@DarrelOne BIG problem.That man NEVER claimed to act in
name of Christianity nor in name of God.In fact religion was not
involved at all.But thanks for playing.--@jimmyliberalSame argument can be made for everyone of those case
you made.None said they were doing in the name of Jesus Christ or
for Christianity, nor did any Christian leader urge, tell, or order them to do
it.But again thanks for playing.
My personal opinion:Somebody ought to protect religious liberty. It
is proclaimed in the Bill of Rights but that did not stop Missouri's
governor issuing an "extermination order" against all Mormons, nor the
Mormons being persecuted clear out of the United States and into what was then
Mexican territory. Missouri, so far as I know, did not suffer for
its intolerance of religous beliefs in this case, nor made any restitution for
the killings, arson and robberies that were perpetrated upon the Mormons. No
POTUS that I am aware of has expressed indignation for it either. So how can
there be any claim made that this is a nation tolerant of religious views when
such a blatant exception has been made. Now that the LDS religion
is one of the largest in the nation things have changed apparently but there is
no apology made for outrageous past conduct against them in Missouri and other
places in the Land of the Free as it is called. If the Republicans prove
different, or the Democrats either, I would wish them well. They are all good
at talking but actions speak louder than words.
Stalwart Sentinel blames religious fundamentalists for middle east violence then
conveniently forgets that the greatest butchers of the 20th century were atheist
secular fundamentalists..He claims "the only thing stopping them here in the
US is liberalism". Religious Fundamentalism can be a problem - aka Westboro
Baptist - however it is the fundamentalism - not the religion per se that is the
perpetrator. The hate based left is truly naive if they believe that bigotry
cannot be perpetrated in the name of popular causes just as effectvitely as it
can in the name of God, motherhood and patriotism. Indeed the left provides fun
house mirror image proof that zeal combined with arrogance and social
acceptability actually makes them WORSE as illustrated by the Orwellian
politically correct facsimile of "liberalism" routinely displayed on
these posts. I have experienced political correct liberals to be the
least intellectually liberal people in my life and, by far, the most prone to
extremism (as again identified by the hyperbolic hate in response to this
The irony of the posts indicate exactly why religious liberty is an issueDarrel generalizes "Where the conflict exists is when people try to
codify their beliefs into law." A good example would be forcing the Catholic
Church to provide birth control or an employer to provide abortion drugs in
violation of their conscience and religious beliefs, when the individual is free
to do it themselves. When companies are praised for having an environmental
conscience - it is truly bigoted to condemn a company who respects human life.
The intolerant left is clearly the perpetrator in this instance, not the
victim.If the hyperbole of Ranch, who implies that everyone with a
different opinion secretly wants to own a slave, is to be the standard here,
then I would ask Hutterite if he truly believes " We all deserve freedom
from religion"; Exactly why should I not place that mentality squarely in
the category of those who wish to have "freedom from Jews." Freedom of
religion includes the right to not believe - but not the right for you to never
be exposed to an opinion you don't agree with. Again, These posts
illustrate classic left wing intolerance and hate.
Hey "Truth" -"Now show me a Christian who is doing the
same, anywhere in the world?" What? . . . Cut off heads?Well,
you don't have to look very far.Beheadings happen regularly
south of the border in Mexico, conducted by self-described Christians . . .
Mostly not for religious reasons though. It's mostly for drug
cartel business purposes . . . And revenge, and all that . . . But there is a
religious element to it as well.. . . Ever heard of the cult of
Santa Muerte? It's fascinating . . . and growing.“. .
evidence suggests that the numbers of defections to the cults that worship a
perverted Christian god (e.g., La Familia Michoacana and Los Caballeros
Templarios) and the various unsanctioned saints (e.g., Jesús Malverde, Juan
Soldado, and Santa Muerte) have grown for years.” – FBI Law
Enforcement BulletinLook it up.
If you want to find out if their's a war on religion, just read some of the
comments here. Alot of hostile people towards religion. Yes, their's a war
@Truth: You eloquently stated..."In Christian Oklahoma, a dark skinned
muslim cut the head off of a Woman and stabbed another? Now show me a Christian
who is doing the same, anywhere in the world? Did I get your ATTENTION"!Hopefully this post backed by FACTS will get your attention!(1)Wisconsin Sikh Temple massacre, Aug. 5, 2012(2)Knoxville Unitarian
Universalist Church shooting, July 27, 2008. (3)Planned Parenthood
bombing, Brookline, Massachusetts, (4)1994 Suicide attack on IRS building in
Austin, Texas, Feb. 18, 2010(5) The Centennial Olympic Park bombing, July
27, 1996 (6) The murder of Barnett Slepian byJames Charles Kopp, Oct. 23, 1998 .
