team. That’s my opinion. What is yours?
UteologyBYU wouldn't have lost to Washington State in 2013.Bronco is 9-9 (50%) versus PAC 12 teams.Kyle is 9-18 (33%) since
joining the PAC 12.It's pretty obvious which coach is more
competitive against the PAC 12.
"His quarterback was fresh off knee surgery and basically had just three
games worth of experience." -- DHDoes Dick post on these
threads? Sounds like it. Apparently the knee surgery affected his
passing game but not his running game. Hill had 15 games worth of experience by
the time he played Washington, how did that turn out?BYU will not be
better as much as the opposing defenses will be worse, BYU will win 10 games
this year, slight chance of going undefeated if they beat Texas.@TatorsUtah was fortunate to beat BYU last season even though we
never trailed the entire game and BYU never threatened to take the lead.@MaxTell me again what BYU did to prevent Utah from going to
bowl games? Yes we can't compete against PAC-12 teams, but neither can
Tator,Pretty confident byu would beat Utah?You had that
same "confidence" before your rivalry game with Utah last year. And the year before And the year before(54-10)And the year before
Love to root for the Cougars. Still, college foitball results closely follow
recruiting more than any other factor. And for 2012, 2013, & 2014, BYU
recruiting classes ranked 60, 63, and 62, respectively. For me, I hope for (and
have grown to expect) a season ranked 30-40. Year in and year out, the Cougs
tend to overacheive.
I want to believe. Help thou my unbelief. I bought football
tickets today, but I am still predicting 7 or 8 wins.
lifelong, tell us all again which bowl game your utes played in the last two
years? And will you be screaming for whitts job after another 5-7 bowless
I'm with @idablu. I love the optimism. Optimism is the trademark of
football fans everywhere from spring ball through Fall practice. Everyone is
puffed up in August. September/October are the reality checks and while the
2014 schedule isn't what it was in 2013, there are still some very good
games on the schedule that will test BYU. Of course, true fans will stick with
their team, but from now until UConn, the talk is all hot air and supposition.
I traveled to UVA last year with very high hopes for our young team. I repeated
it at season's end in South Bend. Lost both. I think the team has
potential, but fruition is what I want to see. Real progress will be measured
in games won. Go Cougs.
Love your optimism, Dick.I think I'll wait and see what happens the
first game. I am hopeful, though.
It would seem Utah inadvertently picked a good time to take a couple of years
off from playing the Cougars. They were very fortunate to beat BYU last season.
Most objective observers will eadmit as much. Luckily for Utah,
Taysom Hill will be graduated by the time the two teams play each other again.
Most Ute fans will admit as much just 2 games into next season. It will be that
obvious to all unbiased observers.
Organizations are perfectly aligned for the results they get. The rest is talk.
How BYU performs against top rated teams will be the yardstick against which
they will be measured.