Doug Robinson: There's a price to pay for playing in the big-time

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  • phgreek Hooper, UT
    July 1, 2011 7:01 a.m.

    I am happy for the U. Both BYU and Utah deserved to have a shot at the BCS, and both are positioning themselves to do that.

    However, it is simply insane to engage in an "Arms Race" for the sake of saying it. Apparently recruits care?

    WRONG! Most parents and recruits care that the facilities and trainers are competitive. They aren't idiots who are simply wowed by how much you me.

    Kyle has established enough of a winning tradition, that he'll get his kids. This notion of spending is simply an uniformed, immature approach to the unknown. I trust it will level off in the years to come when a cycle of recruits, and results are in, and Utah feels comfortable in its PAC 12 skin.

    Until then its like watching our congress do their typical..."I don't know, throw money at it". As was pointed'd you get to the dance in the first place?

  • Rockwell Baltimore, MD
    July 1, 2011 12:33 a.m.

    I Still Can't Say It

    #1 > #2

    Always has been and always will be.

    Someday, if it ever happens, the kids on the hill will understand why winning a BCS bowl is insignificant compared to winning the creme-de-la-creme of major college football -- a national championship.

  • bluemoon1977 Provo, Utah
    June 30, 2011 10:14 p.m.

    I think this will all work itself out. The Utes have very capable people managing athletics and will work their way into the PAC-12 quite nicely. This year presents an unbelievably good opportunity to make some noise in football.

    People do need to know, however, that some of that money will have to go toward making the other sports at least competitive in the new league. That will certainly mean building new venues, paying higher coaches' salaries, increasing recruiting budgets, etc.

    The lovely football stadium was government subsidized rather than paid for by private donors. That will need to change if the fan base increases and more people want to attend home games. It is one of the smallest stadiums in the league.

    But for right now, everything depends on winning all those league games at home this fall. Road wins will be very hard to come by. The Utes played the PAC 12 ten times in the last decade--6 games at home and 4 on the road. They won once on the road.

    But what a time to be a Ute. So much opportunity. Who could ask for more?

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 30, 2011 5:20 p.m.

    @i still can't say it

    And yet BYU has won the National Championship and utah has not. You can call it whatever you want to call it but the trophies are still there and history books still make note of it.

    I can tell you it is an elation you will never feel and it feels good.

  • I Still Can't Say It Holladay, UT
    June 30, 2011 4:41 p.m.

    Utah original BCS buster > BYU "faux" national champion 30 years ago

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 30, 2011 2:39 p.m.

    @i still can't say it

    "You get on the college football map when you win BCS bowls -- but not until then. BYU falls short"

    I am wondering where in the College Football Hall of Fame there is a display for utah's bcs bowl wins? I'll give you a hint, there isn't one. You can find one for BYU's Football National Championship however.

    You see there are 30 something bowl games played every single year and over 60 teams play in them. It is really no big deal, certainly not anything of note, to play in any of them or even win one of them other than one particular one. That one of note, the one that actually gets a place in the College Football Hall of Fame, is the one that results in a National Champion being declared.

    You are not on the college football map at all until you win a national Championship. utah falls short.

  • I Still Can't Say It Holladay, UT
    June 30, 2011 1:35 p.m.

    Doug Robinson, Dick Harmon, and to a somewhat lesser extent Brad Rock have been the flag bearers of all bitterness on the part of Cougar fans. The PAC wanted the courtesy call necessary.

    But wait, what's that I keep hearing, independence is "so much better" than the PAC. LOL. Great, enjoy independence and quit finding strange angles to criticize the Utes success and good fortune.

    You get on the college football map when you win BCS bowls -- but not until then. BYU falls short.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 30, 2011 10:16 a.m.

    One thing that has been lightly touched on here but not really examined is how much the rest of the university benefits financially from the football/athletic program. I would think there is some positive benefit, especially when a particular sport is doing well, but how much is it? Does having a top 25 ranked football team benefit the school enough that it justifies charging students higher fees and tuition to attend?

    I'm not just asking if football pays for itself, or even if the athletic department as a whole pays for itself, but does it actually benefit the school as a whole enough to charge its students more to attend the school? Are the students, whether they are actual sports fans or not, benefit enough from having an top athletic program to justify paying more to attend the school?

    That is the real question.

  • BP Salt Lake City, UT
    June 30, 2011 8:56 a.m.

    First of all, I don't fault Utah for jumping into the arms race (even though it seems as though they've been doing just fine against the PAC-10 without all that money).

    However, I do agree with Doug's basic point. When did college football become the tail that wags the dog? I'm sure its been a more gradual change than it seems. Don't get me football is what makes fall so worthwhile. It's just concerning to think that so much money intended for education is going towards football teams that aren't even financially viable. Though I love sports, I readily admit that our society will not remain viable if this trend continues at the collegiate level.

  • anti BCS Anaheim, CA
    June 30, 2011 6:58 a.m.

    That high-priced, shiney, new sports car is thrilling as you're driving it off the showroom floor, and the exorbitant monthly payments may not seem like a big deal, but when that car picks up a few dents and starts to sputter to 7-5 or 6-6 or even, gulp, losing season finishes with no bowl, those huge monthly payments may become a lot harder to swallow. How excited will Utah fans be to be paying filet mignon prices for chopped liver when the football program takes it inevitable dip into mediocrity?

    See Utah basketball 1998 --> 2010

  • tdlawton Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 30, 2011 5:56 a.m.

    Wow Doug this is really poor reporting... Talk about giving your readers a false impression.

    Talking about student activity fees (which have been in place for 25+ years, i.e. they are not new) w/o talking about student tickets is disingenuous.

    How much do Utah students pay for tickets to Football games, Basketball games, Gym meets, or any other sporting event? You should inform your readers that it is NOTHING... At least it is nothing out of pocket, the sizable block of tickets set aside for students are paid for by those "gouging activities fees."

    Now you can talk fairness, obviously the student going to 6 home football games, a dozen Basketball games, and 6 home Gym meets is getting a heck of a deal, divide 24 events by his/her fees paid and that is below market price... The student that doesn't care about sports and never goes is subsidizing the "tickets" of those that go, but it is not at all fair to portray students as getting nothing of value in return for their activities fee.

    Again this system has been in place at Utah for over 25 years, it is not new.

  • manaen Buena Park, CA
    June 30, 2011 2:23 a.m.

    "Does the average engineering student or theater arts major care about the football team?"
    They do now. As matter of fact, faced with tuition and fees increasing to cover the athletics' budget's shortfalls, they'll now be avid fans praying for undefeated seasons every year so that big bowl paychecks will spare them from steeper increases.

