Mileage tax solution

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  • LDS Tree-Hugger Farmington, UT
    May 8, 2013 9:08 a.m.

    Ogden, UT
    In general, any time you convert energy from one form to another there are losses incurred. This is the reason perpetual motion schemes do not work.


    You've got it 180 degrees backwards Spoc.

    An internal combustion engine converts only 15% of the potential energy of the fuel into mechanical energy - the rest [85%] is wasted as heat.

    On the other hand, an electric power-plant is 85% efficient during the conversion process BECAUSE it relies on the Heat prtion, and not necessarily on the mechanical properties.
    An electric motor is 85% efficient in converting electricity into mechanical energy.

    So - taking all factors into consideration,
    Even with the losses in tranfer over the powerlines, storage in batteries, and chraging and dids-charging --
    An electric vehicle is 3 times as ENERGY efficient as a gasoline, CNG vehicle,
    and roughly twice that of a Diesel [because diesels run at double the compresssion ratio as gasoline/CNG internal comustion enignes.]

    Class dismissed.

  • Spoc Ogden, UT
    May 7, 2013 10:26 p.m.

    In general, any time you convert energy from one form to another there are losses incurred. This is the reason perpetual motion schemes do not work.

    That being said, is it more efficient to convert natural gas directly to vehicle motion or to convert natural gas to generator motion to electricity at the generator to electricity transported to the user to chemical energy charging a battery to electric vehicle motion?

    If it is less efficient to drive an electric vehicle than a CNG vehicle, should the electric be taxed at a higher rate per mile than the CNG car?

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    May 7, 2013 4:41 p.m.


    Repubs are the ones wanting this because it takes away the incentive for green energy cars.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    May 7, 2013 11:10 a.m.

    "That's why liberals like it, of course."

    Except liberals have strong opposition to it due to the fact that we're environmentalists and changing the gas tax structure penalizes those who bought a more fuel efficient car.

  • Hemlock Salt Lake City, UT
    May 7, 2013 10:42 a.m.

    Those who drive fewer miles still expect the roads to be maintained and ready to be used. It's like having a taxi wait for you, the meter still runs even if they are not moving. A user fee, either gasoline tax or toll roads, is still the most reasonable and easiest to collect. Politicians must resist the temptation to divert those fees from transportation needs to the general funds.

  • Strider303 Salt Lake City, UT
    May 7, 2013 10:07 a.m.

    I oppose any tax on miles driven. It has too many unintended consequences, less casual driving or recreational driving which will hurt the fast food outlets and recreational industry as people will constantly think of trips in terms of miles and costs. Less miles driven means less gas purchased and less new cars purchased as old ones last longer. And in the end, less tax money raised which will lead to higher rates per mile. Rich people, and by that I include congressmen and most legislators have not concept of how the rest of us live and try to get by.

    Tax the total sale of gas not the gallon, and use the tax only for roads. Do not use this tax for anything else. Let mass transit and all the other pet projects find their own funding.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    May 7, 2013 10:05 a.m.

    Since the author is responding to editorials about federal gas taxes, rather than state, the idea of driving in one state vs another is moot.

    but what if you drive in Canada or Mexico? Should the US tax you for driving there?

    You know, I wich I had my old car back, the one with the broken odometer. That would be GREAT for this proposal - but only if they removed the existing federal gas tax.

    No, the idea of a mileage based tax is unacceptable - too many pitfalls, too great a possibility for Big Brother to raise his ugly Obamahead even higher.

  • Ultra Bob Cottonwood Heights, UT
    May 7, 2013 9:45 a.m.

    If states can tax purchases made in other states, why not tax miles driven in other states.

    To me, this sounds like a simple way for the rich and powerful to transfer their tax load to the ordinary people. If I drive a small car and another person drives a large luxury car the same mileage, we both would pay the same tax.

    If the tax is applied to the fuel used it more closely approaches the wear and tear on the highway.

    I wonder if the people proposing this tax are republicans or democrats.

  • LDS Tree-Hugger Farmington, UT
    May 7, 2013 9:26 a.m.

    [Thinking again in the Utah-bubble]
    This only works if someone NEVER leaves the State of Utah.

    Just like shipping cargo and freight is based on weight,
    the Wear and Tear on the roads is due to weight.

    the higher the weight, the lower the MPGs, the higher the fuel consumption, the higher the tax.

    Actual Mileage covered is 100% irrelevant.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    May 7, 2013 7:47 a.m.

    Re: "Mileage tax solution"

    What a ridiculous concept!

    We already have a mileage tax -- the more miles you drive, the more gas you buy, the more tax you pay.

    Tracking peoples' cars has no legitimate purpose other than controlling them.

    That's why liberals like it, of course.

  • isrred South Jordan, UT
    May 7, 2013 7:08 a.m.

    So now Utah is going to tax me for mileage driven in other states when I travel across the country?

    I agree that this method is much more simple, less costly, and less scary than the gps tracking by the government, but it doesn't exactly make sure the funds for roads go to the right place.

  • JoeBlow Far East USA, SC
    May 7, 2013 4:20 a.m.

    Often times, our tax structure is designed to discourage behavior we don't want and encourage that which we do. Alcohol and cigarettes are taxed in part to curb their use.

    Do we really want to disincentivize driving cars which get better mileage?

    Secondly, a 2000 pound car driving 1000 miles does less road damage than an 18 wheeler driving the same distance.

    That is currently accounted for in the gas tax structure.

    Just things to consider.