No way. Not now; maybe not ever. When he chooses to follow the rules, maybe.
If not for the honor code, what have we to distinguish ourselves from the common
and ordinary? Holmoe - you've done some dumb things in your tenure (all of
which got you fired by Cal) but this stand takes the cake. Has the disaster of
a football season (several) beaten you to the point of pandering to the
misguided fans? If so, you've hit a new low.
@AlottaBalatas,Best post to date on the topic!Well said.
If McMahon had been a mediocore player or even average athlete he would have
been expelled from BYU and told to go find another school to play for. The
message is if you are a great athlete the honor code does not matter. BYU chose
to ignore flagrant and documented honor code violations. I agree McMahon was a
great QB and contributed to BYU's success. So did a lot of others athletes
who will never be recognized. A say let McMahon graduate and retire his jersey.
As far as the hall of fame I am not convinced that would be the right
decision. I Can see both sides on this issue. Tough call. GO Cougars.
Sad they haven't done it yet. They give honorary doctorates to all kinds
of goofy people. Sad thing really is, Bronco would not have a Jim McMahon
today...everyone wants perfection now...not later...not down the road. Now.
Doesn't work that way folks.
In regards to Jim Mac Mahon and those that would like to keep him out of the BYU
Hall of Fame,Let he/she without sin, cast the first stone.
Jim McMahon along with Leon White, Kurt Gavaia (spelling is wrong), Great
players for BYU and great NFL careers. Sports hall of fames whether its the
College Hall of Fame, NFL or your schools should be more about what you did on
It's time to heal old wounds. Lets stop with old resentments and show love
and compassion to a guy who isn't perfect.
Maybe after we get Jim into the HOF we can get Nixon on Mount Rushmore.gchris - These are institutional issues, nothing to do with the law. If you
are going to use your standard than every kid every booted for an honor code
violation ought to be recompensed.thenun - Lavell Edwards lifted his
protection after the bowl game, and Jim enjoyed driving away and never looking
back. Read his book.
@ Broom Hockey ChampMcMahon was the first great QB to place BYU on
the map, but some of us have struggled with the perceived hypocrisy of
suspending him one week following his football eligibility (preventing his
graduation) as well as instituting the graduation rule (aka McMahon rule).
Doesn't pass the test!And as for the honor code, many young men
and women have passed through BYU with mistakes on their record, and in a few
cases disregard for what BYU stands for. A simple search on YouTube may
provide an example or two.After 30 years, isn't it okay for us
to forgive a young man and HONOR what his parents were told during recruiting
visits? Let's leave the past where it belongs.
This is from the biggest Ute ever-IMO Jim was the BEST of the bunch and I saw
them all woop on us year after year. Nobody could throw it as hard and strong
and then turn around the next play with such touch over the middle to one of
those big tight ends. I will always say because I'm red Alex Smith was the
best QB I have ever seen in RES, but #9 is very very close behind.
Jim should be in BYU hall of fame. He was an awesome QB. The honor code
violation that got him expelled was drinking alcohol and smoking a cigar on
national television @ the Heisman Banquet. Hard for the standards office to
overlook such public flaunting of the code. Maybe Jim can get a BGS. I wish him
luck. Thanks for all the great football Jim!
This is one more BYU fan who absolutely believes that, under the circumstances,
Jim McMahon should be inducted into the BYU Hall of Fame and have his number
Sometimes I'm embarrassed to be a Cougar...stop with all the judgmental
stuff. We all loved watching Jim play and he was one of the greatest. A loose
cannon? Yes. A great ball player? Yes. Retire the jersey. Now,
let's see if we can find another qb who can play like Jim.
