Hoopsworld is reporting that the Jazz are dead serious about Jimmer. They say Harris's style does not fit the Jazz which is very true. Harris is
poor in transition and pick and roll. He is best in isolation plays which the
Jazz rarely run. Jimmer ran a lot of pick and roll and transition at
BYU. His game is similar to DWill's. The bottom line is Jimmer should be able to
run the Jazz flex better than Harris. They are suggesting the Jazz
may trade Harris to POR. If that is true I suspect the Jazz may be able to get
Batum or Mathews back in trade. Drafting Jimmer is starting to make
more sense all of the time. "Fredette could very well turn out
to be Utah's next great point guard"(Hoopsworld).How is that
for a non BYU comment?
bluecoug89 -- unfortunately, all too many teams had great games against the Utes
this year. Citing accomplishments against Utah during the Giac/Boylen era
doesn't carry much weight.
For those who say Jimmer won't be successful in the NBA - Did you also boo when
the Jazz drafted Gordon? If so, why did you boo? GoHay had some of most athletic
measurements in that draft. Yet many Jazz fans booed because he was
"another slow white guy". White yes, slow no. Just a stereotype. I
realize there is the whole BYU v. Utah going on here on these boards - but if we
all take our red or blue glasses off for a moment - Jimmer actually appears to
have a legit shot at playing well at the next level. I think the Jazz make a
mistake if Jimmer is on the board at 12 and they don't take him.
I love how people making dumb remarks about Jimmer's game and that he's not all
that good when he's the one that put 47 points all over the Utes' face. You guys
make me laugh. Who else in college basketball did that?
There are things that measured stats can not reflect: IQ, leadership, court
presence, adapability, heart, determination, aggressiveness, fearlessness,
toughness. Jimmer has shown all of that throughout his entire carrer. It will
carry over into the NBA. Toughness: he was recruited out of high school to
play football by several major colleges including Penn State. Besides his
abilities he will have a Matt Harpring type of toughness. The more he is
doubted the more he likes it and the harder he works. He will have no problem
adapting to the NBA. He is a quick learner.
The Jazz can go Knight, Williams or Kantor at 3 and get good value. Knight would replace Harris and save 9 Mill. Williams could play the 3 but he
could also replace Millsap at 8 Mill. Kantor is extremely agile and
fast for a big. He is about the same size at AJ and may be a better rebounder.
He could replace AJ and save about 14 mill. Kantor is not the ideal size for a
traditional C but he is agile and fast and fits the newer NBA style well. The Jazz may not have a good SF in this draft. Hamilton and Singlton
can't jump. Klay Thompson may be better, faster and more agile than
Korver. However, the Jazz could trade AJ, Millsap or Harris and get a Vet SF.
They may also see how much AK will cost to resign and then trade for
an SF. I am not sure who is available at 12. The workouts are going
to move the board some more. The Jazz should add a lot of talent. The lock out year will be a transition year and some decisions are going to be
driven by the new CBA.
Jimmer was accused of floating in his sprint. He recorded a 3.21, which is
faster than Price and DWill. In spite of floating he is plenty fast. Knight
recorded a 3.07 which is similar to Derek Rose. Jimmer appear to
have 1 minor weakness and 1 question mark. He is not likely to be a good
rebounding PG. That is based on his max vert reach. Rebounding is not a major
issue for most PGs. The big question with Jimmer, as it is with all PGs is
"can he run the Jazz effectively?"BYU ran such an
unorthodox offense that it is hard to tell. I think the PG decision
comes down to Jimmer and Knight. Knight looks like the better defender but may
have trouble on screens. Jimmer is built like DWill. Knight tends to turn the
ball over but should improve with practice. William (3.23)and Kantor
(3.26) both had remarkable sprint times for bigs. They both have similar max
vert reaches. Kantor is very athletic for his size. They both are good
prospects. The Jazz would do well with either. I am not sure the
Jazz can get Jimmer at 12.
Jimmer would fit in nicely with the Jazz, and he's less likely to bolt for the
bigger market if he becomes "too successful" (i.e. DWILL). However,
the Jazz won't take him at the 3 and its probable that he won't be around at the
12.Tom in CA, I've stopped marking down your's and worf's
Jimmer is #4 ALL-TIME in the MWC steals category.Jimmer won't drive the
lane with ease like he did in college, but that didn't seem to be an issue for
J.J. Barea this NBA post-season, leading me to believe it can still be done for
the undersized Jimmer.Jimmer will be drafted higher than he would have
been drafted had he entered the draft last year. Jimmer will make more
money than all Utah trolls combined and have the opportunity to prove himself in
the NBA (so even if he does end up in Europe at some point, at least he got a
chance). Jimmer will be the most popular baby name in Utah this year.
