Rich-poor gap expands in U.S. amid presidential campaign

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  • county mom Monroe, UT
    Sept. 18, 2012 10:54 p.m.

    We are paying 30%. How much more do you think we should pay? We pay fuel taxes, heavy highway taxes, property taxes to states we never drive in, sales taxes on miles never traveled, and the usual federal, state, and income taxes. Our sacrifice is enough. How much do you pay?

  • carman Wasatch Front, UT
    Sept. 17, 2012 7:17 p.m.

    Wealth and poverty is not created by government policy. That is like blaming the rule book or the referees when your football team loses. Wealth is created by sacrifice, hard work, education, attention to details, delayed gratification, discipline, good luck, good health, innovation, a value creation mentality and adherence to valid economic principles. Poverty is caused by poor health, laziness, bad luck, failure to adhere to valid economic principles, lack of education, settling for less than you could earn, drug abuse, divorce, bad parenting, bad decisions, a culmination of hundreds of small, shortsighted decisions, a punch the clock mentality and an inability or unwillingness to keep going when things are tough.

    If you want to address the income and wealth gap, the underlying causes and behaviors will have to be addressed. Changing tax policy, union laws, keeping or changing who is president won't change much at all.

  • Midwest Mom Soldiers Grove, WI
    Sept. 15, 2012 11:34 a.m.

    So many who post here think that the union voice is no longer needed. Unilateral power always corrupts. Collective bargaining brings everyone to the table. It isn't only the wealthy who "create" jobs. Henry Ford knew that he had to pay his workers well so that they could afford his products.

    My son's district offered 2-year contracts with no salary schedule; the district retained the option to change employee salaries, benefits and even reduce someone to part time, mid-contract. To quit, he'd pay a $3,000 fine and reimburse the district for a substitute, "until the district can find a replacement," which they would have little incentive to do. Needless to say, my son left both district and state, as did his entire department. Minnesota gave him a $6K pay raise and double the coach's pay.

    As Governor Scott Walker famously said, "we're going to start with public unions--divide and conquer." You're next. Read up on the Crystal Sugar lockout and how skilled Sensata jobs were sent to China. Both companies were very profitable, yet traded American jobs for even bigger foreign profits. Race to the bottom for America.

  • JWB Kaysville, UT
    Sept. 15, 2012 10:22 a.m.

    The current President was to be hope and change for the United States of America that people voted for in 2008. They knew nothing of this man's leadership capabilities as he was only a U.S. Senator that didn't always vote and was new so didn't lead. In the Illinois legislature, he wasn't a leader except a community organizer. He would have brought in people with leadership capabilities in their areas of expertise. The Secretary of the Treasury couldn't even pay his basic income taxes. The Secretary of State was the wife of a former President and a U.S. Senator that wanted to be a leader of the United States, not the Secretary of State. He brought in his old basketball team members to lead on the Court of the Supreme and we ended up with PACs being able to take over for the people of the United States of America with money, money, and more money without real control. This election has somewhat different rules to deal with and people will not vote as they should since they feel powerless in a world of big money, such as the people in some countries.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Sept. 15, 2012 8:57 a.m.

    The class warfare meme continues, and escalates. And, again we see the bias of the media. Clearly the genesis of this story was not within the Deseret News, but from something put out by the uber-liberal sources quoted (Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, and some Democrat operative), putting spin on a Census Bureau report.

    Equality of opportunity does not guarantee equality of outcomes (or in this case, incomes). When more people are becoming "takers" than "producers" the incentive for the producers to work harder diminishes.

    Sure, some people are getting filthy rich, including big name athletes, Hollywood stars, Obama's cronies in the green energy business, the Facebook guy, etc. And, some people are losing lots of money- retired folks living off their investments; doctors being paid less and less under Medicare rates folks laid off from businesses that closed do to silly EPA rules and reams of incomprehensible regulations.

    The solution is for people to work hard and prosper in a climate of freedom which can grow income for everyone, not increasing doses of socialism to redistribute wealth. Eventually you run out of other people's money to spend.

  • My2Cents Taylorsville, UT
    Sept. 15, 2012 5:59 a.m.

    Redistribution of wealth is illegal and constitutional so why is this term even being used by the news media? Achievement an wealth is what this country is all about. What the president and administration are trying to do is replace freedom and choice with mandates and government controls. Our presidency and his panel of foreign dissidents who came from socialism where wealth is but one class, the government.

    Distribution of wealth is a term that should be used with federal spending and taxation, not economic way of life and independence of the people of this nation. Distribution of wealth is what the americans want it to be, not what government mandates it to be. If people want the wealth of corporate business they will take it without government permission or mandates.

    Organized labor will elevate and restore economic growth, and organized labor is not affiliated by party or government or news media insinuations. Suck on it Rush Limbaugh, unions do not recruit workers by political affiliation or corporate politics. Unions preserve prosperity and workers rights. How workers spend their earnings is no ones business and his accusation are unfounded and criminal, there are a lot of republicans belong to unions.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Sept. 15, 2012 12:09 a.m.

