Dick Harmon: Holliday hire brings Cougs interesting personality

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  • lanius Woods Cross, UT
    March 12, 2013 7:38 p.m.

    Naval is amusing, he is also correct.

  • TrueBlue Orem, UT
    March 12, 2013 11:27 a.m.

    Naval Vet

    Your spin is amusing:

    "The AP, Coaches', and BCS polls place a lot more weight on SOS than Sagarin. That's why Sagarin grants the Y a #26 ranking, whereas none of the other polls grants them as even receiving votes."

    So how do you explain the final rankings for 2011?


    #25/#26/#34 BYU(10-3) (90)
    unranked/#39 Utah(8-5) (49)

    The truth is, your whole SOS theory is so full of holes it resembles Swiss cheese.

    The obviously flaw in your comparison for 2012, is not considering the fact that SOS is an average of opponent rankings.

    Team Y playing two games against #1 and #119 teams would have a SOS of #60.
    Team U playing two games against #59 and #61 teams would also have a SOS of #60.
    Which team would be ranked higher if both teams went 2-0?

    BYU played FIVE Top 25 teams in 2012 (1-4), Utah only played TWO (0-2). So even with a lower SOS, it could be argued that BYU played tougher competition and was more successful.


    #26 BYU(8-5) > #61 Utah(5-7)

  • sls Columbia, MO
    March 12, 2013 8:25 a.m.

    BYU hasn't had a lot of success lately with coaches who come into Provo with no previous connection to Cougar football. That said, there were coaches in the past who came into Provo and really sparked the team---guys like Mike Holmgren and Doug Scovil. Let's hope that Holliday is one of these.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    March 11, 2013 10:34 p.m.

    There is not one unbiased person out there who would say that Utah(who didn't even go to a bowl game) had a better season than BYU(who not only went to a bowl game, but won)

    As for attendance, never are there more fans from the visitors team at a BYU game than when they play Utah. Just because it is the only sell-out of the year, doesn't mean Y fans consider it their bowl game. It just means that Utah fans love to go to a game in Provo once every two years.

    To say that the game was over in the 3rd quarter either means you didn't even watch the game or you simply don't understand football.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    March 11, 2013 10:30 p.m.

    "SOS doesn't matter to Sagarin as much as W/L records. SOS really DOES make a difference. The AP, Coaches', and BCS polls place a lot more weight on SOS than Sagarin. That's why Sagarin grants the Y a #26 ranking, whereas none of the other polls grants them as even receiving votes."

    This doesn't even make sense. How does the AP, and Coaches polls place a lot more weight on SOS than Sagarin. You would have to be a mind reader since both of those polls' results are based on human votes. As for the BCS poll, it is weighted and the results are based partially on Jeff Sagarins computer ratings. Also, how could the BCS poll grant anybody as receiving votes. It's a computer ranking based on the results of 6 different factors entered into a computer, not as a result of votes. Also, the BCS final rankings come out before the bowl games. Nothing comes out of the BCS rankings after the bowl games.

    It is amazing to me the garbage you will post just to make Utah sound like they had a better season than BYU.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 8:00 p.m.


    "Just like the 80's, BYU has once again become Utah's bowl game."

    Sorry cougie. Just because you went back to the WAC, doesn't mean we're back to the 80s. It's clear by all the whining about Utah scheduling teams like Michigan and Fresno St. who is who's "bowl game". How many games had you guys sold out since leaving the MWC?

    Answer: ONE...vs. Utah.

    That's right. WE were your highest attended game over the past 2 seasons. The same cannot be said of us when you visited SLC last fall. WE are YOUR bowl game. There's no way to spin that.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 7:54 p.m.

    Frantic and emotional Indy-WACers:

    SOS doesn't matter to Sagarin as much as W/L records. SOS really DOES make a difference. The AP, Coaches', and BCS polls place a lot more weight on SOS than Sagarin. That's why Sagarin grants the Y a #26 ranking, whereas none of the other polls grants them as even receiving votes.

