'Jesus stomping' incident raises freedom of conscience and speech issues for both sides of debate

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  • Rosieconundrum Utah, UT
    April 22, 2013 7:29 p.m.

    OK, this is totally unrelated to the discussion at hand, but would someone please inform that there is no apostrophe in "its," when speaking of "its author?" "It's" is a contraction for "It is." Whew. I feel better now. Good article, though, and good the the student for standing up for what he believed.

  • spring street SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    April 3, 2013 11:28 a.m.

    @christian 24-7
    So your counter evidance to a he said he said line of reasoning is an unsuporrrted claim of a consperecy cover up by the university?

  • Flashback Kearns, UT
    April 3, 2013 7:51 a.m.

    This is just plain a stupid thing to do. There are better ways to initiate a conversation about Jesus. Hey Silo, I have a hard time with the words as quoted by you that the student said as being threatening. "You'll be hearing from me" threatening? No.

    Just imagin what would have happened had the student folded the paper into an airplane and thrown it around the class.

  • silo Sandy, UT
    April 2, 2013 7:50 p.m.

    Christian 24/7

    Does Fox news count a reliable source to you? Is a statement from Rotela's attorney good enough for you?

    From the daily caller website:

    "Rotela’s attorney told Fox News that the professor, Deandre Poole may have felt threatened when Rotela said of the Jesus stomping, “Don’t do that again.” Rotela also reportedly said, “You’ll be hearing from me.”

    Both were considered threats and a violation of the student code of conduct. Should a college be allowed to enforce their code of conduct?

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    April 2, 2013 7:35 p.m.

    Christian 24-7
    Murray, UT

    Poole said blah blah blah. Of course he is going to cover his back!"

    The exact same thing could be said of the student. If he did threaten the professor and got asked to leave class, don't you think he would cover his back? The truth is, they're both asserting their story. Why are you so inclined to believe the student? Do you have a preconceived bias against professors? Does the fact that the student is LDS automatically make him more credible than someone of another Christian faith?

    Your comment seems all to eager to be offended. Just to review: the exercise was written by a Christian, it was part of the curriculum at a Catholic university for over 30 years without incident, the professor is Christian, and the student is Christian. Tell me again, who's persecuting the Christians here?

  • DanO Mission Viejo, CA
    April 2, 2013 6:51 p.m.

    Christian 24-7, Poole is also a devout Christian. So, now what?

  • Christian 24-7 Murray, UT
    April 2, 2013 4:56 p.m.

    Poole said blah blah blah. Of course he is going to cover his back!

    That is all you bring for evidence? He said/he said? Worthless!

    There are many other objective witnesses. Where are their statements? Suppressed, probably, so FAU won't suffer the embarrassment.

    Again, the student was reinstated and received an apology, for good reason.

    "Apologies are cheap..." For many people that is true. For many others, they are sincere and meaningful.

    If a person of a minority race tells us that something being said or done is offensive, society, in general, now listens and makes adjustments. But if a Christian, or worse yet a Mormon, tells us that something being said or done is offensive, he is told that it is all in his head and that he is being hostile. This case is a perfect example.

    Among the posters here, it sounds like there are those who are supportive of offending and discriminating against Christians.

    Martians, of any kind, are smart enough to know when they are being demeaned. Stones don't listen.

  • DanO Mission Viejo, CA
    April 2, 2013 3:57 p.m.

    Badgerbadger and others. I know you won't believe this, but the professor is also Christian. Put down your persecution complex. There is plenty of evidence coming out that shows the student was the aggressor. Again, DesNews isn't giving you all the facts. Search for "FAU "Jesus Stomp" Professor Physically Threatened by Student, Deandre Poole Says"

    " Poole said his church has been a major source of strength to him throughout the controversy.

    "They've been very supportive of me," he said. "They've been praying for me. They put me in the middle of a circle and the pastor anointed me with oil and placed his hands on me while they prayed for me. It's been part of my life since I was a child." "

  • Mukkake Salt Lake City, UT
    April 2, 2013 3:25 p.m.

    [I repeat the article, there was no evidence that the Rotela was threatening or abusive. Posters who suggest otherwise need to back that up with evidence.]

