Warming less important

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    Jan. 27, 2013 9:24 p.m.

    @atl134: you missed the biggie, which is that nobody has successfully correlated atmospheric CO2 with warming even though they've spent decades and billions of dollars searching for the CO2 signal. It isn't there. All of the proposed "fixes" will have absolutely no effect on the climate, according to the science. So why are we having this conversation?

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 26, 2013 7:28 p.m.

    Our grand children may have a balanced budget and California may be literally under water. Wait till the Chinese have the same mindset as conservatives, cities will be inhabitable in inversions. Cheap fossile fuel and gas masks.

  • Demo Dave Holladay, UT
    Jan. 26, 2013 7:10 p.m.

    “If you really think the environment is less important than the economy, try holding your breath while you count your money.” – Dr. Guy McPherson

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 26, 2013 4:02 p.m.

    [It's unfortunate how people keep attributing "more tornadoes" and "more hurricanes" and "more drought" to human-caused global warming. There's no science to back up those assertions. ]

    1. Stronger, increased frequency of drought with warming is something backed up with climate science. Same goes for floods (this sounds counter-intuitive but basically it says rain storms will be stronger/wetter so flood events get worse, and evaporation increasees when it's warmer so drought events would get worse). However it varies based on location. Like the expansion of the Hadley circulation would expand the desert regions for instance.

    2. More hurricanes is indeed not really projected in the research, though the research suggests they will be stronger.

    3. The IPCC report notes there is basically no correlation between warming and tornadoes. In fact if anything it's actually possibly more likely than not that tornado frequency would decrease with warming since the Arctic warms faster than the tropics, reducing the temperature gradient between the two regions.

    "the alarmists predictions didn't happen"

    Arctic sea ice is declining much much faster than the predictions. The 2000s were the warmest decade in the modern record. 2012 was the warmest la Nina year.

  • atl134 Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 26, 2013 3:55 p.m.

    "After all, fighting global warming is all about spending more money. "

    Actually it's investing in measures that are projected to help us save money long term by reducing future costs.

    "By your ilk, I mean progressives an liberals in both parties"

    Progressives and liberals opposed the Bush tax cuts and the Iraq war, the biggest non-recession reasons the deficit has grown so much the past decade.

  • Mike in Cedar City Cedar City, Utah
    Jan. 26, 2013 6:45 a.m.

    We can walk and chew gum at the same time. Need to get our heads out of the sand on this global warming issue.

    Jan. 25, 2013 11:18 p.m.

    There's a difference between ignoring facts and putting facts into the proper context. Earth has been warming since the end of the Little Ice Age. Warming appears to have slowed or stopped, beginning 15 or 16 years ago, but we're still at a peak, so yes, we're going to set records, but only because we have no records from before the Little Ice Age.

    And, by the way, the United States was hotter than normal last year, but other places on the planet were cooler than normal, such as Siberia (if I've remembered the chart from UAH correctly). Overall, last year was the 8th hottest of the last 10 or something like that. Nothing to write home about.

    Did humans cause the warming? It's not likely, since it's been going on since the early 1800s. And nobody has been successful at finding any reasonable degree of correlation between atmospheric CO2 and global climate even though they've been trying for 30 years. So, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it if I were you.

    Rain freezing on contact has to do with precipitation from warmer air falling through an inversion. That's weather, not climate.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 10:44 p.m.

    Last year was the hottest on record.

    This week, rain that froze on contact.

    I cannot dispute people who ignore the facts.

    Good day.

    Jan. 25, 2013 9:34 p.m.

    It's unfortunate how people keep attributing "more tornadoes" and "more hurricanes" and "more drought" to human-caused global warming. There's no science to back up those assertions. In fact, they've gone down in recent years.

    We've been on this "human-caused global warming is going to destroy the planet!" kick for decades, and what has happened? The computer models ended up being wrong, the alarmists predictions didn't happen, the hockey-stick papers by Mann and Briffa were full of errors, Al Gore has made a fortune as a con man, and life goes on. There's no reason to spend one more dime or one more minute fighting a problem that doesn't exist except in the fevered imagination of people detached from reality.

  • Copy Cat Murray, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 5:20 p.m.

    Last republican president who led a year of no deficit, Eisenhower 1957

    Last democrat president who led a year of no deficit, Truman 1951

    Clinton claimed to have a balanced budget, but is was a lie, backed by voodoo economics. He had a deficit every year of his presidency, hence the debt rose every year of his presidency.

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 3:32 p.m.

    If repubs were really for fiscal responsibility then why weren't they responsible during he 8 years under bush? When was the last time a repub president balanced the budget?

  • Copy Cat Murray, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 2:38 p.m.

    Salt Lake City, UT
    "In a world with global warming there would be no water to grow your crops."

    What? All the water on the earth is escaping gravity and leaving the earth system because of global warming?

    What scientist told you that? We need to see this evidence!

    This changes everything. Before we were told the sky is falling. Now you say it is rising!

    We better act quick on this.

  • Dektol Powell, OH
    Jan. 25, 2013 2:01 p.m.

    You don't believe he should spend time on a weather pattern that can destroy many coastal cities and towns? That can be the cause of crop failures ending in starvation for millions?
    If this is not important, what is?

  • Screwdriver Casa Grande, AZ
    Jan. 25, 2013 1:14 p.m.

    Remember when Bush and all the republicans were all about the hydrogen economy and how it was good for the planet? I remember well because I knew it was a red herring for real change that wasted at least a decade in making any real progress.

    I haven't heard anything about the fake hydrogen economy in years. Ethanol is the same game.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 1:14 p.m.