    When your 2 big brothers moved up to the Pac-12 and Big 12 respectively, we saw our SOS increase, and Ws decrease. When the Y dropped down from the MWC to play WAC football, they saw their SOS decrease, and the Ws increase. No coincidence there. You'll find out soon enough once you guys finally play a relevant schedule.


    The scoreboard determines who is the better team. Utah was MUCH better in 2011; winning 54-10, and that game was over by Halftime. In 2012, Utah was the better team again, having won that game by the 3rd-Qtr. Good luck trying to keep up with your big brother with your ever-increasing percentage of 2-star athletes.

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    March 11, 2013 5:55 p.m.

    It's baffling how Naval Vet could be so adept at finding Sagarin's SOS rankings, which are buried all the way over in the 5th or 6th column of Sagarin's ratings, yet he has so much trouble finding the team rankings, which are easily found in the 1st column, in numerical order, right next to the team name.

    RK Team Rating W L Sched(rank)
    26 BYU A=80.26 8 5 69.48(63)
    61 Utah A=71.27 5 7 72.91(41)

    Since the Utes are so enamored with SOS, they should make up a little trophy to present to themselves at their annual awards ceremony to recognize themselves for finishing with the 41st toughest SOS.

    Just think, if the Utes had had Missouri's schedule, they could have been #1,

    in SOS.

  • Swoop Salt Lake City, UT
    March 11, 2013 2:16 p.m.


    "Ever wonder why you lost 2 more games in 2012 than you did in 2011?"

    U were even more pathetic in 2012, than you were in 2011 when you lost to 10-loss Colorado.

    Despite all of your boasting about recruiting, U just aren't good enough to compete in the PAC 10.2.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    March 11, 2013 1:58 p.m.

    @naval vet

    most fans would agree that

    #26 is MUCH better than #61


    #34 is better than #39

    So, how do you explain BYU being ranked higher by Sagarin, despite Utah's tougher SOS?

    The obvious answer, which you are your crimson bubble dwelling friends on the hill will never admit to, is

    BYU was MUCH BETTER in 2012,


    BYU was a little better in 2011,

    than U!

    Just admit it, and move on. None of your SOS spinning is going to change that!

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    March 11, 2013 1:51 p.m.

    Naval Vet:

    I noticed that little "snicker" you added at the end of one of your latest "impressive" comments. That is actually the advisable thing for you to currently be doing.
    That's because you certainly won't be able to come September when what actually happens on the field will finally count, and all these gibberish comments (and *snickers*) will no longer mean anything.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    March 11, 2013 1:29 p.m.

    To Naval Vet:

    It doesn't matter one iota if you play in the best conference in the world (which the U doesn't) if you still consistently finish at or near the bottom basement of that conference (which the U does).
    Yes, SOS matters. But the Sagarin ratings are almost universally accepted as mattering more, since they take more criteria into consideration, including SOS. As was pointed out to you a bit earlier, BYU's Sagarin rating was much better than the U's (26 to 61). It's pretty amazing what the Y coaches are able to do with those 2-star recruits, especially compared to the U's best-in-the-world caliber recruits.
    Just live with it and stop coming back with your weak replies. Or better yet, tell us yet again what great victories you finally obtained over the Y these past few years. You and other fellow U fans must totally reverence the Y, considering how much they seem to mean to you. Someday you should try looking at the big picture and quit focusing on only one Saturday a season.

  • phoenix Gilbert, AZ
    March 11, 2013 1:27 p.m.

    Naval Vet

    For team that has lost more games regardless of SOS, see mirror.

    Ever wonder how BYU finished 2011 AND 2012 ranked higher in the polls than U?

    It's because BYU performed BETTER against BYU's schedule, than Utah performed against Utah's schedule.

    As much as you want to live in denial and whine about SOS, Utah's steady decline since 2008 hasn't been solely the result of increased SOS. U didn't going bowling last season because U LOST to the only WAC team U played.

