re: realitycheckIt seems that you are accusing the FLDS of the very
thing Flora and Carolyn have habitually done "on record" which is outright LIE
for no other reason than self-justification. Your posts are proving how little
you actually seem to know about the culture and people.
re:realitycheck You said: "why would they bother inviting current FLDS members?
They will tell the panel whatever Willie and company tell them too. It's not
like we can believe them." "Jeff's daughter has been lying to the
court for months - why would the others be any different?""you
actually believe that CPS lied and FLDS told the truth?"And you think that FLDS
members would be good witnesses? They will either lie or send the few people
that are uniquely unlike the average FLDS....""And do the FLDS not turn
their children into super religious little ones?"---------------------------------------------------You post as if you
KNOW what your talking about; but you don't. These are your OPINIONS that seem
to be based on sensationalized media stories and books written by "anti-FLDS"
people. Do you honestly believe every book you read? Carolyns own Son said she
admitted that ONLY 30% of her book is factual. "Under The Banner of Heaven" is a
NOVEL. It IS documented that Flora Mae habitually LIES. I really would like to
see some sort of "documeted" evidence as you say, of the above statements.
Put-UP or Shut-UP.
re - EIRon 5:49pmI guess I'm confused, since I didn't say anything
incorrect. Did they not murder all the dogs in Colorado City because Jeffs told
them to? I've heard it, I've read it, and no one from FLDS has ever denied it
(plus it makes sense given Jeffs need to be in control.) So - you saying it
never happened, Ron? Because after several years, that would be the first time
anyone denied it - it's actually well documented.And do the FLDS not
turn their children into super religious little ones? Everything you hear about
FLDS has to do with religion. Even their website that had the children's
schedule had many many hours of scripture and religious training - far more than
anything else. So is this incorrect?You may not like what I say
about the FLDS, but none of it is false. You just don't like the way I say it.
Well, too bad. The truth isn't always pretty...
CASA AND THE ATTORNEY MAY HAVE: (A)
VIOLATED, (B) BREACHED, AND (C) DAMAGED THE TEENAGER: (1)
CLIENT-ATTORNEY PRIVILEDGE, AND (2) RIGHT OF PRIVACY
CLAIMS AND DISCLAIMERS AS PREVIOUSLY POSTED
CASA FAILED AND THE ATTORNEY FOR THE TEENAGER OF THIS CASE FAILED: (A) TO
DEFEND, (B) TO PROTECT, AND (C) TO PROMOTE:
(X) THE FUNDAMENTAL RIGHTS OF TEENAGERS TO MARRY... (NOT AS A FALLACY)
(X) THE TEENAGER FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT TO MARRY... (NOT AS A FALLACY)
CLAIMS AND DISCLAIMERS AS PREVIOUSLY POSTED SIGNED RECKIPS
99 % SIMILARITIES (X) SALEM WITCH-HUNT TRIALS INVOLVED
[TEENAGERS PRACTICING WITCHCRAFT/SEX]:[BEHAVIORAL]
TEEN-AGERS. (X) TEXAS WITCH-HUNT-LIKE, POLYGAMY WITCH-HUNT
TRIALS INVOLVE [TEENAGERS PRACTICING RELIGION/SEX]: [BEHAVIORAL]
TEENAGERS. CLAIMS AND DISCLAIMERS AS PREVIOUSLY
POSTED SIGNED RECKIPS
What a fun hearing......Carolyn and Flora will autograph copies of
"Escape" then charge $19.95 for the copies. The various attorney
generals will complain about not being able to jail church members because they
are to smart to be caught.......not because they are innocent. The Texas
attorney general will explain how brave Texas was in conducting a raid on women
and children in violation of its own laws after it got a call from a nut. texas
will explain how hard it is to get legitimate evidence after four years of
listening to their informant. Texas will explain how 37 year old women are able
to be teenagers. Texas will explain how a 16 year old pregnant teen isn't
pregnant and is in fact a virgin. And last but not least Texas will
explain how the only "suspect" in anything sits in a jail several hundred miles
away convicted of performing a Church wedding in which both parties said yes. Yep, It will be an interesting show......bring the popcorn and your
checkbooks to pay the expenses of the "expert" witnesses. Oh
yes.........I bet big Willie will stare too........lol
Pregnancy tests don't lie, realitycheck. Witch hunters do.
re: reality checkDUDE, get a LIFE. Don't you have anything
better to do than sit and hack people simply because you don't like them?Why don't you take the time to contribute to a discussion in a responsible
fashion?? Your comments are at best baseless, fear/hate filled"TRASH".
I stand corrected. Let all the FLDS testify. I shouldn't just arbitrarily call
them all liars. My bad.I guess I'm still mad that they got away
with murdering hundreds of innocent dogs simply because the "prophet" told them
to. And I have a real problem with parents turning their children into little
religious drones. But hey - to each their own. They're your kids
and your dogs. Train them and murder them - not my business. Right? (That's
pretty much what you've been saying - none of my business.) Guess the kids will
have to stick up for their little selves and tell their parents "no, I don't
want to be a drone". (That would go over real well...) And I guess the dogs they
got what they deserved. Right? I'd say they were all related to
Michael Vick, but they're racists so that wouldn't make any sense.
