Kansas asks court to exclude voters over citizenship proof

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  • A Guy With A Brain Enid, OK
    Aug. 27, 2016 12:51 p.m.

    And some other activities that require a picture ID:

    - apply for Social Security
    - pick up a welfare check in person
    - pick up a Social Security check in person
    - buy a gun
    - buy ammunition
    - apply for a driver's license
    - pick up advance tickets to a show or sporting event
    - going to an R-rated movie (if you look close to 18)
    - registering for school
    - entering many businesses/work places now require a picture ID to be shown to a guard

    To those who argue about picture ID/verifying proof of citizenship for voting: I appreciate that you want to be "nice" to everyone and disenfranchise no one, but your arguments do NOT pass the common sense test.

    What is most precious to us should be protected with our most strenuous efforts. Period.

  • A Guy With A Brain Enid, OK
    Aug. 27, 2016 12:39 p.m.

    Keep people from voting until they can prove they are actually US citizens?

    Makes perfect sense to everyone but diehard liberals.

    You need an ID:

    - to write a check
    - to withdraw money at a bank
    - to get a driver's license
    - to get a boarding pass at the ticket counter for your airline flight
    - to take the ACT test
    - to take the SAT test
    - to buy a pack of cigarettes
    - to buy a beer at the 7-11
    - to use your credit card at many stores

    But to vote and choose the leaders of your country?

    Oh, no, that would be "racist" or "bigotry".

  • JimInSLC Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 2:30 p.m.

    SSN's do not verify citizenship, but an SSN is required to be employed. Many illegal aliens have an SSN that they have obtained illegally so that they can work. An estimated 80,000 SSN# of Utah children are being used by someone other than the person it was assigned.

    Therefore, if the SSN was required, a quick check could verify the age of the person assigned the number. I doubt that many illegal aliens with stolen SSN# would be showing up to vote if they knew that the SSN# was being checked.

    Using another persons SSN# is a felony. Felons lose their right to vote.

  • Contrarius mid-state, TN
    Aug. 23, 2016 2:09 p.m.

    @David --

    "But we can still verify citizenship. It's 2016. It shouldn't be that hard.

    And the benefits justify the effort of verifying."

    Read that judge's decision again. Read the facts about how few cases of in-person voter fraud there have actually been.

    Kansas (and the other states that have had their laws knocked down) is proposing a solution when there is no significant problem. And their "solution" ends up disenfranchising thousands.

    They're moving **backwards**.

  • David Centerville, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 1:17 p.m.

    I appreciate the concerns raised by Kalindra & Co. Don't use SSN or drivers licenses then. But we can still verify citizenship. It's 2016. It shouldn't be that hard.

    And the benefits justify the effort of verifying.

  • Kalindra Salt Lake City, Utah
    Aug. 23, 2016 12:36 p.m.

    @ David: So you want to just willy bully give out your social security number to who knows whom? Why don't you just go ahead and post that here - save identity thieves standing at the polling place to get it - same net effect.

    The voters who would be disenfranchised by this, have IDs - none of your examples are relevant because they have driver's licenses and are able to do every one of those voluntary activities. What the state wants to do is prevent them from exercising a Constitutional right to vote. Huuuuuuge difference.

    There is no reasonable excuse to deny these voters the right to vote.

  • Contrarius mid-state, TN
    Aug. 23, 2016 12:33 p.m.

    @David --

    "Do all Americans have a Social Security Number?"

    Nope. For instance, Old Order Amish don't. Also, noncitizens CAN get SS numbers with work permits. SS numbers do *not* verify citizenship.

    "In the United States, a Social Security number (SSN) is a nine-digit number issued to U.S. citizens, permanent residents, and temporary (working) residents under section 205(c)(2) of the Social Security Act, codified as 42 U.S.C. ยง 405(c)(2)."

    Keep trying.

  • David Centerville, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 11:55 a.m.

    AuContrarius,

    Do all Americans have a Social Security Number? As JiminSLC mentioned, SSN would be a great way to simply verify citizenship.

    It's 2016. We are talking about cars driving themselves. But we can't verify voter eligibility? It's not that hard folks.

    When I purchase some medications I have to show picture id. I don't buy cigarettes or beer, but I understand that if I did I would have to show picture id for proof of my age. To drive a car I have to have a drivers license. To apply for a loan, to rent an apartment, to get a library card, to cash a check at the bank...we have to verify all kinds of daily functions.

    Of course we should and can verify voter eligibility.

  • JimInSLC Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 11:28 a.m.

    Voting is a right; A right of citizenship. voting precincts should have voters give their SS#, everyone of voting age should have one assigned to them. Then do a quick lookup to check the age of the person the number is assigned. Let the voters know in advance. That should keep most non-citizens away from the polls.

  • AuContrarius mid-state, TN
    Aug. 23, 2016 10:46 a.m.

    @David --

    "Reagan said to trust, but verify. Nothing wrong with that folks."

    Kansas already got their voter suppression law overturned in federal court. But they're still trying.

    As Judge Robinson wrote in that decision: "even if instances of noncitizens voting cause indirect voter disenfranchisement by diluting the votes of citizens, such instances pale in comparison to the number of qualified citizens who have been disenfranchised by this law." Also, "Although the Court is cognizant that the injunction will cause some administrative burden to the State, it is a burden that is outweighed by the risk of thousands of otherwise eligible voters being disenfranchised in upcoming federal elections." and "On this record, the Court cannot find that the State's interest in preventing noncitizens from voting in Kansas outweighs the risk of disenfranchising thousands of qualified voters."

    Remember -- there have only been THREE cases of in-person fraud found in Kansas, within the last **20 years** -- yet the law disenfranchises thousands of voters. It's a horrible cure for a very tiny problem.

  • David Centerville, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 10:18 a.m.

    Uh...with 11+ million illegal immigrants in the country, it simply makes sense to verify citizenship when voting?

    Reagan said to trust, but verify. Nothing wrong with that folks. It sounds like a pretty reasonable way to make sure our elections aren't compromised. When voters feel the election has been honest and well run, they will better accept the outcome of the elections. Who doesn't want a peaceful transition following elections?

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Aug. 23, 2016 8:44 a.m.

    It's Kansas. They're not just financially broke.

  • AuContrarius mid-state, TN
    Aug. 23, 2016 7:59 a.m.

    And even when the federal courts tell these states to cut it out, they are STILL trying to disenfranchise voters. Sheesh.

    "Robinson said evidence in the case shows only three instances in Kansas where noncitizens voted in a federal election between 1995 and 2013, and about 14 noncitizens attempted to register during that time. Robinson said the number of people disenfranchised outweighed the harm of those cases."

    Keep reading that til it sinks in, folks. Kansas and other states are talking about disenfranchising thousands of voters just because THREE people voted illegally over the course of 20 years. Seriously??