Jimmer scored 47 against his college rival team, including a 42 footer
that looked easy.
Chris B: "6 minutes, 2.2 points per game, 1 assist, 2
turnovers." That sounds more like the avg statline of the U transfers. And since you love to go to the who's going to the draft cause they're
real athletes card: Who is it that is getting drafted from the U? U
can't beat the WCC teams on your scheduleU can't have a winning season but
twice in the last 6 yearsU can't get more people to the HC than go to Jr
Jazz gamesU can't sign more players than U have transfersU can't get
alumni to coach your teamAnd you're talking smack on BYU bball?----Demarcus is a new player running the offense in a new league. How
well he rises to the occasion will serve as a litmus test as to whether this is
more of a rebuilding year or a reloading year.
IF the Jimmer workouts go well the Jazz may want to trade back a couple of spots
and pick him up and then try to get an SF at 12 or later. Hamilton,
Singler and Morris did poorly in the verts. That is not good. The
Jazz need to look at Marshon Brooks. I want to see more data on
Knight, Williams and Kantor before I get too excited. There is just not a lot of
overall player quality difference in the 2-10 spots. You might as well draft for
position if there is little difference in quality.
@Chris B Jimmer's lane agility was in the top 3 combine
measurements this year at 10.42. That is better than Knight at 10.74 and Walker
at 10.87. It is also better than DWill, Chris Paul, Aaron Brooks, Ty Lawson and
Derrick Rose just to mention a few. Jimmer was 2nd in modified lane
agility for the combine. You might want to retract your nonsense.
You now look completely rediculous. Jimmer may jump up the board.
How many PGs in the NBA are considered "relentless" scorers rather
than just "good" or "consistent" scorers? I can't think of
even one (that's still active).Being relentless means constant
pressure on defenses.Nash is relentless as a PG, but not so much as
a scoring threat. That's about as close as I can come up with. (Rose can score,
but doesn't seem relentless in doing so.)Dirk is a big that can be a
relentless scorer. Sometimes Kobe can. MJ was a lot of the time, as is Durant.
But, they're not PGs.The Jazz have players with the scoring
abilities: Big Al, Millsap, Hayward, Miles (sometimes), AK (if he comes back as
SF), etc. Jimmer would be a neat fit with the Jazz.He'd be like a
kid in a candy store: score? assist? score? assist?He'd do whichever
the defense gave him. He didn't have that choice much in college.
All Jimmer's life he's dealt with doubters. Note I said "dealt with,"
not "faced." They've ALL been Jimmered!It's no surprise
he's a draft enigma, because being the national player of the year so
resoundingly, yet appearing to play no defense, and certainly not looking like
an athlete, what CAN you make of him?Well, the doubters have their
ammo---too bad their blanks!Those who think Jimmer can't ever become
an efficient PG in the NBA are only waiting to be Jimmered. It'll happen. He's
proved doubters wrong all his life--at every level he's attained.I
don't see him faltering at the NBA level.Isn't that the kind of
"it" superstars are made of? Ability to excel, regardless? The ability
to face a task and conquer it?That's Jimmer in a nutshell.Be prepared to be Jimmered, ye doubters!
The combine agility test numbers have come out. And Jimmer is in the top 3 of
the agility test. Im sold on Jimmer even more now than before. Jimmer needs to
stay here and play ball for Utah.
Chris BHe lit up your mighty utes for 49 big ones - and sat for
nearly 6 minutes in that game. And good luck in the conference of champions. One thing you can't teach is greatness. The cream always rises. Jimmer
was great in college and most likely will be great in the NBA. He will figure it
out there just like he did in college. Mark it down.
@ @Charles...Ray Allen plays good solid D...you must've not watched
him guard Kobe...do you want me to name at least 16 players that can play decent
D?...Ray AllenTony AllenShane BattierJames
PoseyWesley MatthewsThabo SefoloshaAaron AfflaloGordon
HaywardKirk HinrichRaja BellLuol DengRonnie BrewerKeith BogansRajon RondoShawn MarionGeorge Hill
What won't work for the jimer in the NBA is that mid major drive to the
basket/run into someone and hope for a foul move. NBAdraft.net is
typically the most accurate mock draft sites. At one point they had the jimer as
high as #7 and now he's at 17.Based on some lackluster workouts I
could see him dropping into the mid 20's. Let's be honest, that's where Gm's
would feel comfortable drafting the jimmer.
Last comment should have said Cougars, not cougers....
I still don't understand why all of my fellow UTE fans are bashing on Jimmer. I
think he'll have a fine career in the NBA. He is decently quick, can shoot from
anywhere on the court, and has heart like no other. The whole "he plays no
defense" is just garbage. He played what he needed to play and was
probably told not to play too aggressive. If he were to get in foul trouble,
the cougers would have little left. He is athletic enough to play great
defense. I am hoping he has a great career, and I'm a UTE fan.
