Anyone working for Alpine understands the spin being spun here. This article
makes it sound like things are hunky- dory but fails to mention the fairly
drastic reduction in benefits (one plan essentially is a 5% pay cut if you add
up the yearly premiums) announced this year which sends those of us with a large
family and a budget scrambling for cover. Many outside of education point to
overly generous health care packages. Truth be told those packages have been
weed-wacked over the last few years with increases at every turn. I don't
ask for wealth. I simply need to make enough to support my family. What other
profession is routinely asked "so what's your other job?" I think
our state is so satisfied with being really good that we overlook what it would
take, in terms of proper funding, to transform us towards greatness.
This is disgusting, and the board has got to go, and so does Doty. What a
disgusting joke. We voted for the split to gain more control over our local
schools and dollars. All we got for our effort is a legacy Jordan District
administration, same arrogance, and maybe even worse. If I really spoke my mind
the paper would not publish my comments. Doty came in making such wonderful
promises and lofty goals. What a joke! The whole thing is upside down. We the
tax payers should be the ultimate word, but that means we need to do our
homework. There is no election where we can have a greater impact than our local
school board, but that means we have to pay attention, and maybe even get
involved. Then we might avoid such nonsense.
As a teacher in the district I take umbrage with the claim by Seek to Understand
that short days are lost days. In my classroom on short days we delve deeply
into mathematics concepts and activities (spending more time on this than we do
on other days)as well as spending time on specific focused small group reading
instruction. A lost day? I think not. The chunk of time in the afternoon after
the children have gone home is precious time during which multiple activities
are prepared for the coming week which directly relate to the quality of the
instruction that I am able to provide. Could the same thing be accomplished in
the prep time after school on the other days as was proposed? I am not sure. It
seems there is value to a chunk of uninterrupted time such as we are given (if
we are lucky) on short days for one to maintain some momentum. My main concern
about the proposed change was that I would have wished for the teachers to be
more included in the conversations about it.
If the District Administration is so squeaky clean, they should initiate an
independent investigation into the alleged incidents of intimidation etc. The
District big wigs seem to be running in reverse to get away from any reporters
etc. It is odd that the whole District Administration is blaming the most
conservative News Organizations in the State. There is definitely smoke coming
out of the Canyons District. Someone needs to get in there and find the fire,
and put it out. It will have to start with a whole new look to the School
Board!!! Make sure to get out and vote for one of the good guys on June 26th
and November 6th!!!
Sorry to disappoint - I am just a mom whose 6 kids graduated from Canyons
schools. I've never had any connection to the school board and am sorry to
say I have only attended 3 board meetings in 10 years. I've never
understood how the schools could accomplish what they needed to with such short
days and only attending 4.5 days per week. Coming from the midwest, our days
were longer and we went all 5 days.Being a bit of a stats geek, and
working in the medical field where outcomes are life and death and are honored
as important, I wondered how the schools could fit everything in with less time
in school. I learned the sad way that they don't. My 3 youngest had to
attend private schools in order to work up to their potential until high school
when they could get into an advanced course (AP, IB, etc.). When
Doty suggested we go a full 5 days I was excited. Yes, they were taking time
away from the remaining days which I thought was a step backward, but at least
Fridays wouldn't be lost days any longer and on balance it is a better
I highly suspect that "Seek to Understand" is one of the bullying
members of the Canyons School Board, aka Kim Horiuch. If this is the case, then
all of "Seek"'s comments make perfect sense. Even though Kim
Horiuchi is not up for re-election this year she is backing the incumbents and
one of the candidates in precinct 3 to maintain her power base. Horiuchi,
Cowdell and Dody have made themselves a nice little empire that they do not want
disrupted. If you are in precinct 3, please do your homework and study the
candidates and get out to Vote Tuesday, June 26th.
Carman, you missed my point. I do not believe that teachers are over paid. I
have the equivalent of another forty hours of college credit after my BS degree
and I still earn little enough to qualify for my family to qualify for WIC,
reduced lunch at school, and a full tax return. My take home is less than
3100/mo. (no matter what utahsrighttokknow.com says) I live in a modest ten year
old home, and drive a 15 year old car with the majority of the paint coming off.
