Also make a distinction against Government sponsored religion and religion that
is followed at the choice and freedom of those who choose to. Most of the
atrocities of the dark ages was caused by state sponsored religion as it was
abused for power and control. Rome outlawed the reading of the bible for over a
1000 years at one point. Only high level clergy could read it, not even your
average run of the mill priest was allowed to read it. Our own founding fathers
respected personal choice in religion, what they despised was state sponsored
religion. Religion isn't perfect because the people practicing aren't perfect.
But if you took it away, people who abuse it would just find something else to
justify what they are doing anyway.
Your comment is probably the most ignorant and disrespectful to those of us who
don't happen to be LDS. Do you really believe that all we do in church is talk
about the evils of the LDS church? I have gone to church my entire life and have
done nothing but bible studies. We don't sit around every meeting and discuss
the LDS views. The entire world does NOT revolve around the LDS church. It is
still a grain of sand on the beach of religion. Please learn to respect my
religious view as I have tried to respect yours!!!!
Matthew,It is an obvious sign of a poor communicator and a person
unfamiliar with reason and logic who blames the hearer for "failure to hear"
when the reality is that the argument lacks cogency, truth, or both. In other
words, don't blame others for your failure to have a good argument.
I assume that "To JCE" meant inalienable rights.To hear (or read) a
cogent argument one would need to open their ears (or eyes) AND THEIR MIND.
Failure to hear (or read) a cogent argument is a strong sign of having failed to
open either the ears (or eyes) and/or the mind.True religion asks an
open mind, a sincere heart, and personal agency. But some people either just
dont get religion or are too afraid of those three requirements to give it an
honest try. Blaming much that has historically been done "in the name of
religion" on religion is like blaming democracy for the torturing that the
current administration embraces. Good systems cant always prevent bad people
from doing bad things, its that agency thing all over again.
There is not explanation for why freedom requires religion. It doesn't. Religion
is antithetical to freedom. True freedom requires nothing but a recognition that
all human beings are "equal" in the sense that they each have unalienable
"rights" that are not conditional upon anything else.
I still haven't heard a cogent explanation of why freedon requires religion.
In reality, because of religion, Nations have been born, art inspired, music
created, laws formulated, freedom granted, civil rights indentified, the hungry
fed and the list goes on. You should rethink your narrow view of human history,
not that religion has been perfect but its done more than say...communisim,
which bans all religion and "individual freedom."
Religous liberty IS a civil liberty!
It is hard in a world where we honor people like the Clintons, who lie and
cheat, but have a problem in honoring the good like the Romneys.
I find it ironic that throughout human history, one of the most powerful,
pervasive forces AGAINST individual liberty has been religion! And yet we live
in a country where even religion is protected - If you have read history much at
all, you will agree that "religious liberty" is an oxymoron! So what does that
say about Mitt Romney when he receives an award for protecting an absurdity??
CIVIL LIBERTY IS BETTER
We live in a pluralistic society. Homosexuals can have multiple sexual partners.
So can heterosexuals. Adultery we're frequently told, is common. If
polygamy is all about sex, so what? What isn't these days?What's the
big deal if some people who have multiple partners also choose to marry them?
What is it about the marriage contract that makes it illegal to be married to
multiple spouses, but not illegal for a person with one spouse to have multiple
sexual affairs?Help me understand why polygamy (which is all about
sex, after all) is a problem for the State to intervene in, but adultery is not?
And how is it that Mitt Romney can be slandered for something he's
never done in an age when he'd get a slap on the back at the club if he ever got
caught "fooling around?"
There will always be anti-mormons nipping at our heels. We seem to intimidate
them, and rightly so for they are unable to figure things out. they listen to
their Ministers,that most of the time,preach about the evils of the lds church,
and in the meantime we keep growing and growing,and keep spreading the Gospel
throughout the world. The Romneys, Mitt and Ann, are a shining example of
what is good about the Church, and also this country we are priviliged to be
able to live in. may the Lord bless them.