  • Ratman Salt Lake City, UT
    June 30, 2011 12:05 a.m.

    "Oops, nobody bothered to mention the price. It turns out that this Pac-12 move is like buying a car; when you go to close the deal, there are a lot of other fees nobody bothered to tell you about.

    Don't you wish somebody had mentioned this when everyone was kicking the Pac-12 tires last summer? Somehow, they left that part out, or forgot about it in all the excitement."

    Oh, c'mon, Doug! Didn't you bother to attend the news conference on June 17, 2010? Didn't you check your notes? FYI, Dr. Hill made it very clear at that news conference that PAC-12 membership would require a higher financial commiment from the Ute family. Your comments reflect lazy, sensationalist journalism.

  • I Still Can't Say It Holladay, UT
    June 30, 2011 12:00 a.m.

    The PAC asked Utah and not BYU. Sorry Mr. Robinson and other Cougar fans. It just happened that way. It's time to move on.....the sour grapes going over a year now, well, just aren't very becoming.

  • Ratman Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:28 p.m.

    To Doug and all the local so-called sports writers not named Dirk Facer:

    If you can't say anything positive about Utah's move to the PAC-12, please find some other way to make a living.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:55 p.m.

    Dutchman is correct. BYU does pay for its athletic facilities, and other facilities, through fundraising. But that is not the end of it. Once built facilities are then maintained by the facilities dept. at BYU and when they upgrade, fix, maintain, etc they are paid for by university funds. They don't go out and raise funds simply because they need to replace say 30' of fence at the baseball stadium or the carpet in the football offices. It's just standard building maintenence and university funds that pays for it. Not everything built and maintained is done through fundraising alone. Sure the really big projects are done mostly in that manner but there is plenty done without having an entire fundraising campaign to do it.

  • SportsFan Orem, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:29 p.m.


    Independent = we didn't want the MTN, but ESPN wanted us

    PAC 12 Dependent = ESPN still didn't want you

  • Kankles Miami, Florida
    June 29, 2011 9:48 p.m.

    @ CougFaninTX | 8:53 p.m. June 29, 2011
    Frisco, TX

    Independance = nobody wanted you.

  • jmort SLO, CA
    June 29, 2011 9:35 p.m.

    First, how much BYU spends on its facilities, etc. is absolutely relevant to the question I raised regarding whether Utah is having to spend because they want to step-up and be more competitive versus having to spend because they're joining the PAC-12. BYU and Utah are both trying to step-up their programs and I believe BYU has been spending more and will continue to spend as much as Utah.

    Second, it is humorous to read you Utahans bicker among yourselves about the relative quality of education at your second-tier "safety schools".

  • CougFaninTX Frisco, TX
    June 29, 2011 8:53 p.m.

    You know what's great about the increase in ticket prices? When the football players sell their complimentary tickets, they will now get more money. That's what the players do in the PAC10 with their tickets, isn't it?

  • Jonathan Eddy Payson, UT
    June 29, 2011 7:20 p.m.

    The BCS needs to get out of the unpaid student athlete sports business and become what they really are already; a professional NFL minor league sporting talent agency.

    Universities could partner with the BCS and be the local sponsor for this football minor league, for a profit share of course, and the BCS can finally stop getting rich off of the backs of starving student athletes.

    The BCS can rent university stadiums and pay for the upkeep. They can harvest the best athletes and sell them to the NFL and continue making their billions in revenue. Athletes can get paid a minor league salary and can even attend the university as a student if they choose.

    And best of all, universities can return to what they were intended to be; places of higher education.

  • Alpha Chicken Orem, UT
    June 29, 2011 4:38 p.m.

    Growing pains.

  • Abeille West Haven, Utah
    June 29, 2011 4:28 p.m.

    utesovertide -

    Wouldn't it be nice if Accounting worked that way? Actually, the amount divided between the members of the MWC varied, depending on the expenses of the team going to the bowl game. Let's pretend for a minute that half the $8M averaged by these teams were used as expenses - Football team travel, Band/Cheerleader travel, unsold tickets, meals, Hotel rental, etc. That would leave 4M to divide among the 9 teams in the MWC, or about 450,000 per school. That means that each MWC teams would receive a total of 1.8M over the period of 2005-2011 for these four games. Additional amounts were received by other MWC teams participating in other bowl games - though not as large a 'payday' as the BCS bowls. The information I provided above was that BYU reported 46.5 Million dollars in revenue from all Athletic-related events for the 2009-2010 season. Their expenditures were 42 Million, resulting in a net balance of 4.5 Million dollars for the 2009-2010 year. At most, only about 1/2 Million of the 4.5 Million could be from BCS funds received as a result of TCU's participation.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 4:22 p.m.

    Duckhunter wrote this comment on May 9, 2011. He is a huge BYU supporter and in other comments has stated that he owns a construction company and is an insider on how budgets work at BYU. Duckhunter wrote this:
    "the operations of the athletic department are funded by football and basketball revenues plus donor dollars. That is not how all of the FACILITIES are built and maintained.
    They do fund raise to help pay for facility construction but like all other facilities on campus they are built, upgraded, and maintained through university funds. They fund raise to help pay for facility construction for all of the buildings on campus but the church still pays the difference and that is how it is done.
    THE LDS CHURCH, which owns and sponsors BYU, pays for the facilities on campus. They insist on everything being top of the line and they pay to have it be top of the line. That includes ALL CAMPUS FACILITIES athletic or otherwise. yes they fund raise to help pay for them but that is all.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 3:52 p.m.

    Collin Card

    Did I say the Utes played in a BCS bowl last year? No.

    What I was alluding to is that when finances are reported, if there is excess income from the year or savings, it is added to the assets and carried over to the next year. So I was saying that $1 M from 2005 (Utah), $1 M from 2009 (Utah), $1 M from 2010 (TCU) and $1 M from 2011 (TCU), if never spent, would be $4 M in assets over expenses which could account for the 'cushion' in the budget that BYU is enjoying.

    Thanks though.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 3:42 p.m.


    "And many BYU students and their families who live in Utah pay local and state taxes that fund Utah sports. Just for the record."

    Again and again, but I guess it is my lot in life to beat this drum, None and I mean none of your state and local taxes go to support, operate, build facilities or maintain Utah sports. That is the record. So let it be written so let it be done. If the taxpayers of Utah actually supported the education programs at the U at the level the LDS Church supports that level at BYU it would free up a lot of private donations that are currently supporting the U into new facilities and upgrades that would rival anything BYU has.