(but its paid for) I'm not complaining, but I definitely don't deserve
a pay cut!
The idea that Dr. Doty is too worthy to talk to the D-News is fascinating. I
wonder if Seek to Understand is currently on the School Board. My guess it is
Kim H. This mess in the Canyons District is getting worse by the minute. Three
Board members are up for election this year. There is an important Primary
Election in Precinct Three. This is Kevin Cromar's seat. The voters would
be wise to study the three candidates carefully before they vote on Tuesday the
26th. One of the candidates appears to be hand picked by Doty, Dolan, Cowdell,
and Kim H. The only way to fix the Canyons District is to put three new faces on
the Board this fall. It is also ironic that the Canyons Board Members are paid
around thirty thousand dollars a year, while most Board Members in the State
make between two to three thousand dollars. The Canyons Board Members make more
than a first year teacher for a part time job!!! They also get an excellent
insurance package. This pay raise for Doty, and what the Canyons Board Members
make is obscene. The voters need to fix this mess!!
I would be happy to see administrators get bonuses when my kids and their
teachers don't have to take five furlough days a year. Get the kids back in
the classroom and then we can talk about huge raises and outsized bonuses.
To the tax payers of the Canyons School District...Mr. Doty is the
Superintendent of a large school district. He has several Asst. Superintendents
which administer different areas of the district, i.e. Transportation, Human
Resources, Maintenance etc. and these people have people under them which are
the ones who really put their feet on the ground for day to day supervision.
Mr. Doty does not get his hands dirty with the nuts and bolts of the
district. He is nothing but a figure head.Mr. Doty best attribute
is convincing your school board how great he is and he will try to make due on
such meager means.But I DO NOT feel sorry for you,this district is
what you wanted,this new district will run better, with more control to the
citizens. The laugh is on you...now one district is two and you have
two times of everything which includes two Superintendents making more money
than most of you will ever see.The only thing you can do is vote out
those board members who are up this term and the others when their term comes.
These are the people who have approved this.
Dr. Doty angered the teachers by trying to do what is best for students -
eliminating the short day. Since that time, he has been under attack. Some of
the best Superintendents in the country have experienced similar pushback from a
vocal minority when they implement meaningful reforms.The "short
day" in Utah is an "untouchable". Teachers are accustomed to having
Friday be a lost day and parents are accustomed to a 3 day weekend. There is
no justification for the short day on Friday, and Dr. Doty reasonably saw this
and made a move to eliminate it (while maintaining teacher prep time by
spreading it out during the week). I'm sure he had no idea how sacred the
early out was and we are now seeing the results of immature adults who
emotionally place their convenience above the academic achievement of students.
This type of illogical thinking is why our schools don't
improve as they could. Fortunately for us in the Canyons District, the majority
of parents are smart enough to know that Dr. Doty is a treasure. I
also have to mention that the class envy on these posts is embarrassing.
Interesting that the board does not announce this pay raise for the
superintendent until after the teachers have settled with them on their
compensation for next year. Knowing that he gets 13+% when teachers get 1% is an
insulting blow to morale. Is he really that much more important than the people
who spend hour after hour and day after day with the children?
I seem to remember the last time any Canyons administrator or teacher contacted
a board member about concerns, the board member was censored. This was the first
time in my memory and education career (starting in 1971)that a board member was
censored for talking with employees, or when a superintendent required all
district personnel communication go through him before going to a board member.
What competant superintendent would accept the terms of this kind of contract
when teachers and classified people got such a pittance this year? Shame on you,
David Doty, for your apparent lack of empathy and concern for the people doing
the work in the trenches. I am glad I am not an employee of Canyons School
District. Hopefully the electorate will do their duty and install a board that
answers to their community and not just to the superintendent they hired.
