You guys just don't get it.Independence is stupid.There is NOTHING
to play for.No conference championship.No BCS game.Nothing.Anyone that likes this ridiculous Independence thing is drinking blue
2013, 14, but soon. Bring on the new Far West Conference.
I don't care about the Big East as much, what I want to know is what happened to
the BIG 12?
What took decades for Lavell Edwards to build up has now been blown up by the
current BYU Admin in less than 18 months! What a shame.
To Brave Sir Robin: Wouldn't you think that the person who reported this might
be a little bit biased? Of course the Big East would thnk that BYU is being
unreasonable. After all, they want BYU badly, but only on their terms.
However, BYU only wants to join on it's terms. Why would they want to give up
their TV rights on their home games? The Big East wants BYU badly but may have
to settle for SDSU, which is not even close to having the same value to their
league as BYU. So of course their going to feel BYU is being unreasonable.
They want BYU but BYU doesn't necessarily want the Big East. That, my friend,
is the truth of the matter, like it or not!
continued to gdogListen all of us like to get our little digs in on
the other guys but we can at least be honest about things. You've never once
read a post by me saying utah shouldn't have taken the pac12 invite, would be
better off in the mwc, etc. Why is that? Because I know they did the right thing
in making that move despite the circumstances surrounding it i.e. pac's last
choice, gonna be a bottom dweller, etc. Who cares about those things? They're
in.Well it is no different for BYU. Going independent was the
correct thing for them. In my opinion turning down the big east was the right
thing as well. Those are honest opinions, not hot air.
@gdogListen, you are one of the few semi reasonable Utah fans around
here but I really need to call you out on your post.1st of all what
is the basis for your assertion that "BYU is going to play more and more on
ESPN 2 or 3, or be relegated to ESPN U."? Why would that be the case?
Certainly BYU will appear on those ESPN networks but frankly being on ESPN 2 is
really no different than being on the main ESPN. Everyone has both channels on
the basic teir and they are both near the top of the dial.2nd of all
why the insistence that BYU is going to be playing Idaho, Idaho St, NMSU, etc.?
This is obviously not true if you simply look at the schedules beyond next year.
Don't fall into the trap the ute trolls on here set. Just go ahead and look at
BYU's 2013 schedule. It is excellent with a great mix of home and away games.
But even if BYU does have a couple of games each year against those types of
schools it will make them no different than utah or any pac12 other school.
You know I get it about exposure, but consider this; BYU is going to play more
and more on ESPN 2 or 3, or be relegated to ESPN U. Sure many people watch those
channels to, but then consider the days and time slots BYU is going to likely
get. Factor in the exposure element as being exposed, when facing
good teams. Then look at public interest outside of the BYU fan base. Who is
going to respect your exposure when you play Idaho, Idaho State, New Mexico
State, San Jose State ect...? Furthermore, is your fan base going to respect
I'd imagine post-2013 independent schedule would start to include more MWC teams
and less WAC. Maybe not the temper-tantrum likes of San Diego St, but some of
the other teams will be ready to schedule the stadium-filling football squad
The future does NOT look very bright for Independent BYU. BYU fans have
illusions of grandeur when they compare the lower tier BYU to the great Notre
Dame. As a person neither a Utah nor BYU fan, BYU's future looks
dismal while Utah future looks bright with its tie in with the Rose Bowl.I am also baffled why Utah State would leave the WAC for a less
impressive MWC that no longer has Utah, BYU, TCU, or Boise State.
BCS has unfolded like this since 1998.....Records by conferenceConferenceWinsLossesWinning TeamsLosing TeamsSEC 7 0Florida
(2), LSU (2), Tennessee, Alabama, AuburnNoneBig 12 2 5Oklahoma,
TexasNebraska*, Oklahoma (3), TexasACC 1 2Florida StateFlorida
State (2)Big East 1 2Miami (FL)*Miami (FL)*, Virginia Tech*Big
Ten 1 2Ohio StateOhio State (2)Pac-12 0 2USCOregon,
USCThis is a system you embrace like it is your best friends girl
friend? You want this crap? Well, have you system that has failed.
Dutchman;I don't think the BCS is leaving the BCS bowls to be more fair to
other conferences or the help the Big East. In fact, I think it is the opposite.
If they do leave the bowls to the bowls themselves, which I don't think they
will, then the bowls are not going to let go of their top AQ conferences. Rose Bowl - Still AQ for PAC 12 & Big 10Fiesta Bowl - still AQ
for Big 10Sugar Bowl - still AQ for SECOrange Bowl - still AQ for
ACCSo, you see, it's the Big East and Notre Dame that are getting
squeezed out of the new BCS possible plan. Don't make a move BYU.
Notre Dame of the West needs to act more like Notre Dame:"Thank
you, but we like being independent."
WJCoug,That's a lot of heaviness to drop at the feet of the BYU
Point 2..... It won't always be against WAC teams that the schedule is drawn
from. Yes, it likely would continue to be less than top 30 type competition for
most of the schedule, but for what conference isn't that the case year in and
year out? Yearly Mississippi matches can't be on the top of every Tide fan's
christmas wish list. Yearly matches against Furman can't be on the top of every
Gator fan's christmas wish list.... Just because you are an AQ school or within
an AQ conference doesn't mean that you are all of a sudden top notch
competition.... What is Colorado's OCS like? What is USC's out of conference
schedule like? Yes, it is nice to be in the pac-12 because of the prestige of
many of its institutions. Yet, If you aren't one of the original members or
along the coast you are pretty much bottom feeders feasting in times and seasons
against teams of prestige.... Just a fact of life. I think there are hundreds of
thousands of people across the nation that would rather be in USC dorms than
those on the hill or in Tuscon or Pullman.....