  • SLC BYU Fan Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 3:28 p.m.


    LDS Church tithing funds DO NOT support athletics at BYU in any way shape or form. Edwards Stadium, The Marriott Center, Miller Park and the indoor practice facility were all built by raising private donations. While Utah was able to get some revenue from SLOC for Rice-Eccles Stadium, it was also a large donation from the Spencer Eccles Foundation that covered the costs. No state tax-payer funds were used. The biggest reason Utah and BYU are in the position they are in and Utah State has all their problems is substantially larger networks of donors where Utah State fans think the state should hand them taxpayer $$$ to rebuild Romney Stadium etc

  • Collin Card Provo, Utah
    June 29, 2011 3:20 p.m.


    The article was about last year's ath;etic budget ... soooo ... which BCS game did you all play in? I seem to recall a brutal slaying in Vegas.

  • Abeille West Haven, Utah
    June 29, 2011 3:15 p.m.

    Scoreboard -

    Dutchman's right. I, for one, received both my degrees from Weber State. The reason why had everything to do with location - I live in the Ogden area. Since I didn't want the 3-hour round-trip drive, I didn't even consider applying to BYU. I could have easily gone to BYU (I Graduated Summa Cum Laude and hold a valid temple recommend), but Weber State made more sense.

    My Father, One Brother, and One Sister all graduated from the 'Y', and I've been a supporter of BYU through the years. I really love BYU, but some fans need to refrain from posting insulting, degrading statements. Please think through your posts before you make them. Both my Weber State degrees have been valuable to me - just as valuable to me as the BYU degrees and Utah degrees are to the people I manage.

  • SLC BYU Fan Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 3:05 p.m.


    As for in-state schools that kill their students with fees, look no further than Utah State. BYU paying the $115 or $150 for a pass is an OPTION, at Utah State they MUST PAY FEES that subsidize an athletic department that lost over $1 million last year if they want to attend the school in Logan.

  • prunes Tooele, UT
    June 29, 2011 3:00 p.m.

    The whole matter seems to stem from a lack of prestige. When you live with garbage you smell like garbage! Those living among the roses take with them that personna. UU will be better able to hold its head up when engaged in nationally televised feats of derring do and athletic supremacy. There are those of us who will remain loyal to those schools in the WAC and Mountain West Conference just 'cause that's where we live and maintain our attitudes, values, and standards. The Utes have severed this fundamental loyalty which many of us have for these "little guy" teams. I will never enjoy the U as a representative of the little guy image which we mountain teams had, nor will I spend a penny to observe them in a bout with their salt water liberal peers.

  • TheHailstorm South Weber, UT
    June 29, 2011 2:39 p.m.

    @ Dukhummer
    " We are talking about funding the athletic department on the backs of students. BYU doesn't do that and neither should utah ".

    After calling the BYU athletic department ticket office the charge for a student section pass is either $ 115.00 for a mixed seat or 150.00 dollars for the same seat at each game.
    $ 150 per student x 33,000 (est.) students = 4,950,000$ from the 2010 season. This years ticket price will not come out until August when new charges are evaluated and levied.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 2:34 p.m.


    "The reason Utah has very many students is they all can't get into BYU. For this reason Utah competes with UVU, USU, Weber, SUU etc for the leftovers who can't qualify academically for BYU."

    Your comment is reasonable until you reach the part, "for the leftovers who can't qualify academically for BYU."

    That is very elitist don't you think and it continues to give BYU fans a bad rap for putting their noses in the air. The church teaches members to avoid class distinctions. I hope that you can acquire the ability to not look down on some. It may interest you to know that many college bound kids go to other schools because they want to or there is a program available to them at that school not because they can't qualify for entrance to BYU.

  • Scoreboard Draper, UT
    June 29, 2011 2:26 p.m.

    @ute sovertide
    "BYU has also had the benefit of sitting back and collecting over $1 M a year from revenues generated by Utah and TCU playing in BCS games."

    *yawn* and Utah had the benefit of sitting back and collecting twice from TCU's BCS bowl trips yet they still can't stay out of the red. The real problem lies with the loyalty of your fanbase. The majority of them aren't really Utah fans, they're self-declared BYU haters.

    BYU, thanks to it's loyal fanbase, is able to raise enough funds from donors, alumni, etc to field a larger and more robust athletic dept including significantly better facilities, fielding more revenue draining sports programs than Utah does and still manages to finish in the black.

    If Utah had more true fans, they'd be able to fundraise more and not have to break the backs of their impoverished students.

    "my kids not only pay student fees to support Utah athletics they also pay LDS church tithing funds that are used to build BYU's outstanding athletic facilities"

    And many BYU students and their families who live in Utah pay local and state taxes that fund Utah sports. Just for the record.

  • Scoreboard Draper, UT
    June 29, 2011 2:06 p.m.

    "And why shouldn't students pay for a program that attracts National attention and fundraising for all programs?"

    They do, it's called ticket prices. USC's football team has brought a lot of attention to the university recently, none of it good. Same with Auburn, Oregon, Tennessee and Ohio State.

    If you're justifying the shakedown of poor students to fund bigger coaches salaries, etc for all the good attention they draw to the school, then when the attention is really bad (see USC, Oregon, Auburn, Tennessee, Ohio St, etc) and harms the school, will the Athletic Depts and coaches then refund that money back? Seems like it should be a two way street.

  • Scoreboard Draper, UT
    June 29, 2011 1:55 p.m.

    "So you're going to look at a $32 million athletic department budget and tell me, "These days, big universities have become football corporations with a school attached, not vice versa." What a load of garbage."

    Doug Robinson wasn't referring to the Pukes when he said "Big Universities." he was referring to traditional college football powers.

    Hope that clears things up for you.

    @blowhard S
    "If students object to the fees at Utah, let them attend BYU."

    The reason Utah has very many students is they all can't get into BYU. For this reason Utah competes with UVU, USU, Weber, SUU etc for the leftovers who can't qualify academically for BYU. It kinda all rolls downhill. If BYU was willing to take them all in then Utah would be a community college like SLCC.

    "I wounder what schools are losing money, AQ or non-AQ schools?"

    It's mostly state institutions who are strapped financially. Recently Cal-Berkely announced a (iirc) $12 million shortfall in their athletic dept budget and were considering cutbacks in programs. Oregon state was also in similar financial dire straights. They can't keep up with private schools like USC, Stanford, etc.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 1:51 p.m.