    The Deseret News comments have a 200 word limit per post, 4 post limit per article, and block hyperlinks to other websites. Luckily we all have internet access, or we wouldn't be posting here. Please search one of the many other sites that have reported on this issue, including Fox, CNN, and even Glenn Beck's own The Blaze and you'll see that the Deseret News' reporting left a lot to be desired on this issue.

    [The fact that FAU backed down and apologized suggests that Rotela behaved correctly, while the so called educated adults of the university did not.]

    Modern PR strategies usually involve issuing apologies quickly, so long as they don't create legal liability. Apologies are cheap and meaningless in a world with Twitter.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    April 2, 2013 3:24 p.m.


    Your son didn't stop going to church because he went to college, he stopped because that's what some people do. Some of you may remember the study, oft cited during the last presidential election by Rick Santorum, that 64% of kids who enter college active in their churches, leave without actively attending. This is very true. HOWEVER, the same study he is pointing to, showed that 76% of kids who don't attend college stop attending their church. Many do come back later in life, from both groups. In other words, sending your kids to college might give them a better chance of remaining active in their faith.

    So much for liberal indoctrination.

  • Badgerbadger Murray, UT
    April 2, 2013 2:09 p.m.


    I share your pain. There is definitely a class at a local University with a teacher who seeks to make atheists out of Mormons. That is his definition of successful teaching. He is not unique.

    I repeat the article, there was no evidence that the Rotela was threatening or abusive. Posters who suggest otherwise need to back that up with evidence. The fact that FAU backed down and apologized suggests that Rotela behaved correctly, while the so called educated adults of the university did not.

    For those with the sensitivity of a stone, I am sure that insults directed at Martians, are not offensive to you because you are a stone, not a Martian.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    April 2, 2013 12:22 p.m.

    It's sad how much misinformation is swirling around this story. Watching CNN last night, one commentator said "students in Florida were told to write down the name of Jesus, rip it up and stomp on it. If they refused, they would fail the class and be expelled from the University." In other words, she's outraged over something that never happened.

    Again, he wasn't kicked out of class for refusing to step on the paper, but for verbally threatening the teacher. That's a clear no-no. He was then asked to not go to class while the university investigated. I just don't see a miscarriage of justice.

    If you'll all please read the article again, this exercise was designed at a Catholic university, where it was used for three decades. The exercise isn't offensive, but the kid wanted to get offended. He is, of course, free to take offense and to express his feelings. He crossed a line when he threatened the teacher.

  • DanO Mission Viejo, CA
    April 2, 2013 10:56 a.m.

    Please search for "Florida ‘Stomp Jesus’ student challenges teacher to televised debate" for more information. This student threatened the teacher. Just because he's LDS doesn't mean he should get a free pass.

  • Mukkake Salt Lake City, UT
    April 2, 2013 10:55 a.m.



  • JanSan Pocatello, ID
    April 2, 2013 9:49 a.m.

    Thank you for your comment.
    As a divorced mother I returned to college and in some cases faced professors who seemed to relished dismantling a students Christian beliefs and values. I also had a son who when returning from serving an exceptional mission went to college and was there taught how to "critical think" his ways right out of the church. His professor must be overjoyed - but his mothers heart is broken. It sad to think that it is not spiritually safe to send out children out to get a higher education. I know that there will be mean spirited and overjoyed comments from this, so be it. I REPENT of ever sending my son to college!
    And your RIGHT!!! If this was all about getting a discussion going - then why wasn't his rejection to do the beginning of this discussion. Why was he evicted from the class? If he was overly upset why did not the know it all professor diffuse the situation before it got out of control?

  • JanSan Pocatello, ID
    April 2, 2013 9:21 a.m.

    Please show where you have learned that this professor is in hiding for his life. You seem to be the ONLY one who is aware of this fact. I am not criticizing you or not saying I do not believe you - but seeing that I do not know you or how honorable you are - please provide another witness to your claim. Thank you.

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    April 2, 2013 9:18 a.m.


    You have a valid point – but your facts do not support it: Many people who condemn phrases like "that's retarded" are the exact same people who condemn religious intolerance (i.e. Sarah Palin) and many of the people who use phrases like "that's so gay" are also religiously insensitive (14 year old boys)
    PC bullies are those who are clearly NOT interested in tolerance – but merely feign indignation for political purposes – such as those who were horrified at insults thrown at Sandra Fluke (whose behavior was legitimately deserving of criticism) while remaining silent regarding worse insults thrown at women who were non-compliant to feminist dogma. PC police are mocked because of their blatant hypocrisy, not for legitmate concern for tolerance.