I wouldn't count on a BYU/Utah game in 2013. With USC eligible, Utah may just
play Idaho instead for pre-season practice.
Everyone keep in mind that BYU's independent schedule from 2013 on hasn't been
filled out because of the current expansion upheaval. After that settles down
this year (and maybe next), BYU's independent schedule will make Ute fans REALLY
jealous!I've always liked the idea of independence, but would have
accepted the Big 12 (all sports, or compensation for Rose in Oct-Nov games with
the likes of Kansas), or accepted the Big East (with the same kind of Oct-Nov
compensations). BUT, I wouldn't have liked even joining those conferences if
BYUtv got the "axe" in the process.Exposure is everything,
and I believe Holmoe when he said there are plenty of BCS schools out there
willing to play us home-and-home to fill out future independent schedules.
@ three11stu 3:37pm Nov 22The whole point of exposure is for BYU's
fans, not for the rest of the college football world. Fans of all other colleges
are invited to watch, but not expected to.I'm amazed that so many
BYU detractors don't get this. It's exposure for BYU's fans. Duh!
I love the Ute trolls...they just don't get it..or they do get it and it bothers
them to no end. The Cougs are in the drivers seat. BCS restucturing in 2013. Why
would you jump to a conference like the Big East? And BYU serving notice that
this is not Burger King....You get it my way, or no way at all.
It appears more likely that the Big 12 and the PAC 10 never did call on BYU. The Big East called on Boise State and BSU wanted a division west of
Texas. BSU suggested BYU, so the Big East called. But, BYU acted like they were
Texas, so the Big East said, "What about San Diego State?"
Has it occurred to any of you fans of either teams that the reason why the
independents of today are the independents of today is because of their TV
rights? What would Notre Dame likely have to give up if they had joined the Big
East in all sports? Why is it that Notre Dame is Big East in all sports but
football? Could it not be for the blazing obvious fact that it could and most
likely would mean the end of ALL Notre Dame home games being on NBC? I mean
seriously folks.... How is what BYU is 'demanding' any less proper or cool than
it is for Notre Dame? Would they not boost instantly in national and local
following any conference they joined? I hate that greed and pride will be the
root of staying independent for it is against all that the church it is a branch
of stands for. Yet, it is what it is and so be it! To shun BYU for what they are
doing you MUST also do so against Notre Dame.
As much as I used to love BYU and what it stood for, I no longer care for their
hypocrisy with double-standards that prevail across racial lines. Look at who
the new recruits are......interesting, no blue chips, no Polynesian strongholds.
Hmmmmmmmm, I wonder where they're going? Not to BYU. I predict this is the
beginning of the end of the football program. Adios Mendenhall! A good friend
told you about that lettuce between your teeth a year ago and you didn't take
his advice. Guess what? It's still there. Laters......Holmoe! The
exodus has begun!
How can the industry source say that BYU has become unreasonable in the
negotiations? The Big East came after BYU. BYU can negotiate from a position
of strength. Initially, the talk was that the Big East was willing to give BYU
whatever they wanted, so that they would join the conference. Now BYU is being
blamed for not relinquishing their TV rights? Give me a break! The University
didn't build a state of the art TV facility and negotiate an outstanding
contract with ESPN, just to get into another conference with some of the same
problems as the Mountain West. Stay strong BYU. A few years down the road,
this will be seen as the right move. We Are Cougar Nation!
BYU just doesn't want to compete for conference championships. Lame.
"unless BYU decides to relinquish its television rights for its home
football games" BYU will not move to the Big East as a football-only
member.I think this was BYU politely saying "no we do not want
to join your very poorly ran conference...But thanks anyways. Just
my personal opinion
Veruca Salt: "Hey, Daddy, *I* want an Oompa Loompa! I want you to get me
an Oompa Loompa right away!"Mr. Salt: "All right, Veruca, all
right. I'll get you one before the day is out."Veruca Salt: "I
want an Oompa Loompa now!"Violet Beauregarde: "Can it, you
nit!"Sound familar - well it should it sounds like everyone
that wants great games "NOW" look at the 2013 line up:Texas - homeHawaiiUt StateGeorgia Tech - homeHoustonBoise St - home Notre DameUtah - homeWashington StateIt is a gamble staying Indy and maybe it is a bad
thing - but just look beyond your immediate needs and stop saying a steady diet
of WAC teams because it is not - Relax and stop trying to kill the
golden goose to get one egg. "I would not want to belong to
any club that would have me as member" Groucho Marx - "I
would not want to be a member of any Conference whose next choice is SDSU"
JoeBYU(yet I still feel like I want in - wierd huh?)
Aggie fan here.Just an outside observation. If rumors are true that
the BCS is going to get rid of AQ status for leagues and go with the top 10
teams, then BYU is very smart for not giving in to the requirements of the Big
East. I think BYU deserves some credit for thinking long term, not short-term as
some have commented.