Carman, check your facts, please. Wisconsin teachers were under the QEO
(Qualified Economic Offer) since 1993, which enabled school districts to offer
their teachers' unions a salary and benefit package of 3.8% that settled
all economic issues and precluded binding arbitration. That may sound generous,
until you understand that the 3.8% was a biennial, district-wide increase,
including all staff-related expenses, such as pay increases for younger teachers
and all health insurance increases. The net result was that older teachers,
such as my husband, had basically frozen salaries, for over a decade. Now, on
top of this, we have been hit by our governor's Act 10, which lowered our
family's net pay by an additional $400 a month, with promises of future
cuts; that's with a Master's Degree +24 and almost 30 years
experience. Even before Act 10, Wisconsin teachers' income had fallen from
15th to 21st (starting pay is 30th). The rest of Wisconsin increased their
income at twice the rate of teacher pay, during the same two decades. Not
everything political that spins your way is remotely close to the truth. In
this case, not even close.
Ahhh Seek is back. It's been a while. Still posting the most hilarious
stuff though.Way to raise the ire of all the rest of the readers.
"You have not proven yourself worthy of his time". And here I thought
idol-worshipping was a thing of the past. Seek to Understand, aka
Mrs. Doty, any administrator worth his salt needs to have the fortitude to
answer hard questions. That's what leaders do.
Hawko:You got it right. The midwest is paying in layoffs and
service reductions for years of pay and benefit raises where school boards
forgot that teachers are public servants. My grandfather was a superintendant
back in the days when that truly was a public service. I don't believe we
should go back to those days, but we shouldn't be putting people in the top
3% either. And most resources should be targeted at the classroom.
Let's get more qualified and experienced math and science teachers in the
classroom, instead of so many who are straight out of college. Math and science
require years of teaching experience to master. At ten years in the classroom,
the very best natural teachers are just starting to hit their stride in these
subjects at ten years. If we paid them more, we perhaps could get them to stay
in the classroom instead of having them jump to administration jobs just so they
can make ends meet.
The school Superintendents pay should be a multiplier of the median school
teachers pay. It seems the front line that does real work in schools,
corporations, government and about everywhere else always get the shaft. I
guess the only exception is in professional sports.
I am a teacher. I love my job, but it's tough to makes ends meet on my
salary. I work seasonal jobs to add to my budget, and I just took a job at a
grocery store nights to help with medical expenses not covered fully by the
benefits package so many non-teachers think we teachers have. Having said this,
something stinks in the Canyons. Taking a pay raise like that when the teachers
who actually DO the work in the trenches are often getting cuts in benefits or
freezes in pay is morally wrong. I'm not arguing at this time for higher
teacher pay, rather, I am arguing that administration often forgets that they
are servants of the public. I believe they should be compensated as such. This
goes for all government as well. THey are servants of the people, not the other
way around. Cut administration benefits, cut congressional benefits. Let them
all earn a living wage that keeps them more grounded! THis man should be ashamed
of himself for his glutinous wage, him and many other administrators in this
@Seek to Understand: your comments about Superintendent Doty not giving the
DNews time for an interview because it is not "worthy" is quite possibly
the scariest thing I have read here in a very long time. Here we have one of the
most conservative newspapers in the country run by the LDS Church and it is not
deemed worthy of interviewing a public servant, a man who is being paid with
taxpayer dollars? Was there a memo I missed reading that said public officials
get to hide?
Seek To Understand:Somehow, I don't think that is why Doty wont give the
Deseret News an interview. And I don't know how you figure rest of
that..?Quality of education all boils down to what happens in the
classroom, not what happens in the superintendents office. It's funny,
when I taught, I didn't even know who the superintendent was, nor do I know
who the superintendent is in the district my kids attend. Everyone knows who
Doty is, and none of what we know is complementary!
