Red roundup: Arizona Republic pegs Utes to finish last in Pac-12

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  • Jordan Lynchburg, VA
    Oct. 21, 2011 6:14 p.m.

    Trollers keep on trollin' I guess. Guys seriously, cheer for your own team. On both sides. I'm pretty sure the majority of people on this board aren't older than 10. At least try to look mature, people.

  • PAC 10.2 Doormat Springville, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 5:45 p.m.

    @ Duckhunter

    Very much so!

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 3:07 p.m.

    Oh this is fun....LOL!

  • Marked it Down Park City, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 1:48 p.m.


    "Why so much obsession with Utah?"

    For definition of obsession with rival, see mirror.

    btw, ask Coach-K2 if he'd like to have Dave Roses' record after 6 seasons.

    BYU will be just fine in the WCC. Conference affiliation in basketball is much less important, especially once you've established a track record in the NCAA tournament. Dave Rose has already done that with five straight trips to the Big Dance.

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 12:40 p.m.

    Why so much anymousity from BYU fans about Utes being excited to be in the Pac 12? I'm sure you would have been excited had your team gotten invited as well and don't try to tell us you didn't want the invite. Tom Holmoe stated BYU had been hoping for a Pac 10 invite for decades and Bronco just stated his preference is to be in a BCS conference.

    Of course, since so many BYU fans have come on this article to kick us while we're down let's take a look at your team's situation. BYU is currently ranked 47th in the preseason coaches poll. It's gonna be tough to improve on that in the WCC. Welcome to life without Jimmer and in a less respected conference. Don't get me wrong. It will be a while before the Utes get to participate in March Madness, but BYU would almost be a lock if they were in the Pac 12.

  • Uteology Fort Worth, Texas
    Oct. 21, 2011 11:56 a.m.


    Why so much obsession with Utah? :)

  • VegasUte Las Vegas, NV
    Oct. 21, 2011 11:49 a.m.

    So funny how the Ute hater trolls come out at anything negative. We will be fine. We will be much better, even if we do finish last, in the long run than b?U finishing third or fourth in the WCC.

    Have fun in the Jr. High gymnasiums!!

    BTW, what is a Torero or a Don?

    Go Utes!! Onward and Upward!!

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 11:48 a.m.

    Yes, once again Duckhunter proves he is the king of kick 'em while they're down. He also would like us all to believe he knows what every basketball playing kid in the country feels. He said the same thing about football too, but then Austin Lee from Alta High School blew that claim for him when he said Utah was the only school he ever wanted to go to.

    Duckhunter's credibility is low and his arrogance is high, so don't put too much stock in his comments.

  • Uteology Fort Worth, Texas
    Oct. 21, 2011 11:48 a.m.

    Duckhunter | 10:34 a.m. Oct. 20, 2011

    Current reality is sometimes hard to take but the truth is you have absolutely nothing to look forward to with the utah basketball program. It was left to rot in favor of the football team.


    True. Ask Dave Rose if he would like compete in the PAC-12 or WCC.

    The basketball program was playing in the Sweet 16 in 2005 the same year Utah was the first BCS Buster to play in a BCS game in January.

    That same season BYU basketball was 9-21 and their football team finished 5-7.

    Utah basketball has ABSOLUTELY everything to look forward to, case in point Utah just signed the 2012 #1 Utah recruit and ESPN 100 Jordan Loveridge.

  • Uteanymous Salt Lake City, Utah
    Oct. 21, 2011 11:00 a.m.


    It's hillarious that Utah fans would even think of claiming a national championship for 1944, but then have the hypocrisy to whine about the legitimacy of BYU's 1984 national championship.

    Here's a reality check:

    Utah 1944 had three regular season wins - Idaho State (twice) and Colorado College - that's it.


    Because Utah, Idaho State and Colorado College were the ONLY three colleges in the entire Intermountain area that were still playing basketball in 1944.

    The same was true for the rest of the country - hardly anybody was still playing basketball, which is why Utah was invited to take another team's place in the NCAA tournament, AFTER the Utes lost in the opening round of the NIT.

    Slice it anyway you like, but 1944 was the least competitive NCAA tournament in history and the winner was never officially recognized as the national champion by any organization.

    On the other hand, BYU 1984 was officially recognized by the AP, FWAA, NFF, USA/CNN, and UPI as the 1984 major college football national champion.

  • Just the FAX Olympus Cove, Utah
    Oct. 21, 2011 10:20 a.m.


    BYU football 1984 was selected concensus national champion by all five major college football selecting organizations.

    Who selected Utah basketball 1944 national champion?

    The fact that Utah was invited to both the 1944 NIT and NCAA tournaments, but chose to accept their invitation to the NIT instead of the NCAA, proves which tournament even the Utes thought was more prestigious.

