Government, health care

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  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    May 22, 2013 2:33 p.m.

    Her (Palin) first post was about a proposal in the emerging bill that would allow Medicare to pay for doctor’s appointments for patients to discuss living wills and other end-of-life issues. Palin’s decision to call this pending provision a “death panel” ignited a firestorm that resulted in the language being removed from the final legislation.

    The debate predated the relaunch of The Fact Checker column, but our colleagues of PolitiFact awarded Palin with the 2009 “Lie of the Year” for the death panel claim.

    Spin it any way you like.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    May 22, 2013 12:35 p.m.


    Other than someone who wants care when none is required, why would “free” healthcare mean I go to the doctor more often? I have good health insurance and I avoid going whenever I can.

    But as to considering the ability to pay imposing some measure of self-restraint – I agree. The problem is that most of us do not have the ability to pay for something catastrophic. Surely, whatever cost savings might be available with such a plan would not account for heart surgery and all of its required therapies. Most folks would be bankrupted by a single significant health event. Their restraint would be simple – they could not afford to get sick, they would not get care, and death or disability would result.

    Finally, this is not govt. run healthcare. My friends who work in private insurance are gearing up for the new clients. Not to say it is my solution, just that it is not govt. run.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    May 22, 2013 11:27 a.m.

    To "JoeBlow" stop proving HaHaHa right. Here is more recent information that validates what Palin said.

    Read "Krugman: Death Panels and Middle-Class Tax Hikes Ahead" at Investor's Business Daily. There we find that leading Democrats are saying that the death panels are coming.

    Better yet watch "Dems Admit: Yep, Death Panels are coming" at the Blaze

    Also see "Why we need 'death panels'" at MSN

    Seems that the Death Panels are coming and the Dems now admit it.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    May 22, 2013 9:06 a.m.

    HaHaHa writes

    "Please try not to confirm to the rest of us, that YOU are a low informed voter."

    Happy to do so for you HaHa. My original post is exactly correct.

    This from Forbes

    "At the time of Palin's original death panel claim, the IPAB hadn't been written into legislation. Her claim instead was focused on language being proposed in the bill that would require Medicare to pay for end-of-life counseling. The death panel myth grabbed hold even though the vast majority of Americans are in favor of payment for end-of-life counseling"

    Palin is the mother of the "death panel" myth.

    May 22, 2013 7:32 a.m.

    Health care costs are soaring because of unrestrained demand. Unrestrained demand is the natural consequence of health care recipients not paying for their own health care, but simply demanding care without having to consider their own ability to pay. The situation we've had, in which employers pay our health care "insurance" premiums, is not ideal because it creates the perception that it is "free", resulting in increased demand without regard for cost.

    The transition to government-run healthcare addresses the problem of unrestrained demand with a big stick; that is, we can be compelled by government to accept less, both as health care recipients and providers. The "death panel" is the entity that decides how to spend limited resources in the face of unrestrained demand. There is some degree of truth in claims that insurance companies are death panels, although they do have contractual obligations that can be enforced in a court of law. Government-run health care eliminates any contractual constraints.

    The best solution is for people to pay for their own health care and restrain their own demand. This also creates the opportunity for us to provide charitable assistance for those with fewer resources.

  • higv Dietrich, ID
    May 21, 2013 8:23 p.m.

    Who has died because of lack of health care? And were is the right to food, clothing or shelter in the constitution? We have an abundance of it do to lack of guarantee. Capitalism creates a market for things we need. Marx thought a right to food, clothing and Shelter was a good idea. What happened were that was a right?

  • On the other hand Riverdale, MD
    May 21, 2013 6:32 p.m.

    @HaHaHaHa, Medicare has been around for some time now. Show us the death panels.

  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    May 21, 2013 4:54 p.m.

    The stupidity of the left never ceases to amaze, and their loyal brown nosing, defense of obama is equally nauseating. Death panels were never about a doctor or two deciding whether one lives or dies. Please try not to confirm to the rest of us, that YOU are a low informed voter. Death panels are about a misguided government program, that only a mindless sap would support, which inefficiently wastes or distributes resources, and will never be able to provide all that is promised or dreamed of. Therefore, when the pot of money used to provide for citizens healthcare, starts to dry up, "death panels" will be required to step in and decide who doesn't and who does receive healthcare, in order to preserve and prolong the dwindling pot of money. Given the track record of the anti-tyranny conservative organizations, in predicting the types of scandals that this administration uses to suppress voters and information during the past year, any leftist accusing the other side of "low information" has zero credibility!!

  • Irony Guy Bountiful, Utah
    May 21, 2013 1:31 p.m.

    As my relative lost his job several weeks ago, he is now without health insurance. He is working hard trying to find another job. Money for caring for his little diabetic child has dried up. I'm helping, but it's unbelievably expensive. When I think that in Europe, where I lived for a while, this wouldn't even be an issue, it makes me want to cry. The conservative philosophy that rules this country ("you're on your own, little girl") is cruel and sickening.

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    May 21, 2013 1:09 p.m.

    This letter is pure nonsense. Death panels are already in place. They are called Insurance Companies.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    May 21, 2013 12:29 p.m.

    Michael A. Cosman, your letter is based on what? Will you show us? Experience? I think not. Sarah the half governor? Maybe.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    May 21, 2013 12:17 p.m.

    To "Open Minded Mormon" you really don't pay attention to things do you. You complain about private health insurance, but don't seem to care that government insurance is far worse.

    For example, the ACA was going to cut deficits. How is that possible without them taking in more than what the program costs. That is profit, and the government was going to do so without a peep from your ilk.

    Next, government insurance programs are riddled with 2 times the fraud that private companies experience, while only insuring half as many people.

    Medicare denies claims at a much higher rate than private insurance companies.

    With all the problems of government programs, why would you support them?

  • Open Minded Mormon Everett, 00
    May 21, 2013 11:56 a.m.

    ....and we are supppose to feel better that FOR profit Insurance companies pick and choose who lives and who dies?

    BTW: Corporations base ALL decisions on earnings, not votes.
    Governments base decisions on votes, not earnings.

  • Lightbearer Brigham City, UT
    May 21, 2013 11:13 a.m.

    We already have death panels: the insurance companies.

    One often hears that "all life is sacred," which usually means that "all life is sacred till it's out of the womb," or that "all life is sacred till it becomes a matter of money."

    If there is a right to life, there is also a right to the things necessary for maintaining life - food, clothing, shelter, and healthcare - otherwise this "right" is nothing but words on paper.

  • Tyler D Meridian, ID
    May 21, 2013 8:38 a.m.

    @JoeBlow – “Talking about "death panels" screams low information voter.”

    And a political party that celebrates it as a virtue… the legacy of Sarah Palin lives on.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    May 21, 2013 7:02 a.m.

    Or insurance companies.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    May 21, 2013 7:01 a.m.

    Kind of hard to have reasoned, fact based discussions on issues like health care when politicians take a reasonable issue and completely turn it into something it is not.

    And the partisan masses swallow it without question.

    The whole "Death Panel" is based on the notion that doctors could get compensated for their time when discussing options with the family of a very ill loved one.

    Talking about "death panels" screams low information voter.

  • louie Cottonwood Heights, UT
    May 21, 2013 6:53 a.m.

    Really now, more deaths because of Medicare, Tricare, and Medicaid and other government programs I In all my years, I have never heard that from people on those programs. Pre-existing conditions occur with private insurance companies far more than with any government program. Please do your research first.