    The operation of the Athletic programs at BYU are operated in the black and without tithing funds. That is not the issue. The facilities (brick and mortar) and the maintenance of those facilities is another issue and they do get tithing money. BYU can justify this use of tithing funds because the facilities are on campus and most likely used by the general student body and club teams. No problem with that. But it is a bit disingenuous for some to comment that students at the U should not contribute to athletic facilities at the U while the LDS students who do not attend BYU have some of their tithing funds used to build real nice facilities at BYU.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 1:18 p.m.

    @Collin Card

    "BYU (unlike the U) was running it's athletic program in the black."

    The way I see it, that is easy for BYU to do, and not just because of Church affiliation. BYU has also had the benefit of sitting back and collecting over $1 M a year from revenues generated by Utah and TCU playing in BCS games.

    Utah and TCU, on the other hand, as participants in those games, only broke even on the costs from attending those games, because of how the money is distributed among the MWC and non-BCS schools.

    What was the figure? $4 M or so in the black? Maybe they've just saved the million or so they collected those years from each of Utah's and TCU's 2 BCS games.

    As others have pointed out, Utah and BYU are structurally and financially different and are really apples and oranges.

  • estreetshuffle Window Rock, AZ
    June 29, 2011 1:13 p.m.

    "Oops, nobody bothered to mention the price. It turns out that this Pac-12 move is like buying a car; when you go to close the deal, there are a lot of other fees nobody bothered to tell you about."

    Well theres carmax to trade in the old red station wagon.

  • Collin Card Provo, Utah
    June 29, 2011 12:59 p.m.

    According to an article ran is the Desnews about 4 or so months back, BYU (unlike the U) was running it's athletic program in the black. Football being the biggest revenue maker. In other words, they were bringing in enough funds to run the athletic department. So why is are U making unsubstantiated claims that it is run via tithing?

    As for athletic facilities, if they are facilities that the student body will benefit from, then I don't see a problem with the students helping to fund them. If they are, for example, facilities (such as a athlete-only weight room or locker room) then the students shouldn't be tapped for that. That's my opinion.

  • MiP Iowa City, IA
    June 29, 2011 12:54 p.m.

    The financial side remains my least favorite aspect of the sport. But when it comes to student pocketbooks, I feel a need to post.

    I think Duckhuner is right on this one.

    If rising costs are indeed necessary, they should be paid for by the fans, not the students per se. Even at 6 bucks, raising student fees should be looked at with suspicion.

    But the Ute football team needs to stay within budget and not raise the ceiling. Honestly, is now the time to live beyond your means? I agree that decent facilities are needed to fund the team, but excesses as we see at big budget schools don't always yield high results.

    Finally, I think that student tix should remain as affordable as possible for the students. Attending sporting events are an excellent part of the college experience and having a mass of students at the game is quintessential. Go MUSS!

  • Abeille West Haven, Utah
    June 29, 2011 12:43 p.m.

    Actually, some money that comes from the tithes of LDS adherents most certainly does go to BYU. Where that money is used is undisclosed. If I were to guess (and this is only a guess), the majority of the funds do not go to finance Athletics. It probably goes more toward facilities, employees, etc. According to BYU, they brought in enough funds through their sporting programs to offset all the costs - with some to spare.

  • bigsoccer Syracuse, UT
    June 29, 2011 12:32 p.m.

    Tithing doesn't pay for BYU.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 12:20 p.m.

    My kids have all attended the U and paid the extra student fees in addition to tuition. They are also active LDS members who pay tithing. Duckhunter has pointed out on several occasions how BYU athletic facilities are funded not only with private donations but also with university funds that come from tithing donations. So, as I understand it, my kids not only pay student fees to support Utah athletics they also pay LDS church tithing funds that are used to build BYU's outstanding athletic facilities. I don't believe any of my kids have a problem with that but it should be on the record in this discussion.

  • 10CC Bountiful, UT
    June 29, 2011 12:07 p.m.

    When I went to the U I never used the Marriot Library. I now realize part of my student fees and tuition went to pay for the library (which I didn't use).

    I want my money back. Whaaaaa. Whaaaaaa.

  • JTB Tracy, CA
    June 29, 2011 12:02 p.m.

    Is it worse charge students to pay for athletics, or to use tithing money to pay for athletics...

  • hymn to the silent Holladay, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:54 a.m.

    Duckhunter: We do pay for it. Many of us pay more than our seasons tickets worth. Fundraising for U athletics is going very well, thank you. And why shouldn't students pay for a program that attracts National attention and fundraising for all programs? Naive to think that every department at a University works in a vacuum. They complement each other creating a package--- Students fees support all University endeavors, (albeit only 8%, which has been mentioned) Never set foot in the engineering building myself, but happy to see my fees support the great students coming out of there. And by the way, it's not compulsory to go to the University of Utah...for purely an academic experience Westminster is a great option and much more in line with what many detractors here are calling for. What they don't understand is that an academic experience that personalized and student-centric costs more in tuition. Can't have it both ways. Most U students are actually fine paying an extra six bucks to be in the pac 12. The benefits far outweigh the costs.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:43 a.m.

    Johnny Triumph and DN Subscriber,

    Not to worry. None of your tax dollars goes to support Utah athletics, in fact your tax dollars contribute very little to an education at the U. The only reason the Legislature puts any education money into the U at all is because they want to be able to say that the state has a flag ship university. Have you ever noticed how often the politicians like saying that?

  • Skippy West Jordan, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:37 a.m.

    It would have been nice if Doug had listed the new ticket prices and compare them to the old ones. I know there are all kinds of arguments coming from this story but what makes me mad is the increase in the gymnasticts season ticket prices. The utes have been competing against the pac 10 in gymnastics forever, but now we are in the pac 12 we will be paying more to see the same schools. I know that most people don't care about gymnastics, but they do hold the attendence record for gymnastics and the place is packed almost every meet. It's kind of like the Ute gymnastics fans are being punished for this one.
    As for the other sports, I am okay with spending more to watch them play.

  • Bear Somewhere, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:25 a.m.

    Here is a thought on athletics. Why are schools involved in athletics? They are supposed to be educating people. All athletics should be run like AAU programs, if you want to be involved then you pay your fee and play let the high schools and colleges worry about education.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 29, 2011 11:07 a.m.

    Any comparison some of the ute fans on here want to try and make with BYU are completely inconsequential. BYU is a private university, it is funded by a private entity and how it uses its funds are its business alone.

    Utah is a public university funded by tax payers. I have no problem with that. As a resident of utah and tax payer I want to see the flagship university of our state being a top quality university with top quality programs in all areas including athletics. I don't mind my tax dollars contributing to those things.