    That said, the only major selecting organization of the day, the Helms Athletic Foundation, didn't choose either tournament champion - Army was chosen as the 1944 national champion.

    Utah has a 1944 NCAA champion trophy in their trophy case, NOT a national championship trophy.

    BYU has FIVE 1984 NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP trophies in their trophy case, including the exact same trophy that will be awarded to the winner of this year's BCS championship game.

    You can question whether BYU was worthy or deserving of winning the championship, but the only people who question whether BYU actually won the 1984 championship are jealous BYU-haters.

    It's part of college football history now. Deal with it.

    Oct. 21, 2011 9:27 a.m.

    @duckhunter, et al.

    The University of Utah has the NCAA 1944 trophy in the Huntsman Center as proof. I'm not sure where you're getting your made-up information.

    The only thing debatable is the supposed 1984 football trophy that byu had made to represent their undefeated season.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 8:11 a.m.


    Jealous of a team that barely has a winning record the last six years, that has lost 9 of its last 10 against its rival, and that is picked to finish dead last in the PAC 12?


  • PAC 10.2 Doormat Springville, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 7:44 a.m.

    @Go Red

    "Things have a way of evening themselves out."

    Ute chest thumping for 18 months about being in the PAC 10.2 and disappointing seasons in both football and basketball the first season. Yep, that would be karma.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 7:39 a.m.

    It's going to be a long, long, long, empty red seat season.

    ... and I'm very jealous and bitter about it. Please point this out to me over and over and again, again and again.

  • pocyUte Pocatello, ID
    Oct. 21, 2011 7:12 a.m.

    Of course Utah was picked last in the league. I would have put them there too based on the turnover from last season. I don't think they will end up last in the Pac-12 if they play like coach K wants them too (tough as nails with lock down defense)

    Looking over their schedule, I expect them to have 9 or 10 wins going into Pac-12 play. If they can grow together during that stretch I think they will compete very nicely in the Pac-12 and probably be somewhere around .500 in the Pac-12. I will say that I'm more excited about Utah hoops this year than I have been since the Majerus years.

    Go Utes.

  • SportsCenter Olympus Cove, Utah
    Oct. 21, 2011 6:56 a.m.


    From 1939, when the NCAA Tournament started, the Helms Athletic Foundation and NCAA Division I champions were the same, except for 1939, 1940, 1944, and 1954 when Oregon, Indiana, Utah, and La Salle respectively won the tournament.

    In 1944, Army(15-0) was the national champion; Utah(6-1) didn't come close

    1947 - Holy Cross(27-3)
    1951 - Kentucky(32-2)

  • Eddie Syracuse, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 6:15 a.m.

    I for one will wait to see how many of this years team members will remain and not bolt for another program when the going gets rough. Let's face it, these kids like to win and if they don't and are getting beat badly in games, they will run just like several did last year. All it takes is one to run and soon a few more will follow. If the Utes don't win a few games in the PAC-12, they will suffer and suffer bad for years to come. The reason BYU came back so quickly is due to their being a private school, one that people look forward to going to for many years. The U is just another state sponsored school. I don't mean that in a really negative way, but people are more likely to be solidly for a school like BYU than a state run school.

  • MidMajor4ever Syracuse, UT
    Oct. 21, 2011 3:50 a.m.

    Envy, jealousy and hatred brings out the "fans" of our former rival. byu's basketball program has never reached a Final Four and has a very poor NCAA Tournament record. duhkhunter, your team plays in the WCC which is several steps down from an elite league such as the PAC-12.

    You say no young man dreams of being a Utah Ute basketball or football player, come on! Sour grapes! You make me laugh!

    Please feel free to pound your chest over a couple of Sweet 16 appearances in your school's entire history and a football NC played in a 3rd tier bowl game against a team tied for 6th place in a 10 team league.

    Thank you for your continued obsession with The University of Utah.

    Go Utes!

  • Snack PAC Olympus Cove, Utah
    Oct. 21, 2011 1:17 a.m.


    1944 NCAA Champions - Utah
    1944 NIT Champions - St. Johns


    Sorry to burst your bubble, but Utah has never won a national championship in basketball. Trying to claim a national championship for winning the 2nd rate tournament of the day, with only 3 regular season wins and a 3-1 record in post season is ridiculous.

  • Jordan Lynchburg, VA
    Oct. 20, 2011 10:27 p.m.

    Who cares about history. Sure, Utah's history is better than BYU's, but let's not lower our standards to the history argument, let somebody else do that. We know we don't have a great team, but so far I like the way the new coach has handled the situation, and seeing a couples of recruits coming in next year, we have decent talent on the horizon. It may not be as far off as we think. They have to prove it on the court though, and THAT is the most important thing, NOT being in a "high profile conference". The program needs to win, no matter where they are at. At any rate,

    Go Utes!

