'Zion curtain' will continue to stand in Utah restaurants for now

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  • canyonprophet69 provo, UT
    March 12, 2014 12:36 p.m.

    Mr. Monson, tear down this wall.

  • Wyominguy Buffalo, WY
    March 14, 2013 10:22 a.m.

    My opinion on the Zion Curtain may be different than many however it comes from life experience that many longer term LDS members or others may not have. There is a culture of alcohol, I define it as acceptance of a substance that ruins lives, a culture that makes it ok to consume a beverage that is in the end destructive. You might ask how I have come to these conclusions and I will answer by explaining that I owned a tavern in Montana for Ten years and saw the results of the acceptance of this culture. Im supportive of the stand that has been taken, its a subtle but effective way to express the right of a state to hold a line. My compliments to the Senators who took a stand!

  • NeilT Clearfield, UT
    March 13, 2013 8:21 p.m.

    Count me as another LDS who thinks it is a stupid law. Repeal it ASAP>

  • Well.ok Lehi, UT
    March 13, 2013 3:23 p.m.

    It never ceases to amaze me how many message bills our legislature can create to tell the government to get out of our business, but when it comes to alcohol they come groveling back to the throne of government begging it to hold our hands so we are not tempted to partake.

  • xscribe Colorado Springs, CO
    March 13, 2013 12:23 p.m.

    Should be: Again, show us the data, Valentine!

  • xscribe Colorado Springs, CO
    March 13, 2013 10:36 a.m.

    "Valentine says a "wetter" environment where drinking is more socially acceptable or visible gives rise to more youth drinking on or off premises."

    Where's the data to prove this, Valentine? Bet you don't have any!

    Growing up in rural, Mormon Utah, the only places that had beer were convenience stores, and the only places that had liquor were the State-run liquor stores. As kids, we never saw the insides of the State-run facilities, and never thought much about the beer in the coolers, and we never saw drinks being served in restaurants. However, between 16 and 20 years old, most of us ended up drinking plenty of alcohol.

    Again, show us the date, Valentine!

  • dave Park City, UT
    March 13, 2013 9:47 a.m.

    It would be helpful and refreshing if the proponents could provide one shred of evidence related to the walls. One iota of evidence from a credible and unbiased source. This does not exist therefore the proponents are passing laws just to annoy and demean. This tells everything about the character of those in the legislature.

  • Obama10 SYRACUSE, UT
    March 13, 2013 8:59 a.m.

    I'm LDS and the "Zion curtain" is a stupid law.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    March 13, 2013 8:33 a.m.

    The nanny state in full bloom. Were are forefathers able to get a pint at the pub in Philly when discussing the Constitution?

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    March 13, 2013 7:46 a.m.

    @Brave Sir Robin
    Last time I was in San Diego I saw a play in Balboa Park: At intermission, all the wine drinkers were forced to stand in an area roped off with kite string. I thought: If this were Utah, people would be bashing Mormons for silly liquor policies. You prove my point. While I respect you and DC for questioning your religion (questioning is part of internalizing it as an adult) That respect is negated by the fact that you dont question popular culture even harder: Particularly when your church is on the certifiably correct side of a public health debate.

    I am not LDS. I like the fact that Utah restaurants do not look like bars. I have no religous aversion to alcohol but I understand why government would discourage both alcohol and tobacco. I occasionally drink soda: but I understand why San Francisco restricts it in schools. I eat french fries, but I understand why New York bans trans-fat.
    I dont understand how DucatiCR is a victim, when he doesnt see his steak grilled either.
    I dont understand how criticizing fellow Mormons has any relevance to public health or makes anyone open-minded

  • DC Alexandria, VA
    March 13, 2013 6:35 a.m.

    I don't get it. I'm LDS and I don't drink, but I don't get why Utah has a law preventing people from being able to see drinks being made. I've attended literally hundreds of receptions and other functions where drinks are made and poured right in front of my eyes and not once have I ever thought "wow - that looks so good, I want one too." Just doesn't make any sense to me, but it sure continues to make Utah look backward and controlling.

  • DucatiCR Salt Lake City, Utah
    March 12, 2013 6:43 p.m.

    @Counter Intelligence:

    Yes, I enjoy being able to see my drinks being made, that way i know what i am paying for when i order an expensive liquor isn't just bottom shelf junk but what i am being charged and taxed for. It also makes me feel better to see my drinks being made, so i know i am not (or my wife is not) getting something "extra" put into our drinks.