    Thou shalt not lie:

    * I will cut the deficit in half
    * If I haven't turned things around in my first three years, then it's one term.
    * My father fought in World War 2. A three year old father?

    Thou shalt not covet:

    * rich people?---that's not fair
    * you think you're smart and hard working? You didn't build that! Somebody else did.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Sept. 14, 2012 11:55 p.m.


    Mitt Romney has given millions to BYU. How is that, "oppression of the poor by the rich?". Couldn't this be envy?

    Mitt's probably given more to charities then you'll make in a lifetime.

    Envy and whining? Thou shalt not covet.

    I feel no oppression from Mitt.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 11:50 p.m.

    "making each dollar worth less and less! So what cost you a dollar last year now cost you 1.50 today! "

    Inflation is about 2% a year under Obama, below normal.

    "The countries with the highest disparity between the Wealthy and the Poor ALWAYS are those with the most government control over the economy. i.e. dictatorship, Socialist, Communist. "

    Half right. Third world dictatorships have horrible wealth inequality. Socialist first world nations however... Canada has less wealth inequality than the US. So does France, Germany, Norway, Denmark... the list goes on. The top 20% in the US own 84% of the wealth. In Sweden the top 20% owns 36% of the wealth. Care to claim that the US is more socialist than Sweden?

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Sept. 14, 2012 11:22 p.m.

    Rich-poor gap?

    Yes, because we're not all the same.

    It's like school. Some work hard and make the honor code, while others do very little. They could have got better grades but just wouldn't do it.

    Mitt Romney worked without an inheritance and became rich. Great for him, and people like LSD Liberal should be ashamed of his envy for someones success in the American system. Very ub-American.

    Mr. Liberal! Did you criticize Ted Kennedy for being rich?

  • MormonDem Provo, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 11:06 p.m.

    Dadof5sons: that's just not true. Inflation hasn't risen much, at least not as a monetary issue. Food prices have gone up, but that's because of commodity speculation, drought, etc.

    The Book of Mormon tells the story, over and over again, of civilizations rising and falling. And the surest sign of corruption in the Book of Mormon, over and over again, is the widening of the gap between the rich and the poor, and oppression of the poor by the rich.

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    Sept. 14, 2012 11:01 p.m.

    Don Quixote you nailed it. Getting out this will require sacrifice from all; no sacred cows.

  • Dadof5sons Montesano, WA
    Sept. 14, 2012 8:59 p.m.

    Lets look at the root cause of this. if some one becomes rich another person does ne become poor! what is happening under Obama and Bernakie in federal reserve is. Printing of trillions of dollars! making each dollar worth less and less! So what cost you a dollar last year now cost you 1.50 today! The wages of people have not been cut the power of buying with that dollar has been decreased! So now under QE3 our dollar will be worth 42 cents or less if the fed keeps printing money!

  • A1994 Centerville, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 7:31 p.m.

    The answer is more capitalism, not less. The United States has elevated the standard of living for the whole world because of liberty and capitalism here. I cannot understand why anyone who has read history would assume the government could legislate equality. When has concentrating power in the hands of a few people in government ever ended well? Cuba? The Soviet Union? Even our socialist friends across the pond haven't been able to make this work. Life isn't fair, but in America it comes a lot closer than anywhere else in the world.

  • donquixote84721 Cedar City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 6:51 p.m.

    One of the major problems in America today is Entitlements, and it affects both the Upper Class and Lower Class. The Upper Class have been taught to believe that they are entitled to all that they can get, regardless of who it hurts or kills, and the Lower Class believe that they are entitled to all they can get for nothing.

  • ThunderBell Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 6:49 p.m.

    The countries with the highest disparity between the Wealthy and the Poor ALWAYS are those with the most government control over the economy. i.e. dictatorship, Socialist, Communist.

    Collectivist movements all supposedly start out to be about the good of the people but as they mature they find that the obstreperous nature of mankind requires more and more control until all of the power and, therefore, most of the wealth is concentrated in the hands of the "ruling class."

    It follows that the more America allows power to concentrate in Washington or in the hands of "elite" the more the disparity between Wealthy and Poor American will grow.

    Where there is no competition or where the winners and losers are picked by the elite, who consider themselves smarter than everyone else, instead of in the competition of the marketplace the loser is always freedom.

    Holderlin observed "What has always made the sate a hell on earth is that man has tried to make it his heaven"

  • m.g. scott LAYTON, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 5:40 p.m.

    Don't worry Democrats. The media will make sure it's all Bush Romney and Ryans fault. When bad news like this comes out, no one has ever heard of President Obama.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 5:24 p.m.

    @lost in DC
    "Incompetent POTUS BO wants the gap to expand even further so he can create MORE dependency on the dems and further consolidate their hold on power."