    AP/Coaches/Sagarin Rankings/Record/Team/SOS

    #25/#26/#34 BYU(10-3) (#90)
    unranked/#39 Utah(8-5) (#49)

    unranked/#26 BYU(8-5) (#63) bowl winner
    unranked/#61 Utah(5-7) (#41) bowl no show

    Just like the 80's, BYU has once again become Utah's bowl game.


  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 12:57 p.m.


    Ever wonder why you lost 2 more games in 2012 than you did in 2011? Because your SOS went up. It was still WAC-ish, but the fact remains, the stronger the SOS, the fewer the Ws. Your SOS during your final season in the MWC was also tougher than your 2011 season's. And naturally, you lost more games.

    SOS matters. You'll find out soon enough.

    Especially with all those 2-star recruits that'll be taking the field this year too.


  • BigLebowski Mesa, AZ
    March 11, 2013 12:30 p.m.

    Love all the comments from the Ute fans who are trying to suggest that Erickson is a good hire for them. Erickson has had only one winning season (2007 his first year at ASU, without any of his players or recruits and using carryover assistants) in the past 10 years. And before you slam me for saying that ASU is a terrible football program, how did the Utes fair against them this past season? Best of luck to you Ute fans with that coach.

  • Whatsnu Sandy, UT
    March 11, 2013 12:27 p.m.

    Naval Vet

    Stop making excuses and whining about SOS.

    BYU played FIVE Top 25 teams in 2012; U only played TWO.

    BYU finished the season ranked #26 by Sagarin.
    Utah was ranked #61.

    Your SOS is meaningless, especially when you LOST to only the WAC team you played!

    Poor pacywacer!

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 12:00 p.m.


    The WAC may be gone, but all the wins you guys have been trying to justify your program's 10- and 8-win seasons were WAC-ish. You haven't played a non-WAC schedule since leaving the MWC, so "Indy-WAC" seems pretty apropos to me.

    As for going "winless versus the WAC" these past two seasons...we've only lost to ONE team in the WAC. And that was the 16th-ranked Utah State program, and in O/T. Conversely, we did beat 2 WAC teams: the 2011 Indy-WACers, and the 2012 Indy-WACers.

    Poor Indy-WACer.

  • Whatsnu Sandy, UT
    March 11, 2013 11:19 a.m.

    "Poor Indy-WACer."

    It's time to come up with a new childish insult - the WAC is no longer in the football business, so using the above is not only childish, it's also clueless.

    Besides, which team has gone winless versus the WAC in the last two years?

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 11:17 a.m.


    And for what it's worth, Utah hadn't beaten a "single" PAC team with a winning record since 2007. We'd beaten 2: 9-4/18th-ranked Oregon St. (2008), and 8-5 California (2009). Double fail on your part.

    Best you finally come to terms with the fact that you'll be mid-majors forever.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 11:09 a.m.


    "Who cares about first, second and third choice spin? In the end, BYU ended up with the better coach...Care to explain why you completely biffed on the opportunity to compare Holliday's success in that area versus A-Rod's lack thereof?"

    I don't know who ended up with the better coach. At least not between ARod and Holliday anyway. I'd never heard of Holliday before, and the article didn't really say much about him either. Where did he play his college ball? Which teams had he coached at? How long was his tenure there? All that is known is that he'd been coaching longer than Roderick.

    As for OTHER "better coach", Erickson > Anae.


    "So you're telling us Utah was out-recruiting PAC schools clear back in 2007, yet the hapless still haven't been able to beat a single PAC team with a winning record?"

    No, that's not what I said. I merely refuted carver's notion that we'll be outrecruited by every Pac-12 team heretofore. I proved carver wrong, so you're now trying to change the argument. How frantic and emotional of you. Poor Indy-WACer.

  • Tators Hyrum, UT
    March 11, 2013 11:06 a.m.