    “Fear-mongering is evil, and produces evil”

    It is duly noted that you made that comment right after fear-mongering, devaluing the subject of the story and attempting to marginalize the DN and conservative media: May we extrapolate your degree of evilness from that?

  • Badgerbadger Murray, UT
    April 1, 2013 11:51 p.m.

    I am not sure it was an innocent activity at all. I had a teacher who bragged he flipped his students off every day. He pushed his glasses up with his middle finger, and got a thrill out of it.

    If this exercise was to open an discussion, why didn't the teacher pursue the discussion when the student expressed his feelings about the activity? Instead the student was evicted from the discussion, which is more of a discussion ender.

    It doesn't add up.

    And in case you haven't lived long enough to notice, civil society is a lot less civil than it was even 20 or 30 years ago.

  • Zona Zone Mesa, AZ
    April 1, 2013 10:46 p.m.

    Certainly, as a Communication professor, he must know that the message intended is not always the one received. But maybe the message received in this case is more important the lesson the professor intended to teach. For too long, an anti-Christian bias has been the "safe" bias in our society. They have been the group that it is politically correct to target. There's a reason why it was Jesus, and not Allah, and it's not because the professor is afraid of Islam, but because it's the one group that can be singled out in such a way and still have it be socially acceptable. I think it's time for us to learn that bias, even against a majority group, is still bias.

    April 1, 2013 10:03 p.m.

    Did any of you actually read the article? The point of the exercise was not to force anyone to actually step on anything the point is to get student thinking about and talking about the importance of symptoms. Having said that in today's world where religion has become such a sensative issue i(just read the comments above) it maybe necessary to alter this lession to something less touchy for people.

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    April 1, 2013 10:00 p.m.

    Tee hee hee! I bet that professor never thought in a million years a Christian would fight back! I love it!

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    April 1, 2013 10:03 p.m.

    @TJ, I thank you for the recommendation, but I do try to read my scriptures regularly. Your reference to Jesus throwing the money changers out of the temple is not relevant to the discussion of learning about mutual respect. However, yes, it was Christlike, because it was a willful action of the Savior. Jesus was always very firm with those who knew better; in your example, those who would attempt to profit from temple worship. For example: "when [Jesus] was accused of the chief priests and elders, he answered nothing." They had enough information to know that he was the Savior. Their questions were not sincere. Conversely, according to John's account, when Pilate questioned whether Jesus was the "King of the Jews," Jesus asked him if the question was his own, or information from others. Then, Jesus answers him, "To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice." The Savior looks on the heart.

  • Reasonable Man Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 9:21 p.m.

    Hypersensitivity is not the answer to civil society. The student in this case, and all students in a college classroom, however, are in an imbalance of power. It took genuine emotion for Ryan to rebel against the superior's instructions. He was reasonable enough. The professor is not guilty of a crime, just a mistake and he should be able to continue teaching, wiser for the incident that challenged his assumed unfettered discretion. He should be cautioned to respect the students' freedom to learn as well as his freedom to teach. Together they form academic freedom. Being in a superior position, it is the teacher who should, in Socrates' terms, be a philosopher seeking truth rather than a partisan advocating a point of view (and requiring compliance by students). Some choices of subject matter, reading assignments, and classroom exercises betray biases, prejudices, and axes to grind on the part of the teacher, bullying students, for fear of public mockery or bad grades, into politically correct responses rather than genuine inquiry and learning. Teachers should always respect the freedom to learn, and then they can argue for the necessity of the freedom to teach in appropriate ways.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    April 1, 2013 7:56 p.m.

    The exercise has merit if it is used to promote sensitivity towards people of other faiths. As evidenced by the comments above, most are offended by the thought of disrespect aimed at Deity they believe in. Then, they quickly turn on those of the Muslim faith, certain that "those" people would riot in the streets, if asked to desecrate their prophet. The problem with many on the Christian right is that they do not follow the Savior's admonition to love their brothers and sisters as they would themselves. American prejudice and disrespect towards other faiths is legendary, ongoing and frequently perpetrated by those who would claim to support the 1st Amendment. As LDS members, I would expect my brothers and sisters in the Church to support the right of others to "worship how where and what they may." Protecting that right begins with respect. Respect is best understood when it is extended before it is demanded.