Celebrate good times! BYU is extremely tight with money--who knew? I mentioned
this in an earlier story, but BYU is burning a lot of bridges (MWC, Big 12, and
Big East...more to come), who is going to want to schedule them? The WAC is
going to dissolve. Most of the PAC-12 is going to pass on playing them as they
cried about them being anti-LDS. The other big conferences: Big Ten, ACC, and
SEC will want two for one games. The other possible teams: C-USA, Sun Belt,
MAC, Independents and FCS teams--meh.USU will soon be in the MWC,
and they won't agree to the 2 for 1. U of U is going to want a 2 for 1, so
these games will be going the way of the Do-do soon.Doesn't exactly
make the church look good, getting to the negotiation table and asking for their
own tv deal.Keeping turning down invites, and no one is going to
want to dance with you, silly! Here's the brand: BYU, the diva of sports.Clearly BYU didn't want to go to a BCS conference--which is why they
asked for so much.
Bluto,The only replays I've seen on my dish menu lately are New
Mexico St., Idaho, some other team, and Utah St.You don't want to
give THOSE up? What pride is there in those games? Funny how I haven't seen any
replays of teams that BEAT you. I have yet to see the Utah vs. BYU game this
year... why is that Mr. Bluto?Now ask yourself...Why
wouldn't BYU want to position themselves up for a BCS bowl game?I
can guarantee you that you would get more exposure from one night under the
lights of any of those BCS bowl games than you would all season long.
The march towards mediocrity and virtually no relevance to anyone important
continues. The reality that BYU fans refuse to face is that the ESPN contract is
not the same as one that say Texas, or Notre Dame could negotiate. BYU is a
small university in Utah with what I am afraid to say an overinflated sense of
worth. BYU is not Notre Dame, Texas, Alabama, or USC. They are not on that level
so they need to stop acting like it. Why play chicken with your future? The
reality rapidly approaching BYU is being on the same level as SJSU. 14 or 16
team super conferences means no one (of importance) has to schedule BYU.
Naïve BYU fans point to the big names coming to LES, but what they all deny
is that those contracts can be cancelled at a moments notice. Oh sure the teams
will pay the penalty, but in the end it is one more SJSU, Utah St, or New Mexico
St that BYU will have to schedule. The future is not as bright as BYU officials
would have anyone believe.
@Bluto"Why would BYU give up 15-20 million per year, their ESPN
exposure, their replay abilities and their rights to home games?" Are you talking the same replay abilities that you used against San Diego
State?Holmoe's jumping over dollars to pick up dimes!The
greedy become the needy.Hang in there Band of Lil Brothers
PlanetBYU has an interesting article on why BYU is taking so long with the Big
East...To understand why, set the wayback machine to August 2004 and
listen to the haunting words of Craig Thompson:"This is an
ideal college sports match. This [new TV deal] will provide the Mountain West
Conference more exposure over a variety of mediums than any other conference.
MWC commissioner Craig Thompson boasted at the time. Day-to-day, MWC fans will
relish the additional exposures provided to all our championship sports."
I think staying indy is fine if we can get a decent schedule. Once concern with
all the conference talk is that BYU may have burned some bridges (not saying
they did, just concerned about people taking offense at BYU not groveling to get
into their conference). If all the conferences essentially say "you cannot
schedule BYU in Oct or Nov" then BYU is up a creek. I hope that won't
happen...we have some nice schedules a couple of years out, just want to see
something tighten up further down the road.
@ Bluto | 5:33 p.m. Nov. 22, 2011 Sandy, UT "BYU is not
demanding anything which they don't now already possess."Really? BCS access without having to go undefeated? BYU has $$$$
and an ESPN contractBYU does not have BCS access by winning a BCS
conference regardless of overall record.Therefore, a negotiation.Simple.Next
This is a joke and an endictment against BYU's Administration and the Board of
Trustees if you ask me... I am so tired of this organization taking advantage of
its fan base to satisfy short term gain and their interpretation of what would
represent a "brighter future".... How can one possibly think that a
future would be better outside of one of the large conferences instead of being
part of them... I know that ESPN has given us some money.... Big
Deal.... It's short term...BYU tv will turn out to be a big FLOP if
the best we can do is schedule WAC teams... No one wants to watch BYU play
Idaho, Idaho State, NM State, Utah State, Weber State or San Jose State... We
will end up only being able to attract recruits that can't make it at a true
Division I school in one of the big conferences...It's almost like
the Brethern who are making these decisions don't have a clue... Being inspired
on Academic and Religious matters is far different than thinking that you know
everything that you need to know about College Athletics. They are killing the
future of Athletics for this University.
I am so sick of sports. I have been a BYU fan my whole life, but the sports
scene has changed soooooooo much that I have almost lost total interest.
Unfortunately, I see BYU getting sucked into the "money" aspect of
this whole thing and becoming just as "material" and
"money-hungry" as everyone else.There are more important
things in life than sports, i.e. my daughter's marriage which is falling apart,
my son who is totally in left field (drugs, alcohol, sex, etc.), the health of
my wife, my job, the economy, etc., all of which make sports pale in
comparison.I wish BYU would drop its sports program once and for
Seriously, is there anything more amusing than the Utes obsession with all
things pertaining to BYU?With the AQ to Conferences apparently on
their way out, all that is left which is beneficial in joining the Big East, is
perhaps better Oct/November scheduling.Here is that sloution.BYU has a 12 year deal with Boise St. BYU and Boise St. play
rivalry weekend, period.Hawaii and BYU have an 8 year deal,
stipulate that this is also a November game.Notre Dame can be
another traditional November contest.Throw in a Houston/Navy/Air
Force/Colorado St./Ga. Tech etc. and the late season schduling problems are
solved.The old MWC tv deal paid each team 1.5 million, per year. (BYU makes that per game, right now, with ESPN)The Big East is
currently paying each member 3.5 million per year, it is anticipated that with
the new TV deal each team will make about 9 million per year.Now ask
yourselves....Why would BYU give up 15-20 million per year, their
ESPN exposure, their replay abilities and their rights to home games?BYU is not demanding anything which they don't now already possess.