I'm for the boo-birds on this one.McMahon was an incredible QB in his
time at BYU. I loved watching him play.However, after leaving BYU, the
great QB sullied his time at BYU by bragging about his drinking binges after
[college] games, constantly breaking the honor code, and by using numerous
disgusting epithets in describing his time at BYU. Any sports reporters from
those days can look this up.So, now Holmoe wants to retire McMahon's
jersey?Sorry, but a retired jersey means that the athlete was great not
only on the field, but in his personal life as well, and it sends the message to
current and future athletes about the overall character they should emulate
while playing for the University.Jim McMahon, while a great player, was
NOT a great example to any athlete in conducting his personal life, not to
mention his lack of appreciation for the institution that was the vehicle for
his college and professional success.As great as McMahon was, endorsing
that sort of character is NOT in the best interest of BYU or its athletes.
Do they give a touchdown to someone tackled on the five yard line just because
he played hard the rest of the game. Folks you have to cross the goal line. The
graduation is the goal line. McMahon has always known that and has chosen to
Not a chance! This guy hasn't had a good thing to say about BYU in his
life! Never forget the free education, Mr. McMahan! Never forget the exposure
you got for playing under a great coach!
Its time for the University to do the right thing. I hate when stupid policies
stand in the way of doing something that should be done. He deserves to have
all the praise and accolades his career earned him regardless of his graduate
status. Do the right thing and honor Jim. In the words of Spencer W.
Wow. Never thought I'd agree with Chris B on something.
Have to agree with those that have commented that he should get his number
retired. If he was allowed to play then, his number should be up with the greats
by his performance. All this distancing because of things said after the fact is
silly.Be what you proclaim to be byU.... accepting of all.
(especially when he is one of the greatest to ever play in your program)Even Chris B gets it.
Retire #9. Give Jim the love he deserves!
Even I believe his number should be retired, and he should be in BYU's Hall
of Fame. If he can't complete his degree, and that is an inflexible
requirement, then give him an honorary degree. The Y didn't worry about his
keeping the standards of the university when he played for them, they
shouldn't worry about them now So let it be written, so let it
JmThmsHenderson, NVI couldn't agree more. If they let him
play they must let him into the hall. Plus it is true he was expelled!
He's also practically begged the university to let him make up those
Getting credits from BYU is easy. Just ask Michael Oher of "The Blind
Side" Fame who is the Right Tackle now for the Baltimore Ravens. Online
courses in "Home-Ec" and "The Book of Alma" will get him the
requisite 10 credits in no time at all.
I want Tom Holmoe retired.
I need to correct TheNunThe Miracle Bowl (1980) was after Jim
McMahon's junior year. He went on to play his senior season in 1981,
missing only two games due to injury.I don't know if he was
expelled after his senior year, but those who read your post may be tempted to
pass it by when they see inaccurate information.
From an Aggie... hang his number up, he deserves it.It is about a great
athlete being honored, nothing more.You want to count his stats and all he
acomplished for your school and you won't honor one of your greats?As far as the honor code, pull your heads out of the sand. I know and
talk to a number of current players at BYU and hear story after story of CURRENT
honor code violations that occur weekly that are not reported.It is
about FOOTBALL, not grades or honor code or degree to have your number
retired.Hates off to you Jim! and YES, I remember the HUGE fight the
last time you played at Romney Stadium!
Obviously he was a great player. It just bothers me that byu probably
compromised. Its principles a lot to have him stay there and here we are again
with pondering compromising principles to let Jim have an honor just 10 credits
short. Where I come from honors are earned. They aren't given out to
people because we feel bad for them. Jim's had like 30 years to complete
his degree., its only 10 credit that's only a part-time semester. Why
doesn't Jim for once change himself instead of society changes for him?
McMahon has always and I repeat always shown contempt for BYU. The rules are the
rules. If he really wanted this he would have completed what was necassary to
make it happen.
To those who say his jersey should not be retired and he should not enter the
hall of fame because they ask "should he really be counted with the greats
who were great AND followed the honor code rules?" I say the institution
cannot have it both ways. If he was 'allowed' to play there then the
institution endorsed his behavior enough to permit his play.