I don't know that testifying before the Senate for the purpose of getting the
FLDS side of the issues presented is the best avenue. The primary
outcome of having Senate hearings will have been to increase the importance of
media presentation. The Senate has decided not to let these things play
out in the court system. There will be a spotlight on all of this
whether FLDS testifies or not. I think the mountainous slant
under which these proceedings are being structured makes it pretty clear what
the Senators desired outcome is. FLDS would be better served to prepare
a presentation designed for the public. It's pretty much known what the
individuals that are scheduled to testify will say. A major
news network (perhaps Fox?)would have huge viewer numbers for such a event. I believe this would have a greater effect on the outcome of the
proceedings than testifying.
Although I rarely support the FLDS, I am in favor of letting Rod Parker and
Willie Jessop testify. With two people testifying for the FLDS and quite a few
against, it still wouldn't be a balanced situation but it would at least begin
to approach fairness. Many of the horrors of the FLDS are not crimes
but are just as bad as crimes. Obedience,indoctrination, forcing people to
follow the will of the leader, splitting up and reassigning families,
ex-communicating people based solely on whether the leader likes them, forced
marriage, early termination of education, teaching that outsiders are wicked,
control over many aspects of life etc. The history of the FLDS is
that it has committed maybe one crime of significance - statutory rape
associated with forced marriage of underage girls. Not many seem to care about
the crime of polygamy. The other crimes such as misuse of funds seems to be new
to Warren Jeffs. It seems that Willie Jessop has gained some control and it
doesn't appear that he'll support forced underage marriage. It seems
the FLDS wants to be its own tiny country with disregard to the laws of the U.S.
and that should stop.
FLDS religion is based on total lies. They only make up stuff about God to
ensure themselves that it's alright to commit adultery.
but, in reality, a deceitful lieTexas did change the law to prevent
the FLDS from forcing young girls into arranged marriages.But, Texas
changed the law to prevent FLDS parents and leaders from abusing their own
children, not because Texas was trying to restrict the religious freedom of the
FLDS.If the FLDS didn't like the law, they were free to try to get
it changed, or to move to another state that allowed such marriages.They DID NOT have a right to simply ignore the law because they didn't agree
with it.(Show me where that is in the Constitution.)It's
time the FLDS learned that they aren't above the law and they have NO RIGHT to
pick and choose which laws they're willing to obey, and which laws they're going
re- realitycheckyou forgot that these ex-FLDS members are the liars. You
also forgot that this IS actually AMERICA and that we are SUPPOSED to have
FREEDOM of RELIGION. It doesn't say in there "if the government likes it."
Plus, don't forget that Texas changed the law specifically to make a problem for
the FLDS. The person who pushed for the law to change the age of legal marriage
ADMITTED to that. So I suppose you may be related to all these lawmakers that
should be called lawbreakers because they are constituion breakers. Do you know
what the constitution says or are you one who thinks the constitution is exempt?
I think it is so sad that reality check refuses to give the benefit of the
doubt. Apparently all he (probably she) listens to is the lies....I would like
to know if she ever has even talked with an FLDS person to see for herself if
they are liers or not.
re - Thomasyou actually believe that CPS lied and FLDS told the
truth? lol - care for some land in Florida? And you think that FLDS members
would be good witnesses? They will either lie or send the few people that are
uniquely unlike the average FLDS....
I can't think of anyone, anywhere, who, if someone where striving to prosecute
them would not want to represent themselves in some form or another. The fact
that the FLDS were not chosen shows that those who did the choosing have an
agenda and want to hide it. Any TRUE American should be questioning there
motives. How many of us would like similar circumstances, just because people
full of hate are the only ones who have been telling the stories, it seems to be
that that is all we want to belevie, is that people are bad. It is time for the
FLDS to speak out and for others to allow them the opportunity.
above comment should read 31 out of 53 girls.
Orin Hatch is shading the truth. I definately sent him an e-mail. Irregardless
of who is telling the truth, fair play stibilates that you invite both sides.
Mesage to reality check: Throughout this debacle it was the FLDS who told the
truth and it was CPS who was lying. The CPS claimed that 31 out of girls 12-17
had been or were pregnant only to see this list dwindle to 4 or 5.
Like many Utahn's I don't have a law degree, don't practice or officially fight
polygamy, don't find polygamy anywhere in my background, have not dated or
married a relative, am not FLDS or LDS or any 'DS ... okay, so there aren't many
of us afterall ... but I'm as capable and qualified to be on this panel as those
why would they bother inviting current FLDS members? They will tell the panel
whatever Willie and company tell them too. It's not like we can believe them.
Jeff's daughter has been lying to the court for months - why would
the others be any different?