HB116 showdown will reveal who controls Utah GOP

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  • TRUTH Salt Lake City, UT
    June 17, 2011 9:28 a.m.

    LOL!!! Are these two having a debate or a love fest.......its like listening to two guys fighting over who is the bigger dope! At least give us a debate before you post a story ...this is like watching MSNBC

  • Hellooo Salt Lake City, UT
    June 14, 2011 12:03 a.m.

    Love how the main stream middle is now describe as the "far right". Not much demeaning in that term. Really, why doesn't the article say it is the "far left" extremist political establishment that....

  • Jazz Bass Man Wellsville, Utah
    June 13, 2011 4:31 p.m.

    The overt and outright bias in this article is amazing. So any citizen in Utah who against mass amnesty for illegal criminals is an "extremist" or "far right" wacko? Wow, the deseret news has truly reached a new low, and it's telling of how desperate the open borders/mexican reconquista crowd really is. EVERY Utahn I know of is law abiding, and is against amnesty for illegals. None of them that I know are "far right", racist, or "extremist".

    Delegates: Do the right thing and throw this amnesty monstrosity in the trash can where it belongs. Don't let the biased media, or some pressure groups push you around. Remember who it is that you work for.

  • Nonconlib Orem, UT
    June 13, 2011 3:31 p.m.

    My own hope is that HB116 will be repealed and that this will be one more nail in the Republican Party's coffin. I'm hoping that the Far Right, who for some unknown reason consider themselves mainstream, will tip so even farther to the right so that they finally rip the Republican Party in half, thus restoring balance to Utah politics.

  • TruthSleuth7 SALT LAKE CITY, UT
    June 13, 2011 3:23 p.m.

    The thing that is not mentioned here is that the practical, state-based, solution to the immigration problem was actually spearheaded and introduced to the legislature by the Utah democratic representative Luz Robles.

  • LDS Liberal Farmington, UT
    June 13, 2011 11:44 a.m.

    countryscotty | 9:58 a.m. June 12, 2011
    Orem, Ut

    HB116 needs to be repealed. I am ashamed to be LDS.


    Bazinga | 8:03 a.m. June 13, 2011
    Taylorsville, UT

    So, since I want to follow the guidance of my church, I feel the correct thing to do is repeal H.B. 116.


    Political ideology ahead of official LDS Statements.

    All I can ask is this:

    #4 ...Do you sustain the other General Authorities and local authorities of the Church?

    #7 Do you support, affiliate with, or agree with any group or individual whose teachings or practices are contrary to or oppose those accepted by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints?

    But since you don't drink Coca-Cola, so you feel you are fully Temple worthy, right?

    Sad -- I will continue my prayers for the Latter-Day Nephites.

  • Fitness Freak Salt Lake City, UT
    June 13, 2011 9:19 a.m.

    Isn't it AMAZING how much support lawbreakers receive from the media?

    Others have ALREADY EXPRESSED most of the points that I could make.

    I would only add that I was taught to "honor, obey, and sustain" the law of the land.
    The Obey part to me is obvious.

    The "honor, and sustain" part to me means we should elect those persons would work to uphold the laws and in some cases, fire from employment those who refuse to enforce laws (police chiefs).
    The pandering to illegal alien trespassers and trying to make all sorts of excuses for NOT enforcing the law has got to stop.
    Passing a whole new set of "feel good", but meaningless and worthless laws doesn't help much either!

  • Bazinga Taylorsville, UT
    June 13, 2011 8:03 a.m.

    One argument that I don't see anywhere from the LDS church's recent press release was that they clearly stated that immigration was a federal issue. Hence, any attempt to tackle this at the state level could be seen as a direct contradiction to the church statement. Sure the statement only specifies the "enforcement only" type bills, but, for me, it also includes states creating quazi-amnesty bills.

    So, since I want to follow the guidance of my church, I feel the correct thing to do is repeal H.B. 116.

  • UtahVoter Spanish Fork, UT
    June 13, 2011 7:27 a.m.

    Love this quote:

    "The LDS Church could not be more explicit in supporting the package of immigration-related bills that passed in this year's legislative session, including HB116. Anyone who suggests otherwise doesn't understand plain English, is playing games or is flat out lying."

    I was at the Utah County GOP convention and the question of LDS support *never* came up officially in all the heated official debates. It seemed nobody wanted to deal with the, erm, "elephant in the room." Neither the supporters nor the opposition.

    Maybe now, with two more official communications on the subject, delegates can at least tackle the question. Why does the LDS church support the thing?