CONTINUEDAs for defensive questions; I do buy some justifications
given for Jimmer's lack of defense at BYU. It's more than foul trouble though.
Jimmer needed to save energy for the offensive end where he saw triple teams.
My concerns with Jimmer's defense are with his lateral movement and
back pedaling. He moves smooth laterally but slowly nonetheless. As for back
pedaling, he is heavy footed.
Jimmer worked with the ball in his hands at BYU. He will need to do the same in
the NBA. Jimmer is an NBA Point Guard and not a Shooting Guard. He will have NBA
scorers around him and can't jack up endless shots from the parking lot
anymore. Jimmer was needed at BYU to get a large volume of shots. As a Point Guard, Jimmer will need to orchestrate chemistry. Basically, he
will need to change his BYU approach when running an NBA team. Can he? I think
it depends on the team and the role.I am not saying that Jimmer
can't be a scorer and a combo guard type. He could guard the point (if he can),
and then switch roles with a bigger guard handling the ball. Here is the problem
with that; despite having unquestionable range, Jimmer didn't come off screens
and spot up much at BYU. Can Jimmer do this in the NBA? Maybe, but I don't like
taking the ball out of his hands too much. Jimmer is a creator. Plus, spotting
up means that NBA talent and size will be closing in on him.
Not only is he an enigma to the NBA, he was a pain in the Utes' butt, too!
The NBA consensus draft has Jimmer going at 9 to the Bobcats. I
heard an interview today with Bibby. He said when he first came out that
everyone said he would not make it in the NBA because he was to small, slow and
could not play defense. He has played 13 seasons. He is the same
size as Jimmer. I think Jimmer will do fine. He will need a year or
more to learn to be a PG.
Jimmer will stand up to the pick punishment but will he be able to turn the
corner and finish in the NBA? Can he run the team better than Harris in the long
run? Do you trade down? How many young players do you want? All of
the 2-12 players have some risk. If you do go big with the 3 and not
Jimmer with the 12. Who do you pick? Do you go for a SF like Hamilton or do you
draft a big that you do not need like Moutie or Morris? The consensus draft has
the Jazz picking Kantor and Valanciusas. The Jazz have a lot of
options and they have a the GS pick next year. How many young players do you
want? Where are your greatest needs. Who can you replace to have the
greatest impact? The outside shooting can be addressed at the SF/SG
and PG. Hayward appears to be the SG of the future. CJ and Harris are
inefficient. CJ may be okay backing up the SG. Kantor and William add outside
shooting at PF. Millsap will add range. Okur MAY be back. Add a
This is a very problematic draft for Utah. The 2-8 players all have strengths
and weaknesses. They all have some risk. KOC is very open about drafting the
best player available. That means he has to trade to fill needs. The
Jazz need an SF (especially if AK goes). They can get by with Hayward and CJ but
both of them are better at SG. The Jazz may need a PG who fits the offense
better. They need outside shooting, defense and bigger bigs. Williams claims to be an SF but he is really a PF who should be able to play
SF (at least some of the time). He is a quicker version of Millsap. Kantor is a little bigger than Millsap and also can shoot outside. He is about
the same size as AJ.Can/should Kantor replace AJ/Millsap? How much
is gained? AJ/Millsap then have to be traded for a SF.Knight is the
most likely PG at 3. How much better is he than Harris? Will he stand up to the
abuse of running thru/setting picks. Harris is injury prone. Knight is not built
like DWill. continued
Someone please prove to me Jimmer doesn't play "D". BYU Defense they
went with a majority of the time was a 3-2 or even a 1-2-2. His job was just
force to a direction base line mostly. Professional said at the combine he had
good feet and was not as bad as people keep talking about.
"LivinLarge | 2:23 p.m. May 25, 2011 Bountiful, UT Jimmer is
not destined to be an NBA star, as in college. The lowliest NBA defenders will
be 10x's better than the best college defenders Jimmer faced. He is Mark Madsen
part II."Let's see, the Mavs have JJ Barea, Thunder have
Sefelosha, Heat have Mario Chalmers, and the Bulls have CJ Watson. Are you
tellimg me that as rookies, all those guys were THAT much better than Jimmer
today? Do you really believe that? Jimmer won't drop 30+ per
night, but he does provide some offense some teams desperately need. His
defense will be just fine since he'll be getting help from his bigs anyway. I
think there are a lot of surprises in store with where he lands. All he needs to do is be a 10pt/5ast guy to have a long career in this
league....and make a lot more $$$ than anyone on these boards.