    But in the area of athletics I do not think they should put any of the burden on the backs of students. I also do not think students should get radically discounted access to athletic events. They should have to pay for them if they want to have them. But that is vonluntary, not involuntarily added to the cost of tuition, fess, etc.

    Utah fans need to pay these costs. You claim you are top line fans so prove it. If you trust chris hill and he says they need it then step up and pay it yourselves.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:51 a.m.

    Johnny Triumph and DN Subscriber:

    The Legislature and the Tax Payer do not fund University athletics, ever. Tax dollars go to the education of students only. They do not fund any of the buildings used by the athletic department.

    And while we're on the subject of the legislature, if you look at the U's recent budget report, the U's annual budget is approximately $2.5 Billion in annual expenditure. The legislature funds about $400 Million of that, putting the Legislature's (taxpayer's) contribution to education at the U at about 8%.

    So you have nothing to worry about. You as a taxpayer barely fund education at the university at all. By those numbers it is almost entirely privately funded. In fact, the U's biggest revenue generator, at about $1B annually is the University's very successful health network.

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:50 a.m.

    @hymn to the silent

    We aren't discussing education. I have no problem with the state subsidizing Utah students education. My tax dollars go to that subsidizing and I'm ok with that. We are talking about funding the athletic department on the backs of students. BYU doesn't do that and neither should utah. If you want to have a personal issue with me I'm fine with that. But you should actually address the subject and not try to bring in some outside issue that has nothing to do with it just so you can argue with me. How ridiculous that was. Maybe you should know your place. LOL!

  • Tommy2Shoes Lehi, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:28 a.m.

    Instead of comparing U student fees and costs to BYU you should be comparing them to those in your new league. What does a ticket to a USC or Oregon home game cost? What do these students pay in fees? What do their coaches make? How much revenue to they take in from tickets, donations, etc.? Your new reality is not BYU (you have left us in the rear view mirror per many of your fans). It is now time to pay the piper or fall to the cellar. What's it going to be? Rise to the top or become a Washington State? Can't wait to watch how the Utes succeed in their new conference. Since I'm a Cougar fan and graduate I don't have to pay to watch, but I don't have to be negative either. Good luck Utes and make your former rivals proud. Your successes will only make our matches against the former heated foe that much sweeter.

  • Collin Card Provo, Utah
    June 29, 2011 10:26 a.m.

    What about the assertion that the Ute athletic budget is from its revenues and private donations. Ute posters keep stating that. Why hit up the poor students?!

  • Johnny Triumph American Fork, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:17 a.m.

    I work for a company that overstaffed based on perceived future demand. That demand never arrived. We burned too much VC money and had to go and get more, thus diluting our overall value. We had to lay off people to reduce costs. It hasn't been pretty, and it seems the Utes are headed down the same path. Utes should continue to grow within existing revenues and expect success to build over the long-term. Keeping up with the Joneses is NOT the way to grow and will only lead to trouble. Kudos to Washington State for accepting mediocrity but for not abusing public $$. Utes would do very well to follow that example, hopefully the Utah State Legislature will demand cuts to sports programs when the next budget shortfalls to fund the University arrive.

  • DN Subscriber Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:16 a.m.

    @ KamUte 10:26

    "Got my tix. Too many naysayers. If you don't like it, don't watch."

    I am happy not to wathc, but as a taxpayer I don't want a dime of my money going to fund football (or soccer, basketball, gymnastics, water polo, etc) other than intramural level which allows all students to participate.

    There is something obscene about full ride scholarships for athletes and coaches pulling down salaries higher than our top Generals for their involvement in sports.

    Nothing wrong with doing it if every dollar freely comes from fans willing to pay out money for it, but it is a huge waste of tax dollars if any is being forcibly confiscated from taxpayers.

  • pocyUte Pocatello, ID
    June 29, 2011 10:14 a.m.

    Nice work, Crimson. Looks like Robinson should have done a bit more homework. Good things are happening on the hill, and they are spreading to little old Pocatello

    Go Utes

  • bigsoccer Syracuse, UT
    June 29, 2011 10:06 a.m.

    Its funny how I haven't read one comment bashing on Utah, but there are some ute fans trying to bash on BYU on this board its kind of funny.

  • gizmo33 St. George, Utah
    June 29, 2011 10:05 a.m.

    well uh I'll tell ya what well uh yeah uh well anyway you look at it uh its kinda well ya know. some do -n- some dont ..

  • Abeille West Haven, Utah
    June 29, 2011 9:57 a.m.

    Oops - my mistake. BYU brought in 46.5 Million, not 48.5 Million, for the 2009-2010 academic year.

    Do I have to give back my Accounting degree now?

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:56 a.m.


    Your comment is pretty funny coming from someone in Iowa where last season Utah beat Iowa State on your home turf, what was it, something like 68-14? I remember a quote from the Iowa St head coach in one of your local papers saying Utah looked like an NFL team. Of course the QB Utah had then was the same one that is back this year. Good luck in your big tough Big 12-2 conference.

    Brigham Young led the pioneers out of Nauvoo and into Iowa for a winter stay. Maybe if Brigham had pointed out the true price of going all the way to the Salt Lake Valley they would have just decided to stay there in Iowa. But no, they moved on to the Salt Lake Valley where Brigham founded the University of Deseret (now Utah) in 1850. So, the price was paid and now the University he founded is reaping some of the benefit by associating with other great universities in the west.

  • DrUte Woods Cross, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:56 a.m.

    This opinion piece needs more homework. The U tuition rate is one of the best around, and certainly one of the best in the PAC12. A fast, soft comparison:
    (All undergrad rates & assume 2 semesters = 1 year & 12+ units = full time).
    1. U of U: $3381 res, $10694 Nonres per semester.
    2. BYU: $2210 LDS, $4420 non-LDS per semester.
    3. UCLA: $13500 per year res, $28600 per year nonres.
    4. AZ State: $4860 per semester res, $11160 per semester nonres.

    And U tuition may be halved if a member of the immediate family is a state employee ( U of U, U Hospital, etc.), or use your GI Bill, or join ROTC or the Utah National Guard, etc. 'Where there's a will there's a way'.

    So clearly UofU tuition is one of the best deals in the West, and especially if you combine an Associate's Degree at SLCC with two years at the U.

    As an adjunct faculty member, I know the U is a fantastic life-changing personal investment.

    --- Got my tix, looking forward to FB & BB & PAC12, ugottaluvit baby!!!

  • Abeille West Haven, Utah
    June 29, 2011 9:55 a.m.