    If a kid sees alcohol and is driven to drink, you are a bad parent who has not taken the time to explain to them the dangers of underage drinking, and the affects it has on the developing brain.

  • joseywales Park City, UT
    March 12, 2013 6:32 p.m.

    It's a stupid law for many reasons. I would say that every time I've ordered a drink at a restaurant, I've never seen it poured. Not because of some stupid wall, but because I was engaged with who I was dining with. I've never watched a server like a hawk to see where the drink comes from. I trust the establishment to do it right and they always have. Kids or those who don't drink probably couldn't see the drink being prepared either. But what stops kids or non drinkers from watching me drink my drink from the next table over? stupid.

  • RyanD Park City, UT
    March 12, 2013 4:24 p.m.

    The great thing about the free market -- where it exists -- is that it relieves us all of the need to go on internet message boards and engage in debate about the psychic benefits of product and service features such as visible-cocktail-mixing. If enough people enjoy watching their drink being made, a restaurant will open and serve that need, to the harm of no one (least of all minors, who enter a place of business at the permission of their parents).

    Likewise, if there are enough people like Counter Intelligence who derive some benefit from having drink-mixing hidden, a restaurant will open to serve them and their families.

    And this being a free country in which we buy only the products and services we choose, everybody wins!

    This logic is so beautiful, economics textbooks created a word for it: American Capitalism.

  • RyanD Park City, UT
    March 12, 2013 4:07 p.m.

    I think I finally got it. When it comes to health care, we'll roll the dice and trust in the free market, but when it comes to the critical issue of family-friendly restaurants, we can't take the chance.

    Thank you Utah Legislature, for protecting the Sizzler from turning into Studio 54.

  • Brave Sir Robin San Diego, CA
    March 12, 2013 3:48 p.m.

    I'm LDS and I think the Zion curtain is a stupid idea. All my LDS friends think so too. In fact, I don't know a single person (LDS or otherwise) who supports the Zion curtain.

    In reality I think there are about 5 people in all of Utah who support the Zion curtain. Unfortunately, all of them are in the state senate.

  • dalefarr South Jordan, Utah
    March 12, 2013 3:47 p.m.

    When a politician says, "it's not a hijack", it usually is. The consolidate bill appears to have the tracks of church lobbysts all over it.

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    March 12, 2013 3:32 p.m.

    I left out a critcal two words
    "And next time I go to an outdoor theater IN CALIFORNIA and see all those wine drinkers huddled in a fenced corner - by law: I will remind myself how hypocritical Utah critics really are"

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    March 12, 2013 3:28 p.m.

    "and the rest of us should be able to enjoy Ruth's Chris, Market Street, or any other quality restaurant."
    What is stopping you from doing just that?
    Do you have to see a drink being made to get one?
    Will food, not watching your alcohol being poured, being the focus of your dinner really ruin your meal?

    I find it fascinating that "progressive states" will place restrictions on soda, trans-fats, tobacco or even require warnings on alcohol or restrict access to it - but when Utah does it - all those progressives suddenly become victims.

    The fact is: Alcohol has far greater social and health related costs than tobacco
    There may have been valid reason to drink alcohol years ago when it was cleaner than the water - but now a social life centered around an intoxicant is just plain creepy. And it not good public health policy

    Utah need not apologize one iota for shuttling alcohol off to the side.

    And next time I go to outdoor theater and see all those wine drinkers huddled in a fenced corner - by law: I will remind myself how hypocritical Utah critics really are

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    March 12, 2013 3:22 p.m.

    Do you have to check your concealed non-permitted guns at the door of family friendly restaurants?

  • raybies Layton, UT
    March 12, 2013 3:21 p.m.

    The fact remains that the less ubiquitous and easy to access alcohol the fewer fatalities are caused in motor vehicle accidents. Now if only we had a device that automatically shutdown your phone or texting device if you were driving. Recently my daughter has taken to counting the number of drivers that text/phone and drive. Generally there are 2 to 4 times more women than men that do it, and even on short outings she counts around one in ten to fifteen using phones.

  • Thefullnancy SOUTH JORDAN, UT
    March 12, 2013 2:58 p.m.

    So let me get this straight. Our esteemed legislators in their infinite wisdom have proclaimed that anyone can conceal carry a gun but no one can eat in a restaurant where one might possible be able to view the mixing and pouring of alcohol, but the consumption of alcohol is ok. I am gobsmacked.