@motorbikeOnce again you are the one trolling up a BYU article here.
You are supposedly a utah "fan" yet you can't seem to move on from
BYU. Now when I am over trolling on utah articles I fully expect utah
"fans" to call me out and actually enjoy it. You on the otherhand are
typical of utah "fans" in that you apparently believe you should be
allowed to troll up BYU articles without anyone calling out your laughable BYU
hating untruths. If you are going to troll then quit whining about being called
out for it. If you are going to post from the position of a BYU hater then
prepare to be rebutted.I know that you won't take my advice here,
you'll continue to think you should be allowed to troll without anyone
questioning your motivations but that is a typical utah "fan" thought
Brave Sir Robin:Nice try. But we don't accept your false
presupposition that you had an open mind concerning BYU's actions before this
story came out.You're going to have to try a little harder.Asking you about what you think about BYU would be like asking the Knights who
say Ni about what they think of well, Brave Sir Robin.
Being in a BCS league to qualify for a BCS bowl isn't BYU's problem (see Utah,
Boise State, Hawaii and TCU). Winning enough games to qualify for a BCS bowl is
@the Rock"BYU has it too good as an independent. Why join
an AQ conference that is about to lose that status and have to give up its
television rights too? As I see it there is little to gain and a whole lot to
lose."I don't think the Big East is going to lose it's AQ
status to another conference. The only other conference out there with a shot of
taking it from them was the MWC and it is now out of the running with BYU and
Utah gone and TCU and Boise St leaving. There's no other conference
out there with the ability to meet the criteria. Certainly not the WAC or
C-USA.But, as it is, even though our schedule wasn't great this year
I'm looking forward to upcoming seasons and schedules full of teams like Texas,
Boise St, TCU, Notre Dame, Georgia Tech, WVU, VT, Penn St, etc.Rumblings about upcoming BCS changes are indicating that the BCS is going to
eliminate AQ status completely and the requirement for playing in a major bowl
is to finish in the top 10 of the final regular season poll. So, conferences
might not matter.
@kosta fesenkoYou have many times forgotten to change your place of
residence when you changed the screen name. No I have not catologued them for
future reference I have just made note of them. You will sometimes forget which
character you are pretending to be and post in the venaculer of one of your
other identities. You will often post with one of your other screen names soon
after you have posted in a previous one trying to back up the "point"
you made with the 1st name. When you 1st posted as "kosta fesenko" you
actually had posted using a similar name using a couple of jazz players to form
the name and used Alpine as the place of residence, which not so ironically is
the place of residence of several of your other screen names. You then changed
it to "chicken mcnuggetville" then a day later changed the screen name
to "kosta fesenko" and kept "chicken mcnuggetville" as the
place of residence. Frankly there isn't room enough here to post all
the obvious connections but suffice it to say you and I both know all of those
screen names are yours. Plus a few more.
@ Gorum The Old | 4:45 p.m. Nov. 22, 2011 Madison, AL Using
the fact that BYU played Utah as a reason to prove that BYU's schedule looked
"very good at the beginning of the year" is not going to sit well with
yes the big east wants us thats so much better than independence then they dont
want us independence is great make a decision BYU fans
Kosta, If anything, BYU would have the leverage to offer a 2 for 1
with Utah. I know it would never happen because of only 3 OOC games for Utah
every year which makes scheduling BYU troublesome, but that's not BYU's problem
to solve. BYU has the bigger stadium which means more revenue. The Utah game was
4x the cost of any other home game ticket in my season package. It's a
guaranteed sellout, selling 20,000 more tickets than RES. If the avg. BYU/Utah
ticket is $60 (and it's most likely higher than that) then that's $1.2 million
more if the game is at LES versus RES. That's the exact reason why it makes a
ton of sense for USU to agree to 2 for 1 which they have. So where is Utah's
Why didn't the Deseret News publish the entire quote?I doubt BYU
will happen, a college football industry source told CBSSports.com. They are
being extremely unreasonable all of a sudden. This is one reason why they did
not get into the Big 12. Their general counsel (lawyers) is a piece of
@giantfan*face palm* go back, read your own post again.
You are arguing from a purely one-sided view point.
I hope all this works out, one way or the other. It's interesting to note that
most byu fans who post have done a complete 180 turn in their opinion of joining
the the BE. There's guy in our ward who was loudly extolling the virtues of the
BE at church this week. He claimed to have inside information, no less and that
it was a done deal. Hmmmmm...I wonder what he'll be saying this
week?? As byu goeth, so goeth its fans. You guys are a
hoot. Anyway, congratulations on ending up where you want to be.
@motorbikeprobably true. I hear that when the new site is
relaunched, there will be an "ignore user" feature. Duckhunter will
be the first to go. He brings nothing to the table but rhetoric and talking
points that greg wrubell told him.
