BYU football: Brandon Davies' suspension informing non-Mormon recruits

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  • Draft dumbie Farmington, UT
    Aug. 6, 2011 12:00 p.m.

    Y Grad/Y Dad:

    Thank you for your input. I would like my kids to go to BYU (I got a late start in having children, so my first college age child won't be for about 6 more years), but I have been worried that they could not have a good wholesome experience like I had more than 30 years ago, because of the changed environment. Your comments give me hope.

    People misunderstand my stance on enforcement of the BYU honor code. I'm all for the honor code. I think it creates a great atmosphere on the BYU campus. I would just like to see the BYU administration take more of a rehabilitative approach to enforcing the honor code than a punitive approach. Especially for athletes who only have four years to try to make it to the pros (if they have enough talent), any disruption in their playing career can be catastrophic. Also, if a student leaves BYU and tries to transfer somewhere else (due to honor code violations), there is a loss of credit hours and a disruption in continuity of completing an academic program that results in a significant increased expense in obtaining a college degree.

  • panamadesnews Lindon, UT
    Aug. 5, 2011 10:33 p.m.

    Big Daddy Utah: I think that Brandon wanted it handled just the way it was. If not, if would have been handled different. He was not trying to hide anything. He manned up, took it in stride, and it ended up being a positive thing for him, his family, his girl friend, and BYU. There have been other similar cases, and none were ever handled the way this one was. Everyone was a winner!

  • nomad1 American Fork, UT
    Aug. 5, 2011 8:08 p.m.

    Unfortunatly, the honor code is a two-edge sword. There are students who honor it and have a great experience and others who don't. I had roommates who didn't honor the code and would not confess it. They would hide it in fear of being kicked out of school. They would delay the repentence process until they were finished with school. It was my thought that kids should have free agency to make the decisions they wanted. I always thought of the gospel as my honor code. If kids are mature enough to voluntarily go to class, they should be wise enough to know the difference between right and wrong. Unfortunatly, kids will make mistakes, code or nor code. IMO, the honor code is more like satan's plan. The gospel is enough byu!

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Aug. 5, 2011 12:01 p.m.

    Draft dumbie

    Your point is well taken. Ironic that the athletes who we all think might get a pass or special treatment, actually do recieve closer scrutiny. However, I think it unfair to blame that entirely on the university. Certainly BYU has a concern to NOT appear to give favorable treatment to a student just because he or she is an athlete, but I beleive the difference mainly amounts to making a public announcement, something that if they didn't do, would be done for them and in a manner not of their choosing.

    I also had a great experience at BYU, once I moved out of the rich kids apartments and into a basement on the south side of campus. We probably overlapped - I was there from Jim McMahon through Robbie Bosco and Ty Detmer.

    To date, three of my four have attended BYU and had a different but equivalent experience. There too, they took my advice from the outset, lived in a more humble apartment setting and had a tremendous experience. I do think what has increase is an elitist, "richer than thou" atmosphere, but increasing wealth throughout the church in general may be our greatest trial.

  • Draft dumbie Farmington, UT
    Aug. 5, 2011 10:03 a.m.

    Y Grad/Y Dad:

    Your "logical conclusion" leaves out one important factual consideration--namely, that a high profile male student athlete is more likely to have the media snoop into and publish the details of his honor-code-violation suspension when BYU suspends him from the team and makes the announcement in the middle of the season than is a non-athlete student.

    In fact, based on the extremely small level of experience I have had with the honor code--which is second hand information from some students that did have a problem with the honor code--it appears that the honor code has been applied much more harshly to high profile student athletes on several occasions, than it has been applied to non-athlete students.

    Finally, even though I had a great experience at BYU in the late 70's and early 80's, I don't think the experience is the same today as it was then, and I don't know if I want to put my child into the elitist, "holier than thou" atmosphere that seems to permeate the BYU campus today.

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Aug. 5, 2011 7:56 a.m.

    Draft dumbie

    My I have your permission to follow your thought to it's logical conclusion?

    If you would be concerned for your child and the honor code if he was a recruitable athlete, would you be equally concerned for your child even if he was NOT an athlete?

    If your concerns are reasonable, then could we not assume that the majority of LDS parents would feel as you do?

    If that were the case, then BYU would have no problem accomodating all of the applicants who did apply.

    And yet we see that this is not the case.

    What would you conclude from this exercise?

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    Aug. 4, 2011 9:59 p.m.

    Fred T | 2:28 p.m. Aug. 4, 2011
    "calls from moms and dads....because they want him in that environment...what you really want is the kid wanting to be in that environment.

    This is not unlike the LDS parents wanting to send their rebellious little Johnny or Suzie to BYU to "straighten" up. They don't...."