(7) The murder of Alan Berg, June 18, 1984. (8)The murder of Dr.
George Tiller, May 31, 2009
@TRUTHNow show me a Christian who is doing the same, anywhere in the
world?------------------------Well, not a beheading, or
stabbing, but I know of a white Christian that, in Christian Oklahoma bombed a
Federal Building and killed 200 people. Remember?Christians have plenty of blood on their hands to be pointing at Muslims. Our
Master, being the number 1 pacifist of all time, being the All Powerful God,
admonished Peter, who was trying to protect Him that those who take the sword
shall also perish by the sword.Those who claim to be his most ardent
of followers are the among those that beat most loudly the drums of war.
I want to know what candidates of any or no party believe in with regard to
Life, Liberty, Property and the Constitution of the United States. That is
basic, and they need to speak clearly and go on record. I also want to know if
I can trust to keep their word.
@TRUTH – “In Christian Oklahoma, a dark skinned muslim cut the head
off of a Woman and stabbed another?”Would that act have been
any less deplorable if it were a light skinned Muslim?
@Ranchhand......If you don't believe that you're not paying attention
to international news?Whose not paying attention...you don't
have to go to international extremes to find News?In Christian
Oklahoma, a dark skinned muslim cut the head off of a Woman and stabbed another?
Now show me a Christian who is doing the same, anywhere in the world?Did I get your ATTENTION!
with Obama defending Islam and attacking Jews, someone needs to defend everyday
Americans?Good on you Sen. Cruz! Good Riddance Obama/Weiner/Holder
@Tek;I know what I compared this to. Christian extremists are
nearly identical to Muslim extremists. If you don't believe that
you're not paying attention to international news.
When fascism comes to America,it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a
Here they go again. Seems the GOP just can't get out of it's own way
when they self destruct every election year. If this is a key platform
it's a losing one. Outside of a few, already, Republican, districts this
will turn off independent voters.
13 signers of the Constitution were Free Masons, and "religious men"
However they had three simple rules.1. Men must be allowed to
believe in Their God, whatever that is?2. A belief in God usually
encourages men to good works. (But not always)3. Religion must never be
used to rule or make laws.It was shocking after we hear so many
times how religious these people were etc. They all agreed that religion must
have no part in the government of this country. They believed that
good people would make good laws.
LP Grad, BYU Alum,"....Laws requiring that doctors doing abortions
have hospital privileges are aimed at protecting women from under-qualified
doesn't it? But if that was the true purpose of the provision, its scope
should cover eye clinics, pediatrics, geriatrics, infectious diseases,
cardiology, and numerous other classes of specialty clinics. It was aimed
exclusively at abortion clinics for reasons that should be self-evident. Trying
to make it be about patient protection is not the least bit credible to me.
Now the President of the United States must obey the Israeli government in order
to be good Christians? Ted Cruz has gone off his rocker.
Every post thus far has claimed "religion is stripping away my rights!"
What utter nonsense.People need to learn to differentiate between
people and religion. Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, and Mike Lee do not represent
religion. Until they are hired as spokesmen for their respective faiths, they
do not represent religion.Also, since when have laws been passed
because of religion? Laws requiring that doctors doing abortions have hospital
privileges are aimed at protecting women from under-qualified people.
What's to stop doctors from getting privileges or clinics from hiring
doctors with privileges? Absolutely nothing. People point to alcohol laws in
SLC as religious, but in reality, they're designed to protect against
underage and binge drinking. If the laws were based on religion, the courts
would have struck them down by now. That the laws are still existing should
indicate a lack of religious bias "stripping me of my rights."People like creating villains for their perceived hardships, and the
left's biggest boogeyman is religion. In reality, they argue against sound
I think that most of the posters on this forum have stumbled over their
stereotypes.Ranch, you have no concept of Islamic fundamentalists,
Taliban, etc to make the comparison you did.Anyhow, the Democrats
used to be the party of Kennedy and sticking up for the oppressed. They used to
stand for civil and human rights.What we are getting from them is
that they think abortion clinics should be less safe, that they are safe enough
and that businesses should not be guided by a conscience, they exist only to
make money.There is a hole in American politics where the Democrats
used to stand and the Republicans have finally had enough sense to recognize
this and they are moving to fill that hole.