Kosta Fesenko,If you think I proved your point with my post than you
didn't understand it.
Hey Kosta, I know you've been around long enough to know Duckhunter doesn't
possess the ability to process logical thought. I wouldn't waste your time
trying to explain leverage to him, he's still working on that High School
continued from above.When readin my last post it should become clear
that BYU' 2011 Schedule looked very good at the beginning of the year. True,
there were 5 cup cakes, but the rest figured to be good games. The problem is
that the 7 teams that were supposed to be good, weren't. All 7 (with the
exception of Texas) have all taken a serious step back.The result is
that the schedule that when created looked good and full (well, 7/12) of quality
opponents turned out to become somewhat of a joke.Summary: For all
of those saying that BYU isn't/doesn't schedule quality teams, you are wither
stupid, didn't bother to think before posting, or can't remember past last
September.Have a nice day.
@duckhunterShow me proof that I have multiple screennames. As far as your "point", then go ahead, dump Utah, watch as LES
continues to be 80% full with these 8:15 on ESPNU kickoffs. You need BCS teams
on your schedule. Utah doesn't need you in the slightest.giantfan,
you proved my point with your post, but you probbly didn't see it.
What does it mean that BYU is being unreasonable? Everyone enters a negotiation
with a bottom line below which they will not agree. If you are going to buy a
car and have determined that you will not pay more than $20K, but the dealer
refuses to sell it for less than $22K, are you being unreasonable if you won't
pay the $22K? Are you unreasonable if you try to continue negotiating? Are you
unreasonable if you decide to walk away? No, no, and no.The only
people who are being unreasonable are those who expect BYU to agree to something
that they deem to not be in their best interest. Every other school in the
country is doing the same thing (looking out for their best interest), why is
BYU not being allowed the same courtesy?
After years under the horrible TV contract the Mountain West had, I understand
BYU's reluctance. However, the trend toward bigger conferences is driven
primarily by money, not AQ status. With a truly national footprint and being
the last conference to negotiate, the Big East could shape this thing into a
Re: Kosta FesenkoWhy would BYU accept 2 for 1 with Utah when it's
home games that they need to fill more desperately? They can go anywhere and
play a road game but their ESPN contract only works for home games, since the
home team owns TV rights. And ESPN brings up another point: BYU may have to fill
a 12 game schedule every year but that's where the partnership with ESPN comes
in very handy in helping negotiations along. With that advantage, what really
does the Big East offer that BYU doesn't already have, besides more regularly
scheduled opponents? Before it was the coveted AQ status but we all know that's
more tenuous than ever.
Imagine this schedule for BYU next year:Of BYU's 12 games. 3 will be
conference champions the year before. 4 will have played in BCS games. 3 will
have played in multiple BCS games. One will have a BCS national championship
title and played another BCS NC game just 2 years ago. One will have finished in
the top 10 for 3 years strait. 4 of them will have finished the previous year
ranked. Another 2 will have been ranked for multiple weeks during the previous
season, but had fallen out by the end. 2 of those who didn't finish in the top
25 the previous year will have finished there the 2 previous years.Sounds pretty good doesn't it?That was this year's schedule.Before last year, Oregon St and 'Ole Miss had finished in the 25. Texas played in the NCG 2 year ago.TCU has finished in the
top 10 for 3 years strait.Utah has 2 BCS victories and is
consistantly ranked.Hawai'i tied with then #8 BSU and #11 Nevada as
WAC cochampion and finished 24th in the final BCS rankings.UCF won
11 games last year and finished in the top 20.
@kosta fesenkoI'm begining to think you may actually believe that is
your only screen name. It is pretty obvious you are that delusional.That said BYU does not need utah for their schedule. utah can only play BYU in
September because their pac12 overlords have dictated to them that they are not
allowed to play any out of conference games after September while exempting
themselves, see USC and Stanford and who they play late in the season for proof,
from the same rules.BYU has no problem at all scheduling good teams
early in the year so they can easily dump utah and get someone comparable that
month.If utah was allowed by their overlords to play BYU in November
when BYU is struggling to schedule decent teams then you might have a point. I
say might because I still think BYU would laugh chris hill right off the phone
if he ever even suggested it, but since utah does not have the clout to tell the
pac12 what it will do then your non point is even more non than usual.
Im torn, keep a better TV deal and stay independent or accept the Big East deal
with less exposure and shut San Diego St out of a chance to leave the MWC.
There is a strong possibility the Big East's next TV contract will be with
Comcast. BYU in no way should join the Big East if there is even a chance of
repeating what happened with the mtn. End of story.
The Big East has some big power brokers in their corner (Paul Tagliabue among
them). Don't look for them to lose their access to the BCS. The last thing the
BCS wants is litigation.
Re: Brave Sir Robin,So you're going to take the word of a
"source within the Big East" who is going to spin the truth in the Big
East's favor over anyone else? Ok. You probably also believed Casey Anthony's
lawyers when they said she was innocent.My guess is the Big East is
negotiating from a standpoint that they believe that membership in the
conference is a good thing, that the Big East is lightyears better than
Independence. So, from that perspective, sure, BYU not wanting to give up TV
rights would be "unreasonable". But from BYU's side, where
Independence has already proven to be successul, you've got to offer something
better than just joining the MWC 2.0
@Duckhunter,again, I am only Kosta Fesenko. That is it. I have no
other screen names. I am still not sure why I am being accused of having
multiple ID's.......at any rate, here is the leverage: BYU has to
fill 12 slots each year. Until they prove that they can get 12 quality games,
then they need Utah. Utah only has to fill 3, meaning they do not need BYU (BYU
doesn't really "need" Utah, but moreso than the other way around).
