Hotter, weirder: How climate has changed Earth

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  • oaklandaforlife SLC, UT
    Dec. 6, 2014 7:20 p.m.

    Climate change is just an outright lie. Just ask any of our beloved GOP delegates.

  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Dec. 5, 2014 9:53 a.m.

    Cats says:
    "I've just seen and read the articles of too many scientists to make me believe that global warming is a threat or that it is man made. "

    --- Then you didn't understand what you read.

    worf says:
    "Melting icebergs will cause coastal flooding. ... Nope!
    Try this.
    Get an empty ice tray. Fill it with water, then place it in a freezer.
    When the water freezes, notice how the ice cubes takes up more space. Water expands when frozen."

    --- What happens when ice on land melts into the oceans? You forgot to include that aspect in your experiment. Now, take your glass full of water, place ice cubes above it. Does it not then overflow?

  • jasonlivy Orem, UT
    Dec. 5, 2014 1:43 a.m.

    My question is, at what point do we reach a climate that we are happy with? What if we stop driving our cars completely, stop eating beef, shut down every plant that omits emissions, recycle every piece of garbage we generate, build all of houses out of mud and straw, and plant a trillion trees. Will that be where we decide that global warming is no longer an issue? That brings on another question, who determines what the optimum climate for our planet is? I like the idea of having a warmer planet. The last few years have been too cold for me.

    This spring I returned from backpacking a week in the Maze District in Canyonlands and a group from Montana who've made regular visits there every year for the past 30 years could not get over the incredible wild flower growth this year, the best they had ever seen! Water was in abundance and the desert was alive and well!

    I'm kind of rooting for global warming...

  • Frozen Fractals Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 4, 2014 12:49 p.m.

    @worf
    Sea ice melting causes the water level to decrease. Land ice melt from glaciers (Greenland etc) cause sea level rise because that's adding water to the system that wasn't in the ocean before like the sea ice was.

  • Frozen Fractals Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 4, 2014 12:46 p.m.

    @illuminated
    "and this year was one of the coldest on record."

    Every temperature dataset (NOAA, NASA, CRU, UAH, RSS) has this year on pace to be one of the top 5 warmest on record globally.

    "There has been no warming in the last 20 years"

    Every year in the 1990s except 1998 is colder than every year from 2001 onward in all 5 datasets.

    "It is a scientific fact that 2014 has been the coldest years in the last 15 years."

    In Wisconsin and Illinois and neighboring states, and that's about it. That statement is completely wrong for the globe.

    "We have to go back 100 years to find a solar maximum that was as weak as the one we are in right now, and the recent solar minimum...one has to go back 200 years to find one that was as weak."

    Considering we're in the weakest solar cycle in a century and have a barely not El Nino year, if this were all just natural effects, why did we just set a 12-month record high in the NOAA dataset? Something has to account for this.

  • Uncle_Fester Niskayuna, NY
    Dec. 4, 2014 10:56 a.m.

    I wonder why, (if climate change is so dangerous) insurers including Lloyd's do not even list climate change in their top 20 concerns going forward. It would seem that potential for catastrophe would be a concern. The truth is models -which is the only place any significant warming exists- are not able to predict anything and can't even get it right when used to predict last year's temps where all inputs are known.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Dec. 3, 2014 10:56 a.m.

    Melting icebergs will cause coastal flooding. A result of global warming? Nope!

    Try this.

    Get an empty ice tray. Fill it with water, then place it in a freezer.

    When the water freezes, notice how the ice cubes takes up more space. Water expands when frozen.

    If the ice cube represent icebergs, the water level along the coastline will decrease as icebergs melt, because the iceberg is expanded water.

    Hmm? Could our political leaders, Al Gore, and media, been telling us something which are true?

  • JJ1094 Saratoga, UT
    Dec. 3, 2014 6:03 a.m.

    @Liberal Ted

    You must be younger - when I was in school was that we would be facing a thick blanket of clouds which resulted from the use of fossil fuels. The blanket would cover the earth, reflecting much of the solar energy off the planet and we were entering into another huge ice age which would cripple agriculture and starve the world's population. Yes, that was the effect of global climate change.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 4:14 p.m.

    Dear Kwall,

    I didn't say we can't effect the ENVIRONMENT. I'm for clean air and water as much as anyone else. I don't believe we can change the CLIMATE or stop it from changing. I've just seen and read the articles of too many scientists to make me believe that global warming is a threat or that it is man made. The climate has always been in a state of change since time began. We have always adapted to that rather than trying to stop it or change it.