    I quoted you because that's the same idea I got from this article too. My guess is Coach Doman realizes this too, which is why he hedges by saying he's not sure it will change how many non-LDS they actually sign. This article was a bit one-sided. It may be a side I agree with, but it did seem like a homer job.

  • Rational Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 9:52 p.m.

    Draft dumbie | 3:37 p.m. Aug. 4, 2011
    Farmington, UT
    Looks like BYU got the exact result they wanted from "sticking to their principles" in the manner in which they handled the Brandon Davies matter--a lot of positive PR.

    I am 100% certain that "PR" had 0% influence on the Davies situation.

  • Veritas Aequitas Fruit Heights, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 7:34 p.m.

    troutman | 5:25 p.m. Aug. 4, 2011
    Washington, UT

    "Last report I heard was there are as many missionaries not serving their alloted time as there is going out!"

    Ummmm, could you cite your source?

    The way you phrased your statement would lead one to believe that 100% of missionaries leaving are coming home early. Is that your assertion?

    Either way, I have no idea where you recieved your information, but you seemed so proud to be sharing it, that you ended it with an exclamation point.

    Brandon Davies is going to be a stud-athlete, and has shown he has a solid character. I have no doubt that during this whole situation he has learned more about life, and being successful, than he ever dreamed when he signed up for BYU and the Honor Code.

    "Big Daddy Utah" would have Brandon run and hide from the situation, claiming he was "paraded" to the entire country.

    Instead, Davies decided to "man-up" and grow from his lesson in "real-life".

    If the kid keeps it up, the sky is the limit.

  • nottyou Riverton, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 6:22 p.m.

    To: troutman

    You said, "Last report I heard was there are as many missionaries not serving their alloted time as there is going out!"

    Really? If I understand you, that report basically said that not one missionary is completing his two year mission?

    Could you give us the link to that report? It must be a gem.

  • troutman Washington, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 5:25 p.m.

    The way things have been going lately in the Church, (and BYU is part of the Church whether some want to admit it or not), soon all players will have to have a temple recommend in order to play there!

    Last report I heard was there are as many missionaries not serving their alloted time as there is going out!

    Is the BAR-raised to high?

  • Mormon Ute Kaysville, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 3:57 p.m.

    This is a good thing for BYU and its mission to help represent the Church.

  • full disclosure Providence, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 3:37 p.m.

    What a blessing it is for BYU that such a thing occurred with Brandon Davies. Maybe after his college career is over they will make him the Recruiting Coordinator.

  • Draft dumbie Farmington, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 3:37 p.m.

    Looks like BYU got the exact result they wanted from "sticking to their principles" in the manner in which they handled the Brandon Davies matter--a lot of positive PR.

    I wonder what those non-LDS parents will be saying if their child makes a mistake and violates the honor code, and gets treated the same way Brandon Davies was treated--and, if the timing is a little bit different and the violation happens later in their child's career, he has his athletic and/or academic career seriously hampered as a result. Even though I'm a BYU alum, an avid BYU fan, and a devout Mormon, I'm not presumptuous enough to think that my child would never make a mistake concerning the honor code, and therefore (if my child was actually a recruitable college athlete), I would think twice before I would encourage him to attend BYU as an athlete, with the present policies in place concerning the manner in which the BYU honor code is enforced.

  • Fred T PHOENIX, AZ
    Aug. 4, 2011 2:28 p.m.

    calls from moms and dads saying they wanted us to recruit their son because they want him in that environment

    This is fine, but what you rteally want is the kid wanting to be in that environment.

    This is not unlike the LDS parents wanting to send their rebellious little Johnny or Suzie to BYU to "straighten" up. They don't. They rebel more and go off campus or to other Utah cities for their "fun". Saw it in the 70's and I'm sure it is the same today.

  • H2OSKI Alpine, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 1:42 p.m.

    @Big Daddy Utah

    Strange you are so concerned about how the Brandon Davies thing was handled by BYU. They did exactly what you said they should.

    Maybe your perception is wrong...afterall Brandon Davies himself does not appear to have a big problem with it so why should you? My guess is he probably has a better concept of what really happened vs your warped perception via the media.

    Brandon Davies appears to be doing the right thing which makes him all the more impressive of a young man to me. He has nothing to be embarrassed about at this point.

  • Ragnar Danneskjold Bountiful, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 1:18 p.m.

    Re: junkmail

    I guess if you make the assumption that interest would grow at a similar rate in LDS athletes. I have always just assumed that BYU can get into the door of about 99% of the LDS homes. In my opinion, they won't receive much additional interest from LDS athletes because it is pretty much at maximum capacity. I would assume that interest from non LDS players would grow at a higher rate. It isn't a big deal, but under my assumption that non LDS interest would be growing, and LDS interest would be basically the same (automatically one of their top choices), that you would see the makeup of the team change unless the team feels that it is important to have a higher makeup of LDS players.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 1:11 p.m.

