BYU's No. 10 seed surprises national media

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  • Wiscougarfan River Falls, WI
    March 18, 2014 6:49 p.m.

    re: motorbike

    "Bottom line though, it's easy to see that RPI rewards teams far too much for simply playing (not winning) against tough out of conference opponents."

    I agree with that. The problem with any single metric/rating system is that it will have inherent biases. Another example is BPI rewarding teams for wins over embarrassingly bad teams. I found it hilarious over the last few weeks that many Ute fans were littering BYU boards with talk of how BPI is so superior to RPI. Indeed, Utah ranked 10 points higher than BYU largely due to their laughable OOC schedule. Give three of their 300 and lower RPI wins to BYU and BYU's BPI would be higher.

    March 18, 2014 2:48 p.m.

    +1 William Wallace

    March 18, 2014 2:44 p.m.


    Danbury, CT

    I love SMU, but they don't deserve to be in the NCAA's this year. Not over Pitt and FSU. They don't stand a chance against Oregon with Collinsworth out (or with him for that matter)."

    Too bad bro, BYU got in. Sorry your team didn't! But, play a stronger schedule next time and maybe your fortunes will turn.

    BYU is without Collinsworth but, they are also without Pac 12 officials and Oregon's home court with this one...

  • William Wallace OGDEN, UT
    March 18, 2014 12:36 p.m.

    OldTimeFTBaller: Thanks for the comments. I too find it odd that so much trash talk has gone Utah's way, and they handled BYU easily. I'm a Ute fan, but don't go "Chris B." on everyone. I picked Oregon to beat the Cougs, simply for the reason I stated a week ago. I don't think BYU is built for NCAA success. I think it comes down to running good offense, and playing tough defense. I don't think those are strong points for BYU, but I think it will be a great game. BYU fans should be focusing on Oregon, and Utah will have their hands full with a quality St. Mary's team. Good luck to all.

  • sportsfanforlife salt lake city, UT
    March 18, 2014 10:38 a.m.

    HAHA! awww byu fans got their wittle feelings hurt after they saw and now realize what the national media really thinks about their "powerhouse" program, after ALL year claiming that everyone had "so much respect" byu. This is hilarious! Now the national media is "biased" and doesnt know what they're talking about? oh man im i having myself laugh righth about now.Oh yeah, i forgot byu "fans" know extremely more than those "self-appointed" experts, who btw, get paid for what they do while all these byu fans are couch experts.

  • CordonBleu Park City, UT
    March 17, 2014 10:27 p.m.


    I wouldn't say you're much of a BYU fan at all - 90% of your comments are completely negative toward BYU, and those that aren't are only mildly complimentary.

    Dave Rose is one of only 9 coaches who have lead their programs to 7+ NCAA tournaments in the last 9 seasons.

    The east coast bias in the media was never more apparent than in the quick reversal by the pundits as soon as they discovered that the numbers contradicted their personal biases.

  • Scores Idaho Falls, ID
    March 17, 2014 8:58 p.m.

    Yes it was #3. That was their out of conference schedule strength. The utes better man up next year with the players they have...and with the same record result as this year...they will go dancing too.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    March 17, 2014 8:02 p.m.


    byu did NOT have the #3 schedule in the country. Try again

  • PP Eagle Mountain, UT
    March 17, 2014 6:36 p.m.

    Two things are funny - People that say Oregon will kill us when there is irrefutable evidence to the contrary (an OT loss in Eugene) and people that claim that they are BYU fans yet state that BYU should not be in the tournament. BYU won 23 games against the #3 schedule in the country. They are head and shoulders above the other teams that they keep getting compared to. The committee not only thought they should be in the tournament they ranked them fairly well. The day your fandom has a lower standard than the NCAA selection committee is the day you should renounce your cougar club membership and start wearing red.

  • Newspaper Reader Highland, UT
    March 17, 2014 5:59 p.m.

    It sure is odd to me when Cougar fans don't seem to be happy that their team is in the NCAA Tournament. Who cares if they "should" have not been selected. They were! And a #10 seed to boot! Just be happy for them! I'm not saying the detractors aren't happy, but they sure seem to be debbie downers in this situation.