    Salt Lake City, UT
    In a world with global warming there would be no water to grow your crops.
    At what point would you realize, you cannot eat money?

    11:02 a.m. Jan. 25, 2013


    They say their Christians,
    but they don't read their scriptures.

    Brigham Young talked about the time when a bushel of wheat would be worth more than a bushel gold.

    But their too worried about what happened in Benghazi, if Obama has a birth certificate, and who staged the Sandy Hook massacre so the Government could come get their guns...

    Just because their world never has enough conspiracies to explain their reality, doesn't mean the rest of have to agree with their AM radio fables.

    Even Glenn Beck was telling them to pipedown on all the Conspiracy non-sense the other night...

  • Ninjutsu Sandy, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 12:57 p.m.

    I seems to me that some people see climate change as a problem that needs to be addressed and are generating proposals to combat it.

    Others, rather than making counter-proposals or coming up with their own ideas, just seem to be denying that the problem exists.

    If conservatives want to do some good, they will debate the proposals themselves rather let so-called liberals take credit for any solution.

  • Redshirt1701 Deep Space 9, Ut
    Jan. 25, 2013 12:28 p.m.

    To "LDS Liberal" what are you talking about??? Conservatives are fighting the deficits. You and your ilk are the ones who have been running it up. By your ilk, I mean progressives an liberals in both parties. Just look at the $6 Trillion that your uber liberals have added over the past 4 years.

    To those of you who think that we should destroy our economy in favor of the environment, go to Netflix and watch "Cool It". It is a film, that is produced by an AGW alarmist. He believes that CO2 drives climate change, but he states that economically the proposals make no sense. He shows how more lives could be saved by not implementing the protocols and regulations that are being proposed.

  • Irony Guy Bountiful, Utah
    Jan. 25, 2013 11:31 a.m.

    Much of the deficit we face is now being driven by massive storms and the dollars needed to clean up. National flood insurance system worked fine for 50 years but since Katrina has gone belly up. Sandy will cost a trillion before it's over. Climate change is upon us; action is urgent NOW. In fact, it's probably too late.

  • Opinionated Sandy, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 11:21 a.m.

    RE: LDS Liberal: "Conservative mindset"? "Spend now, worry about paying for it later"? LOL, I believe you have your labels mixed up.

    I find it amazing how our society is crumbling apart morally and financially, where our safety is being threatened from every side, where the concept of family is passe, and you want to make a big deal out of a small change in temp that only an egomaniac could think he could change. I'm not saying we shouldn't be aware of our footprint on the ecosystem--it just seems Jeff is right to say let's concentrate a little more on areas closer to home.

    And, to blame climate change for every hurricane that comes our way is amazingly myopic.

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 11:14 a.m.

    More 'bait and switch' from Republicans.

    Concerned about warming? Worry about the debt.

    Bush doubled the debt and Obama hasn't? Worry about terrorism.

    Osama Bin Laden is dead? what is Obama doing about global warming...?

  • Blue Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 11:08 a.m.

    Said the Republican dinosaurs of the Late Cretaceous, "Asteroids? You expect us to pay attention to asteroids? Don't we have more important things to worry about?"

  • Pagan Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 11:02 a.m.

    In a world with global warming there would be no water to grow your crops.



    At what point would you realize, you cannot eat money?

  • Tolstoy salt lake, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 10:47 a.m.


    thats right peanut its all about overthrowing your precious way of life.

  • Darrel Eagle Mountain, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 10:32 a.m.

    So...let's figure out our money and whether the wealthy should get a 3 point tax increase before we try to save the human race.

    I don't see any fallacy with this logic.

  • PeanutGallery Salt Lake City, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 10:17 a.m.

    Good letter, Jeff, but global warming isn't ALL about spending more money. It's also about attacking capitalism, undermining freedom, and gaining more control over people's lives. Oops, sorry, I guess I'm supposed to call it "climate change" now.

  • Eric Samuelsen Provo, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 10:11 a.m.

    I do think, actually, that a condition that poses an existential threat to human life on this planet might become a fairly important issue, worth doing something about immediately.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    Jan. 25, 2013 9:44 a.m.

    I certainly agree that we have many issues to occupy our time and attention.

    But to suggest that the future of our planet (and we only get one) is low on the priority list seems short sighted.

    Do we have "bigger fish to fry". Perhaps not. Especially if we are the fish to be fried . . .

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 9:26 a.m.

    There's a lot of things we shouldn't be ignoring, and climate change is among them. It's refreshing to hear the president mention it, but I wouldn't worry about meaningful change anytime soon.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 9:10 a.m.

    This is the same conservative mindset that created the huge Federal deficeit in the 1st place.

    Spend now, worry about paying for it later....

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 8:39 a.m.

    "Let's tell our elected officials to tackle bigger issues like the economy, tax relief and curbing spending, and leave global warming for another day when we have paid off the national debt and thus have some spare money sitting around."

    In other words, never.


    So you're suggesting we merely kick the can down the road and solve nothing. Great. That's what repubs excel at.

    When was the last time we had no debt btw?

  • one old man Ogden, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 8:37 a.m.

    Warming is just one of literally hundreds of things our leaders should be concerned about and working on.

    Ignoring it would be like vacuuming the living room carpet while ignoring the grease fire on the kitchen stove.

  • RanchHand Huntsville, UT
    Jan. 25, 2013 8:22 a.m.

    Jeff, has it occurred to you that warming might cause many other problems that will be costly?

    Hurricane Sandy, more powerful tornadoes, worse winter weather in some areas and more drought in others. Each of these things is going to be far more costly than prevention. An old adage comes to mind: An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.