    I'm hoping that -- regardless of religious affiliation -- more delegates might take a moment to soberly reflect on the actual messages explaining why the LDS Church supports HB116 and possibly re-consider their own rhetoric on it.

  • tenx Santa Clara, UT
    June 13, 2011 6:58 a.m.

    country scotty 9:58 you sadly are so correct. The pressure they used to intimidate the legislators was unbelievable.

  • Considering Stockton, UT
    June 13, 2011 1:42 a.m.

    It is amazing to me how many who generally hate any political involvement from the LDS church are suddenly thrilled about church support for amnesty.

    Similarly even as LDS Church members who agreed with the church on Prop 8 were called lemmings and those who disagreed were praised as being independent and open minded, suddenly all church members are supposed to agree 100% with the political views of the LDS church on HB 116 and any who disagree are castigated.

    When the men I sustain as Prophets stand up in general conference or put their signatures under a letter to be read over the pulpit telling members that the good Lord wants us to support amnesty, I'll consider it my religious duty to support amnesty.

    Until then, I'm not inclined to let a bunch of PR people, lawyers, or those with close associations with the chamber of commerce dictate my political views with mere press releases.

    If this is doctrinal, put it over the pulpit.

    Otherwise, expect that there will be some honest political disagreement....just as liberals want there to be when the church takes a conservative political position.

  • JBrady Murray, Ut
    June 12, 2011 11:23 p.m.

    Majority of Utahns and Americans are against amnesty, which HB 116 is. When someone comes here illegally to work, and we allow them to stay and work, it's amnesty.

    I see both commentators support a sub class of worker for the Salt Lake Chamber. That is not something to be proud of. Neither should ignoring the 9% of America that is out of work.

    This legislation is anything but fair, it gives welfare labor to the business community. It's not innovative or courageous. It's not compassionate to those out of work, or those who lose their jobs, or depressed wages caused by the glut of labor, or to the people waiting in line in other countries to come here legally. It's dishonest and creating a sub class of labor is a disgrace.

  • one vote Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2011 10:30 p.m.

    Utah is controlled by the radical right not Republicans.

  • CJ Murray, UT
    June 12, 2011 7:02 p.m.

    The arrogance of these two is amazing, anyone who disagrees with their open borders amnesty rhetoric is off base. If anyone is misguided it's these two. As for who controls the party I think it will be clear on Saturday that delegates are going to oppose HB116 and not care what the Church, the Chamber, or anyone else says, the only ones who count in our Democracy are the people and we are fed up with all these groups telling us what to do and believe. The motives of all these groups are suspect, the fact is the majority of Utahns have had enough of illegals and their supporters. Turning Utah into a sanctuary state is the only thing that will come of it all.

  • BYU Alum Cedar Hills, UT
    June 12, 2011 4:16 p.m.

    One of the first tactics for those losing an argument is to start the name calling. "Far right" (ie. extremists, facist, racist, etc.) have been thrown around a lot in this particular question about those who are taking advantage of our country and system. I am a registered Democrat and far from "far right". There are many of us who see this as what is fair, what is right for Utah, and what is right for our country. If you are name calling, you have already lost the argument. Down with HB116 and vote out those who would compromise what is right for a cheaper than cheap labor underclass that we all end up paying for with our education and medical system abuses.

  • Emophiliac Vernal, UT
    June 12, 2011 2:22 p.m.

    Who would think that being against illegal activity would not be considered mainstream by Utah businesses and churches? In any event, I will be using HB116 as a litmus test for my vote. Since we're talking Utah, I will be voting against any Republican who is for HB116. The vote will either go to a Democrat or to a Republican who stands with the average Utahn. We'll just have to see which it will be.

  • M.Sanchez Salt Lake City, Utah
    June 12, 2011 12:28 p.m.

    "Right wing and Left wing extremist hate the plan, which is clear evidence of its fairness."

    Really? I think it is the opposite.

    Here are some examples.
    During the committee hearings on SB 60, (the bill that HB 116 is based on before the bill number change) diametrically opposed groups on the illegal alien issue came together in agreement that this bill HB116 is bad for their various reasons.

    The Citizens Coalition on Illegal Immigration, 9/12 groups, Eagle Forum, The Utah Minuteman Project, UFIRE, ACLU, Projecto Latino, United Front for Social Justice, Immigration lawyers, Bishop Webster and many legal immigrants are following different processes to end HB 116.
    They are all writing editorials, letters to the editor, speaking on radio shows,talking with neighbors and personally talking with state Senators and Representatives.
    Some Utah citizens have organized an effort within the Republican party's process for a resolution to repeal HB116.