A school board and superintendent that appear to be benefiting each other at the
expense of the school district they have a responsibility to support is very
troubling at the very least, and probably need to be investigated. When it comes
to teachers/students they seem to often have the attitude of "It's
about us, not them" when it absolutely should be the opposite. Their refusal
as public servants to do interviews is a concern. What are they trying to
hide?I want to move to Sandy/Draper area, but I'm not making a
move as long as the current administration is in power (and POWER seems to be
the key word). I hope that a board with common sense who will take a stand and
do what's best for the teachers and students will be voted in."Seek to Understand" - please provide full disclosure about your
relationship with Doty and the Board. You can't seriously think that with
all the teacher discontent in the Canyons district that there isn't a
serious problem with the administration. Why would any parent support that kind
of atmosphere that their children are a part of?
Obviously the school "board" (I use the term loosely)aren't doing
their due diligence.I've known a few of these highly paid,
professional administrators. The one thing they're good at is convincing a
"board" of their invincibility. Their "skill sets", usually
aren't anywhere near how well they can convince the "boards" of
their "vast skills".Another way to look at a position like
this is: if they paid someone HALF his salary, exactly what would be the
result?Be specific please.Conversely, if they pd. someone
TWICE his salary, would they get someone TWICE as good?How, why?Salaries like these in the public sector defy logic!
There seems to be a strange infatuation of the Canyon District school board for
Superintendent Doty. They seem to have little interest in the students and
teachers in their school district but have a need to reward and revere their
"leader." Maybe they need some psychological testing from one of their
DNews is "not worthy of his time?" I think that "Seek to
Understand" does not comprehend the duty of an administrator. His economic
status seems to have inspired some sort of reverence that is disproportionate to
your obvious disdain for the poorly compensated "malcontents" and
"angry teachers." The classroom is where the rubber meets the road, in
education. Canyons' Superintendent pads his own generous pay package,
while overseeing a mere 1% increase, below the cost of living, on some of the
lowest-paid teachers in the nation. Attitude reflects leadership. If you truly
"seek to understand," try talking to some of the teachers, and support
staff, in your district. You might learn something.
Who says there is no money in education?? Yet all we hear is the taxpayers
don't pay enough. From now on, tell your kids to grow up to be a doctor,
lawyer, school superintendent.
As a Canyons District parent I am grateful to have such a competent
Superintendent and I thank our Board for not bowing to the voice of a few
malcontents with regard to Mr. Doty's employment.Superintendent
Doty has proven himself able to be a strong leader in the face of much
contention in a new district with several different strong factions. He is
just what we needed for this transition to a new district and he had done a
phenomenal job.He made the teachers angry this spring, so there is a
witch hunt on and the news doesn't print his accomplishments or interview
those of us who really know and understand how his leadership has been a great
asset to our students and our schools. I am disappointed that
whenever Superintendent Doty is brought up in the news it sounds like common
neighborhood gossip. No wonder he won't give you an interview DNews - you
have not proven yourself worthy of his time and I see that as just one more
reason to applaud his intelligence and good character.
Like the old cowboy said: "If we could buy him for what he's worth and
sell him for what he thinks he's worth, we'd all be rich."
We tried to talk folks out of voting for the district split but people drank the
koolaid. When will the Canyons School District patrons realize that you have a
golden opportunity now to do the right thing and that is when school board
elections come up that you vote out the current board and bring in a new board
that will "right the ship"?
Not worth it.
Those are some pretty ugly numbers. Forcing five days without pay and other
cuts, and then giving all those bucks to one person is pretty bad stuff. I
concur that the coming elections must be used to purge the district of the Doty
friendly school board and then Doty himself.Wonder how many new
books for classrooms his big buck increase could have purchased? Money for Doty
and cutbacks on books for kids. Everything is wrong with that picture!
This is outrageous!The Canyons School Board must be replaced as they
come up for election!Given the history of his contentious behavior,
the bloated spending (necessitating $15 million in custs with no apparent
reduction in education results), the Superintendent's compensation is
already excessively generous both in base salary, benefits, raise and bonus.Public officials should not be getting paid vastly more than the people
they work for!We need NEW School Board members who will cut the
Superintendent's pay by 25% immediately and cancel ALL automatic increases.
And, voters need to vote AGAINST any property tax increases for Canyones School
District, given their history of wasteful and bloated spending.