    To Chris B:

    Really, you are not.
    A better team would not base it's entire season on beating just one in-state rival.
    A better team would not settle for being in the basement of their conference, no matter how great that conference is.
    A better team would at least need to be good enough to become bowl eligible.
    Utah might have the motivation to lately play over their heads for one weekend a season against their nemesis. But that certainly doesn't make them a better team overall.

  • uteBusters Park City, UT
    March 11, 2013 10:55 a.m.

    Naval Vet

    So you're telling us Utah was out-recruiting PAC schools clear back in 2007, yet the hapless still haven't been able to beat a single PAC team with a winning record?

    7-11 in the PAC, conference cellar dwellers, and steady decline since 2008 with all of those PAC-caliber recruits.


  • TheSportsAuthority Arlington, VA
    March 11, 2013 10:33 a.m.

    Naval Vet

    Who cares about first, second and third choice spin? In the end, BYU ended up with the better coach.

    It is funny that it bugs you so much.

    Despite your frantic and emotional spin, however, it's obvious that you're ignoring your own "gold standard" for coaching success -- how many players a coach has sent on to the NFL. For a position coach, it's even more relevant to compare players for that particular position, in this case, WR.

    Care to explain why you completely biffed on the opportunity to compare Holliday's success in that area versus A-Rod's lack thereof?

    Spin away!

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 10:10 a.m.


    "...[Utah] will never again out recruit any school in the Pac 12."

    What a frantic and emotional thing to say. Do you know when was the last time we were outrecruited by every school in the Pac-10/12?

    Answer: 2007.

    That means the Utes out-recruited several Pac-10/12 teams while not only still members of the MWC, but also prior to the Utes being envisioned even as a passing notion for membership. Fail.

    Seems to me a certain little someone is having a difficult time reconciling the fact that they've been outrecruited by their big brother in each of the past 6 seasons, and with no realistic hope in sight at closing that ever widening gap. Poor Indy-WACer.

  • Stop The Nonsense El Paso, TX
    March 11, 2013 10:00 a.m.

    I'm excited for the Holliday hire. He seems like someone with great credentials who may be able to bring out the best in Apo and the other receivers. This may actually cause Hoffman's numbers to decrease, but hopefully his skill level will continue to increase and he will get drafted. I am cautiously optimistic about this team.

  • carver Enterprise, UT
    March 11, 2013 9:50 a.m.

    Naval Vet:

    But it will never matter what coaches Utah has because they will never again out recruit any school in the Pac 12. If your going to play in the Pac 12, Utah and Colorado is goinmg to be your last choice.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    March 11, 2013 9:24 a.m.

    There is "rumor" that Anae was given full control of the offense; including coaches. Anae wanted to bring in his people; which would explain his attempt at hiring Roderick(who he coached at Ricks and would have been a great hire) I don't know if it really had anything to do with Cahoon, other than he may have been a bit of a scapegoat here. As for Dupaix, same thing along with the fact that Dupaix is a running backs coach with most of his experience in the option game; ie. Navy. Both very good coaches and super individuals, but they found themselves in no-mans land with the hiring of Anae who appears to be intent on developing the passing game which has given way to more of an option attack over the past few years. The best hire was Tujague. Weber was horrible. After learning more about Holliday, I believe BYU got the better coach, but Roderick was definitely the first choice.

  • Chris B Salt Lake City, UT
    March 11, 2013 8:33 a.m.

    My Cougar friends, I want you to have the absolute best coaches you think you have. Really, I do. I want you to believe that your team is NC caliber. Really, I do. That way, when we beat you (again), you'll have absolutely no excuses for losing. Other than the fact that you played a better team. Really, we are.

  • BleedCougarBlue Enid, OK
    March 11, 2013 8:25 a.m.

    I stil want to know why Ben Cahoon was fired.

    Bueller? Bueller? Anyone?.....

    You don't become the CFL's leading receiver by being a slouch at your job. No, not even in the CFL.