  • Dr. Coach Bountiful, UT
    March 17, 2014 4:55 p.m.

    I'm a cougar fan. A cougar grad. And a blue blood. But the cougars, bless their horrific three point shooting hearts, shouldn't be going to the big dance. Are we talking about the same team that played an entire game without making a single three pointer after taking 31 from beyond the arc? The same team that claims to be playing their best basketball and was lucky not to have their championship game with Gonzaga called on a seventh inning little league twenty run rule? The free throw shooting is atrocious. The defending is non-existent. Opponents walk through the lane like a hot knife through butter. When they're at the foul line I'm screaming "Don't embarrass the school, please don't, just give the ball to the other team and play on". These boys are nice kids. And like most sports teams, they've worked really hard this season.

    I don't think I could watch them embarrass the school with another disgrace in the first round. Better to call it a season and start practicing those foul shots.

  • LovelyDeseret Gilbert, AZ
    March 17, 2014 4:49 p.m.

    ESPN had BYU making the tournament. That didn't come as much of a surprise. Nebraska was the shock team.

    March 17, 2014 2:49 p.m.

    Did Utah make the NIT?

  • motorbike Cottonwood Heights, UT
    March 17, 2014 1:21 p.m.


    "They picked Team C (BYU) then backtracked when they saw who it was."

    Which really just tells us that basing the seeding process so heavily on RPI is jacked up. If you look at any of the other rating systems, which all take more data into account, you'd get a better picture of what teams truly belong. And before Coug fans jump down my throat, the other rating systems may very well have still been positive for BYU.

    Bottom line though, it's easy to see that RPI rewards teams far too much for simply playing (not winning) against tough out of conference opponents.

    Congrats to BYU though, they did what the NCAA system wanted them to do. And until that changes, they should keep doing the same thing, win or lose.

  • Cougarista Salt Lake City, UT
    March 17, 2014 12:50 p.m.

    Dear Digger,

    You embarrassed yourself. An analyst is not supposed to be a cheer leader for or against any team. Stick to the facts and just forget 5 sends left and Danny Ainge with the ball.

  • yarrlydarb Ogden, UT
    March 17, 2014 12:42 p.m.

    Ltrain, you're absolutely right when you say "Phelps is a joke and makes watching the ESPN show almost unwatchable."

    The thing that bothers me most about these so-called experts is that they are self-appointed and they get paid for spouting their opinions and stirring up controversy.

    Remember Bryant Gumbel and his Bo-dittly-tech comment after which the Cougars won the National Championship? Quite ironically, BYU handily took care of Bo Schembechler's U. of Michigan team, the true Bo's Dittly-tech.

    You're right; these know-it-alls are not worth listen to or watching.

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    March 17, 2014 12:30 p.m.


    Can't agree with your assessment of Collinsworth. He'll be missed, big time.

    This BYU team is young and scrappy. Maybe they'll surprise us.

  • The Rock Federal Way, WA
    March 17, 2014 11:43 a.m.

    The Cougs nearly knocked off Oregon at Oregon. Playing on a neutral floor will help even the odds.
    Losing KC hurts, but there is enough talent remaining to pull it off, but only if their 3's are dropping. If they play up to their potential, or anywhere close to it, they should win.

  • Mark321 Las Vegas, NV
    March 17, 2014 10:57 a.m.

    The eye test is usually the bias test. It shows when they showed the numbers but disguised the teams. They picked Team C (BYU) then backtracked when they saw who it was.

  • DEW Cougars Sandy, UT
    March 17, 2014 10:48 a.m.

    @3grandslams - believe me, Digger has been seeing those replays on Danny Ainge over and over for so many years. It would be cool if Digger took a job at the hill and seeing another Rick M. look a like in loosing his cool.

  • Henry Drummond San Jose, CA
    March 17, 2014 10:41 a.m.

    I think this is a great compliment to Dave Rose. He's built a good program and done it the right way. Glad to see his team get some props.