    JMort -

    BYU released a news article stating sporting events brought in 48.5 Million dollars in the 2009-2010 academic year and 42 Million dollars were spent on those sporting events, leaving a net increase of 4.5 Million.

    This was released by BYU while discussing the state of their sporting programs with WCC Presidents.

    J-TX is also right: generally, BYU does not have to, and generally does not, release financial information to the public. This was a rather unusual case and gives us a glimpse into the health of sports at BYU.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:46 a.m.

    universities are "pursing a growing, full-scale football business."

    A business that millions of college students and graduates from all walks of life enjoy participating in and following, and one which provides writers like Doug a job so they can write about it in news columns each week.

    And so what if football, or athletics in general, has become a business? What has happened to America's drive for business, entrepreneurship, leadership, and management? Did Doug even think about how many students, graduates, or general American citizens are employed or have jobs because there are football teams that play each other every week during the fall?

    This "business" includes employees from janitors to announcers, from concessions workers to marketing managers, from 3rd party contractors to TV networks, from team managers to head coaches.

    All while giving hundreds of students each year at each school an education that is paid for.

    Its not perfect, and there are things about the "business" we would all change. But at least football and the people involved with it have figured out how to create jobs.

  • regis Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:44 a.m.

    I'm a Ute fan. I support the move to the PAC 12. But forcing students to make huge donations in the form of student fees is wrong. Very wrong.

    Tuition has skyrocketed in the past couple of decades. And textbooks are way out of line (some professors force students to pay $150 for the book the professor wrote - tell me that's not a conflict). Students don't need any additional burdens.

    But if U students were paying $1,000 each in fees that go towards athletics, that would equal roughly $25,000,000 per year in revenue just from student fees. So I seriously doubt they're paying that much.

  • CrimsonUte Pocatello, ID
    June 29, 2011 9:39 a.m.

    Again, let's check some facts before crying about the increase in student fees. Mr. Robinson says, "Some students pay as much as $1,000 a year to cover athletics." Not at Utah.

    A check of the student fees on the university's website shows that for the Summer 2011 through Spring 2012 semesters, the per-student athletic fee is $82.36. I called the Income Accounting office to ask what the fee was before the increase, and they told me it was $76.22. So the huge, burdensome increase was less than six bucks.

    Again, this article is sensationalist journalism. The University of Utah (and most other universities) is first and foremost a place of learning and education. Certainly there's a little room for some athletic competition and entertainment as well.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:36 a.m.

    Waiting till the money comes in to make improvements, or bonding against future revenues, when there are plenty of people and alumni around who can help us build a better program and university sounds like a bid for failure and I'm glad the U isn't following your plan.

    If we don't improve everything we can in rapid fashion to compete, it would be writers like Doug that would come out and say "I told you so, you can't compete, you're mediocre, etc."

    "a $16 million football facility that's good enough to house an NFL team." I like how he rags on spending $16 million on a facility that has been needed for over a decade. How much did BYU spend on their indoor training facility that can house a 747? Probably a lot more than $16 Mil, but I'm sure he praised that expenditure.

    "the Utes have been doing just fine with their current budget." True, but I've never heard a U coach or official say their goal is to do "just fine" in the Pac 12.

  • 3grandslams N. Liberty, IA
    June 29, 2011 9:29 a.m.

    Losing seasons are really going to hurt ticket revenue. Right now football and basketball are lined up to get serious beatings, basketball especially. The football team has no qb that has played the new system and freshman running backs who have never played D-1. They could do fine in the MWC but the PAC will suffocate them. In fact the only team that has a chance of a winning record next year is the girls gymnastics team. The basketball team...well, they still feel like they got everyone.

    You get what you ask for. Whitt will be out of a job in less than three years, cruel u fans will claim they need a high profile coach (Urban you still broadcasting?) And Norm Chow will be retired. In fact he only took the Utah job to save face getting out of UCLA before he was fired.

  • utesovertide Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:22 a.m.

    I am a student at the U, so I'll put some perspective on this.

    Yes, actually, a major portion of the student body cares about the athletic teams. This is different from years ago I am sure, but this is a new generation where engineers and computer scientists also like sports.

    I pay for the "student athletic fee", the crimson club donation, and a season football ticket in the chair sections. Yes, it would be nice if the student athletic fee counted toward it, but I understand that it can be used elsewhere, so I use it for bball, volleyball, and other events to get my money's worth from it.

    I knew last year as soon as the Pac 12 announcement came out that more funding needs, including higher ticket prices, would be coming. But thanks for telling us that a year after we all knew, Doug.

    I've studied economics, and I know that when you have one of the largest student sections in D1 football, with 7000 Muss season ticket holders, and over 32,000 paid season ticket holders, and only 45,000 seats, supply and demand curves show the price must go up.

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:16 a.m.

    Already applications from new students particularly amoung freshman are way up at the U because there is a sense that graduating from a University that runs with an elite academic crowd like the PAC 12 schools has its benefits. It won't be long (I would guess about six years) before Utah is a member of the elite class of AAU. If students feel those associations have benefits and it comes from being in the PAC 12 then let the students vote on whether to raise their fees for joining the PAC 12 and let them debate the value of it. There is a price to pay for any endeavor. You can advance or stay put.

  • Sixpack Roy, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:14 a.m.

    This is a silly article and additional silly arguements!

    Sure let the ticket holders bear all of the cost, fine. Lets price those student tickets at their true value. Because of the student athletic fees (~$170/year) students can attend any athletic event fee of additional charge and can get preferred seating in football for an extra $30. They can also get a buddy pass for another $170. So a student can get two tickets in E37 for roughly ~$370/year. Season ticket holder are paying anywhere from $1500 to $1020 for equivalent seating elsewhere in the stadium. The value of those student seats range from $750 to $210 each/year.

    Any student interested in paying the true value?

  • J-TX Allen, TX
    June 29, 2011 9:09 a.m.


    No, BYU is a private university, and does not have to tell anyone what it pays for stuff. Nothing wrong with that.

    The U is a state-run facility and as such reaps both the benefits and detriments of being such.

    I get tired of people comparing the U and BYU. Apples and oranges, in many, many ways.

  • Utah'95 FPO, AE
    June 29, 2011 9:07 a.m.

    Mt Rushmore says:

    " that Utah won't have to share the PAC 12 cellar with Washington State."

    The ol' "Utah will be just like Washington State" is one of my favorite "insults" from those who wish ill for the Utes - because it's so pathetic!