    If someone could shed some ACCURATE information here (read that as, "no rumors from trash-talking Utah fans) I'd appreciate it.

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 11, 2013 7:56 a.m.

    Solomon Levi:

    "Howard S...Holliday was BYU's second choice... Aaron Roderick was first choice...LOL at the spin."

    Spin? So you're saying Roderick was NOT Mendenmidmajor's first choice? Do Howard or I need to refer you to the article where the Y first sought out Utah's WR's coach BEFORE defaulting to Holliday?

    Howard wasn't spinning anything. It happened just like he said it did. "LOL" at YOUR spin.

  • deseret pete robertson, Wy
    March 11, 2013 7:02 a.m.

    One thing for sure -- We have no lack of Media coaches and analysts who know how every coach will work out long before any games are played --- And why every decision is wrong or right before the season starts --- We need more colleges and universities to be able to use this pool of such stalwart all knowing talent.

  • LindonMan Lindon, UT
    March 10, 2013 11:45 p.m.

    I love how a couple of comments on a BYU article really seem to get those ute fans all defensive about things. Now that's laughable!

  • Solomon Levi Alpine, UT
    March 10, 2013 10:27 p.m.

    Howard S.

    "Holliday was BYU's second choice... Aaron Roderick was first choice."

    LOL at the spin.

    The truth is, you're scared to death that BYU ended up with a much more experienced and well-rounded coach.

    It's hard to tell who was Utah's first choice.

    A-Rod co-OC, demoted to PC and replaced by Chow who was replaced by BJ who was demoted to co-OC understudy and replaced by DE who in theory will be in charge of the offense for one year, at least when Whit isn't micro-managing DE like he tried to do with Chow.

  • Cougars1 Bluffdale, UT
    March 10, 2013 10:23 p.m.

    Bubble? No. The bubble would be the cover-up that Hill is in the middle of in relation to what is going on with the swim team.

    As for Anae, this is one of many Cougar fans who did not criticize Anae. If I remember right, it was Bronco who stepped up and claimed responsibility on that drive. Anae has done nothing but good for BYU as evidenced by the obvious interest in him as an assistant by Whitt. What he was offered, or whetther he was offered is neither here nor there; the fact remains that there was interest.

    "Laughable" would be Utah's record in basketball against BYU the last 10 years.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    March 10, 2013 9:55 p.m.


    "The situation on the hill is laughable."

    Laughable? Actually that "laughable" situation is 3-0 against BYU in the last three years.

    What does that say about the situation in the bubble?

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    March 10, 2013 9:48 p.m.



    How was the 2010 block Anae's fault?

    Actually Barney never said the block was Anae's fault. But if you had been paying attention Cougar fans roundly criticized Anae for conservative play calling in the final drive that set up the field goal attempt.

    Also to be precise BYU's Devin Mahina was left trying to block Utah's Taplin-Ross and Bradley. He chose Taplin-Ross on the inside leaving Bradley virtually untouched for the block on the outside.

  • Ernest T. Bass Bountiful, UT
    March 10, 2013 8:17 p.m.

    We get the coaches they want. We get all the recruits. We pretty much dominate. Anae was way better than Erickson.

  • eagle Provo, UT
    March 10, 2013 7:56 p.m.

    Not sure what Ben Cahoon did wrong or what Joey Dupaix did wrong for that matter?

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    March 10, 2013 7:48 p.m.

    To Barney Google: Did you watch the film of the play where Burton blocked the field goal? I did, and BYU's defender looked right at Burton, then hesitated and went the other way. Appparantly he did not think Burton could get there in time to block the ball, or attempted to shore up the BYU line of scrimmage. Either way, it looked to me like he could have made the block on Burton, but for some reason did not. How is this Anae's fault?

  • sls Columbia, MO
    March 10, 2013 4:16 p.m.

    Roderick has been demoted twice at Utah--Johnson once. The situation on the hill is laughable.

