HS FanYou can blame it on Republicans... but I dare guess that if
Democrats were in control today... Utah would not be much different (because
they would still be representing the same people). We would still have limited
funds. We would still have more priorities than dollars. Putting Democrats in
control doesn't magically change that. And IF we put Democrats in control
and they jacked up taxes so the government had so much money that no priority
went unpaid.... you would find them out of office and Republcans back in office
pretty quick.Utah has slightly larger families than other states,
but not all that much. ALL States spend more on educating large families than
they do small families, and single people pay for educating other people's
children in every State in the United States. We are no different than other
states in that respect. But Utahn's DO tend to have lower incomes than
most states. That's a problem. you can't have the highest
per-pupil-spending in a state with larger than average families and LOWER than
average incomes.Electing Democrats doesn't change our incomes
OR our family sizes.
2 bits-A generalization on my part for sure. Many Republicans do pay more
than their fair share. But, we live in a one party state and the controlling
party sets the agenda. Their tax agenda is designed to favor large families
with much of the expense thrown at the feet of single people or couples with
small families (not to mention those that buy alcholic beverages at a state
controlled liquor store). My wife does taxes and she says it is amazing how
many returns she does for families in this state that make over 100k a year and
pay little to no state income taxes ( 7-10 deductions can do that). No objective
person would say that's fair or illustrating personal responsibilty for
their choices. It's social welfare, plain and simple. I've raised two
kids, that have gone thru the public education system. I'm grateful for
good teachers who work hard but feel frustrated at the general populace who
ignores the simple reality that our school system is under funded.
HS FanSpoken like a true "bitter_Democrat"...How do
you know Republicans don't pay their way? You can't lump everybody
based on their party (Hint.. some Republicans DO pay taxes). Utah Democrats
have a corner on paying taxes.And how do you know all
"parent's with large families" don't pay their own way? I
have several neighbors with large families that are also very financially
successful. I know they pay a lot in taxes AND donate their time and $$ at our
local schools. So how do you group all "People with large families"
into one stereotype and blame all "People with large families" as
"not paying their own way"??You can claim "people with
large families", or "Republicans" don't pay their own way.
But that's just rhetoric, not reality.If you want to get
real... is it possible that the POOR don't pay their own way? Especially
poor parents with large families? I know actually saying that is terrible...
but isn't it true?I have nothing against the poor. I think we
owe them a good education. But doesn't the same thing goes for the
vilianous "People with large families"?
I always have a good chuckle when I hear some Republican refer to us a family
oriented state and investing in our children. They and the constituents that
keep putting these people in office are hypocrites, plain and simple. People
with large families and legislators who support them don't pay their own
way and want society to subsidize their life styles. Nothing will change until
society demands people be held accountable for their choices.
I agree that Utah (or any other State) has any business short changing
education. But I'm always disapointed when a person starts their
arguement with the per-pupil-spending arguement. SPENDING is not a good
criteria to use to judge a State's commitment OR success in education.
When a person opens with per-pupil-spending as their reason for doubting
Utah's commitment to education and then goes on and on about spending... I
have to question their real motivation. You CAN have an excellent education
system without participating in the spending escalation game we have in the
United States today (with each State competing with the other states to see who
can spend the most, and the even bigger competition to not be the State
that's on the bottom).We have much room to improve... but just
rampoing up spending will magically do it IMO.The spending game is a
game nobody can win. so why play?If Utah increased their spending... that
would just put another State on the bottom, so now THEY must increase THEIR
spending... where does it stop? It doesn't! Focus on something besides
Too bad we can't come up with a tax on parents who don't support their
children's education. I.E. Allow children too much time watching TV,
playing computer games; not making sure they do homework; don't spend time
reading with them. Maybe parents whose children make less than "C" grade
work should pay extra taxes. Too bad politicians and some educators come up with
hair-brained ideas like "no child left behind" (actually, this meant all
get left behind). Too bad our previously moral culture has been trashed. Money
cannot fix any of these problems. Education? Good luck, but we don't
Re: "One idea is to raise the severance tax."Yeah,
let's raise taxes. That's the one-size-fits-all liberal
"solution" to EVERY "problem."Come back and see us
when there's a real problem. Then we can talk.In the mean time,
EVERY Utah kid who wants a good primary/secondary education has that
opportunity.And "higher" Ed needs to demonstrate throwing
more money at it will actually help, not just build more unneeded physical
plant, endow a few more posh, honorary, non-teaching chairs, or fund employment
of a few more post-docs to finish the research they should have done on their
Utah spends lots of money on education but the amount per student is down
because we have lots of kids, well educated kids. While most states are
shuttering school buildings utah is not because of our abundance of youth.
While not perfect, we get Abigail bang for our buck here in this pretty great
jotab:Stop confusing people with facts!
1Conservative, yes Granite School District did raise taxes once. They raised
taxes 1 dollar for every ten dollars they cut. The increase was even endorsed
by Howard Stephenson and the Utah Taxpayers Association. They
eliminated more than 70 positions. They cut 5 days off of teacher contracts.
Which was over a $1000 pay cut for most teachers. They have cut programs. They
have raised class sizes. They have postponed maintenance items, purchases of
equipment, and other capital expenses. No, I am not a GSD employee
but a citizen who has taken the time to find out the information by attending
school board meetings. Utah has the lowest administrative overhead
in the nation by the way.
I agree. All the problems solved when we are old we be by the kindergarteners of
today. You don't WANT that cure for cancer while you're on your death
Cuts to local school districts?What "cuts" are those? My
property taxes go up almost every year for the school districts' revenue
enhancements.Come ask me about volunteering more money for the
schools when they reduce a few of their 6 figure salaries at the district
offices.Why don't the democrats focus a LITTLE on the
ridiculous salaries and waste at the district offices, rather than continually
asking for MORE money?
Osmond's preschool initiative was an excellent plan but was shot down by
ideological purists. King and Briscoe ran their bills this past session but
neither one could get out of committee. The R's talk a good game but vote
NO on any substantial new funding. Where are the R's proposals? They only
thing they want to spend money on are pet projects not the basics. We are barely keeping up with growth this year and that is not even
considering the past 3 or 4 years when we didn't, not to mention the cuts
that local districts had to make up for on their own.
Thanks, Richard, for an informative editorial about a problem the Republicans
think will go away if they ignore it. I found it interesting that all of the
specific proposals to raise money for education came from Democrats. Aaron
Osmond got mentioned, but I didn't see any specifics coming from him. The
rest of the state GOP is just silent on the issue.