Call me "delusional" but if I was Chris Hill, thats what I would do.
If BYU doesn't want that, then by all means, continue filling up the schedule
with WAC teams.....
I grew up in Provo about two miles from LES. From the time I was 10 or 11 I went
to 4+ home games a year and was able to watch the away games on TV. Then I moved
to Michigan for grad school and upon finishing moved to the Seattle area.
Although I am still a die hard fan and read the DesNews daily, I felt
disconnected from my team since I was not able to watch any games...until this
year. Yeah, the competition has left something to be desired and the team itself
has not been spectacular this year, but I have loved being able to watch every
game. It has been great. For me, AQ status in the Big East is not worth losing
that. AQ status in a better conference, that's a different story.
@cowardly robin"based on this article, I'm going to conclude
that BYU is being unreasonable."Of course you would conclude
that. For one you are a utah troll, for another you assume that BYU actually
wants what the Big East is offering. It is pretty obvious BYU doesn't want what
is being offered or else they would have already accepted it."Being unreasonable" is something that only applies when you are the
one asking to get in and then laying down conditions. It doesn't apply at all to
BYU because they aren't asking to get in, the BIG EAST is pursuing BYU. I'm sure
they think BYU is being unreasonable because they aren't getting what they want.
BYU on the otherhand doesn't want what's being offered so they really don't care
what the BIG EAST thinks.It is pretty obvious to everyone but the
ute trolls that BYU can take or leave this thing. If they get what they want
then they are willing to come on board, if they don't get what they want then
they have no interest in doing it.It sounds to me like BYU holds all
of the cards.
"Since we are talking about business leverage, the Utes should use theirs
and demand 2 for 1s from BYU."This is your brain on drugs. Any
From the comments I've read, I'm amazed at how many BYU fans there are who truly
believe that BYU can do no wrong. I've heard you exist, but I didn't believe
it...until now. At least now I know where on the internet you congregate.And based on this article, I'm going to conclude that BYU is being
unreasonable. It's not like this is some blogger, or local media hack, or Utah
fan who's saying BYU is unreasonable - this is a source within the Big East.
He's right in the middle of this thing. I'm going to take his word over a bunch
of internet-surfing fans.
Get your 2012 Cougar season tickets now. With exciting home games against:Hawaii, Idaho (again?), Washington State, Weber, Utah State (again) and the
big game against Oregon State. It will be a party of the likes none have
seen.At least some of the road games will be fun. If you
are a good recruit, take a look at better options. All those hours in the film
room, weight room, getting hit will pay off at the Armed Forces, Poinsettia Bowl
or Kraft Hunger Bowl. Is this what you dreamed about?
@kosta fesenko aka "duckhunted", "articuno BYU",
"duckhunter hunter", "noblepromise", "54-10"You've used all of those screen names on BYU articles today. You even
changed place of residence for "articuno" to Hilghland or else forgot
to change it from when you were posting as "duckhunted".That said your post above:"Since we are talking about
business leverage, the utes should use theirs and demand 2 for 1's from
BYU" That actually made me LOL. You see an entity actually has
to have leverage to use it. utah does not ahve any leverage to demand that from
BYU and they know that. Certainly utah "fans" like yourself like to
pretend they do but of course they don't. There is absolutely nothing utah
possess's that gives them the "leverage" to make that demand.LOL!
You people who say BYU is selfish and greedy have no idea what you're talking
about. I doubt any of you have lived outside the Wasatch Front and tried to get
a BYU game for the past 30 years. Impossible. You can't build a program unless
you get some exposure in some major media markets. The past decades in the
WAC/MWC were a disaster. If you're a Ute fan, just think how hard
it's been to watch Utah football until now. There are far more of us outside the
Wasatch Front than inside and we all want to get the games. Now, the other half
of exposure is playing quality competition and winning. I wish we'd do more of
that. But I can't blame BYU for wanting to avoid another MWC/The Mtn situation
like we had a few short months ago!!I'm torn over the Big East. A
sinking ship with all the defections, but one with member schools in major media
markets. I think it is too big and not a cohesive set of schools like most other
conferences. I think we are in for a lot more re-alignment in the coming years.
Why take a step backwards after you have taken a couple forward. Exposure is #1.
They also have freedom to schedule as they want and they get a bunch of money
for their troubles. I don't like the November scheduling much with the
exception of Hawaii but that will get better. If it becomes necessary to join a
conference for AQ status or BCS(or something similar)inclusion then they can
concede some things. Until then, I think they are doing the right things.
Since we are talking about business leverage, the Utes should use theirs and
demand 2 for 1s from BYU.
Again, BYU is the one negotiating from a position of power, not the Big East.