Dixie Dan,Your statement just proves your ignorance on the matter.
Any male in The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints can hold the
priesthood. This came about in the year 1978. Also if you had any smarts at all,
polygamy has not been part of the doctrine of our church for over 100 years. Get
your facts together before you open your mouth. I would be embarrassed to make
such a statement. You ignorance shine brightly.
I have to say it, there are some really ignorant and disgusting comments
sometimes. I guess that you people that have to say something to attack didn't
watch the movie Bambi. And I guess I am the pot calling the kettle black. But
give it a rest you anti-Mormon's, go find a way to be happy and let us be happy.
If you are a Christian, then act like it, if you are an agnostic or atheist,
then be a do gooder, but for heavens sake, grow up and stop attacking every turn
of the way. I guess I can't get the reward, cause I am not being as gracious as
Romney, but enough is enough, and it is so the same. Just reading the rude
comments here is showing exactly what Romney had to endure, close minded hateful
people to the Mormon church. Trust me, I have some issues with some religions
at times, or lifestyles or even ethnic groups, and I keep my mouth shut, cause I
respect human beings enough not to attack what they value and treasure, but I am
not in a good mood right now and it is just the same thing every time.
Political politeness aka mutual admiration, among the
semi-religious/money-making sects. Let's keep it simple, to allow
everyone to have and keep their chosen faith, but take-away the "tax-exempt"
status of all faiths, and keep religion and business completely seperate. One
problem, where is the profit in that?
I think the Romney's are great. The award is well deserved. Much of the
comintary about the Romney family is about how he stayed to his values.
I love the Romney's for their example of what LDS people everywhere should be.
They are good humanitarians, citizens, parents, and this country would be better
off if the Romney's would be in the White House in January '09. Thank you Mitt
and Ann Romney for your devotion to your country and your faith. I hope you get
to serve this nation that you love in the future. The award you received is well
Yes, Dan, you missed that part of the speech. Read it again. Quit analyzing it
from a narrow Modernist perspective. And don't tell me racism is racism no
matter when it occurs. Go study the film: Amazing Grace. You might there be able
to extrapolate what Mormonism is about in the characters' inner conflicts. But
they're not your French Revolutionary character who would have blood flowing in
the streets, in order to careen headlong into Utopia. Many of us prayed long and
hard for that change to be revealed and hastened; the nuance and complexity of
those experiences are at the core of Romney's speech. talk to me more at
"She said the award was given "to those who refuse to compromise their
principles and faith, and do so 'resolutely.' If there were additional honors
for graciousness in defense of their faith, for modesty and sheer decency, we
would be conferring those medals as well on Mitt and Ann Romney."That's great to hear. Under that criteria, the mothers of the FLDS will be
getting the same reward any day now. If anyone ever deserved "honors for
gaciousness in defense of their faith"..they do.
Dixie Dan you are living in the past. Update your information before you have
other people believing false information as you do. Does it really need to be
repeated for the 10,000th time: polygamy was banned by the church in 1890. All
worthy male members of the church 12 years old and more can receive the
priesthood. You're welcome.
don't talk like that. Truth is the first victim when we give out awards. We
don't want no stinkn facts to get in the way.Romney was ... well, a
flip flopping fluff. But he has positioned himself well for 4 years from now.
He has done that. Now he just makes money and looks thoughtful for 3 years, and
makes arrangements to keep Baptists out of the GOP.Of course, the
world changes. And that is why Hillary cannot stand the thought that Barak will
get into the white house before she can, and thus her chances will be gone. She
has to have it NOW!!!Dixie Dan: right on southerner.
I don't recall him defending the exclusion of African-Americans being denied the
Priesthood or that Polygamy remains a tenent of his faith. Did I miss this part
of his talk?
It couldn't happen to a nicer or more deserving couple.