Of all the BYU quarterbacks I would take Jim McMahon over all the others in a
pinch to win the game. He was an amazing leader with a swagger that we now lack
at BYU. Come on Cougars, retire the jersey, give him an honorary degree. It
needs to be done now.
typical hypocrisy once again at BYU.McMahon did not "leave"
byu short 10 credit hours short of graduation. He was expelled the week after
the Miracle Bowl game and was not given the chance to earn those 10 hours during
spring semester. And, until that time, graduation was NOT part of
the requirement for induction to the hall of fame at byu. That came after the
expulsion.Now, they make a big deal of retiring his number, in the
name of trying to cover up the fact the administration messed up by expelling
Jimmy Mac, trying to save face in an otherwise embarrasing fiasco.None other than Dick Harmon wrote the article several years ago as he was
promoting McMahon for inclusion into the hall of fame, in the name of erasing a
hall of shame moment by byu.
Oh my goodness. Get it done--yesterday. This is an Athletic Hall of Fame--not a
Comprehensive BYU or LDS hall of fame. And kudo's to Tom Holmoe for the
courage to move forward on this.
McMAHOn bragged about drinking and such at BYu. Seems to have gotten away with
a lot or put on porbation numerous times. What he said about the institution
could of effected the schools descision too. Happinwess Provo in rear view
Holmoe, you should spend your time figuring out where to find a few new coaches!
I loved watching McMahon play, too, but he doesn't represent what the
school's values are. If you want to send the message that football values
and the school's values are different, go for it. And while you're at
it, explain it to the great athletes you've crucified along the way.
Jim McMahon did NOT graduate and his jersey number should NOT be retired. Retire
Tom Holmoe instead.
McMahon's number should be retired while he can still enjoy the day. And,
Broom Hockey Champ, can you tell us which of the Honor Codes McMahon violated?
Under the law, if a person isn't charged or convicted of a crime, it
didn't happen. Along with Young, Detmer, Nielson, Wilson, et. al., McMahon
defined "Quarterback U." He was a unique player and individual and he
deserves to have his number retired and as soon as possible.
Yes, Jimmy Mac needs his number up there. That stadium is largely
there anyway because of him....not just Lavell.Tom, you have the
The time has come (a long time ago)...
Awesome. Finally some respect for the man. Chris why haven't
you rained your comments here yet?
it would be the right thing to do
I remembered Jimmy Mac was really ticked at Marcus Allen who won the 1981
Heisman. I was disapointed Jimmy didn't win it. Thank you Tom Holmoe but
the University is the one going to have to do the change to make it work. Jim
deserve the BYU Hall of Fame soon. Interesting to what I read in Wikipedia that
Jim was a Punter back in 1977 which was really surprising.
It would be the classy thing to do and just might go a littl ways towards
acknowledging that if BYU had promoted McMahon for the Heisman like they
promoted those to follow he probably would have won it. Just ask Clay
Even as a Utah Ute fan, I agree MacMahon's number should be retired. That
was the heyday of BYU's passing attack and MacMahon took it to a whole new
level. Give the man credit and retire his number and put him in the Hall of
Fame. He deserves no less.
As great as McMahon was, I don't think it sends the right message to the
fans if BYU administration retires his #9. Over the years, I have
loved watching replays of his games both at BYU and in the NFL and I feel bad
for his current condition. However, should he really be counted with the greats
who were great AND followed the honor code rules?
Great idea! I was an undergrad and grad student at BYU between 1977 and 1982.
Jim McMahon was an incredibly exciting player to watch and is an important part
of that era of BYU football.That honor is long overdue. The sooner
the better, Mr. Holmoe.
Should already have been done. A no brainer.
Jim's hail mary to Clay Brown in the miracle 1980 Holiday Bowl is the
all-time greatest play in BYU Football history, bar none. His number should go
up without the degree!
Retire the jersey. It is time. Jim deserves it.