  • Raiders11 OGDEN, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 4:04 p.m.

    The greatest threat we will ever face is when people dont simply look at facts that come from different sources and scientist throughout the US. all facts go and show that the Earth's temps have shot up dramatically within the last 30 years.

    just in the us here is a quote:
    "The year 2013 tied with 1980 as the 37th warmest in 119 years of data for the contiguous 48 U.S. states, according to the National Climatic Data Center (NCDC). This follows the record warmth of 2012, which was substantially warmer—a full degree Fahrenheit (0.6°C)—than any other year since national records began in 1895. The U.S. warming rate of about 1.3°F (0.72°C) per century (blue line in the graph at bottom right) is roughly comparable to the global rate of warming (see above)."

    you want the source just look it up. dont go looking for some republican or democrat answer look at a scientific commnunity has looked up i really do not CARE if you are republican or democrat i really dont. if you want our lives to be any better or even the lives of our children to be better then we need to do something.

  • What in Tucket? Provo, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 2:27 p.m.

    Buffalo had the heaviest snowfall in memory recently. In August the Antarctic ice pack reached a record over 2 million kilometers square. Hard to get too excited when global warmers try so hard. in the meantime Asia is increasing the number of coal plants while here the death rattle of coal is hardly heard as natural gas takes over. We are making good progress here. Photo voltaic energy has doubled this year for example, but we are not ready for all renewables. A good storage system is needed to make solar viable.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 1:08 p.m.

    To "Raiders11" we are not in trouble unless we adopt the policies proposed by leftists. Economists have look at the effects of enacting all of the carbon trading and governmental controls on businesses vs just dealing with problems as they come up, and the economists have found that the best thing to do is to deal with the problems as they come up.

  • Kwall Logan, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 12:53 p.m.

    @ Cats

    You really think humans cannot affect our environment? Humans affecting climate isn't one big action in one place that is causing the whole climate to change. It is just the accumulation of smaller effects we have had on our environment. Its the accumulation of deforesting, emissions, and development among other things. So in order to believe we cannot change the climate, you would have to believe that we cannot have negative impacts on our environment. Do you really believe that?

  • silo Sandy, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 12:30 p.m.

    @illuminated

    Ice caps on both north and south poles are _not_ growing bigger each year. Stop mis-representing buzzword articles from Heritage Foundation as data.

    Fact: Polar ice is measured three ways. Area, Volume and Extent. Only Sea Ice Extent is increasing, and only in the south pole. Research Sea Ice Extent...it's not considered a good thing, nor is it considered the slightest indicator that warming has stopped, nor reversed.

    Your quote from Jens Pedersen says exactly the opposite of what you are claiming it says. If we are experiencing the weakest solar cycle in 100-200 years, and that weak solar cycle should be causing massive cooling, then why is 2014 the warmest year in the 100+ years of global temp data? Even if you (incorrectly) buy into the idea that temps have levelled over the past 15 years, shouldn't those temps have declined unless countered by warming from another source?

    Again. Forbes, heritage foundation, climatedepot and other right-wing entertainment outlets are not valid, nor reliable, sources for objective data. Every time you reference any of them, your bias is laid bare.

  • FT salt lake city, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 12:28 p.m.

    Long before man created any religon or even before man walked the earth, Mother Nature was here. She has kept the planet alive by illimanating species who over exceeded the carrying capcity of their environment or were unable to adapt to her ever changing ways. She's always been here and always will. Man on the other hand has only been here a short time, and it looks as if he too is destined to be one of the millions of species that came and went.

  • Light and Liberty St. George/Washington, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 11:46 a.m.

    Ordinary Folks: A boy scout also is supposed to represent honesty, rather than channeling fear and variance of climate into a money and power grab. One would think that the earth is this tiny cubicle without any means to repair itself. Hogwash. I'm all for cleaner environment, but the biggest problem we have is not "climate change" but immorality and big government, a government that knows without a doubt that if it can "educate" enough people to believe that God isn't in charge, then they are more than happy to step in and take His place! Climate change is nothing more than government sponsored greed trying to find a way to control the masses! If it indeed meant that we need to curb oil and coal consumption, then why don't all the revelers show us by example by turning in their cars, quit buying from stores, and grow a garden? The reason why that is unreasonable for them, is that is isn't true. Why change when what you are proposing has nothing to do with reality? Unless, of course, you can use it as an excuse to put someone else in chains!