BYU has what it really wants for the next several years--greater exposure and
more control of its brand as a football entity.If this was all about
AQ status, BYU would have sold its independence to the Big 12, which would have
put them on a similar TV exposure/annual payout level as their rival Utah, which
joining the Big East will never provide. Why even toy with the Big East when
the Big East cannot possibly give BYU what the Big 12 can? Only if the Big East
will take BYU with BYU's existing TV deal would it even make sense for BYU to
join. If BYU can't keep control of their home TV rights, it becomes a
non-starter in negotiating with the Big East.Let the Big East gather
in Boise State and San Diego State and create something akin to a new and
improved C-USA. BYU (not to mention BYU's fans) is better off staying the
I get weary listening to pundits say that BYU is being "unreasonable"
because they don't want to give up what they have for something less. The only
value I see in moving to the Big East would be ease of scheduling during the
second half of the season. That's it. The automatic "AQ"
status seems destined for the trash heap, as does the conference's AQ status
itself.Why give up independence, and why give up a larger TV pot for
a smaller one, especially when it was the Big East that contacted BYU? As a fan since the mid 1970's, I have enjoyed supporting the Cougars because
in doing so I am supporting my church. I am perfectly willing to wade through a
couple of years of New Mexico States until scheduling catches up with the
Long ago, eighty percent of MWC TV revenue came from BYU games. Obama wanted the
cougs to pay a little more to make it fair. Independence is a
breath of fresh air.
As I understand it, the reason the BCS moguls are talking about doing away with
the AQ status for all conferences and independents is to stop the very kind of
conference sausage making and cherry picking that is going on with the Big East
and to some extent the Big 12. The reasoning is if the AQ status is no longer
then conferences like the Big East do not need to try and structure something so
ridiculous. It also gives the big bowl committees from the Orange, Sugar,
Fiesta and to a much lesser extent the Rose bowls the power to choose the teams
and match ups that they want. Of course, the BCS will still set the table for
the national championship game.
@ WildcatYou are obviously clueless about BYU's motivations. It is
not about greed or money. It is about BYU name brand to get on as many
television sets as possible. That is why they went independent in the first
place. That is why they have made a huge investment in the new broadcast
facility.Having said that, I really wish they would join a BCS
conference--better competition/scheduling, chance for BCS bowl, and probably
better recruiting. But the powers that be just aren't going to release the
stranglehold they have on television rights. I understand their motivation, and
its not about money. I just don't agree with it.
Stand your ground. Deliver on your mission. Don't let the peasants bother you.
Be the antithesis of Penn St., Miami, Ohio St. and many more.
I think BYU has issues getting real games lined up a couple years down the road
as when most league grow to 14 and 16 teams, much of their scheduling
flexibility will be taken away by having to schedule in league opponents. BYU
will be fighting for ever fewer open slots a schedules.But I could
be wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.
Having exposure with your own TV deal means nothing if nobody is watching it. I
wonder how many people nationally are staying up for these 1030 eastern kickoff
games against teams like Idaha and New Mexico St. Heck, how many people here
are tuning in to these games, besides die hard BYU fans?
Doesn't CBS have a huge vested interest in sandbagging BYU publically?
Adterall, it competes head-to-head w/ESPN. BYU and ESPN are tied at the hip.
CBS' contract w/Beast is up in about 90 days and negotiations to renew are
eminent. It simple seems that McMurphy's column was very conveniently self
serving for CBS, painting BYU as the bad guy. I am shocked Gordon didn't ask the
same question? I've been a Beast advoocate all along, but not if BYU has to give
up ESPN and BYUtv. BYU's value will carry over to all other venues when on the
road so this is a CBS ploy for future contract power and nothing more. BYU
should NOT accept any compromise deal.
Whether it goes through or not, this new proposed Big East is an unstable mess.
Rutgers, UConn, Louisville, Cincinnati, and South Florida are either going to
wither on the vine by effectively becoming mid-majors (again ... remember, 10
years ago, only Rutgers was a football member of a current BCS league, and they
were horrible) or jump to the ACC at their first opportunity.
BYU would not walk into a situation only to be burned in 2 years when everything
falls apart. Already the scheduling next season will be much better. What we
experienced this season with multiple WAC teams was a desperate attempt to
schedule opponents as fast as possible. BYU has a great deal being independent
and is on the inside of the negotiations. They are not the speculators. They
will make a very well informed decision that suits them and their mission/goals.
Remember when BYU and Utah were roped into the mountain network? That sucked.
BYU has a great deal with ESPN in place. Their fans are able to see them perform
which is what the school wants. They would be very hesitant to throw that all
away for something that might not be too great in a couple years. Also they have
a state of the art broadcasting facility. Can you blame them for wanting to use
Look at next years schedule - Not too shabby. If BYU has to give up everything
to join the Big East for a net loss, why bother. BYU's schedule is improving
moving forward and if the BCS changes it's formula, BYU will be better off as an
independent. BYU has some smart and wise people working on this and I believe
they know what is best for BYU and that they will get it.Go Cougars.
Everyone speculates without knowing the actual facts. It's not being selfish.
It's called smart business sense. The Big East would not be much more of an
improvement over the Mountain West. Why give up a lucrative ESPN deal and
become subject to possible bad administration similar to the Mountain?
Obviously there are problems in the Big East or the good teams wouldn't be
bolting from it. The schedule would not improve that much considering what is
in the works for BYU.
Boo hoo, so maybe we are not going to the Big East. I am not crying.
We need an upgrade in schedule strength especially in the home game department.