  • T-Mac Corona, CA
    Oct. 20, 2011 9:54 p.m.


    In what year did the NCAA become the "true" national championship game, 1946, 1951, 1979, 2011? Cite your sources.

    I guess you'll have to count Utah's 1947 NIT as a true national champonship, right? Or do you have some way to explain away that one too?

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 9:33 p.m.


    Uh....utah has NEVER won the basketball national championship. utah "fans" try to perpetuate that untruth but the fact is they have not. When they won the ncaa tourney 70 years ago it was an upstart tourney that was at best the #2 tourney of that time. Sorry to have to continue to set you all straight but it seems as if none of you realize National Championships have to actually be National Championships.


  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Oct. 20, 2011 7:15 p.m.

    What does Chris B. predict for the Utes?

    Oct. 20, 2011 7:12 p.m.

    It's interesting how the Ute haters such as Duckhunter come on and predict their rival's hoped-for demise. Just a reminder:

    NCAA National Championships:
    Utah 1
    BYU 0

    National Championship games played in:
    Utah 2
    BYU 0

    Final Fours played in:
    Utah 4
    BYU 0

    Sweet Sixteen appearances:
    Utah 9
    BYU 2

    And I could go on and on, like comparing All-American players with both schools, but it really is irrelevant. The only thing that is important is that the University of Utah is now in a high-profile conference, a conference that BYU "fans" would kill to be a part of.

    Duckhunter, your posts always come across as sour grapes.

  • socalcougar! La Crescenta, CA
    Oct. 20, 2011 5:44 p.m.


    You make a good point. Utah had some good talent on those teams and proved it in the NCAA tournament. If Utah can get those type of players, they will be just fine in the PAC-12.

    Being in the PAC-12 will help them with recruiting. But they will need better players than they've had the last several years. Hopefully being the PAC-12 will change that. Time will tell.

  • Riddles in the Dark Olympus Cove, Utah
    Oct. 20, 2011 5:31 p.m.


    "I see those from the Y who believe that one year of semi success now makes them basketball critics and knowledgeable"

    Having the concensus national player-of-the-year and coming within two points of the Elite Eight without your star center is much more than just having semi-success.

    Despite your hyperbole, Utah fans would give their eye-teeth to have the kind of "semi-success" that BYU has had during the Dave Rose era.

    BYU Utah Basketball 2006-2010

    Last 5 Seasons (MWC)
    2010 BYU 30-6 (2nd) Sweet Sixteen
    2009 BYU 25-8 (1st) 2nd Round
    2008 BYU 27-7 (1st) 1st Round
    2007 BYU 25-9 (1st) 1st Round
    2006 BYU 20-9 (2nd) NIT
    Total BYU 127-39 (77%)

    2010 Utah 14-17 (5th)
    2009 Utah 25-10 (1st) 1st Round
    2008 Utah 18-15 (6th)
    2007 Utah 11-19 (6th)
    2006 Utah 14-15 (6th)
    Utah 82-76 (52%)

    Utah couldn't even beat the bottom-dwellers of the WCC last season.

    Oh, and just in case you've forgotten, BYU has won 9 of the last 10 head-to-head games, including the most lopsided HC beat-down in BYU-Utah history.

  • joseywales Park City, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 4:22 p.m.

    Duckie- So what? in athletics there are ups and downs. Even the most storied programs rebuild and aren't on top every year. And speaking of storied programs, let's just end this now shall we? Utes- NIT champs, NCAA champs, several final four and Elite 8 appearances. Cougs-NEVER been to a Final Four! Again, so what? we've been picked 10.2th (thanks to pac 10.2doormat for his moronic term) As stated above, if we even finish 11th we'll be exceeding expectations. The team will be back in the Sweet 16 before the Cougars will, so let's talk when you find another Jimmy.

  • SportzzFan HERRIMAN, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 4:14 p.m.


    I am always amazed at the arrogance of those who wear the blue.

    Thanks for sharing today's wardrobe choice with us.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 4:10 p.m.

    I hope they do better than that. Basketball in the PAC is much more competitive top to bottom than football. There usually aren't any really bad teams.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 4:02 p.m.

    And yet all of the utah "fans" on here know I am right. utah's basketball program is awful, why pretend otherwise? And no utah will not turn it around as quickly as BYU did, if they ever turn it around, and I'll tell you why.

    There are 1000's of kids that dream of playing basketball at BYU, letterally thousands of them. There isn't a single kid alive that drams of playing basketball for utah.

    BYU will always get enough good players to be a good team as long as the coaching is good. utah does not have that built in advantage. That is why BYU was able to bounce back to a winning record 2 years after only winning 1 game wereas utah has been mired in mediocrity for the last 6 years.