    I could've sworn that conservatives thought Obama wanted to steal money from the rich to hand to the moochers at the bottom... which is literally the opposite of what you are claiming he wants to do with the wealth gap. Can't you all keep your attacks consistent?

  • justamacguy Manti, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 5:22 p.m.

    Excuse me but Obama already made this definition. If the deseret news allowed this I would give video links to him saying this. If you lived on the East Coast it might be true. One thing for sure, Romney has plans for projects that will make jobs. Such as the keystone pipeline. We know what we're getting already with Obama. The last four years have not been job increases. Trying something new might be better.

  • Fred44 Salt Lake City, Utah
    Sept. 14, 2012 5:03 p.m.

    lost in DC,

    You have stumbled on the democrats secret plan get everyone on welfare then give them a check that doesn't cover their basic needs and they will love and worship you. Makes perfect sense.

    Face it Instereo is right, look at the numbers this has been trending this exact same since President Reagan and trickle down economics. I will confess I voted for President Reagan and I thought trickle down economics made sense. The problem was I didn't realize who little a trickle the wealthy would send down the pipe.

    I will be honest I still believe that in theory trickle down would work, the problem is that the wealthy don't want to let a reasonable amount of money trickle down, they want it all for themselves.

  • Kent C. DeForrest Provo, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 5:00 p.m.

    Political platforms are largely irrelevant to this problem. It is a symptom of a dysfunctional system called corporate capitalism that has a dual pay structure. The system is designed at its most fundamental level to pay one group (the owners and managers of capital) as much as possible and to pay the other group (wage laborers) as little as possible. It is simply good business to minimize costs, one of the primary ones being labor. This is why jobs continue to be sent abroad or replaced by technology.

    Yes, we can tax the pants off the first group, but that still doesn't cure the underlying illness or fix the system. Even when we had a top marginal tax rate of 94 percent, the rich still managed to get richer (albeit at a slower pace, and the middle did expand). But to cure this illness, there is really only one solution. That is to share ownership of businesses with those who are actually producing the wealth. Any other solution will be ephemeral and eventually lead to the same dead-end.

  • Dave D Pocatello, ID
    Sept. 14, 2012 4:59 p.m.

    Doctrine and Covenants 49: 19-20

    19 For, behold, the beasts of the field and the fowls of the air, and that which cometh of the earth, is ordained for the use of man for food and for craiment, and that he might have in abundance.

    20 But it is not given that one man should apossess that which is above another, wherefore the world lieth in sin.

    Living in inequality is sinful, not just nationally, but internationally. Let's do something about it.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 4:45 p.m.

    Incompetent POTUS BO wants the gap to expand even further so he can create MORE dependency on the dems and further consolidate their hold on power.


  • Instereo Eureka, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 4:24 p.m.

    This gap isn't a one year event. It started widening during the Reagan years and accelerated during the Bush 1 and 2 years. During Clinton it slowed but still increased. Once Trickle Down Economics defined by Reagan, it was morally justified, legislated and deregulated into existence. Now of course both presidential campaigns will make it a talking point. As I see though, it came about because of GOP policies and they aren't going to anything with their party platform ideas. It's important to give the president who is elected the tools, that is members in Congress, to fix this. So it's much more then a presidential campaign issue, it's a party ticket issue. I'm sure most in Utah will choose the GOP Ticket, so I guess they don't really want to fix the problem.

  • Whatever Springville, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 3:51 p.m.

    "Middle income is $200,000 to $250,000 and less"

    Just when you start to think that Romney has no clue how actual middle class families live, he opens his mouth and removes all doubt.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 3:50 p.m.

    In fairness to Romney, the words "and less" make me think he was trying to say "below 200k individual or 250k married" in a manner similar to how tax cuts for those making over that are referred to as the "tax cuts for the rich".

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 3:30 p.m.

    "Is $100,000 middle income?" Stephanopoulos asked.

    "No, middle income is $200,000 to $250,000 and less," Romney responded.


    The Democrats don't need to paint Romney as an out-of-touch wealthy Billioaire.

    He does a fine job of it all by himself.

    This from the same POTUS candidate that can't name a single tax-loop hole he'd get rid of....

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 3:00 p.m.

    "Of course this would mean Romney/Ryan for 2012."

    They don't have a jobs plan other than their massive cuts to gov't jobs. Firing a million people isn't a jobs plan.

  • kiapolo Provo, MA
    Sept. 14, 2012 2:37 p.m.

    Romney is way too out of touch to be any help here. Just today he defined "middle income" as $200-$250k a year.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 2:19 p.m.

    And POTUS wannabe Mega-Millionaire Mitt Romney sees not only as GOOD news, but wants this trend to not only continue, but Increase!


  • patriot Cedar Hills, UT
    Sept. 14, 2012 2:12 p.m.

    so much for handouts and wealth redistribution. The end result is that everybody suffers. The solution is jobs jobs jobs. Create the best jobs environment and forget the handouts. Of course this would mean Romney/Ryan for 2012.