Crowded classrooms greet Utah students returning to school

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  • RickH Blaine, WA
    Sept. 3, 2013 7:43 a.m.

    Interesting that schools do not have enough money to deal with class size but can put 3.2 million into a new sports facility. May I suggest that it is a matter of priorities?

  • nanato12 Spanish Fork, UT
    Sept. 2, 2013 4:27 p.m.


    Teachers are not under-worked. They put in their own time (and money!!!) to make the students' experience a good one. They take classes in the summer to keep up their education or work a second job because they can't afford to live on their salary (especially the men teachers). Teaching is not babysitting!!! Unfortunately too many parents treat it that way. They don't care what goes on in the classroom as long as their kids are not under their feet. Why don't you volunteer to take over a teacher's class sometime and see how much they actually do?
    I'm pretty sure that 100% of state income tax does not go to education-don't know where you got that crazy idea!
    Teachers are doing their job and it's hard. If parents and other people in the community would volunteer in the classroom teachers' lives would be a little easier.

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    Aug. 31, 2013 1:49 a.m.

    Josey Wales does ask some critical questions. But we can actually raise taxes on corporations as many communities have agreements where many businesses go tax free.

    We could also legalize gambling and have a lottery.

    We can end tax deductions for large families who are taxing the system.

    These are some possible solutions...

    Aug. 29, 2013 3:19 p.m.

    @Moabmom, I'd sure like to know where these so called "perks" are that you promoted in your comments. I'm married to a school teacher of over 20 years, and I have yet to see any perks given to her; just higher and higher class sizes, fewer money available for class resources (which ends up coming out of our pockets), with very little pay increase.

    Also, I'm not sure how you can compare a school teacher to a sunday school teacher or church calling. Church callings are just that, voluntary. Everyone knows no money is involved in that. Teaching school is a profession, and should be paid for their skills and abilities, just like any other profession. A teacher is making less and less each year, which is why the quality of teachers is going down. No one wants to be a teacher when they start out at only $30,000 a year, with very little room for increases or pay advancements.

  • YouAreKidding Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 29, 2013 1:31 p.m.

    I'm as fiscally conservative as they come. But, I am so sick of parents in this state whining and complaining about how much they pay in taxes for the schools. Go read your property tax bill guys. I live in the Granite School District and only $700 of my annual property taxes go to fund education. ONLY $700. I would happily pay triple that amount if I could count on the quality of the education increasing with the quantity of my contribution. Unfortunately, Common Core, the USOE, the UEA, and the Granite School District are doing everything they can to kill the public education system in Utah. Thank heaven there are charter schools!

  • JMHO Southern, UT
    Aug. 29, 2013 11:53 a.m.

    I wouldn't want to be in Moabmom's sunday school class. She gives homework.

  • Moabmom Moab, UT
    Aug. 29, 2013 11:36 a.m.

    Same old tired quantity equates to quality argument that doesn't hold water when the test scores come in. Teachers today are more spoiled than the kids. Funny you never hear a Sunday school teacher or a bishop/ pastor complain that their class size is too large or their congregation is too large. I guess it depends on what motivates a person to teach. Since the creation of the DOE by the Fed gov't in the 70's, and the formation of teachers unions, the quality of education has gone straight down hill. What used to be a 'calling' is now just another job with great perks. Glad I got through school before they ruined them. All my classes, both private and public school, averaged around 30 students per class and nobody whined about it. Didn't have aids or 'para' educators and teacher work days either. Kids weren't pushed to the next grade till required skills were accomplished. The ability to adequately discipline students and the fear of retaliation for discipline by both parents and schools is a big part of the problem. Schools have basically evolved into giant day care centers with little or no academic value.

  • joseywales Park City, UT
    Aug. 29, 2013 11:27 a.m.

    So, why is it a concern for high school classes to have 40 kids, yet we encourage our kids to go to college/universities where classes can be in the hundreds? I'm sure it isn't easy to have large classes, but we can't build schools without raising taxes, and most of us can't afford to have our taxes raised. So, what's the answer?

  • Roger Terry Happy Valley, UT
    Aug. 29, 2013 8:13 a.m.

    Ironically, the graphic accompanying this story is a good example of what is lacking in our educational system. The graphic purportedly presents "pupil-to-teacher ratios" for the top and bottom states in terms of class size. But the ratio for Utah, 21:9 (2.33 pupils per teacher), which is supposedly the second largest class size in the country, is almost identical to Vermont's 9:4 ratio (2.25 pupils per teacher), which is supposedly the best in the nation. The national average, by the way, is 16:0 (an undefined number). Obviously, the numbers should have a decimal point rather than a colon. They are not ratios. They are simply numbers representing how many students there are per teacher. So Utah's number is apparently 21.9, while Vermont's is 9.4. The national average is 16.0. Yes, our schools do need to do a better job at teaching basic math.

  • Howard Beal Provo, UT
    Aug. 28, 2013 11:32 p.m.

    A good share of the teachers at our local high schools have over 40 students. Some approaching 45 range. Way too many...

  • shark Buena Vista, VA
    Aug. 28, 2013 8:11 p.m.

    Could the real problem be overpopulation? Maybe too many folks on the Wasatch Front don't think they can possibly move to less populated areas. Maybe it is too hard for them to leave Zion, or what they think is Zion. Broaden your horizons, folks!

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Aug. 28, 2013 7:55 p.m.

    Some ideas:

    * two/three teachers share an aid
    * downsize sports. One football field serving three schools.
    * for a tax deduction. Have some businesses donate to school activities.
    * encourage parent volunteers.

  • toosmartforyou Farmington, UT
    Aug. 28, 2013 5:43 p.m.

    Teachers are not over-paid; they are under-worked. We need teachers to have full-time work, 12 months of the year, like EVERYONE else in a profession.

    Give them 12 months of work, raise their pay by 25%, reduce their class sizes by 25%, and then NO MORE whining about class sizes, the "stress of teaching" etc. Make teaching a profession instead of baby-sitting and get on with educating students.

    These little darlings grow up to pay personal State Income Tax, 100% of which goes to fund education, HIGHER THAN ANY OTHER STATE in the country.

    As I heard at a Davis School District Taxation Hearing (where the taxes were going to be increased no matter what---no surprise there), "I love teaching your children, just no so many of them." Sorry class size goes with the job. So, DO your job.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Aug. 28, 2013 5:20 p.m.


    More students from parents who can't feed them.

    Paying for meals on top of everything else is costly.

    No wonder we have large classes.

    Perhaps parents could contribute to meals, and tuition since they have food stamps.