High school football: 4A all-state teams

Return To Article
Add a comment
  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 24, 2013 2:37 p.m.

    UCAggie, As a final thought and question to you (and any voting member of the media or coaching staff). Please reflect on this one simple question.
    Which of these two athletes deserves to get First Team All State?

    Athlete A or Athlete B?

    Athlete A catches 17 Touchdowns.
    Athlete A is the only receiver statewide to be inducted in to the record book that year.
    Athlete A leads his team to a winning record of 8-4.
    Athlete A averages 18.24 yards per catch.
    Athlete A scores a touchdown on every 4.8 catches.

    Athlete B catches 17 Touchdowns.
    Athlete B is the only receiver statewide to be inducted in to the record book that year.
    Athlete B leads his team to a winning record of 8-4.
    Athlete B averages 18.45 yards per catch.
    Athlete B scores a touchdown on every 2.9 catches.

    So UCAggie. Which one of these two deserves first team all state honors?
    Similar stats, same record and against almost identical opponents. Who's your man now?
    The answer is simple. Both!!
    For those who voted for Gray last year and NOT Gustin this year....you should be ashamed of yourself! There is NO logical excuse for your inconsistency and bias in voting. None!

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 24, 2013 2:14 p.m.

    Sure. I will answer that Question. But first, check my profile....they are not "my boys".
    The Elite 11 is almost as big of a joke as the All-State voting. Allow me demonstrate how ridiculous the Elite 11 selection process really is. Please remember that Utah valley contains half of the total 4A athletes (region 7 and 8) in the state.
    Provo Heralds Elite 11 Defensive MVP (Leslie) did not even make the Deseret News Honorable Mention list. Their two Elite 11 QB selections (Camp and Money) did not make the Deseret News Honorable mention list either. Nor did I see Elite 11 receiver Trinnaman on the Deseret News Honorable mention list. How stupid is that? An Elite 11 athlete in one paper and not even honorable mention in the other Utah Valley paper. What's next...The LDS.Org Top Ten most Spiritual players? Enough with the inconsistent selections and lists. It just proves how flawed the system really is.
    There is only one real and consistent list that matters. It is not biased, prejudiced, political, corrupt, opinionated nor based on coaches preferences. It is the Utah State Record Book. Only one of more than 400 Utah receivers will get there this year. Guess which one?

  • UCAggie OREM, UT
    Dec. 23, 2013 7:03 p.m.

    I was just looking for your comments on PG being Elite 11 and not GG. Congrats to all the recipients for their accomplishments and hard work. Back to your original post of GG not being 1T All State. Now 0-2 or 0-3 if you include DH Elite. As I mention there are always going to be those that question the selections and you are just going to have to accept being in the minority on this one. Again congrats to both your boys on a great season. And Go Broncos!!

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 23, 2013 2:53 p.m.

    UCAggie. As a side note, The Elite 11 is NOT voted on by the coaches and obviously focuses on athletes that play both ways as opposed to production and records. Gray was the only receiver specialist that made the list (and rightfully deserved it). He was the biggest threat Salem faced (Besides Jason Money) and a legitimate D1 athlete. He was also moved to defense in ONE game to help contain ONE opponent. Can you guess who that was?
    As for the others, you can combine any two of those receivers touchdown stats and still not equal that of Salem's top receiver. Speaking of Salem receivers, they have Zobell under the RB category. Can you please explain that one?
    I also agree with you that Higginson should have been the coach of the year leading his team to a school record 8 wins and first playoff victory in Salem High history. However, Chambers (Spanish Fork) is by far the most intelligent coach that I observed in action this year. He clearly used his NFL experience to create a separate defense to contain Salem's offense. He is obviously a fan of the movie "Money Ball" and using real statistics to win.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 23, 2013 2:05 p.m.

