Protect our precious land

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  • Curmudgeon Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 23, 2011 6:24 p.m.

    Procuradorfiscal says: "How much more of Utah DO liberals expect to place off-limits to Utahns?"
    Facts are so inconvenient, aren't they?

    First, national monuments (as well as national parks and wilderness areas) are no more "off-limits" to Utahns than to citizens from any other state; in fact, creating a national monument preserves the land FOR Utahns and other citizens, and prevents the land from being placed "off-limits" by your beloved private developers.

    Second, the land that is now a national monument did not belong to any particular citizens of Utah, nor even to the Utah state government; it was and is federal land. It was not confiscated or condemned; there was no "land-grab." As such, it belongs to all the people of the United States. Where do you get the idea that because land is located in Utah, it belongs exclusively to Utahns? Would you also conclude that Gettysburg belongs exclusively to Pennsylvanians?

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Sept. 23, 2011 3:17 p.m.

    Observing and gathering facts from world history indicates danger when a government is in control of peoples land, money, education, etc. Why do we keep making the same old mistakes?

  • Fitz Murray, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:48 p.m.

    Numbers are so easy to manipulate that it is scary. Let's start with the poll. It was a small 400 person sample, taken outside the area most affected, with questions that are part of what is called "push polling" or polling with a preconceived finding in mind. It is a biased poll.

    The $50 Million did not go to education, it went into a trust fund where it earns interest and only a part of that interest is paid to education.

    As for the coal and mineral resources, they have not yet been realized and some may never be realized. There was a lost opportunity cost by trading the lands on the Kaparowits Plateau for other potential assests. They should have been blocked up at the proposed Andalex coal mine site and the mine should have been pursued. It would have provided a better economic return for local government and education. Miners are paid a lot better than hospitality people. There are also areas in the Escalante Canyons that have proven oil and gas reserves. I love hiking the canyons, but facts are facts and the trade by SITLA cost education dollars. Numbers can be looked at many ways.

  • Happy Valley Heretic Orem, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 4:51 p.m.

    DC- You mean the property taxes Utah waives for Corporations. Have you been to staircase, I doubt it if you think it's real estate development property.

    There's plenty of room still around Kanab to grow and guess what last time Kanab experienced growth John Wayne was in town.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 4:10 p.m.

    sold only once? maybe, but property taxes collected yearly adn the property made productive in perpetuity.

  • worf Mcallen, TX
    Sept. 22, 2011 3:58 p.m.

    Yes! Look at our national debt, poor education, and high unemployment. Is it really wise to have our lands grabbed and controlled by the same liberals?

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 1:41 p.m.

    Re: "I would bet if there was an honest debate on this issue alone, the people of Utah would support Crystal, not Herrod. The fact that Utahns vote for Republicans is not because of this issue."

    I'd take that bet. It's a sure thing. Yours is the classic liberal argument -- "if only there were an HONEST debate, everyone would agree with me."

    Well, now's the time. Be honest.

    What ARE liberal plans for a liberal-elite petting zoo in the West?

    How much more of Utah DO liberals expect to place off-limits to Utahns?

    How much more free reign DO liberals intend to give SUWA/EPA/Sierra Club to destroy agriculture and recreation in Utah?

    The fact that Utahns vote Republican is because we Democrats have nothing to offer but excuses -- for more taxes, more profligate government, more regulation, more unemployment, more radical environmentalism, and more support of indecency and perversion.

    Unfortunately, honesty is about the last thing Utahns have come to expect from liberals.

  • EJM Herriman, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 1:29 p.m.

    I enjoy reading the postings with all the different labels being placed on people. Radical environmentalists, anti-growth liberals, east bench cultural elites (that's a new one). If I didn't know better I would think that world was coming to an end.

  • Eco-Weenie Dayton, OH
    Sept. 22, 2011 12:34 p.m.

    "The monument has benefited local economies. Employment...grew 38 percent... Real per capita income grew by 30 percent."

    The question is did this growth occur because of, or despite monument designation?

    Many areas of the west where there are no national monuments experienced similar levels of growth over the same time period.

    In Kane and Garfield counties, where the GSENM is located, most of the employment growth was in non travel and tourism industries (53%), while employment in tourism related industries (which you would expect to receive the most benefits from the GSENM) grew only 7%.