  • Clark W. Griswold Sandy, Utah
    March 17, 2014 10:17 a.m.

    BYU will continue their tradition of being one and done. Oregon should have no trouble winning this game.

  • Picardy Provo, UT
    March 17, 2014 10:06 a.m.

    Coach Rose is a class act with recruiting disadvantages that continues to put a great team on the floor year after year. What he has done at BYU is nothing short of miraculous. I love the guy!

  • souptwins Lindon, UT
    March 17, 2014 10:01 a.m.

    Exactly what is the "eye test?" Should we stand back 10 feet and cover one eye? Seriously--- The "eye test" is nothing more than condescending subjective people looking for a big name from a power conference. Get over it, Digger! You look the fool on this one. Even among the other #10 teams, BYU's at the top with #33 RPI & #17 SOS. The schedulers who had BYU pick up those tough OOC games really deserve the praise for this bid.
    As far as Ore goes, I think BYU will lose but that doesn't take anything away from deserving the bid. Playing without KC impacts our future prospects but doesn't negate the past accomplishments. I'm hoping to be proven wrong but it will take everyone stepping up to take a piece of what KC brought with his versatility and well-rounded game. Go Coug's!!

  • Ltrain St. George, UT
    March 17, 2014 9:42 a.m.

    These national guys are nothing but a walking talking bias. Phelps is a joke and makes watching the ESPN show almost unwatchable. As for J. williams I think i'd take a road victory at Stanford over a victory over UMass. I think that BYU will be ok without Collinsworth. He's the least important member of the 5 main guys. They would be in a world of trouble w/o one of the bigs, and Haws is by far the best player for them. Even Carlino is more important because he's the wild card in games against the "big boys." If he plays well they have a chance, if he doesn't it doesn't matter if Collinsworth is there or not. Besides, this way we don't have to endure the world's worst perpetual haircut.

  • BYU9293 Clinton, UT
    March 17, 2014 9:16 a.m.

    Congrats to the cougars, they deserve to be there. Also, Oregon is an up and down team and we should have won the game at their place earlier, blew a late lead and lost in OT. Even without Collinsworth, I think we have a chance. The key will be Carlino, can he play within himself and play smart? I am happy for the team. If Collinsworth were healthy I think BYU would be picked by most to win the game with Oregon. Oregon is not a good road team this year and they won't be at home now.

  • Ed Grady Idaho Falls, ID
    March 17, 2014 9:14 a.m.

    Digger Phelps? Please......

  • Snark Provo, UT
    March 17, 2014 8:43 a.m.


    No chance against Oregon? Did you watch the first matchup?

  • AzTim Gilbert, AZ
    March 17, 2014 8:24 a.m.

    Is there anything more silly than the "eye test"? When the real test - win/loss record, SOS,RPI, and etc - causes Digger to disagree with Digger he reverts to this silly eye test which is nothing more than a beauty pageant demonstrating nothing more than a personal bias. There is a reason the eye test is not part of the selection process,'s too subjective! Is the blond more beautiful than the brunette? Who's to say? The eye test is just not a reliable tool and it allows for too much bias. Give it a rest Digger.

  • Missouri Coug Greenwood, MO
    March 17, 2014 8:16 a.m.

    Free Throws Will Win The Game......

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    March 17, 2014 8:07 a.m.

    Many teams going to the dance, are not as good as some not going.

  • Frozen Chosen Savage, MN
    March 17, 2014 6:47 a.m.

    This starts to make up for all the times BYU got jobbed on their seeding in the tourney.

  • CougarColby Fort Benning, GA
    March 17, 2014 5:59 a.m.

    Congrats to the Cougs, but we did get lucky on this one. Yes, BYU does deserve to be tournament bound, the experts agree and one of them even picked us as a 10 seed prior to the show (check Greg Wrubell's tweet). The RPI, SOS and wins vs. top 100 don't lie as the broadcasters noted. The selection committee doesn't use the "eye test" much since it is not a measurable (quantifiable) stat, so sorry FSU.