Yes, its bogus but its much more nefarious than that. By stressing diversionary
issues like this the republicans disguise the real agenda which is flatten the
tax code and to raise taxes on poor and middle class people and lower them on
rich people. Check out Mike Lee's tax proposal from a few days ago in this
paper. They get your support on social issues they don't really care about
so they can pick your pockets.
That's the beauty of it all, isn't it? Such "poor",
"suppressed" people fighting for their religion. Well, there is nothing
to fight. Obama has not in any way limited our religious freedoms. We wish to
believe so because it is human nature to believe the worst, most dramatic things
have been planned by diabolical people as a part of an "evil scheme."
The simple reality is that belligerent conservatives are simply putting on a
show for their own self-righteousness.
Sadly it is the same tired version of "liberty" they usually shop
around, they want religious liberty for those that have the same religous views
as them to impose those views on the rest of us that have different beliefs.
Believe it or not there are actually religous people and religions that do not
share republican beliefs about social hot bottom issues.
"Obama's attack on religious liberty?"Obama has made NO
attacks on Religious Liberty. Only in the minds of wrong-thinking Right Wingers
has Obama made any attack on religious liberty.The President has
defended the Constitution however, including the First Amendment. And
that's what has gotten so many "Conservatives" so very upset.Obama and all truly freedom loving Americans realize the importance of
an underlying American principle . . . The Separation of Church and State . . .
Now renamed the "Government's War on Religion," by
"Conservative" propagandists.Near-sighted Religionists
insist that anything that obstructs their religion from asserting itself in
forming government policy is wrong. But that's not a Wrong. It's a
American Right. We the people have a right to follow the Religion (or no
religion) of OUR choice . . . And NOT be suppressed by the Religion of YOUR
choice.True freedom-loving Americans don't want to be ground
down under the heel of YOUR religion.Get used to it.BTW,
how would you feel if Evangelicals gained power and by government decree
declared Mormonism to be unlawful and "a dangerous cult."Would you protect the freedom of their religion to suppress your religion?
This is a bogus issue. Religious liberty in America has never been stronger than
it is today.
I don't think anyone is against Freedom of Religion.Where the
conflict exists is when people try to codify their beliefs into law.Ironically, those who are convinced that Sharia Law is coming to the United
States are the very ones trying to codify their religion into law.We
are no less free to practice our religion today than we were 50 years ago. To be consistent those claiming religious freedom must be absolute
should be rallying at the capitol decrying the State for prosecuting Warren
Jeffs, or Brian David Mitchell. They were just following what they thought God
told them to do. They should be filing suits in court for those Churches who
have the Government dictating to Churches what Sacraments they can and cannot
perform regarding marriage. They must also be largely against the US
intervention against ISIS/ISIL from trying to place what they believe to be
right, an Islamic State.Or are there reasonable limits that can be
placed on our religious rights?
Most of the "religious liberty" argument is pure bunk. It's
effects are widespread however and pernicious, and it will establish Utah as a
purely one-party-Republican state.
good. I think it will serve the country well when these :religious liberty
politicians" are out in the open and are prevented from taking office or
voted out of office. They do a severe disservice to this great and secular
This is the new dog whistle for conservatives. Religious liberty? I suppose
that "states rights" call was tainted by its segregationist past, so a
new one had to be invented. But Religious liberty?How many
Christian bashings are going on in the country? Are we passing laws forbidding
evangelical churches? Did I miss the secret administration order to burn
fundamentalist texts and holy books? Are we starting to tax churches?An obvious overreaction to conditions in this country. There is obviously
persecution in other countries of ethnic/religious minorities by the Islamic
majorities in Africa and Asia. Ironically, that is what would happen here by
the so-called Christian fundamentalists, evangelicals and other fellow travelers
if they had their way. What they really seek is theocracy, they just don't
like it when they are in the minority in other countries.Bah humbug
Corporations are now "people" of faith and the corporation's
religious conscious trumps employee rights; yet the attack is on religious
liberty? Also, I can't help but note the incredible irony that
this article uses the last paragraph to mention a terrible crisis in the Middle
East that is being caused by religious fundamentalists. On a Venn Diagram, the
Value Voters Summit has about 80% overlap with ISIS - the only thing stopping
them here in the US is liberalism.
We all deserve freedom from religion. I'm all for religious liberty.
Their next rallying point: Separate drinking fountains, restaurants, bathrooms,
etc. for Blacks and Whites. Can't possibly have them using the same
facilities! That's an attack on our religious liberty.Then,
they'll add anti-miscegenation laws back onto the books, God certainly
didn't want the races to mix!!Then, women will all be required
to cover their heads, and ankles. Ankles!!! Such wantoness!!Good
grief, Republicans. Get a grip.