  • ugottabkidn Sandy, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 11:47 a.m.

    And then we have Mr procuradorfiscal that commences to name calling without facts. I think in the end we were better served by protecting natural beauty than turning it over to oil companies and the like to purge our resources from Mother Nature all the while feeding your misconception that society would see some money. Of course some see the beauty of oil rigs and air pollution, I don't.

  • Dektol Powell, OH
    Sept. 22, 2011 11:22 a.m.

    "If the land is developed"???
    Where do you propose to get the water and who do you believe will move to Southern Utah to live?

  • Ben H Clearfield, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 10:03 a.m.

    What you are talking about is a one-time payment. If the land is developed, it is cash in the hands of the local county and school district every single year. It is not a good deal for our kids, no matter how you spin it.

  • Demo Dave Holladay, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 9:00 a.m.

    Thank you, Crystal, for being a clear voice of reason in an echo chamber of insanity.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 9:00 a.m.

    @ procuradorfiscal, I would bet if there was an honest debate on this issue alone, the people of Utah would support Crystal, not Herrod. The fact that Utahns vote for Republicans is not because of this issue.

  • Crystal Y-O SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:46 a.m.

    a) If only I lived on the East Bench. If only.
    b) If having a deep and abiding passion for Bach, Stravinsky, Beethoven, and Mozart over Britney Spears and Eminem makes me a cultural elitist instead of making me someone who seeks the things that are "virtuous, lovely, or of good report or praiseworthy" as my religion encourages, then I welcome the denotation of being a cultural elitist. I just try to fill my life with enlightening, spirit-filled entertainment!
    c) I am the former communications director of the Young Dems of Utah.

  • Happy Valley Heretic Orem, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:46 a.m.

    lost in DC said: And despite some possible temporary benefits,

    You mean like strip mining it for coal, or selling it as real estate once.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:24 a.m.

    how much of that job growth was from 1996-2001, and how much came after?

    You could say job growth grew an infinite amount if you expand your time from 1845 to 2008.

    And despite some possible temporary benefits, you're saying you are OK with giving ANY pres dictatorial powers to conduct future land grabs? If such powers are OK for land grabs, what other purposes are they OK for? Where do you draw the line?

  • The Real Maverick Orem, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:07 a.m.

    I think people are becoming wise to the shenanigans Grand Ol Party and their corporate interests. Thank you for your letter.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 8:02 a.m.

    Re: ". . . Utahns really don't want the vision of Herrod and his special interest group masters.


    He, and people a lot like him, seem to be elected and re-elected in Utah -- a lot more often than radical greenies.

    Maybe that's a better indicator of what Utahns want than a condescendingly elitist opinion piece by the communications coordinator of Utah Young Democrats.

    Or even a reader comment in response.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 6:45 a.m.

    The writer of this letter is correct. Herrod playing an old, tired political game here in Utah that is driven by a small group of vocal land users that just want to serve their own personal financial interests. Same old, same old. And Utahns really don't want the vision of Herrod and his special interest group masters.

  • ECR Burke, VA
    Sept. 22, 2011 5:43 a.m.

    Thanks for setting the record straight Crystal. The old argument that maintaining strict environmental standards, researching and developing clean sources of energy and a host of other issues lumped into the environmental category, is naturally bad for business or bad for the economy is nonsense. Your letter does an excellent job of illustrating that fact. The national parks and monuments in Utah are part of what makes Utah uniqure; sets it apart from most other states. It's part of what makes Utah special. Let's keep it that way.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    Sept. 22, 2011 5:15 a.m.

    Re: "And Utahns see through the divisive anti-environment rhetoric."

    Yeah -- we sure do.

    We see that Grand Staircase-Escalante is just another in a long series of assaults by radical environmentalists and anti-growth liberals on Western states' independence and way of life.

    It's only East-bench cultural elites, like the writer, that laud the condescending actions of Left-coast and Back-east liberals and greenies to turn the West into their own private petting zoo.

    Out-of-state liberals wanting to lock more and more land away from Americans should direct their attention to Eastern or West-coast states, and leave us alone to enjoy Utah as we always have.