Finally!! A judge that has some common sense.
@Brio;Utah is already the very bottom of the barrel for per-child
spending; 50th!Vouchers are simply a way to cut that spending even
further in order for the Utah Legislature to eliminate public spending and
funnel public money into their own pockets (many of them are invested in
@Brave Sir Robin,Parents went through the same school/educational
system as their children.Further evidence of our weak, and costly
educational system.The focus should be on teaching students study
kills, researching, and presenting their findings in several ways.It's pretty simple.
As an educator I am just concerned that due process won't be followed in
charter schools. It will be for students but for teachers that will be another
What?! The democrats preach that unions and government increase efficiency and
choices. After all a teacher that is hired and can't be fired is more
motivated than a teacher that must prove themselves year in and year out. Not
saying all union teachers are bad, but, there is enough bad in there to make it
Parents are problematic but in Utah, like Worf has alluded to, the state
legislature is mostly to blame for the ills in Utah's system.
@worf"Let's not totally blame teachers for our poor
educational system!Legislators has caused most of the problems!
Period!"Actually most of our educational problems are caused by
parents. There are exhaustive studies to support this. When you have parents
who don't get involved or care about their kids' education, you get
kids who don't get involved or care about their own education.
Whatever works best to help students do their best is what should come first.
And tenure is not a part of that. The unions are mainly about protecting
teachers from losing their jobs, even if they are not up to the job. Teachers
unions are not concerned about students first, that is and always has been
obvious. They will defend even teachers who abuse kids. This ruling in
California of all places should show the typical pro union Democrats that "a
times they are a changin."
Fred44, Let's not split hairs. There are differences but it is
fundamentally the same issue, public money that follows the student has been
deemed good in higher education (even if they go to private institutions) but
not in k-12.
Regarding redistribution of wealth/money dictating decisions...Redistribution of wealth/money dictating decisions is good if originated by
Republicans.Redistribution of wealth/money dictating decisions is
bad if originated by Democrats.
Solutions not Stones,You are making an apples and oranges
comparison. By law all my state income tax goes to education. At the K-12
level public schools are provided for students free of charge ( I know there are
fee's for classes sports etc.). Choices are available (open enrollment and
charter schools). Higher Education is completely different on multiple levels.
Pell Grants and Subsidized loans are also different than a voucher.
Let's not totally blame teachers for our poor educational system!Legislators has caused most of the problems! Period!
Normally I would tend to agree with the protections that unions provide. But in
this instance I agree with the judge. In Davis County I've tried to get the
district and the board to improve secondary math education and the district
wouldn't be moved. They came up with every excuse imaginable to not lift a
finger to undo the damage that has been done to math education since I went to
Fred44,So, are you suggesting that Pell Grants, subsidized loans,
etc. should be disallowed at private universities like Westminster College and
@ Brio.... Too bad the charter schools have mostly shown themselves to be mostly
inept. Pursuing the bottom line of profit, they too often cut corners. Given
enough time (maybe 20 years) some serious competition might pop up. Charter
schools have been known to hire teachers that actually got fired from public
schools! Still it's not a bad idea. Competition is a great motivator.
Brio,There are currently plenty of choices. Traditional public
schools do something that no other schools do, they take all students
irregardless. If you want competition great, then lets have it, but let all
schools compete equally. Vouchers are just a form of redistribution of wealth.
When you take my tax money and pay for publics schools that is like paying for
streets, parks etc. Things that benefit all. When you take my money and give
it someone else to spend on their childs education as they choose, that is not
spending my money on a common good. A voucher is not an appropriate use of
Much of this issue would be resolved if the Obama administration would support
school voucher programs. This would allow all students, including those who
brought this law-suit, to have more and better choices regarding where they
attend school. Because Obama is beholding to big teacher unions for
their campaign support, and because those unions are adamantly opposed to any
voucher systems, the current national Attorney General, Eric Holder, is suing
states and districts who try to allow or expand the use of school voucher
systems.It's a prime example of doing the wrong thing for the
wrong reason. Money too often dictates decisions, no matter how obviously flawed
some of those decisions are. And not allowing school vouchers is a very flawed
idea. Allowing voucher systems would be perhaps the quickest way of
allowing a way out for these inner-city students who are currently trapped with
no choices regarding their sub-standard schools.Having more choices
would force these bad public schools to improve or perish. With no competition,
they can continue forever with their incredibly bad teachers and teaching
systems. It's asinine that it's almost impossible to fire terrible