    UCAggie, I understand your animosity and frustration seeing that Orem had two Elite 11 selections on offense, yet finished with a losing record (5-6) and then lost to Salem twice. Juab (who went 8-4) would have contended in your region. Gray's best game (3 TD's) was against Mtn.View (1-9). Your point is? Didn't a 3AA team beat you by 28 points? Anyhow, I appreciate your stats since they further prove my point. Find a comparable receiver in Utah, or 10 surrounding states who led all divisions in TD's, scored on every 2.9 touches and averaged 18.4 yards per carry. Try it! Anyone close to those stats was first team in their state. Guaranteed!
    Gray, ( a legit selection for both all state and elite 11 ) deserved first team and the record book last year on the same amount of touchdowns yet less yards per catch. He also needed 33 more receptions to get there. If you believe he deserved it then (like I do) how do you not justify Gustin doing the same with much less this year? You have no argument! No category is more important than TD's! What was Manning honored for yesterday? Most yards? Most completions? Most attempts? Think about it.

  • UCAggie OREM, UT
    Dec. 21, 2013 12:41 p.m.

    I see your boys were named to the DH Elite 11 and All Valley teams. Interested to hear your comments on PG being Elite and GG All Valley? I guess the locals aren't seeing eye to eye with you on the 17 TD's argument either.

  • UCAggie OREM, UT
    Dec. 20, 2013 3:51 p.m.

    Here is the breakdown:
    GP Rec RecPG YDS YPG YPC TD TDPG 100gm
    TC 12 91 7.6 1223 101.9 13.4 15 1.3 5
    NG 11 73 6.6 1126 102.4 15.4 14 1.3 6
    GG 12 49 4.1 904 75.3 18.4 17 1.4 3
    ZZ 12 57 4.8 1052 87.7 18.5 8 .67 5

    If I am a voting coach and I look at these...still a "No Brainer". You mention the QB's of the 1 teamers. GG's brother was the QB early on when GG caught the majority of his TD's. 3 against Juab who is 2 classifications below SH?? Having my Brother as the QB certainly doesnt hurt. You and I both know preseason predictions mean nothing. There are always going to be those who feel slighted or overlooked and question the process. The process will not change because there is not a better one. Give credit where credit is due. GG gets his credit in the all time record books. DNews got it right. If I am voting on coach of the year though, Higginson gets my vote. He was outstanding. Good luck next year.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Dec. 19, 2013 4:33 p.m.

    Sorry, Orem is now in Region 7 but the argument for Gray remains...

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Dec. 19, 2013 4:32 p.m.

    My only complaint is the coaches and media should dig a bit deeper. I think there are many great players on less than stellar teams that deserve a bit more recognition.

    For example, I would say Nolan Gray was the best receiver in Region 8 and should be a first team all-stater. I haven't perused the list but that's where he should be.

  • Hawaii football fan Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 19, 2013 1:03 p.m.

    Thanks for the conclusion Baller. Let me restate: Both of your guys were a threat. However, one of them was a flat out "Baller"... and a BIGGER threat. If all-state were based purely on stats then my 2nd team guy would have made 1st team. Word of mouth in Utah goes a long way. Sometimes that's a good thing, sometimes not. However, we do agree that each of us had a selection that was overlooked. And it doesn't end there. I know of at least two LB's that weren't even HM!... despite the fact that one had more tackles than 10 of the twelve selections (1st, 2nd, HM). And the other had more tackles than 7 of the 12. Perhaps DN will "revamp" the system next year.
    On the bright side, I think your Region (8) returns some of the top QB talent in the state next year: Hall (MM), Covey (TV), Money (SF), and Iongi (Provo) are studs! No offense there, right?

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 19, 2013 11:30 a.m.