    So we are to believe that Utah, three-time conference champion, and top 3 of the conference 6 of the last 8 seasons, will be the 11th or 12th best team in the Pac-12?

    ute alumni says:

    "pac 10 plus 2 ain't all that great, usc on probabation and can't play in a bowl for the next few years. oregon is okay. the washington and arizona teams are average at best."

    "Oregon is okay?" They just played for the national championship! EVERYONE in the national press says they should be a top 10 finisher again.

    When people talk about USC being down, that's compared to the USC we're used to seeing. Experts go on record claiming that the Trojans have a chance to win every game they play, and may be the favorites to win the South.

    Sagarin says the "average" 3 teams you listed all finished the season ranked in the Top 30.

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:03 a.m.

    The article is about reality, not dumping. Like it or not, this is the way it is. The rest of the PAC teams have been getting 15-20 million per year for quite awhile. CO has been getting BCS $$ also. Alum donates 2-3 times that much or more to schools like Stanford, USC, UCLA(even in bad years) and some other PAC schools. Utah has got to put a lot of $$ into their football program and other sports athletic facilities in order to compete for better recruits. Then, if the football team sells out all their games for a couple of years they will probably want to expand their stadium for a hundred million or so to bring it up to PAC standards. This year, Utah is probably worse off financially than they were in the MWC. It will get better each year and when they have their full share of the PAC pie, they will be in a great position to compete facility wise. They may have good athletic success before then and I hope they do, but this their reality for now.

  • hohum Saint George, UT
    June 29, 2011 9:01 a.m.

    TJ; Good point, at the time of registration each student should be given the opportunity to contribute to the athletic department by buying their $1,000 ticket. This ticket would get them entrance into the sports events. The student could use their ticket or sell it, that way, all who want to support the program will and there is no need to charge those who don't. The others could buy their tickets on a event by event and game by game.

    This would really show what the support is.

    As to the Y, I give my money with the knowledge it is going to be used wisely and the best way. Before any comments about tithes etc., I give my money VOLUNTARILY, not have it taken without my permission.

  • jmort SLO, CA
    June 29, 2011 8:58 a.m.

    Does anybody know how much BYU has paid/is paying for their facilities (and how much they are pumping into their football program)? It would be nice to have that number to sort out how much of the Utah increase is attributable to joining th PAC-12 and how much is attributable to raising bar bar (and trying to be a contender all the time rather than part of the time).

  • hymn to the silent Holladay, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:55 a.m.

    Duckhunter: The LDS Church subsidizes BYU to the tune of nearly two-thirds the cost. That means all those folks paying tithing who will never attend BYU are paying for somebody else's education. Fine by me; but seriously, don't tell us to prove that we are legit by paying our way to a better league and academic standard when you are living like a trust fund baby. Your education at BYU would be 5 or 6 times as much money if the Church weren't subsidizing it. (Again, use my tithing to get an education, I'm good with that...we all should be. And we should all be happy that our tax dollars are used to educate the next generation who will become our caretakers). But please, know your place.

  • Civil Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:54 a.m.

    Excellent article. It is all about "keeping up with the Jones.'" As bad as the fact that student fees increase is the fact the budget went up 2000% and not a dime will go into athletes' pockets. This at a time when according to a PBS special, scholarships fall $3000 short of paying for a student athlete's EDUCATIONAL expenses. But of course, "we need a $16 million building" and coach Whitt's salary, a FRACTION of which could put that extra $3,000 in football player's pockets. In fact, I'll bet Whitt gets a salary increase within the next three years that would cover that $3,000 per player.

    No one distrusts unions more than I, including the NBA, NFL, MLB, etc., unions, but it is time for an NCAA athletes' union.

  • Rational Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:41 a.m.

    skywalker | 11:39 p.m. June 28, 2011
    Palo Alto, CA
    Is there a reason a program that's going to be rolling in the dough needs to gouge poor working students?
    Yes, but it isn't a good one: Because "everybody does it."

  • TJ Eagle Mountain, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:32 a.m.

    ??? What jealous posts. Did you actually read them. I see a lot of complaining and a lot of support but no jealousy. If your trying to bring BYU into this, they already have excellent facilities that rival the best PAC schools, and then some.

    Utah will have to upgrade their facilities in a major way to compete with the facilities the top PAC schools have. That won't guarantee success but Utah has proven teams that don't have big athletic budgets can beat those who do somtimes.
    Utah will nearly always get the top recruits that want to come to Utah, the rest they will have to fight for. That is why they need facilities that will blow away the recruits. Ticket prices will be pushed as much as possible and should get them an extra couple of million per year if the stadium sells out. Requiring students to pay fees they don't agree with is extremely controversial. That should be a voluntary fee for students who want to attend the events.
    Having said that, Utah will be in a great financial position and within 3-5 years, they should be where they want to be. Good luck to them.

  • Vegas Las Vegas, NV
    June 29, 2011 8:29 a.m.

    Now the University of Utah has followed the rest of the state with the moniker "keeping up with the Joneses".

    How dare we stay within a budget while we watch all of our neighbors have fancy weightrooms, new uniform designs, and fancy lockers! Not fair! Not fair! Not fair!

  • Duckhunter Highland, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:26 a.m.

    I agree with uteology. Raise ticket prices and let the fans pay for the increased costs. Students should not have to pay for it through increased fees or tuition. This should be true at every single school. I know that it isn't, but it should be.

    I would willingly pay more, and have, when BYU has deemed it is needed. I certainly understand that utah now needs to increase spending to be competitive in their new conference but charging students, who have nothing to do with it, is not the way to go.

    utah fans have the opportunity to show that they are a legitimate fanbase. They tell us here all the time that they are legit, that they are growing, that they are not fair weather. Well prove it. Pay for what you are getting.

  • SoCalUtahFan Utesville, CA
    June 29, 2011 8:18 a.m.

    @PAC-12 Envy

    ...Independence is way better.And cheaper too...

    Who do you think fund BYU sport programs?

  • Dutchman Murray, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:11 a.m.

    Doug, thanks for dumping on the U. It was very enlightening. This news hasn't been covered at all in the last twelve months. I am shocked, shocked at this news. Utah is a pioneering state with a "can do" attitude but maybe it would have been better if the pioneers had stayed in Nauvoo instead of venturing out west. Let's cancel the celebration on Friday and head back to the Mountain West Conference. Get Craig Thompson on the phone and see if he will let the U return.

  • Whoa Nellie American Fork, UT
    June 29, 2011 8:08 a.m.

    Since football at most schools is self-supporting, and supports most other athletic programs, why is there a need to raise fees to fund increased football needs as this article indicates? Why not let the football program use the revenues it generates to fund the increase in associated costs for the new conference alignment and let the other non-revenue generating sports sink or swim? Oh, I just realized it probably has something to do with Title IX. It's really a political issue after all.