I just wonder how much of the "controversy" over Jimmer's game is real
and how much is pretense. Maybe Jimmer is such a hot commodity that
nobody wants to tip their hand and show how much they really want the guy?A whole lot of bluffin goin on here!
Correction"Nash and Miller average 2.8 and 2.6 APG now.
" I meant Turnovers per game.
Chris B spewing his daily Jimmer hate.Lets look at the facts and
compare Jimmer to 2 other players coming out of college that were ready for
"Europe" Andre Miller and Steve Nash.Minutes per game All 3 right around 30 min per gameTurnovers per gameMiller
2.7Nash 2.6Jimmer 2.5All 3 had more turnovers as minutes went
up and scoring went up. All pretty close. Also note that Nash averages 2.8
Turnovers per game in the NBA and Miller 2.6. Pretty much the same as college. I
would expect the same for Fredette. Assists per gameMiller
5.4Nash 4.5Jimmer 3.5Points per game. Do I really need
to go there? Jimmer did not play that much as a Freshman and still averaged 18.7
(22.6 his last 3 years, one w mono)Nash 14.9, Miller 12.1. I really
don't see much difference. If you come back with how good Miller and Nash play
D, that proves you don't watch the NBA. Nash and Miller average 2.8
and 2.6 APG now.
Chrissy,You know that your prediction accuracy hasn't been stellar,
and you are wrong a whole lot more than you are right, but when you make
negative comments about everything BYU, and Jimmer, it leaves us all
wondering...Why do you care so much? Why is it so important that
you are right about Jimmer playing in the ero leagues?Dude, get over
it. Jimmer will go where he goes. It is not up to you. He will do what he
does, wherever that is.Let it go...
Jimmer is not destined to be an NBA star, as in college. The lowliest NBA
defenders will be 10x's better than the best college defenders Jimmer faced. He
is Mark Madsen part II...
I disagree with any analysis that says Jimmer doesn't handle the ball well. In
fact, Tim Miles (CSU) said this year that "Jimmer handles the ball like
Curly Neal." You know, Curly of the Harlem Globetrotters, who performed
dribbling tricks all game long. Jimmer Fredette has a great handle. He's
a very good passer. His weakness is defense.
Chris B.Dude your hatred towards Jimmer is so over the top. Stick
with politics! your knowledge of the game and who has or hasn't got talent shows
more and more every time you type.Oh another ute left the program
please spin this one for us all to enjoy!(JJ O'Brien see ya) Hows that pac 12
working out for ya? It seems to me that kids are dying to stay around. LOL
Where Jimmer gets drafted really depends on his private team workouts. I think
he has the athleticism to guard in the NBA especially within the team defense
most teams employ. He is strong enough to consistently get to the rim and the
line and his range goes without saying. If he surprises (defensively and
atheltically) in those 1-1, 2-2 or 3-3 drills teams set up he could jump several
places. I think teams know he can come in and be an offensive spark. But if he
shows he has the overall game of an NBA starter it is a whole new ballgame.
for all of you who whine about Jimmer and his defensive skills, please list for
us who actually plays/played defense in the NBA?Ray Allen?Reggie Miller?Steve Nash?Deron Williams?Hornacek?Barkley?Stoudamire?Spud?DrJ?Nate Robinson?Westphal?AD?And many dozens of others.Seriously,
unless you are solely in the lineup for defense, there aren't but 15 guys in the
NBA who play good, solid defense.Anything else to whine about?
The problem is the scouts look at Jimmer and he doesn't have the stereotypical
can-score-on-anyone-at-will-look. However, this kid can play and he has a ton of
what most NBA players don't...desire!He'll be good as gold.
I loved every minute of Jimmer's career at BYU butI've never totally understood
the Jimmermania when it comes to the NBA. There are very few places that I
think Jimmer would be a good fit. New York is about the only place where i see
him fitting because D'Antoni doesn't play defense and has little that passes for
an organized offense. Based on what I saw of Jimmer in school he
appears to have too many things to his detriment to be a success in the pros.
He is definitely a defensive liability. BYU could compensate for this but it
will be exposed in the pros. He may be able to score 30 a game but will likely
give up 32. Also he's not big enough to play the shooting guard and I don't
believe his ball-handling skills are competent enough to play the point in the
NBA. I wish him all the best to succeed but I fear he is Greg
Kite-esque. Incredible college player just not suited for the NBA game. Good
luck to him wherever he goes, though.
Never good when you have a quarteback quandry, look at BYU last season.
He is a perfect Euro league type player. No defense. Good shot. Very spastic
with the ball, leading to lots of turnovers and fast breaks going the other
way.In his 2 years in the NBA he'll have an average line of 6
minutes, 2.2 points per game, 1 assist, 2 turnovers.