    I will conclude with these final thoughts and facts. My original point was to demonstrate how politics and player bias have jeopardized the integrity of the All-State selection process. Hawaii football fan (and current football coach) has confirmed all of my suspicions. Only one receiver in the state of Utah and the surrounding states of Oregon, Washington, Wyoming, Idaho and even Hawaii produced 17 or more touchdowns this year. Only one football player in 15 surrounding states scored every third time he touched the ball. And yet a coach will actually claim he is undeserving and "not a threat".
    Gray, a legitimate all-state selection scored 17 TD's last year on 83 receptions and averaged 18.24 yards per catch. Gustin produced 17 TD's this year on just 50 receptions and averaged 18.48 yards per catch on a team so "untalented" that it was predicted to finish last in their region by the media and coaches. The record book will recognize both Gray and Gustin for their amazing accomplishments of 17 TD's in one season. However the coaches and media will reward just one of them. I am greatly disappointed in any voting coach or member of the media that failed to demonstrate consistency.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 18, 2013 2:49 p.m.

    Hawaii fan...once again, where's the facts to support YOUR opinion?.....and isn't claiming to be a fan of the Rainbow Warriors embarrassing enough? I did hear that the reason they changed the original spelling from Havaii to Hawaii is so that they would be guaranteed at least one W. Norm Chows defense and the sands of Wakiki are similar. Very Porous.
    You may be a coach but obviously not a defensive coordinator or an offensive specialist. One receiver (state wide) was entered in the record books this year (and only six during this century) and yet you claim he was not a threat. Again, I would stick to coaching special teams if I were you. Zobell is great but never once faced a double team this year. Eight of Salem's opponents saved that for the "none threat"...Gustin. Ask Spanish Fork why they changed their whole defense to bracket one player. After getting beat the first time by Salem, Orem moved Gray to the defensive side of the ball to help contain Gustin who still caught 155 yards and a touchdown in Salem's first ever playoff win. That was a BIG GAME! Stick to coaching kickers.

  • Hawaii football fan Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 18, 2013 12:50 p.m.

    Baller: You know what opinions are like, right? Your guy had a great season and was recognized... move on. Trust me, I have a bigger beef with an entirely separate position where a players 2nd team selection (and supporting stats) are twice that of the guy who made 1st team. Perhaps even a less deserving teammate at a different position made 1st team... just sayin.' The reality is coaches felt Z was the bigger threat. Once again, don't lower yourself and berate a teammate. Appreciate the recognition and move on. Suggestion for the future: taste the carpet at RES, improve strength of schedule, perform in big games, and become the all-around receiver... not just a jump ball wonder. I'm anxiously awaiting more Rainbow Warrior insults.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 18, 2013 11:48 a.m.

    UCAggie continued. Now lets talk team impact. What impact did the athlete have on their teams success? For example, Compton had the number one rated QB in the state (128 rating) and future D-1 prospect (like his brothers). Logan also had an experienced line with at least one all state selection (Rice) and predicted to win their region and advance to the quarter finals. Sounds like a nice environment to work in and succeed.
    Miller had the second rated 4A quarterback at the helm with two all state players in the backfield (Godderidge and Anderson) not to mention White on the O line. Defenses could not focus solely on Miller with such a potent backfield.
    Orem had the third best QB (Camp)in the 4A division. If defenses focused on Gray then Overly (at 6'6") could kill you on the opposite side. Orem was also predicted to win its region.
    Salem had a back up QB with a rating of 68 (almost half of Nelsons), predicted to finish last and having never won a playoff game. Defenses (including yours at Orem) restructured their whole game plan around stopping one receiver. Double teamed nearly every game yet produced more with much less.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 18, 2013 10:56 a.m.

    It is obvious that most people (and some coaches)do not comprehend the proper way to evaluate an athlete. The actual formula utilized today (besides height, weight and physical abilities like 40 speed and vertical) are the following three key areas. Productivity, Activity and Team Impact.
    Most still favor the Productivity Factor (PF). Can he score touchdowns?
    First there is no excuse for a player who catches 17 touchdowns to NOT receive all state honors. Period! In fact it has never happened until this year. Someone try to justify that with facts. I dare you. If it was easy, more than 12 athletes in the history of Utah Football would have done it! Again, no excuse!
    UCAggie: you are telling me that because Miller averaged 3.1 more receiving yards per game than Gustin yet averaged less yards per catch and then produced 13.3% fewer touchdowns....that he is your man? Really? You are telling me that Compton who averaged 3 yards less per catch (15.43 to 18.32)and also produced 13.3% fewer touchdowns is also your man? Or Zobell that had only 140 more total yards receiving for the season but yet produced 112% fewer touchdowns is also your choice? Really!?