    As to Holliday, if BYU wants to recruit seriously in Texas, they must get an invite to the Big 12. However, beating UT would help a lot, both to recruit and to get an invite to join the Big 12. If Holliday can help turn in a 2-0 season to start the year, I'll be behind him and all the other coaches 100%. Nobody in Texas will care about beating Utah or anyone else on the schedule, if the Longhorns come out of Provo with a win.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    March 10, 2013 2:49 p.m.

    AltaHawkFan says:

    "Dennis Erikson was utah's second choice. Robert Anae was first choice."


    Cute response... not accurate but cute.

    I guess I must have missed the news reports where Anae was offered and accepted and then rejected Whits offer.

    The truth is that Whit made one offer and got one acceptance.

    Really... If it weren't for made up facts Cougar Nation would have no facts at all.

  • JmThms Henderson, NV
    March 10, 2013 2:50 p.m.

    Naval Vet,

    You all are too much! Hilarious. Yea, Anae would have come in 4th as an OC candidate at that great, elite institution in SLC! Hilarious. How come you, Chris B and the like live on these BYU boards and I have never even been to a Ute board let alone comment on one?

  • AntiSNOT Taylorsville, UT
    March 10, 2013 2:03 p.m.

    I love this guy's intensity and toughness and how he seems to be instilling that in our WR's this year. I really think he's going to make a difference with guys like Apo, etc. Can't wait for the opener against UV!!! The main question mark with this team is how will the OL do? That is the big key at this point. That, and will Justin Sorenson improve at kicking. BYU already looks great everywhere else.

  • gdog3finally West Jordan, Utah
    March 10, 2013 12:29 p.m.


    Who knows, you may be right. Good comeback nonetheless.

  • Barney Google Beaver, UT
    March 10, 2013 11:19 a.m.

    @AltaHawkFan stick to your High School sports. College conversation is out of your league.

    There is a oxymoron down south. Y fans wanted Anae's head on a plater in 2010; After the "Burton's still unblocked" game, Bronco gives Anae his walking papers.

    Here's where the oxymoron comes in; They hired Anae back in 2013.

    This seasons T-shirt slogan; "Recycle!"

  • Naval Vet Philadelphia, PA
    March 10, 2013 9:29 a.m.


    Nowhere had it ever been reported that Anae was offered the O.C. position at Utah. All that had been said was that Whittingham asked him to interview. The more likely scenerio was that Whittingham was interviewing multiple candidates for the position, and Anae was just one of the O.C.s on his list. I'd find it highly implausible that Whittingham would have preferred a guy run out of Provostan 2 yrs ago over a 2-time Nat'l Champion/3-time Pac-10 Coach of the Year. I wouldn't doubt that Erickson was Utah's 1st choice. I have no idea what order Anae would have come in. 2nd? 3rd? 4th? Oh well. What does it matter? We got Erickson anyway, so we never had to find out.

  • BlueHusky Mission Viejo, CA
    March 10, 2013 8:39 a.m.

    There is no evidence that Detmer would be a good choice. He would be as big a gamble as Doman was. I'm excited about the new offense we're reading about now. Lets see what these offensive coaches can do before we start looking for someone else. As for the Utah coach who changed his mind ... well I don't see anything at Utah that I would be excited about.

  • AltaHawkFan Sandy, UT
    March 9, 2013 11:52 p.m.

    Dennis Erikson was utah's second choice. Robert Anae was first choice.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    March 9, 2013 7:02 p.m.

    Ty Detmer was a wish, not a choice.

  • rlsintx Plano, TX
    March 9, 2013 6:39 p.m.

    Re: Roderick -

    When people come, and then go again very quickly - don't worry at all about it.

    If they are not "all in", rejoice that they are "all out".

    He's where he felt comfortable apparently and BYU has someone who is willing to choose to be there.

    Wishing them both success.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    March 9, 2013 6:06 p.m.

    Holliday was BYU's second choice... Aaron Roderick was first choice.

    Jason Beck was second choice... Ty Detmer was first choice.