  • MIMom Mt Pleasant, MI
    April 1, 2013 7:47 p.m.

    I appreciate OHBU's comments. It is sad to me that no matter what side of the coin one is on with any matter these days everyone becomes offended so easily. What happened to critical thinking and trying to gain a better understanding of why someone is presenting an exercise or a point of view or whatever it may be. It is amazing what happens when you step back and look at situations without instant offense. If I recall from my upbringing that being easily offended is not good either. Everyone barks that people are bashing Christianity when a good portion of those claiming to be Christian exhibit very little Christ like behavior in return. It leaves me scratching my head daily. I also find people are VERY quick to join someone's band wagon without knowing all the facts. If everyone were slow to anger and make an effort to understand the bigger picture there would be much less finger pointing and much more actual Christlike behavior.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 1, 2013 7:46 p.m.

    Actually i think the exercise could be very valuable and thought provoking. Prompting each person to test their own feelings and values can be defining and enlightening on an individual basis. Like the book's author said, there hasn't been a problem with the exercise for many years, if ever.

    My guess is this kid grew up in a household or environment where either he was taught Christians are persecuted or he experienced persecution and therefore was highly sensitized to the issue.

    Probably we will never know the whole truth of what actually happened.

    DN has many articles that religion is under attack and religious folks are being marginalized, as does conservative media.
    Fear-mongering is evil, and produces evil.

  • Fern RL LAYTON, UT
    April 1, 2013 7:36 p.m.

    From the news reports of this incident, it seems like the textbook intent of this exercise was to get the students talking, often about why they wouldn't stomp on the paper. Yet, it seems like it was the professor that saw a different, anti-communication intent and was going to force the stomping; and it was unclear why he couldn't handle communication in a communications class.

    To actually stomp on any name that represents a person held in esteem by any group of people, seems like an act that would automatically disqualify someone intending on becoming a diplomat.

    After much thought on the matter, it seems to me that the ideal name to use would be the name of the teacher, after respectfully asking if he would allow it.

  • Truthseeker SLO, CA
    April 1, 2013 7:20 p.m.

    "Poole told Inside Higher Ed he had used the exercise before without problems.

    But when he conducted the exercise about a month ago, one student expressed strong objection. Poole told the website that after class, the student came up to him, hit his balled fist into his other hand and said “he wanted to hit me,” the instructor said. The student didn’t hit him, but Poole said he was alarmed and notified campus security and filed a report on the student.

    Some media reports have mischaracterized that incident, Poole said, by reporting that Rotela was suspended because he refused to participate in the exercise. Most students in the class refused to participate, he said."
    (Sun Sentinel April 1,2013)

    Sounds like a "he said, she(he) said" story.

    Guess we have our own extremists if the insteuctor is getting death threats.


  • Billy Bob Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 6:03 p.m.

    If you follow the link in the article, you will find that the professor did indeed get a chance to tell his side of the story. He claims the student threatened him. I doubt that it was a serious threat, if a threat at all, but unless other students in the class come forward and give clarity to the story, we will never know.

    After reading both accounts, I think it is a terribly designed exercise and the professor was only guilty of doing what sadly many professors do - just following the lesson plan blindly without thinking of consequences. The professor also claims to be a deeply religious Christian. Although I can't see how a "deeply religious Christian" would follow such a lesson plan, I think I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

    We all make mistakes, and just because his mistake was quite offensive to most Christians doesn't necessarily mean he is a terrible person. I likely do not agree with the professor in many regards, but one of my beliefs as a Christian is that it is not my place to judge.

  • JSB Sugar City, ID
    April 1, 2013 5:58 p.m.

    Were there other students in Mr. Rotela's class that didn't step on the paper? Or was he the only one?

  • djk blue springs, MO
    April 1, 2013 5:03 p.m.

    if this had been a teacher whom uses what our Heavenly Father has blessed him with in his intelligence of teaching skills then he would never have done this. the teacher should be repremanded with tough restrictions but i personally feel the teacher should be fired with no references.
    NO ONE should of stomped on our Savior's name ! those people have no reverence or clue to what our Savior truly did for them.

  • Mukkake Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 4:59 p.m.