  • UCAggie OREM, UT
    Dec. 18, 2013 12:46 a.m.

    Baller - Not sure how you can base your opinion on TD's alone. Gus is an excellent player and had a great season, but I am with Hawaii on this Compton, Gray and Miller were no brainers and yes the stats speak for themselves and that includes Tot yards, Tot catches, yards per catch, yards per game and TD's. And for me, I take a receiver with 12 catches 150 yards and no TD's in a game vs 5 catches for 35 yards and 3 TD's any day.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 1:42 p.m.

    Let me try to understand your logic. You would actually consider a kid that catches 10 balls for 100 yards and no Touchdowns more valuable than a kid who catches four balls for 75 yards and two Touchdowns? Really? And yet you claim to be an informed football fan? You have just lost all credibility. :) The state is full of receivers that can rack up yards on hitch routes but scoring is a true skill. As Hawaii would confirm....you need to score in order to win. The team with the most points (not yards) is the victor. All I am saying is that Compton struggled big time in post season without Chase (all state QB) at the helm and only scored once in the last three games combined. He is a great receiver but I would personally expect more from my First Team All-State selection. But hey, congrats to him for a fabulous season. Logan was a great team.

  • Hawaii football fan Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 11:34 a.m.

    Interesting Baller... the stats speak for themselves. Each receiver you're bashing had more receptions and more yards than your guy. Coaches (we) felt these guys were a threat inside AND outside the red zone. Coaches votes indicated such. As far as strength of schedule? You're kidding, right? You warmed up with Hillcrest, Payson, and Juab. Cough, cough. Much Mahalo to you as well. I'm really from Emmett, ID... but love Hawaii:)

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 9:24 a.m.

    Hawaii football fan continued....
    As a side note, all teams play a handful of softer opponents.
    Logan beat Bonneville (1 win), Ogden (2 wins), Mtn Crest (2 wins) and Hurricane (2 wins).
    Sky View beat Bonneville (1 win), Provo (1 win), Mtn Crest (2 wins) and Ogden (2 wins).
    I'm not sure that I would be bragging about their strength of schedule if I were you.
    Please do your research prior to commenting and include facts to substantiate your arguments.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 17, 2013 9:11 a.m.

    Aloha Hawaii Football Fan. I always thought a "bottom feeder" was a team that lost more than 10 games in one season. Hawaii was the only D-1 team in America to lose 11 games this year. Time to consider D-II and a more suitable conference like the GNAC.
    Utah All State selections should be based on statistical data and productivity like every other state in the country.
    All the receivers selected were excellent but here is the obvious difference.
    Compton needed 91 catches to reach 15 touchdowns. (6 catches per TD).
    Grey needed 73 receptions to obtain 14 touchdowns. ( 5.2 catches per TD).
    Zobell needed 57 receptions to reach 8 touchdowns. (7.1 catches per TD).
    Miller needed 51 receptions to gain 15 touchdowns. (3.4 catches per TD).
    Gustin needed just 50 receptions to lead all classifications with 17 touchdowns.
    (2.9 catches per TD). Who is clearly more productive? Especially considering that Compton and Miller both had all state quarterbacks on their team.
    Gustin will join a list of 12 athletes in Utah State football history to catch 17 or more TD's in one season but he can't make first or second team? Go Figure. Politics?
    Compton, Miller and Zobell will not make that list.

  • Hawaii football fan Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 16, 2013 3:39 p.m.

