There is no such thing as a free ride — someone must pay

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  • Crusader Layton, UT
    Oct. 9, 2012 5:24 a.m.

    Get rid of the socialist freeloaders, no one should be able to have a child until they have enough in savings to pay for K - 12 education.

  • Salsa Libre Provo, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 9:08 p.m.

    So, if poor people are required to go to the emergency room, who pays for that? Have you looked at your medical insurance co-pay and insurance premiums lately? Did you ever figure out why that procedure that used to be covered is no longer covered?

    Yes, there are costs. But there are costs with being an American citizen and living in this country!

  • boxerdog915 Clearfield, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 7:15 p.m.

    Here's a thought...people being responsible for themselves!!! I agree with this opinion piece. I am so tired of paying for people who have no motivation to take care of themselves. I have no problem paying a little more for those who need it but this isn't about who need it, it's about those that demand it, which is happening more often than not. This nation is becoming so dependent on federal government help that now they expect it as well as expect the working people to pay for everything while they do nothing. It's getting asinine and needs to stop!!

  • Makid Kearns, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 1:42 p.m.

    Here is 1 point that some people might have missed. In the letter, they are basically asking for a repeal of Obamacare. I understand that. Now, Obamacare uses Private Insurance companies to meet the goals it sets.

    Now, if it were to be repealed, all of the protections that were included will be removed. A big protection that everyone wants but will be repealed with the rest revolves around Pre-Existing Conditions.

    Did you know that insurance companies prior to Obamacare could deny you coverage because you had a pre-existing condition? Did you know that if you have had a transplant, you have a pre-existing condition. Did you know that if you donated a kidney, you have a pre-existing condition.

    Now, should we deny coverage to the above as well as people who have/beaten Cancer, any surgical treatment, blood transfusions, severe allergies, Etc.?

    That is what people need to realize. If you are against Obamacare, you want everyone with a pre-existing condition to be denied coverage.

    Instead of wanting it repealed, modify what is there already. Make it better?

    It might be hard as it is the Republican healthcare plan, but modifications can happen.

  • Counter Intelligence Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 10:14 a.m.

    @LDS Liberal
    Your assumption that anyone who recognizes the limits of money, government and welfare is advocating "outlandish hatred toward the sick, the elderly and the needy" is downright vicious and pathetic.

    I try to be as intellectually liberal as possible: Yet the day-after-day chiding from the fashionably intolerant politically correct, such as your posts, who seem to be far more pious, angry and arrogant than the worst mouthpieces on the right, is precisely why I am turned off by intolerant left-wing politics.

    Your posts represents WHY illiberal political liberals are more dangerous to society than right-wingers.
    Tolerance involves more than expressing hate for fashionable reasons.

  • JoeCapitalist2 Orem, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 9:06 a.m.

    LDS Liberal: Your self-manufactured outrage agains conservatives is the result of automatically assuming that anyone who wants to reign in government entitlements has no compassion.

    The typical liberal response to cuts is that the most vulnerable members of society are going to be thrown under the bus and that conservatives would cheer that. They believe that if you cut Medicare, Social Security, or Welfare funding that automatically means that the poor, sick, and truly disabled are going to be the first to be cut off. They never assume that government would use the reduction in funding to cut off the lazy, fraudulent, or people with enough resources already.

    In some liberal circles, keeping some high school dropout from using food stamps to feed his alcohol and nicotine addiction is cruel and inhuman punishment and excessively taxing some young family struggling to get by so a comfortable retired couple can get free medical care is compassionate.

    I am not going to go the liberal route and assume that my extreme example is the norm, but it does happen a lot nevertheless.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    Oct. 8, 2012 8:15 a.m.

    The government cannot give anyone something they do not first take from someone else. There is no such thing as a free ride — someone always has to pay.

    I for one, am tired of the freeloaders who expect everything handed to them without the bother of working and taking responsibility for themselves.

    Patricia Allred-Sorensen


    Why do conservatives show such distain and outlandish hatred toward the sick, the elderly and the needy...
    and turn a blind eye and actually cheer unfunded wars for oil, Corporate Welfare, and bailouts to Banks and WallStreet?

    This is why I chide them day-after-day....

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Oct. 8, 2012 7:24 a.m.