    [Can you imagine the controversy that would ensue if the professor had instructed his students to write the word "Mohammed" or "Allah" on the paper and stomp on it?!?! The entire middle east would be rioting in the streets and the oh so noble and enlightened professor would be going into hiding because of the price that would be put on his head.]

    Oh, you mean exactly what happened in this case? The professor is in hiding now, because of death threats.

  • Mukkake Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 5:01 p.m.

    As "silo" mentioned earlier, the student made statements that could easily be construed as threats. Also not mentioned in this article, is that the publicity surrounding this issue has resulted in death threats against the instructor, resulting in him being placed on paid leave for his safety (not as punishment).

    Seems like the kind of reaction many of these comments claim only comes from Muslims.

    [Conversely, Mr. Rotela, while understandably offended, should have merely refused to step on the paper with the name of Jesus, calmly explain why, and then drop the matter.]

    You mean perform the activity exactly as intended? Novel idea.

    [The silence coming from the halls of the ACLU with respect to this...is deafening.]

    And from the ACLJ, their right-wing counterpart. Probably because the University did everything right.

    Simple advice, don't make veiled threats against your instructor if you want to stay in the class/University.

  • Abinadis friend Boise, Idaho
    April 1, 2013 4:57 p.m.

    A school is not the place for this person to put on this demonstration. He can say what he wishes elsewhere but is
    not appropriate as a teacher in a school class.

  • Kalindra Salt Lake City, Utah
    April 1, 2013 4:39 p.m.

    Could someone please explain to me why those who oppose "that's so gay" or "that's retarded" or other such verbiage are considered the PC police but it is okay to be opposed to this exercise?

    I get the whole idea that Jesus is someone special - but aren't current living human beings special also? I mean, wasn't that the whole point of Jesus' teachings?

  • the truth Holladay, UT
    April 1, 2013 4:28 p.m.


    How about using the name "obama" or "karl marx"?

    There must be other "deep" symbols of the the left that could be used.

    If one must use the symbol "Jesus" then that says something about our country, something that the left probably doesn't like, and they deny vociferiously.

  • NT SomewhereIn, UT
    April 1, 2013 4:28 p.m.

    The silence coming from the halls of the ACLU with respect to this...is deafening.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    April 1, 2013 3:33 p.m.

    Can you imagine the controversy that would ensue if the professor had instructed his students to write the word "Mohammed" or "Allah" on the paper and stomp on it?!?! The entire middle east would be rioting in the streets and the oh so noble and enlightened professor would be going into hiding because of the price that would be put on his head. Yet the secular left has no problem whatsoever mocking and denigrating the deity of Christians, even on prime time national television (SNL). So courageous!

  • andyjaggy American Fork, UT
    April 1, 2013 3:35 p.m.

    It's ironic, I remember my institute teacher performing this exact same exercise, obviously no one in the class stepped on the paper. Kudos to the student for not doing it, but it sounds like no one else did either. The real problem was in how the school responded to the situation.

  • jttheawesome Scranton, PA
    April 1, 2013 2:49 p.m.

    It seems that both parties herein lacked good old-fashioned common sense with regard to the handling of this matter. Mr. Poole, if he is the Christian man he claims to be, should have found a different way to bring about the desired conversation about symbols, especially religious symbols. In this age of political correctness, it makes no sense to deliberately use an offensive exercise like this merely because a textbook recommends it. Conversely, Mr. Rotela, while understandably offended, should have merely refused to step on the paper with the name of Jesus, calmly explain why, and then drop the matter.

    “Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother."

    Matthew 18:15

  • silo Sandy, UT
    April 1, 2013 1:38 p.m.

    The 'jesus stomping incident' also raises issues about whether freedom of speech should include threatening speech.

    Unfortunately, the article does not tell the whole story, and misrepresents the reason this student was disciplined. He was not disciplined because he refused to take part in the exercise, and he was not disciplined by the professor of the class.

    "Rotela complained to Poole's supervisor about the exercise and was reportedly told not to return to the class".

    What the article doesn't state is that per Rotela's lawyer, he sent a message to the school administration in his complaint, stating "don't do it again" or "you'll be hearing from me". Those statements were taken as written threats and a violation of the schools code of conduct. That is the reason for his disciplining.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 11:55 a.m.

    @Chris B

    "I'd love to know why the professor has never done this with Muhammed?"