    Oh no, Baller, not again! Your HM guy had FANTASTIC games... against bottom feeders. He struggled against WX, SF, SPV, and TV. DN had 3 no-brainer picks in Gray, Compton, and Miller. These guys are STUDS! As a Salem fan you should take pride in that they got it right in picking the correct Salem receiver for 2nd team. "Z" fires off the ball, has speed, and makes an effort to block. "G" can learn a thing or two. Great size... and well... great size. Coaches recognized this in pre-game film and made adjustments. HM is a great honor... you lower yourself by not recognizing one of your receivers that truly stood out.

  • The Baller Salem, UT
    Dec. 16, 2013 9:25 a.m.

    I bet Salem will volunteer to fill that opening with WX. I would love to see a rematch of those two teams. Speaking of no love.....Salem has a the only receiver in Utah State history to catch 17 or more touchdowns in one season (something no other receiver in the state accomplished this year)and NOT get first team honors. In fact, he did not even get second team honors. How does a voting coach or media member justify that? Honorable mention on this list but good enough to be one of a handful of receivers ever to be entered in to the UHSAA record book? Really? Not to mention doing it with the back up QB on a team that went 3-7 last year and was expected to finish dead last in their region. Oh, and they beat Orem twice this year on their way to the second round of playoffs.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    Dec. 15, 2013 6:44 p.m.

    I saw both WX and Sky View play Timvpiew. Sky View was the better team.

  • Tenn12 Orem, UT
    Dec. 12, 2013 8:45 p.m.

    Considering Woods Cross' preseason schedule consisted of Maple Mountain, Judge Memorial, and Viewmont, I think maybe you should be asking yourself whether you'd dare play Orem and Sky View during the preseason because that was one weak preseason. Sky View would have given Woods Cross A LOT of trouble had they played. Woods Cross is very basic on defense and relies on being physically superior to other teams they face which more often than not, they were physically superior this season. Sky View's offensive attack is very wide open with a great quarterback similar to a Covey which gave WX fits. There is no way Woods Cross would be able to stop them. They key would've been if Sky View's defense played well. Besides East, Timpview, and Logan, Sky View was the most impressive team I saw in 4a last season. Seriously though and perhaps this is contradictory to my first post, I believe Woods Cross had some great athletes and was as talented as almost any other team in 4a this season. I just get frustrated when region 6 gets so much love and talks so much without earning it through results on the field.

  • Uteswin! Bountiful, UT
    Dec. 12, 2013 1:33 p.m.

    To Tenn12-

    WX has an opening in the preseason schedule next season....Does Orem or Skyview want to schedule WX? I am sure WX would love to put an end to YOUR speculation....Timpview should have had several off lineman on 1st team....they were good players...don't be a hater against the kids that were voted in....Or a Region 6 team that only lost to the two teams that played for the State Championship this season.

  • Tenn12 Orem, UT
    Dec. 11, 2013 10:22 p.m.

    Mr. Edwards, what coaches voted on this? Was it only the coaches from region 6 (the salt lake region)? How does East get 6 kids plus Mr. Football so 7 total and Timpview, the actual champs but not the media champs, gets only 3 plus the 4a mvp? Not one of Timpview's offensive lineman is good enough for even the second team? Doesn't seem too credible. I thought Sky View was a better team than Woods Cross personally. I think they are deserving of more consideration than Woods Cross. Sad truth is they would have received more attention if they were in region 6. Oh well, one thing the region 6 coaches did get right is Nolan Gray of Orem as a first team receiver. I believe he was the best receiver in the entire state this year and possibly even last year as a junior.

  • Jhpeterson Woods Cross Davis county, UT
    Dec. 11, 2013 4:52 p.m.

    I am happy Nick was picked but he is 6'2 230 pounds you have his weight and height wrong

  • BridgerK American Fork, UT
    Dec. 11, 2013 12:28 p.m.

    James Fox from Olympus should have been first team .....No offense against the Jr. from Woods Cross but James had double the tackles and was also in the semi-finals. Averaged 11 tackles a game.

    But.....fair enough.