    While EastCoastCoug isn't a fan of Rose, I absolutely am. All the guy does is win, win, win with a below average squad year in and year out. The best player he has ever had hardly gets playing time in the NBA (I still love you Jimmer!). So for him to make the NCAA tournament nearly every year is a huge accomplishment coming from Provo. I love our players, but here is a reason they weren't recruited to Kansas, Duke, North Carolina, etc. etc. etc.

    Rose overachieves every year. He does more, with less.

  • Down under Salt Lake City, UT
    March 17, 2014 1:08 a.m.

    Digger should come to the hill in SLC, the crow has landed and there is plenty to go around.

  • AZguy Phoenix, AZ
    March 16, 2014 11:23 p.m.

    interesting article and video. Thrilled BYU is in a 10 position in a winnable game. Not sure how winnable without KC, but winnable.

    Apparently, the selection committee rewarded BYU for their strength of schedule and OOC schedule, but I don't disagree with either commentator. On the eye test, I too would take FSU and Pitt over BYU. But the numbers don't lie.

    I also think they missed giving BYU credit for a 2 point loss to Iowa State, since they mentioned FSU's close loss to Florida.

  • moderateinmagna MAGNA, UT
    March 16, 2014 11:10 p.m.

    digger phelps is still ticked off about his notre dame getting beat by danny ainge in the ncaa tournament in the 80,s he is a sore loser and it shows better rpi and sos than the other 2 teams makes them the better team regardless of what the no count analysts from espn or cbs or any of them

  • oldtimeftballer Salt Lake City, UT
    March 16, 2014 10:56 p.m.

    Congrats to the Utah schools....and my Cougs


    All the smack talk is a joke. BYU fan here, but let's win something before we spout off at the U. We haven't won a league title or conference title. We haven't won anything in a long LONG LONG time! And we may win one game if we are lucky so stop like we are a powerhouse. And remember Utah beat us by talk smack on them when they beat us head to head is dumb people! Guess you have short memories.

    And Utah enough. Much improved and a young team with a promising future...but like football you are learning the PAC is tough and you haven't done squat. So Coach K is great but fans get a reality check and lets hope Weber State comes closer than u did vs Arizona

  • Unbelievable West Jordan, Utah
    March 16, 2014 10:41 p.m.

    Digger really looked quite foolish back peddling the way he did. He's got the memory of an Elephant, and is still dancing on table tops whenever BYU's name is mentioned.

    Digger, why so bitter?

    Rise and shout!!!

  • 3grandslams Iowa City, IA
    March 16, 2014 9:11 p.m.

    Nothing like egg all over your face on national TV. I wonder if a Digger still remembers Danny Ainge?

  • carman Wasatch Front, UT
    March 16, 2014 9:09 p.m.

    Strength of schedule matters for seeding in the big dance...

    Once again this proved to be true.

  • eastcoastcoug Danbury, CT
    March 16, 2014 9:04 p.m.

    I love BYU, but they don't deserve to be in the NCAA's this year. Not over Pitt and FSU. They don't stand a chance against Oregon with Collinsworth out (or with him for that matter).

    I'm not a Coach Rose fan. I don't think he's done anything worthy of praise in the postseason.

  • labman Pocatello, ID
    March 16, 2014 8:27 p.m.

    digger is no friend of BYU, never has been, never will be. the test shows his bias! of course we are a weaker team without Collinsworth, but it was still fun to read of "foot in mouth" disease by some of the broadcasters. Every game is a challenge in the tourney and Rose has his hands full defending Oregon with one less player, he is now down to 7 contributors who will need to run the whole game against Oregon. go cougs, run and not faint, you will need to shoot the light out to win, but oh what a victory it will be if they can pull it off. 50% of the teams will lose, so I like the odds right now. Go cougs, you have earned it regardless of what Digger thinks or says.

  • Nate in the 808 orem, ut
    March 16, 2014 8:18 p.m.

    Good for BYU. Just shows that the experts who make the field have a lot more respect than some local types who are out of touch with reality in their red goggles.