    @ Grover. You need to get out more to learn about these permanent welfare recipients as I have. It will change your entire view of the government’s welfare state. A study was done that a welfare recipient can receive benefits in the neighborhood of about $42K/year and even more if they have children! Why work? Could that be the reason unemployment is so high? In the meantime, the national debt skyrockets, all which must be paid for by our grandchildren, all in the name of “compassion”. If you think unemployment is high now, wait a month after Obama wins re-election! You haven’t seen the worst yet!

  • Grover Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 9:51 p.m.

    Standard trope of the right: "We have an all time record for people on food stamps." Now if times were good the logic of the statement would be troubling. How could we have so many on the dole when times are so good? That is not the case today. Last month was the first month below 8% for unemployment in 40 months. That rate equals the worst downturn since the Depression (over 80 years ago). So now the right wants us to be outraged that so many people need help?? Just another case of public education in Utah failing to teach basic logic i.e. when many people are out of work and without income what is the result? Answer: the need for government assistance goes up.

  • HaHaHaHa Othello, WA
    Oct. 7, 2012 9:38 p.m.

    The stupidity of the left, never ceases to astonish! We have traded an ineffective and inefficient medical system, to an even bigger mess with Obamacare. It will be more expensive, it will be a jobs killer, and it doesn't do ONE thing to make people more accountable for their medical expenses, or to control costs! In theory it will put more people on insurance, which will ultimately be a government insurance program, paid for by the tax payers(who are already paying the costs anyway).
    You can blame the TARP and some of the bailouts to industry and finance companies on Bush, and you wouldn't be lying, but you would be a liar, if you didn't recognize that BHO and MANY democrats didn't play a bigger role in these deals. Oil subsidies are a joke! There are is no such thing, just a democrat manufactured lie to promote more class envy styled reactions. If we needed to pay for the wars, all welfare payments should have ended, along with dozens of other wasteful federal programs. I would greatly favor that idea!

  • timpClimber Provo, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 8:10 p.m.

    Unfortunately I have relatives on Medicade and food stamps and WIC and etc., and they just keep having babies (6 with the oldest just 6) The father will not look for work or go to DI or the State for training (He didn't finish high school). If there were work requirements for all the handouts I would not feel like I'm ripped off. Yes we need a safety net but we also need a work net.

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 7:00 p.m.

    I agree, someone must pay.

    When we hand out billions to Egypt, Iraq, and Libya, who is paying?

    When we give defense contractors blank checks for them to built jets that our Pentagon doesn't want, who is ultimately paying?

    When we bail out banks, like Bush's TARP did, who paid?

    When we give out tax cuts, oil and gas subsidies, and reward folks for moving their businesses to China, who is paying?

    We desperately need to be more accountable. Lets begin with eliminating the tax cuts, closing the loopholes, cut all foreign aid, and the defense spending in half.

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Oct. 7, 2012 4:44 p.m.

    Because the government’s numerous attempts to solve poverty only create more poverty! We have an all time record number of people on food stamps with no end in sight. People fall into poverty because they make poor life style choices, not because there aren’t enough government programs! This is neither mean spirited nor greedy, it’s the truth!

  • Ying Fah Provo, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 2:33 p.m.

    This is just more of the "I don't want to pay for anything I don't like" nonsense. You live in a community and you have made a covenent in the organization of that community to do certain things for those truly in need.

    The idea that there is mass fraud among the poor in gaming the system has a long history. Fortunately, it is not true. It is not pleasant to be poor. It is not pleasant to need help. But it is right to have help available for those who need it.

    Perhaps the writer yearns for the days of the workhouse? The idea that everyone's success was done without help from someone else is fiction. It's just that some of these people don't want to give credit where it is due because they then would have to admit to needing help which, in their minds, makes them weak. This is one reason so many mothers have such a thankless job.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 11:53 a.m.

    A government program called Head Start has bipartian support because they have substantiated that for every dollar spent there is a $9-15 return from child achievement and becoming productive adults. This is just an example that from underprivilege can arise excellence. You need to stop looking at these things as the poor gaming the system and as seed money that will have long term benefits. Medicare fraud is rampant because of the so called job creators gaming the system not the recipients. The same is true with Medicaid. You should be putting your attention to what can we do to improve the systems not eliminate them and as was related previously a single payer healthcare system is the only logical direction we can go. You and I are already subsidizing 60% of the nations healthcare so lets go all the way. It won't be as expensive as you think and your employer will be thrilled to get out of the healthcare business.