  • illuminated St George, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 11:39 a.m.

    There is more evidence we are entering a new little ice age. Ice caps both north and south are growing bigger each year and winter is on-setting earlier and lasting longer for the northern regions. If the earth was truly warming, why would the ice be growing bigger each year? IPCC agreed in its last report that warming has at least "paused". All while the world outputs exponentially more CO2 each year. There is no correlation between human CO2 output and MMGW

    Jens Pedersen also believes so, a UN IPCC reviewer & senior scientist at the Denmark’s Technical University. He says, "We have to go back 100 years to find a solar maximum that was as weak as the one we are in right now, and the recent solar minimum...one has to go back 200 years to find one that was as weak."

    Unicorns, fairies, and man-made global warming = myths. If you have a religious belief in something that you can't prove to be true using science, that's great. More power to you. But don't call your personal faith in MMGW real science. Leave your religious beliefs away from my tax dollars and business.

  • Liberal Ted Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:36 a.m.

    When I was a child, the experts told us that the world by now would be a fiery furnace. That the world population could never go above 6 billion. There would be wars fought over water, oil and food. The oil by now would be gone and entire cities and people would crumble into ashes.

    Here we are over 8 billion people. Fighting obesity. Oil free flowing. Wars being fought because of radicals with a twisted religious point of view. So much for the experts.

    Oh, and they told us all of the ice would melt and the every lake and stream dry up. That never made sense to me, since all of the water from the ice would have to go somewhere. Either into space or the oceans. Eventually if the earth did heat up and oceans warmed up, then the water would evaporate creating clouds. The clouds would travel to land areas and dump the water at some point.

    Earth has naturally done this for millions of years. But, there isn't money to steal if you report that.

  • silo Sandy, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:31 a.m.

    @illuminated

    I checked your sources. Googling '2014 coldest year' links to a Heartland Institute article that references the first 5 months of the year in North America.

    Funny thing about Global Warming is that it applies to Global temperatures.

    Try Googling '2014 warmest year' and you'll be led to the actual NOAA study for Global temps through November of this year. That study states the following:

    "_The first ten months of 2014 were the warmest such period on record._"

    Regarding your statements about the ice caps being bigger than ever, and the global warming pause, both are just as easily debunked by anyone who looks at the objective data, rather than relying on Heartland Institute to filter it.

  • Cats Somewhere in Time, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:26 a.m.

    Dear Illuminated and EarthLink:

    Thank you for your enlightened comments. I think it is the ultimate in arrogance for us to believe that we actually have the power to change the climate or that we can stop change. The climate has been changing for millions of years and it has nothing to do with mankind.

  • Liberal Ted Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:24 a.m.

    Every politician needs an enemy to put fear into the population, so they can steal our money. Climate change has successfully robbed us and our children and future generations.

    I have nothing against stopping pollution and protecting the planet. However, feel good programs that costs billions with no effect, just seems more of scam than a solution.

    Maybe if we had leaders that preached climate change, actually live the lifestyle they preach. Rather than jetting around the world on our dime, lecturing us how we need to be poor so they can be rich and steal more from us.

    Then you have a city of idiots 'New Orleans' for example that build 5 feet below sea level next to the ocean. The sea surges over and here come the politics with their fear mongering of climate change....did they really think that a disaster would never happen? Why rebuild the city in the same spot?

    Oh well, I give up hope. There are too many idiots that won't ask simple questions.

  • clearthink Salt Lake City, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:07 a.m.

    This article is a string of nonscientific assertions, carefully written to mislead the public.
    For example, notice that the AP focused on 10-year intervals ending in 1992 and 2013. Why? Because if they go further back, the planet was hotter, weather was more extreme, and atmospheric CO2 levels were much lower!

    Every time you read that the world is getting "hotter," you won't read that this is because NOAA keeps adjusting historical temperatures downward. That's right: NOAA is changing the historical record to "prove" the planet is warming.

    Notice that Borenstein's 30% "jump" in climate extremes excludes hurricanes, because no major hurricane has struck the U.S. since President Obama took office--the longest "pause" in hurricanes since the Civil War.

    For the last two years, Arctic Ice has been increasing, although Borenstein carefully omits that by referring to the 10-year average. The North Pole was ice free in the 1950s, but you won't hear about that. The "slight" gain in sea ice in Antarctica is far greater than the supposedly huge loss of sea ice in the Arctic.

  • illuminated St George, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 10:04 a.m.