    The point of the lesson, as the textbook notes, is to note how there are people who will hesitate or choose not to follow through with it and use that as the point of discussion about symbols and their meaning to people. It works better if you use the example provided in the textbook, Jesus, because the majority of the class will be Christian and have a deeper connection to Jesus than Muhammed.

  • Oatmeal Woods Cross, UT
    April 1, 2013 11:24 a.m.

    Civility is dying in America. Look at the nonsense that came out of the Gay community because of the Prop 8 issue. No, I am not talking about rational arguments from those who opposed Prop 8, I am talking about those who attempted to desecrate temples and mocked religious practices and beliefs. Look at the weird attacks on the current POTUS from radical right-wing groups and Donald Trump.

    One can present an articulate argument, stick to the truth and maintain civility.

  • samhill Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 11:02 a.m.

    "To Lukianoff, the worst offense was how FAU handled the situation by trying to punish Rotela for complaining."


    As far as I'm concerned, the **only** offense was FAU's response to Rotela's response. The fact that they could possibly initiate some action against this student for simply refusing to do something that he considered offensive is ridiculous.

    Fortunately, it seems to have had a chastening effect on FAU, the institution.

    I wish I could say I was optimistic that it would have a similar effect on most other institutions of "higher" learning.

  • CougarBlue Heber City, UT
    April 1, 2013 10:43 a.m.

    Professors seem to think they are an entity unto themselves, who are unapproachable and seem to think they have all the answers. Their attitude is; "I have a PHD, how dare some little snot nosed kid challenge me? I have worked hard to get this degree and therefore I know all the answers and am the supreme judge of what is right and wrong." PHD actually stands for Piled Higher and Deeper. This professor and this University demonstrate this attitude 100%.

  • OHBU Columbus, OH
    April 1, 2013 9:51 a.m.

    So it turns out, the exercise originated at a Catholic college. Despite being done there for three decades, not one person at this Christian school has been offended. Seriously, everyone is so eager to get offended it's kind of sad. Chris, it said Jesus because it must be a symbol most of the students will identify with. As the article pointed out, very few students over that professor's 30 years have ever actually stepped on it.

    We will never know what happened at FAU. By law, we will only ever hear the student's side, unless he decides to sue the school, which is unlikely. He gave his account, but the teacher and university are not allowed to defend themselves and make public their accusations against the student. Accusations, by the way, leveled after talking with him, the professor, and other students in the class.

  • Supporting LDS Church Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 9:42 a.m.

    Gov. Rick Scott has earned respect with this comment:

    "The professor's lesson was offensive, and even intolerant..."

    While I believe that a growing wide-spread acceptance of religious intolerance will weaken our divine protections as a nation- there are those who would arbitrarily require my moral arguments to exclude my beliefs and subjective religious knowledge. For them, I'll provide the following-

    When we exercise our moral agency we act freely, but not necessarily are we morally justified. The freedom to act does not make all 'acts' moral.

    When we tolerate extreme-insensitivity, offensive, hateful, ugly or vulgar conduct- then we are not promoting the fundamental respect required for which peaceful discourse needs to thrive. If we can't require this smallest amount of integrity of ourselves, then we'll only have fostered a society that readily flirts with violence.

    Do our words provoke peace or violence? It's that simple.

    When leaders of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints speak, their words continually to promote peace. Yet the more any religion promotes peace the more they are fought. If that isn't evidence that Satan is real, then I don't know what is.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    April 1, 2013 9:26 a.m.

    I'm fine with the exercise, as long as they are "equal opportunity" stompers.

    But I'm going to go out on a limb and guess the professor has never done this with the word "Muhammed"

    Anyone disagree with me?

    I'd love to know why the professor has never done this with Muhammed?

    shouldnt Muslims be able to do what he tries to force Christians to do?

    Shouldnt Muslims be expected to act the same in non-violent respones as the Christians have done in this "exercise"?

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    April 1, 2013 9:28 a.m.

    This was a stupid exercise, and making more of it than that is opportunistic.

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    April 1, 2013 9:18 a.m.

    Just another example of those in the 'great and spacious building' mocking and pointing fingers of scorn at believers. Lehi had it right, "We heeded them not".

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    April 1, 2013 8:54 a.m.

    Why practice this exercise? Why not merely talk about symbols and ask questions? I think a good class discussion about symbols... Religious and non religious... Would have gotten the point across.