  • Hemlock Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 10:54 a.m.

    Medicaid is so greatly abused that some reforms would be more practical and ethical than simply cutting funds. Ask any emergency department worker about the personal who takes an ambulance to the hospital (because that's free for on Medicaid) for a non-emergency, the doctor who is frustrated by skipped appointments and non-compliance by those on Medicaid, the provider who fraudulently submits claims or the person who abuses their Medicaid benefits by their own life style choices. Simply raising taxes and pouring in more money is not wise.

  • Blue Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 10:23 a.m.

    Conservatives, do you ever look in the mirror and ask yourselves when and how it was that you made nasty, short-sighted selfishness into a virtue?

    We have had two hugely expensive yet unfunded foreign wars, huge tax cuts, tax subsidies for oil companies, and Wall Street banks treating our mortgages and retirement funds like poker chips in a casino. To no one's surprise, this has made a mess of the economy, and a lot of people are now either on the streets or barely hanging on by their fingernails.

    But instead of addressing the greed and arrogance that wrecked the economy, conservatives now belligerently double-down on their mean-spirited ignorance and decide that senior citizens, military veterans, children, the disabled and the poor are the cause of our economic woes.


  • a bit of reality Shawnee Mission, KS
    Oct. 7, 2012 8:20 a.m.

    I wonder if the letter writer likes the current system. If you don't have insurance or money, you just show up at the ER for free health care, that the hospital and doctors are required to provide for free. Or even if you have some insurance and assets but they aren't enough for a big medical event, the medical bills put you into bankruptcy, leaving not only your medical providers without full payment for the services they provided, but other creditors as well.

    If everybody had medical insurance, there would be fewer bankruptcies, which would be good for everybody. Hospitals and doctors would be paid for everybody they see, which would allow them to charge lower rates. People would be more free to change jobs and create their own businesses, knowing their health insurance coverage and ability to acquire coverage isn't tied to their jobs.

    Just as our society freely gives a K-12 education to all citizens, it should also freely give basic healthcare to all citizens. Whether you are going to pay your mortgage or pay for your child's leukemia treatment isn't a free-market decision we should impose on our citizens.

  • DVD Taylorsville, 00
    Oct. 7, 2012 8:10 a.m.

    Highways that I do not use are also paid for out of my taxes. There are many things that don't immediately benefit us that we are called upon to pay taxes for in this nation and in our communities. The conditions that would lead us to not have that would be one that also fragments our nation into small isolated communites that would each be much poorer on their own. Think of warlord fiefdoms in Somalia.

  • Curmudgeon Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 7:38 a.m.

    How callous, uncaring, and ignorant to label those who receive Medicaid as "freeloaders." Patricia should educate herself about the kinds of people who receive, and need, medical care under the Medicaid program--like my son who has Down Syndrome, and could not possibly work in a job that would pay enough to purchase private health insurance, even though he would love to.

    Frankly, I wish the writer would not have to pay for Medicaid; she doesn't deserve the privilege and blessing of helping those in need. Let her keep her filthy lucre for herself.

  • freedomingood provo, Utah
    Oct. 7, 2012 6:46 a.m.

    "someone must pay". Some people pay for things with the fiat paper money they recieved by thier position of power over others that must work and exert themselves for very little.

    Those that actually work for a living, pay with thier sweat and discomfort. Who's really paying for everything in this world? The workers. "by the sweat of thy brow."

    Now think it over. Who's paying? Don't be fooled by human constructs of power and fiat currency. The idle will answer for thier slothfullness.

  • Moderate Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 1:12 a.m.

    At what point did compassion die within you? What should become of the people after you take away their Medicaid? Would you send them all to the emergency room? That's not free either. Would you kick them all to the curb to wither and die in the gutter? That would make it difficult for us to say with a straight face "We are a Christian nation."

  • Hutterite American Fork, UT
    Oct. 7, 2012 1:05 a.m.

    So what's going to happen when it's your turn at medicaid and you get punted? Yeah, someone must pay, just like we're doing now. So let's get everyone in the boat. For their entire lives as citizens. At no point in anyone's life is health care cost free. Never. But we can make it better, and make it available without the self righteous guilt trip to everyone in the nation. Someone must pay. Let's make it a better deal for everyone. Let's get single payer health care in place.