    It is a scientific fact that 2014 has been the coldest years in the last 15 years. It is a scientific fact that the ice caps are bigger than ever. It is a scientific fact that there has been no global warming over the last 20 years.

    It is being called "The Global Warming Pause" by thousands of scientists around the world including the IPCC. Read the IPCC's recent climate report, the "Pause" is the central theme of the report. Google it. These facts have been available all over the web for months and months, it is only blind ignorance and left-wing partisanship that is keeping the global warming myth alive.

    Google "2014 coldest year". According to every scientific measurement of temperature in the US according to the network of nationwide thermometers monitored by the U.S. Historical Climatology Network, which have been measuring U.S. temperatures since the 1890.

    Do some research and educate yourself with the facts, not leftist scare tactics. Global Warming is a lie.

  • Kwall Logan, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:57 a.m.

    @Illuminated

    Actually, 2014 is on pace to be the hottest year on record for global temperatures and ocean temperatures. The previous high was 2010. The 10 hottest years have all come in the last 17 years. A simple google search can confirm that for you.

    We have certainly contributed to greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. We have clear data showing that the levels of greenhouse gases are increasing, that is scientific fact. It is also a scientific fact that concentration of greenhouse gases will lead to an increase in temperatures. Those aren't debatable. Now, it is possible that humans aren't responsible for all of climate change, but it is the most supported explanation for climate change. Until a better explanation is brought forward, that is the paradigm we work with. If you have a better explanation that absolves humans of all responsibility, please do share.

  • Raiders11 OGDEN, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:48 a.m.

    @illuminated

    I really hope you are joking, forget about Politics for one minute and think about what is actually happening out there. Do you honestly think that the earth has not changed rapidly in the last 20 years? heck even in the last 10 i can see a difference!

    Global warming is occurring whether it be by man made influences or the earth we are in trouble and we need to start looking at what we can do to help rather than blame others or call out party (political) agenda WHO CARES! its the earth our home and all that we have who cares about someones wealth or political gains due to it cant we make the world a better place?

  • illuminated St George, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:40 a.m.

    There has been no warming in the last 20 years, the polar ice caps are bigger than ever and this year was one of the coldest on record.

    Man-made global warming is a myth perpetrated by the left to get more money and power. It's used as propaganda to levy more taxes, laws and attack business for "social justice" and "equality", just like they are doing with Ferguson and did with ObamaCare, the IRS, the NSA and executive amnesty.

  • ordinaryfolks seattle, WA
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:38 a.m.

    Sensible Scientist

    By your comment, I would gather that you are not in the camp which would advocate for world wide action to slow down the degradation of the planet.

    Your main complaint about this article is that the increased population of the Earth has greater number of people affected by climate disasters, therefore more costly. Well, that is a bit like the argument about a tree falling in the woods and no one being there to hear it.

    However, I will take your bait on this, and just say that there are no net increases in the violence or numbers of weather related disasters, and that population increases are a given. What about the other effects of global degradation: pollution, ocean acidification, rising sea levels, etc? Is this not something to worry about?

    Frankly, whether or not your argument holds up, I can not believe that we are leaving the planet to the next generations in such lousy shape. As a Boy Scout I learned that we were supposed to leave our campsite even better than when we found it. However, that seems inconvenient to many.

  • Light and Liberty St. George/Washington, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:32 a.m.

    Tracking climate change seems wise, except that the people in charge of tracking it base their policy decisions on what they want to see, including billions of dollars funneled into their accounts, rather than whether "climate change" is a natural phenomena that we don't have any control over, let alone understand how to "fix" it. Come on people, open your eyes to the truth without acting like we actually have any control over its existence!

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:30 a.m.

    Poverty, and suffering are caused by corrupt/greedy governments.

    Not global warming!

  • Sensible Scientist Rexburg, ID
    Dec. 2, 2014 9:08 a.m.

    Increases in annual costs of disasters or number of people affected, or even of an event being classified as a "disaster" are 100% a function of increasing populations, not of climate or anything Nature is doing. They are irrelevant to this discussion, yet are constantly brought up by fear-mongers for their political gain.

    See through it.

  • There You Go Again Saint George, UT
    Dec. 2, 2014 8:30 a.m.

    I checked Drudge.

    As long as regressive re-Publican oligarchs say life on Earth has not changed, not just the climate, not gotten hotter, more polluted with heat-trapping gases, more crowded and just downright wilder...

    Life on Earth has not changed, not just the climate, not gotten hotter, more polluted with heat trapping gases, more crowded and just downright wilder.