Randy Shumway: How to quickly increase number of college graduates

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    Sept. 20, 2011 10:21 p.m.

    A another little fact check: nearly 50% of all full-time students and 80% of part-time students work while in school.

    Sept. 20, 2011 10:17 p.m.

    here is the reality folks like it or not the unemployment rate for those without a degree over 11% the unemployment rate for those with a degree is about 5.4% thats just the reality we live in.

  • Screwdriver Casa Grande, AZ
    Sept. 20, 2011 4:24 p.m.

    You call college a scam but college graduates have half the unemployment rate of the rest of the population.

    Outside of Utah people get degrees to go to work. I knew some girls at BYU majoring in Family Studies I think it was but that's what they want to do for society. So what?

  • Anti Bush-Obama Washington, DC
    Sept. 20, 2011 3:55 p.m.

    With no employment. College is the biggest scam in the world. If I would've known that before I graduated, I would've just dropped out. I'm stuck at a job that I hate now but an thinking about getting into the Funeral Industry where there is zero competition and a very high need.

    If everybody has a college degree,nobody does. Just think about that.

  • BobP Port Alice, B.C.
    Sept. 20, 2011 1:30 p.m.

    Go where the jobs are. If you are LDS try thinking of going somewhere away from Happy Valley and the Wasatch front.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 12:41 p.m.

    Re: "This is a real problem."

    No, it's not. It's a manufactured crisis liberals demagogue to scare the rubes into voting Democrat. Nothing more.

    Most Americans have employer-provided health care. I'm betting you do. It galls liberals they can't tax it, but that's OK. It works fairly well.

    No one is denied needed health care. Not even illegals. When misfortune smiles on Americans, the system treats them, even if they're too poor or too irresponsible to have insurance. Then, if they can't pay, the debt is written off as uncollectible, or in bankruptcy.

    We pay, of course, but without laundering it through government.

    Re: "I don't know the answer."

    I do. Leave health care alone. The system that has evolved in the US is a pretty good system.

    Evolution is a liberal god. Their faith seems to flag, though, when it comes to actually letting evolution work. They've got to tinker, "improve," and, ultimately, destroy, institutions that have evolved in pretty good form.

    Unless it advances their other god -- socialism.

  • Opinionated Sandy, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 12:08 p.m.

    I congratulate you. Surely you understand, however, that you are in the vast minority. There is, however, still that little thing called scholarship, which I certainly recognize as being more earned, yet still money given to you and obviously needed.

  • JoeBlow Miami Area, Fl
    Sept. 20, 2011 11:40 a.m.


    How about you look at the problem and stop with the ole "those without healthcare don't produce anything.

    This is a real problem. I dont know the answer.

    But the issue deserves more consideration than just flippant remarks.

  • procuradorfiscal Tooele, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 11:11 a.m.

    Re: "Don't sell the problem of health care short."

    Yeah, don't do that.

    See, if we all had "free" health care, we could all afford to work in the History, English and Sociology "industries." We wouldn't actually have to do or produce anything, and we wouldn't have to work hard, like they do at McDonald's or the grocery store.

    We'd be free to just sit around and "self-actualize."

    "Worker's" paradise!

  • JoeBlow Miami Area, Fl
    Sept. 20, 2011 8:59 a.m.

    "People need to have their hair cut more frequently than they need a history major."

    You are exactly right Mom, but how do you live on this kind of wage?

    Many people that you deal with daily, work in jobs that do not provide health care.

    What is the answer? I know it is a tough question.

    Rifleman would say that one should have gotten a better education. That is certainly one solution, but as noted earlier, many with a 4 year degree are working for $8 per hour.

    Health care is a much bigger issue than most people realize. Very few doctor visits would cost less than $300 and even minor out-patient surgery will run $10,000 to $20,000.

    Most would rather spout political talking points than really address the situation.

    Don't sell the problem of health care short.

  • isrred Logan, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 8:56 a.m.

    "Fewer students are paying for their education. They have opted out of work and instead have learned to depend on us for their education money"

    I had a full tuition scholarship and had a job all through school and I still finished with about $13,000 in student loans (which I realize is not massive in comparison to most). I never got a grant or "free" money from "you"/government (other than the subsidization of my loans so I didn't have to pay interest until after graduation). The reality is that even with my tuition covered, paying for fees, books, other supplies, food, housing, gas for my car (that is definitely not nice or new), etc that the cost of going to college is expensive.

    Don't you dare call me lazy or say that I "opt out of work" and depend on you.

  • RedShirt USS Enterprise, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 8:23 a.m.

    I have a better idea, one that will fill that checkbox. What we should do is have a certificate program or "degree" program where we look at what college courses were completed and give them a higher education certificate based on what they took. That way, we can boost the number of people with post-secondary degrees or certificates.

  • Opinionated Sandy, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 7:52 a.m.

    When you say financial counseling, you're really saying "teach them to get more government money through grants etc", correct? Fewer students are paying for their education. They have opted out of work and instead have learned to depend on us for their education money. If grants, scholarships, medicaid, and the bishops storehouse went away, you would see two things happen. One, less kids would be going to school until universities streamlined their fees to account for not having government money. Tuition would go down. The price of books would go down. Teachers would learn how to teach using more simple means. When these things happen, student would have saved enough money from working to come back to school.

  • Mom of 8 Hyrum, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 7:07 a.m.

    A higher education doesn't automatically guarantee a better job. There simply aren't that many jobs to go around. My husband manages a retail store full of college graduates who can't find a job that pays more than the $8/hr he can offer.

    Check the job boards--there aren't lists of jobs requiring degrees that go unfulfilled; there simply aren't that many good paying jobs available.

    I agree with Marxist (although Karl isn't one of my favorites): people need to learn how to do all kinds of work, and be flexible in what they'll accept. There are plenty of trades out there that can provide better jobs than a token degree in many majors.

    People need to have their hair cut more frequently than they need a history major.

  • kcmannn Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 7:02 a.m.

    As usual, Mr. Shumway has no clue about the issues. Why does the DN keep humoring this guy? If he actually knew what was going on he would see that the real problems are much larger than just a lack of advising. Every day I see college students drop out of school because a) they have too much debt or b) they are poorly prepared for college level work. They can't go to school because, like the rest of US society, they are buried in debt and have to work full time to pay for their nice new car etc.... They also simply can't handle the requirements of college work. The K-12 system sends these students forward with such poor reading, writing and math skills that they have no chance of success. Go ahead Mr. Shumway, advise away but unless these two BIG issues are addressed it will have little or no effect.

  • DougS Oakley, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 6:18 a.m.

    To get more graduates quickly, the colleges and universities can just do more of what they have been doing for decades, i.e. lower the graduation requirements to match the lower entrance requirements.
    I remember once, talking to the dean of students at a catholic university in California who bragged about having the highest standard for admittance in that state "we require a "'C'" average!

  • marxist Salt Lake City, UT
    Sept. 20, 2011 12:33 a.m.

    I think what Mr Shumway proposes is a good idea, but students need at a more fundamental level surivival skills, and that means they need the hard facts facing labor (which most of them will be). This is information most likely will not be provided by any Utah institution of any kind. They need some foundation in Marxian economics and philosophy.