But a move to the Big East is a lateral move if you ask me and the Big East
would be the party getting the upgrade... the Big East, for the past 6 or 7
years, has been consistently worse than the MWC but with the addition of Boise
St and Air Force the conference might be viewed in great favor of keeping it's
AQ status. I still think down the road the Cougs go somewhere but IF the fans
have to deal too much with this creampuff home schedule LES will suffer in the
attendance category. I for one will travel 4 hours to Provo to see BYU/Texas but
I will no longer travel to see BYU/NMSU... Come on Cougs the fans NEED SOMETHING
good to hear! we didn't want to go to the Big Least anyway! lol! and whats funny to me is that Utsie trolls are already out talking like its
1999. Truth is, it doesn't matter where BYU goes, because,
well...........we are BYU. Independence has been great and I anticipate us
getting the same access taht notre dame has enjoyed since we are comparable
programs historically and now as far as fan bases go. Bronco has
said that this team will be in the national title race next year. This is his
favorite team.I trust that the bot will do exactly whwat needs to be
done. we will do ther ight thing. and no matter what, we always have more bcs
access tahn the utsies! eat that up utsie trolls!
What is "Big East" about the Big East anyway? If the western half of
the Big East is Boise State, San Diego State, Houston and SMU, how is that a
better conference line-up than the best of the current MWC? And the eastern
half is even worse. How often are Connecticut, Rutgers, Cincinatti, Navy and
Central Florida going to be BCS contenders? Chances are good that Boise State
won't endure as a national power so if BYU wants to dominate another conference
and winning a conference championship is the most important thing, then they
should join the Big East. If they want to have national exposure, have their
fans see all their games on national television and keep the money from tv and
bowl games (though usually not BCS bowls), play other nationally significant
programs, then they should remain independent. The national college football
landscape will do some serious shifting in the next few years. BYU should stand
its ground until the shifting stops.
It's not about money, it's about visibility. Show of hands, who wants to join
the Big East and possibly get stuck with 3-4 games on TV with the rest limited
in availability and no chance for even BYUtv to air them? Anybody??? That is
what BYU doesn't want to happen (again, MWC) Get a good deal cougars or don't
deal at all. The schedule will get better:2012- GTech, Utah,
Boise, ND, Org St, Wash St2013- GTech, Utah, Boise, ND, Wash St, Texas,
Stay independent. Soon this conference will be revealed as a desperate attempt
to keep 'big boy' status. No disrepect intended by a few of these schools in AQ
conferences? It was a stretch for BYU, Utah and TCU but San Diego State?In any case, don't sweat the little stuff. Keep the contract, play a
random, fun schedule every year and see what happens. I am losing my taste for
this 'Vegas style all-in' on college sports. We need to remember these are
student-athletes. Back to basics. Win games and people watch, lose'm and the
seats are empty. And when its over make sure you have a real degree hanging on
your wall. A lot of people have paid a lot of money for these universities for
academics, football should remain second place.
The Rock,Too good at beating up bottom dweller WAC teams, you mean?
To many fans are going to be upset if BYU doesn't jump at the chance to get into
a BCS conf. , the fact is BYU being independent is just fine, the scheduling
will improve with time and unless the Big East or Big 12 or any other conf. for
that matter want to make it worthwhile, BYU just needs to stay independent. If
the BCS makes the changes being talked about there won't even be BCS
conferences. Why would BYU give up their TV rights etc if it won't be to their
yay! more games against the bottom of the Wac teams! wahoo! now BYU can get
an even more inflated view of themselves!yay!
Principle and selfishness or arrogance and selfishness - you decide.
SO SICK OF THIS.
Carnak,With every team that was any good from the MWC, is the
conference really any different from the WAC? And the WAC's TV deal sure offered
more exposure. USU going to the MWC is a losing proposition. They should be
looking at possibly conference USA.
I wouldn't be too sad not to join the Big East, but if the tv negotiations is
what kept us out of the Big 12, then I have to throw my hands up in the air and
scream, "What were you thinking!?"
Wow, I have never seen a University more tight with money. Reminds me of the
friend who pulls out the calculator to figure out how much everyone owes for the
tip.This also reminds me of the Saw movies. In this case, Jigsaw
set up a game to see if BYU could overcome it's selfishness and greed for money
and play in a BCS conference--to which they have failed miserably. This is the
beginning of the end for BYU football. The door is slamming shut with BYU left
to itself and its misery.Hey BYU--GAME OVER!
We don't really fit into the Big East anyway. Neither does Boise St., Air Force
or San Diego St. I thought it was a stretch when the Big 12 was considering us.
For now I am happy with independence. Let's wait until it all plays out with the
BCS and realignment. We are in a good spot and should not have to compromise to
get into a conference on the verge of collapse.
"They are being extremely unreasonable all of a sudden."All of the sudden??
Before you go and say that BYU is unreasonable, consider this:The
ball is in our court. They want us. We aren't dead-set on joining the Big
East. So: If we have a deal that is very beneficial to us and to the Big East,
we will go. Otherwise, our hearts aren't broken.I loved that my
Cougs were on international TV every game (and so did my family that lives all
across the country). We got extreme exposure, and that is what the university
All I care about is the best competition. If BYU decides to remain an
independant, here's hoping that the schedule can be upgraded so both the Utes
and Cougars are playing top caliber teams. No matter who joins the Big East,
hopefully this will give USU an opportunity to join the MWC where I believe they
would do very well.
BYU has it too good as an independent. Why join an AQ conference
that is about to lose that status and have to give up its television rights too?
As I see it there is little to gain and a whole lot to lose.