    @Big Daddy Utah

    If you really paid attention to the whole Brandon Davies situation and were not just looking to find fault with BYU you would know the way you suggest they should have handled it is EXACTLY the way they DID handle it. The AD's office simply announced that Brandon Davies was suspended from the team for violation of the school's honor code. That's it. They did not give any specific details on the nature of the violation nor the identity of the girlfriend, and they repeatedly declined to comment when asked by the media for further details, citing the privacy of all those involved. Of course the media was able to find out what happened by interviewing other people outside of the BYU administration and publicize it all over the country because of the intense interest surrounding BYU at the time, but it is not fair to fault BYU for that. No matter how BYU had chosen to handle it there was always going to be those, like yourself, who would criticize them so it was a no-win situation for them, but the majority of response to the way they handled it has been positive.

  • RepresentBlue West Jordan, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 1:00 p.m.


    I doubt there is any sort of quota as you suggest, although it is an LDS institution whose mission is primarily to provide secular and spiritual education for members of the LDS faith, and the athletics programs are designed to support that mission, as well as provide a missionary tool for the LDS church overall. Having said all that, I would expect there is some desire to recruit *mostly* LDS athletes, though certainly there has been and always will be a place for non-LDS athletes - many of whom actually end up joining the church as a result (see Ty Detmer, Curtis Brown, etc).

  • Johnny Triumph American Fork, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 12:29 p.m.

    Isn't it amazing that morals win out in the end? For all the nay-sayers in the Brandon Davies suspension it's one more example that the good guys will win. It might not be on the field or court, but good will win out.

  • junkmail Salt Lake City, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 11:52 a.m.


    Presumably, as the pool of interested non-LDS students increases with more exposure, so would the pool of interested LDS students. The pie will remain the same size, and the number of available ingredients are increasing at similar rates, there's no reason to expect that the makeup of the pie will change significantly.

    Obviously, BYU doesn't accept every non-LDS student athlete who wants to play here. No reason to expect that to change.

  • Vegas Las Vegas, NV
    Aug. 4, 2011 11:09 a.m.

    @Big Daddy

    Umm, that IS all that BYU said. They never went into details. It was other students in the know who disclosed the nature of the violation (possibly the girl herself).

  • dallas realist rockwall, texas
    Aug. 4, 2011 11:09 a.m.

    @ big daddy
    if you recall correctly then you know that ALL the school said was that brandon davies broke the honor code. that is all that was said by them. the media is who brought everything else out.

  • Big Daddy Utah SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 10:21 a.m.

    I have no problem with your honor code. It is your school and you can have all the rules you want. What I did not agree with was the way you paraded Brandon Davies personal life to then entire country. You could have simply said Brandon Davies broke the honor code and is no longer a student at BYU, case closed. If I was Brandon (and his girlfriend) I would run as far as I could from your institution.

  • Ragnar Danneskjold Bountiful, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 10:11 a.m.

    "I don't know that the amount of LDS to non-LDS kids we will sign will change significantly," Doman explained. "But the pool of non-LDS kids who are looking for a faith-based institution with high academics has increased significantly for us."

    Why wouldn't the number of LDS to non-LDS signings go up then? Does BYU want to stick to a member quota on the team or something? Are the non LDS kids not necessarily great athletes?
    Don't bring up Crowton in your response. I think what he did was down play the honor code; what this article is arguing, is that more non members want to attend BYU BECAUSE of the honor code and standards. So why won't those kids be more accepted?
    Honestly, this is in no way a knock on BYU. I am just curious as to why they wouldn't expect the makeup of the team to change with the change in the makeup of interested students?

  • Shooter_McGavin Las Vegas, NV
    Aug. 4, 2011 9:04 a.m.

    BYU -- The nice kid that your parents always wanted you to bring home, but you'd rather go out with the flashy sports guy (Ohio State or USC), or the unintelligent bad-boy (Utah).

  • Mountanman Hayden, ID
    Aug. 4, 2011 8:18 a.m.

    Wait a minute! Does this mean that not all college atheltes want to act like hoodlums, drunks and sex addicts? I guess there is hope for the human race after all! Isn't it great that there is still a school where higher standards are willingly accepted. embraced and appreciated?

  • Y Grad / Y Dad Richland, WA
    Aug. 4, 2011 8:06 a.m.