    Many of the utah "fans" on here have claimed that utah is now a football school, I understand them wanting to make that claim since their basketball programs litterally sucks and their football program is ok, and they are correct in one aspect. They are a school that can only support one decent program, they do not have the resources to support 2. Basketball's the loser.

  • Rock Of The Marne Phoenix, AZ
    Oct. 20, 2011 4:01 p.m.

    Awh, Ducky out from the hole he crawled in after the Utah BYU game I see, once again sharing his biased beyond belief dower predictions regarding the Utes. Duckhunter you must enjoy eating crow. Prepare for the next course. Bon appetit.

  • JustGordon Cottonwood Heights, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 3:03 p.m.

    I see those from the Y who believe that one year of semi success now makes them basketball critics and knowledgeable have come to talk trash.

    I am always amazed at the arrogance of those who wear the blue.

  • Utehaterforlife Syracuse, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 1:25 p.m.

    bottom of the pac 12, tell us how the view is from the bottom.

  • Johnson72 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 12:50 p.m.

    Well duh!!!

  • UtahUte16 Salt Lake City, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 12:43 p.m.


    You tell us! Way to come in here and put us in our place. Seriously, who let's this guys posts through?

  • T-Mac Corona, CA
    Oct. 20, 2011 12:17 p.m.


    Appreciate the classy comments. You're an entirely different caliber cougar fan than Duckhunter.

    However, I have to disagree with you on recruiting. When Utah was in the WAC and MWC under Jerry Pimm and Rick Majerus they never lacked the talent to make it to sweet 16's, elite 8's, and final fours (Van Horn, Miller, Bogut, Chambers, Vranes eyc.). Basketball is very different from football from a recruting perspective... If you have 1 or 2 really good players, you can go deep in the tournament (see Jimmer).

    Good luck to the Utes & Cougs this year

  • socalcougar! La Crescenta, CA
    Oct. 20, 2011 11:43 a.m.

    Duckhunter, I'm a BYU fan, but I think you are too hard on Utah. This year Utah will not contend for the PAC-12 championship, so I agree with you, but as the underdogs they will have nothing to lose, so they may win a few more than people think (i.e., they won't rot). Going forward, in my opinion, the Utes biggest challenge will be recruiting. Top BCS level programs rely heavily on players that rarely stay for 4 years. Some schools like Kentucky have new faces every year because their starting lineups are all drafted. Unlike football where depth and talent may be developed, college basketball has more of a revolving door. I think this difference will make it harder for Utah to compete in basketball than in football.

    The good news for Utah is that the PAC-12 is not a historically strong basketball league. So Utah will have a chance, especially when it has a strong line-up of seniors and juniors that have been in the program. It is bad timing that Utah is joining a much better league right now. It will make recruiting at a BCS level harder if they finish last.

  • SouthernUtahUte Hurricane, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 11:35 a.m.


    Are you a psychic bro? Because you're acting like one.

    BYU turned their basketball program around when they were just awful.

    Utah hasn't been 1-25 bad, so what makes you think that a Ute turnaround is just so far out of reach? I just have to laugh at your "love" for the University of Utah. Grow up a little! The amount of effort you put forth to not like Utah is downright hilarious. How old are you again....?

    Anyways, Utah's basketball program will turnaround and get better; it wasn't long ago when Utah was very very good.

    Heck... There is no where to go but up!

    GO UTES!!!!

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    Oct. 20, 2011 10:34 a.m.


    Just like utah "fans" like to remind BYU fans how long ago their Football National Championship happened let's just say it has been over a decade, almost a decade and a half, since utah didn't win the basketball national championship against Kentucky. It has also been a decade and a half since BYU hit rock bottom in basketball, which by the way they bounced right back from in 2 seasons. In otherwords, and to quote every utah "fan" that has ever posted on this site, those things are "ancient history" and completely irrelevent.

    I hate to burst your bubble but you will not "come out on top". utah will never be a pac10 basketball power and will only occasionally be competitive. This year they will be abysmal and may not win a pac10 game.

    Current reality is sometimes hard to take but the truth is you have absolutely nothing to look forward to with the utah basketball program. It was left to rot in favor of the football team.

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    Oct. 20, 2011 10:29 a.m.

    Well, at least this way if you do not finish last you've exceeded expectations...

    Oct. 20, 2011 9:56 a.m.

    Before the Ute haters give their 2 bits worth, yes, we know that we are going to be challenged. But we'll come out on top. It wasn't that long ago that the Utes were going to the Sweet 16 each year, including a run to the National Championship game. And during that same time our rival was going through rough (1-25) seasons. Things have a way of evening themselves out.

    Go Utes!!