    It's really not fair that the ski team or women's tennis should lose funding because there are more people who would rather see football. Not fair at all so let's gouge all the students and falsely blame it on the football program because of the increase in costs to be competitive with the rest of the conference.

  • govt rocks Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 7:59 a.m.

    Blame it on the officials: The research done at the University levels are a huge contributor to our national and international economy. They provide a highly skilled and productive work force. These are grant programs that pay for themselves, that is why they are there and why they should stay. These grants are also not solely funded by taxpayers. There are tons of privately funded grants out there provided by lots of companies, not just for education or research, but a lot of other activities as well.

  • PAC-12 Envy Taylorsville, UT
    June 29, 2011 7:27 a.m.


    Independence is way better.

    And cheaper too.

  • Howard S. Taylorsville, UT
    June 29, 2011 7:20 a.m.

    If students object to the fees at Utah, let them attend BYU.

  • BlameItOnTheOfficials Cottonwood Heights, UT
    June 29, 2011 6:34 a.m.

    Notice how the talk turned from how the university would be raising ticket prices and tuition to how government grants should be and were being used to fund department budgets? It's not just the students and fans paying for all this. It's every taxpayer paying for every grant at every university.

    We all love our college athletic programs but they are just part of whats wrong with big government. And big government is whats wrong with America these days. Something has to change.

  • Liberal Ted Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 6:30 a.m.

    A big problem with the cost, is that the more attended and popular sports like football, are forced to give money to sports that only the athletes and their families go to. Especially with womens sports. The fan draw isn't there, their ticket sales suffer, so football is forced to subsidize the other athletes.

    Instead of making college sports a mini-socialists state. Let them compete. Let these other sports become creative in getting fans. Football didn't start with 100,000 screaming fans. It's something they have built up year after year. The Utah football team used to play on a field with wood bleachers. Now they have a stadium and a band. They didn't always have that.

    Get political correctness out of sports. Save it for the classroom, where some professors work hard to indoctrinate students to follow the annointed one.

  • T.S.Zarathrustra Salt Lake City, UT
    June 29, 2011 5:49 a.m.

    Oh my, my, my. All these fits of jealousy. It is almost enough to make one wish we were going independant.

  • owlmaster2 Kaysville, UT
    June 29, 2011 12:48 a.m.

    I've paid for my tickets... happily so.

    You get what you pay for and we get caffeine in or diet coke.

  • Uteology Fort Worth, Texas
    June 29, 2011 12:47 a.m.

    Raising ticket prices is supply and demand.

    Raising student fees is garbage.

    I wounder what schools are losing money, AQ or non-AQ schools? If it's mostly non-AQ schools then why doesn't the governing body, NCAA, create a revenue generating scheme like a playoff system?

  • JoCo Ute Grants Pass, OR
    June 29, 2011 12:16 a.m.

    RE Crimson Ute - GREAT point we are the farm leagues for corporate America. In most industrialized nations corporations pay taxes that are specifically designated to pay for the cost of the trained employees they currently receive for free. Charge the students for an education that produces engineers, biologists, chemists, nurses etc. for big business. Corporate Socialism.

    Here's another one word reason = Alums. I just joined the Crimson club for the first time in 12 years.

    Re ERDoc: It makes no sense to increase the burden of the athletics budget on the backs of students. Huh? How much does your ER room pay for the training of the doctors and nurses. I'm betting it's about $0.00.

  • El Chango Supremo Rexburg, ID
    June 29, 2011 12:00 a.m.

    The only way the students should be paying for the athletic program is through ticket and merchandise sales.

  • ERDoc Park City, UT
    June 28, 2011 11:54 p.m.

    Re: Crimson Ute
    As a university faculty member who has been at least partially responsible for bringing in over $500K in research funding in the past year, that's exactly the point: we've brought in the money. If I want to spend more on research, I write grants and, once the money arrives, I work within that budget. I don't increase my lab size and ask the students to pay for that increase. While I'm happy for the university's successful transition to the Pac-12 and the increased visibility this brings to our academic programs, it makes no sense to increase the burden of the athletics budget on the backs of the students.

  • skywalker Palo Alto, CA
    June 28, 2011 11:39 p.m.

    Is there a reason a program that's going to be rolling in the dough needs to gouge poor working students?

  • CrimsonUte Pocatello, ID
    June 28, 2011 10:34 p.m.

    This article is disingenuous. The University of Utah received over $450 million in research and training awards in 2009-2010. Their net revenue in 2007 (last year for which I could easily find data) was over $2.3 billion.

    So you're going to look at a $32 million athletic department budget and tell me, "These days, big universities have become football corporations with a school attached, not vice versa." What a load of garbage.

  • KamUte South Jordan, UT
    June 28, 2011 10:26 p.m.

    Got my tix. Too many naysayers. If you don't like it, don't watch.

  • sammyg Springville, UT
    June 28, 2011 10:24 p.m.

    And every one thought that the advertisers and the media people were paying for this huge PAC 10.2 windfall.


  • WHAT NOW? Saint George, UT
    June 28, 2011 10:15 p.m.

    And this is news?

  • ute alumni Tengoku, UT
    June 28, 2011 10:13 p.m.

    pac 10 plus 2 ain't all that great, usc on probabation and can't play in a bowl for the next few years. oregon is okay. the washington and arizona teams are average at best.

  • Basement Dweller Prather, CA
    June 28, 2011 10:02 p.m.

    Looks like I'm stuck here in the basement for a few more years.

  • GetRidoftheCorruptBCS MENLO PARK, CA
    June 28, 2011 9:38 p.m.

    I keep seeing people quote the $20 million per year number quoted for the PAC 12 TV contract, but the Cal AD has publicly discussed that the early years of this contract will only bring $9-10 million to the fully vested league teams. This looks like a mighty big hole for the Utes if they are in an arms race against programs that already spend substantially more each year.

  • Mt Rushmore Arlington, VA
    June 28, 2011 9:32 p.m.

    "Does the average engineering student or theater arts major care about the football team? Does the kid who's working nights to pay for tuition and overpriced textbooks want to pay for an NFL farm team?"

    Yes, that bio-engineering student who's working a night job and trying to keep his GPA up so he can get into med school is really going to be excited about having his student fees jacked so that Utah won't have to share the PAC 12 cellar with Washington State.

  • SoCalUtahFan Utesville, CA
    June 28, 2011 9:24 p.m.

    Ok. I am sending my check.