    Lest anyone mistake or distort our intentions, Coach Mendenhall is looking for individuals who are committed to conforming to high standards. The fact that there are non-LDS athletes that fit the mold is pleasant, but it is not a surprise. The fact that some are excellent athletes is just that much better.

    Athletes, LDS and otherwise, who are willing to conform will not only stay in school, but also be more likely to sacrifice self for team. As opposed to the self-centered sense of entitlement that so frequently accompanies the greatest of the athletic capabilities, team unity can be the equalizing factor. When your opponent is bigger, stronger, faster, individual and team disciple can still win the day.

    Especially when the margin of difference grows incrimentally smaller.

  • thebigsamoan Richmond, VA
    Aug. 4, 2011 6:28 a.m.

    BYU's unique environment and the exposure with it's partnership with ESPN will no doubt attract some non-member kids who share the same values. But, if they start out with a bang and become wildly successful, then who knows? Their recruiting possibilities just might be unlimited.

    The future is very bright for both Cougar and Ute football! Go Cougs! and please don't underestimate Coach W and the boys in red!

    Go Utes too! Kick some Pac 12 tails and show them what Utah football is like! And don't settle for just sniffing the Rose. Pluck the dang thing and bring it home. Imagine how sweet that'll be if you can still do it after a shellacking by those unathletic sunday school boys down south on 9/17, heh? LOL, j/k guys! I love the Utes too...I just love the Cougs a bit more!

  • thewholetruth West Jordan, UT
    Aug. 4, 2011 5:28 a.m.

    Don't overlook: The balance of this whole equation has to include the sudden appearance of some highly profiled "LDS" names being brandished on the national stage--escalating late last year til now--all coinciding with the sudden surge in recruits knocking on the Y's door. A considerable number of Americans have overcome prejudice and pride or at least are beginning to get over the 'Mormon' stumbling-block/issue.
    Names of especially current prominence, who've recently given further definition to the face of the LDS faith of course have to include Romney, Huntsman, Beck (Glenn, who has millions of enthusiastic, mostly non-LDS followers); add to this current mix the old trusted names of Dale Murphy, Steve Young, Trevor Matich, (gulp) Harry Reid, Orrin Hatch, and numerous others, all have to be having some influence in the thinking of non-LDS athletes and their parents...

  • UGradBYUfan Snowflake, AZ
    Aug. 3, 2011 10:45 p.m.

    It sounds like Coach Mendenhall has the right perspective, by staying with the current ratio of LDS vs non-LDS players. I think that could have been the undoing of Crowton. He may have tried to increase the number of non-LDS player too much. We can only hope that the non-LDS players quality does increase. Recruiting is really an inexact science to say the least. Physical tools don't always translate into superior play on the field. But, whether the quality of non-LDS players increases or not, if BYU holds onto their high standards for the students/athletes, things will go well for the University as a whole.

  • Captain L Provo, UT
    Aug. 3, 2011 10:13 p.m.

    CA reader: Yes they did.
    No one should doubt that BYU will handle any similar situation the right way. Doing the right thing will always be more important to BYU than winning or getting a recruit etc.

  • Laser Iowa City, IA
    Aug. 3, 2011 10:07 p.m.


    Who would have guessed that BYU could attract athletes from all faiths with great values to play for the Cougars? Oh, that's right, Bronco did.

  • TrueBlue Orem, UT
    Aug. 3, 2011 9:03 p.m.


    shhh, you're killing the theory that being a stellar athlete and having high morale values are incompatible

  • CA. reader Rocklin, CA
    Aug. 3, 2011 8:53 p.m.

    Gee, I guess BYU handled the whole thing correctly after all.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    Aug. 3, 2011 7:10 p.m.

    "We've been receiving phone calls from moms and dads saying they wanted us to recruit their son because they want him in that environment". The Davies Issue, both the way the school handled it and Davies high charactar shown in his continued commitment to BYU have increased interest in BYU from both LDS and Non-LDS athletes.
    Guess the Yners were about as wrong about this as anyone could have been.
    Honor, Integrity and Class. Gotta love BYU.

  • Coug Pleasant Grove, UT
    Aug. 3, 2011 7:02 p.m.

    Anyone remember the 1994 movie "Blue Chips"? Nick Nolte plays a college basketball coach who is under pressure to win. J.T. Walsh plays "Happy", a booster who is paying the players under the table. It's rated PG13, and stars Shaq, Anfernee Hardaway, even Bob Cousy makes an appearance.

    I don't understand lecherous boosters either. They sound like creepers. Unfulfilled high school athletes trying to smooze college kids in order to increase their self worth. Wanting their phone numbers, texting them, etc. It comes off as desperate and bizarre behavior.

    Do the athletes a favor by donating your money and cheering them on...from a distance.