Defending the Faith: It's a comfort to know death is not the end

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  • johanBjorn Salt lake city, UT
    Nov. 29, 2012 7:03 p.m.

    jtt -

    That would be Pascal's wager you are thinking of.

    Here's the thing with that: To believe something for fear of being wrong about it doesn't really make sense. You can't just go through the motions and expect reward at the end of life just because you went to church every Sunday.

    I believe this view of the afterlife and end of days is a crutch for people to lean on, personally.

  • jttheawesome Scranton, PA
    Oct. 6, 2012 7:40 a.m.

    I believe it was C S Lewis who said something like this: If we Christians are wrong about heaven and the afterlife, and agnostics and atheists are correct in saying that there is nothing after death, then we Christians lose nothing. If, however, Christians are correct - and I for one firmly believe that we are correct - and there is indeed a heaven and afterlife based upon choices made in this life - than the agnostics and atheists will lose everything for all time and eternity. Just food for thought.......

  • Serenity Manti, UT
    Oct. 5, 2012 4:38 p.m.

    @ Sharonna. I totally agree with you in what you have taken from the Holy Bible. But I am trying to prove, without the Bible,that life does continue after death. Many don't believe the Bible as you and I do. But there is so much more proof out there about the afterlife from people's own experiences - even the ones who have never heard of God. As Jesus said "He who has ears, let him hear." Some won't or can't get over science and the things you can surmise with your five senses and don't comprehend the spiritual.

    I'm quiet frankly surprised that Scientist didn't go into negative energy, dark matter or anti-matter. He did get down to photons though. I've always found these things so interesting.

  • sharrona layton, UT
    Oct. 5, 2012 9:24 a.m.

    @Serenity,… “. Man was created from the dust of the earth, also according to the Bible and was given life by the breath of God.’ True,
    the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto ‘God’ who gave it.” Ecc 12:7.
    Heaven, I Desire to *depart and to be with Christ… (Phil. 1:23). Paul uses the term *analuo (loosed up) At death, though the body is “loosed down”. When Lazarus died, his spirit “was carried away by the angels into Abraham’s bosom” (Lk. 16:22). For those who die in Christ, death is union with the Lord. Jesus informed the dying thief, “Today you shall be with me in paradise” (Lk. 23:43).
    At death, all who have lived in rebellion to God will enter a spirit state characterized by pains, trouble, and sorrow (Psa. 116:3). They will be immersed in shame and contempt (Dan. 12:2). It will be a realm of anguish, suffering, and torment (Mt. 22:13; 25:46; Mk. 9:48; Lk. 16:24; 2 Thes. 1:9; Rev. 20:10).

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    Oct. 5, 2012 7:40 a.m.

    A Scientist,

    I think you over simplify the complex relationship between matter and energy and the conversions from one to the other.

    You may extinguish the flame (the source) but the light and heat it generated did not simply disappear. They remain in the universe in one form or another. Also, the candle remains to generate more light and heat later.

  • A Scientist Provo, UT
    Oct. 5, 2012 12:34 a.m.

    Are you talking about religion or physics now? I don't find the law of conservation of energy in any religious text, including LDS Standard works. Is your religious belief based on science or faith? If faith, the law of conservation of energy is irrelevant.

    Joseph Smith revealed, "There is no such thing as immaterial matter. All spirit is matter, but it is more fine or pure, and can only be discerned by purer eyes; we cannot see it; but when our bodies are purified we shall see that it is all matter" (D&C 131:7-8).

    Since then, physicists have demonstrated the creation and annihilation of (ponderable) matter particles, and imponderable non-matter particles. Thus, matter is then not conserved: matter particles (such as electrons) can be converted to non-matter (such as photons), or even into non-matter potential or kinetic energy.

    In short, think of a flame on a candle. When the flame is extinguished, it does not continue to exist and "go somewhere else". And when a Cheshire Cat stops smiling, the "smile" does not continue to exist and "go somewhere else."

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 11:33 p.m.

    Twin Lights,

    I call them as I see them. If you want to call my beliefs Fairy Tales, go right ahead... since you don't know what they are, you might lack credibility, but knock yourself out.

  • Twin Lights Louisville, KY
    Oct. 4, 2012 8:11 p.m.


    That you have not experienced it does not mean it doesn’t happen.


    First, the ephemeral nature of life is not lost on those who believe in an afterlife.

    Second, please refrain from referring to my beliefs as fairy tales and I will pay you the same respect.

  • Serenity Manti, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 7:58 p.m.

    @ A Scientist - I was not refering to the light bulb in a scientific way but rather in a colloquial manner.

    I have been there when people die and when that happens, the internal life which was in that body seems to leave.

    To illuminate my assertion, I guess the question is: Does life cease to exist posthumously? You honed in on the example of the lightbulb, not when I said that in this universe, energy cannot be created or destroyed; it only changes form. What would make the energy in a life exempt from that law of physics?

  • A Scientist Provo, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 6:40 p.m.


    "When a person dies, you could see the energy leave the body as if someone turned out a light bulb."

    No, you cannot "see the energy leave the body" any more than you can see the energy leave a lightbulb. The electromagnetic radiation that is transformed into a visible spectrum in a lightbulb does not "go anywhere" when it "leaves" the lightbulb. Your example is a very bad one if you hope it illuminates your assertion.

  • Serenity Manti, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 5:47 p.m.

    I have often wondered that without the Bible, specifically the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, life after death would be relevant. Man was created from the dust of the earth, also according to the Bible and was given life by the breath of God.

    When that mortal body dies and decomposes back into the earth, what happens to the essence of life, the energy incorporated into a life, in fact life itself? When a person dies, you could see the energy leave the body as if someone turned out a light bulb. Where did the energy go? Did it cease to exist? Did the life-force die? How could it when energy cannot be created or destroyed? It only changes form.

    People have believed that life goes on from the earliest recorded times. Other than the Savior's resurrection, we have no recorded evidence of anyone conquering death. As we believe, our faith grows; as our faith grows we understand the deeper, more spiritual aspects of life. The Savior said that there are those who have eyes but cannot see, ears, but cannot hear. Perhaps we need to see more clearly and listen more.

  • sharrona layton, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 4:10 p.m.

    RE: John 11:25 KJV, Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me,though he were dead, yet shall he live.

    Salvation is not universal but based on the belief of Each individual. For God so loved the world that he gave his One and Only Son, that Whoever Believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. (John 3:16 NIV)

    For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone Who Believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek. (Romans 1:16)

    Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s Wrath remains on them. (John 3:36 NIV)

    Christ redeems from more than mortal death,redeems us from spiritual death . As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins. Eph 2:1.

  • Dennis Harwich, MA
    Oct. 4, 2012 3:32 p.m.

    Death seems pretty permanent to me. I'm 60 and have yet to meet, see or interact with anyone that has met their demise.

  • Vanka Provo, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 9:52 a.m.

    Comforting to know death is not the end?

    Not to many people who consider the temporary nature of life to give it its most profound meaning, flavor, and preciousness!

    And at the end of a life well-lived, to welcome that ultimate quintessence of quiescence and the absolute freedom from the heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks that flesh is heir to - 'tis a consummation devoutly to be wished!

    No, many of us find no comfort at all in fairy stories about immortality and Platonic scenes of eternal empyreal ennui!

  • Church member North Salt Lake, UT
    Oct. 4, 2012 9:51 a.m.

    Just because one believes in something does not make it true.

    But I do understand that it gives them comfort and helps them get through their life and I respect that.