    All of this effort is by the citizens of Utah. It is saying the concept of HB 116 and SB 60 is wrong. Please listen to us the citizens of Utah.

  • Brother Chuck Schroeder A Tropical Paradise USA, FL
    June 12, 2011 10:52 a.m.

    It's time again, to set the record straight. Is this a mass cover-up?. As the Mormon Church sinks deeper and deeper into the battle over amnesty for illegal aliens in Utah, it risks raising questions about the influence that the Mormon Church will attempt to exercise over Mitt Romney and Jon Huntsman should one of them eventually be elected President of the United States. When Republican delegates introduced resolutions to repeal HB116 at county Republican Conventions, the Mormon Church issued an "Immigration Response" that set out its support for HB116 and specifically for provisions "that will allow those who are now here illegally to work legally." Now, political and Church leaders face the very real possibility that elected delegates to the state Republican Party convention will support a resolution on June 18 calling for the repeal of HB116. According to reliable sources, the Mormon Church is now considering issuing yet another statement that will effectively instruct Mormon delegates to kill the resolution. However, if it does and if the delegates do indeed defeat the resolution, questions will arise about the control that the Mormon Church exercises over people sworn to represent those who elect them.

    Deport illegals.

  • Hunt Spanish Fork, UT
    June 12, 2011 10:19 a.m.

    I tire of the continued false claim of the pro illegal crowd that those delegates that are against hb116 are "far Right" Republicans. They use it as a derogatory term in yet another attempt at shame tactics. Once again, they don't have the facts on their side, nor do they have the moral high ground.
    I would hope that our Republican delegates do not give into this undo and unfair pressure being placed on them by groups and individuals that are not representing the interest of Utah Citizens.
    HB116 is nothing more than institutional racism and its supporters know it. They are motivated in their support of the idea for various reasons, all having personal financial gain at its core. This is financial gain that is at the expense of Utah Citizens.

  • evensteven Sandy, UT
    June 12, 2011 10:10 a.m.

    Is the definition of "mainstream" when one agrees with Pignanelli and Webb?

    This piece is just another in a long string of lame attempts by these two to marginalize any who favor anything short of open borders and immediate citizenship.

  • countryscotty Orem, ut
    June 12, 2011 9:58 a.m.

    From reading all these wonderful news articles....I would say the Utah GOP is owned and operated by LDS inc. just as the papers are.

    HB116 needs to be repealed. I am ashamed to be LDS. I was taught growing up to obey and sustain the laws of the land and to uphold the constitution. This law and the support of it by "the church" goes against everything I was taught growing up LDS. I believe in compassion and loving thy neighbor but this goes to far. You should not reward those that break laws for their gain. HB116 does just that.

    This law (HB116)is not only a slap in the face to those that come legally but to those that do not live across the border and have to wait in line to come legally. This is exactly why immigration laws have quotas for how many people can immigrate from each country. Where is the fairness or compassion for the starving African or those in refugee camps in Thailand? Repeal hb116 and replace it with a law that is FAIR and does not reward those that have broken our laws but rewards those that follow it.

  • Esquire Springville, UT
    June 12, 2011 9:57 a.m.

    The right wing is too extreme even for the Church. People, it is time to stop the conservative bullies.

  • danaslc Kearns, UT
    June 12, 2011 9:50 a.m.

    Far right wing? You mean those who believe in our Constitution and Citizens Rights to live and work? You mean a free society? Is that the far right? This is interesting to be called the Far Right. Ok, well whatever.

  • Brother Chuck Schroeder A Tropical Paradise USA, FL
    June 12, 2011 9:21 a.m.

    Would HB116 showdown will reveal who controls Utah GOP?. Did you ever notice how the pundits and talking heads seldom refer to the ramifications of some politico's action, but how they will be perceived by the voting public? It seems in politics that it isn't important what you actually do, but what you are perceived as doing by one faction or another. Utah plus Congress passes legislation telling the voting public only what they think we want to hear and will support, never even giving a hint of the rot the bill contains. As long as we perceive it to be a beneficial piece of legislation that's all they want, to heck with the actual harm the bill can cause, we peons don't need to know about that until it's too late then DN prints it. Have you ever watched a good slight of hand artist at work? He does his seemingly impossible tricks by getting you to focus on one hand while the other hand does the magic. As long as the hand we're watching is not involved, our perception is directed away from the action. I say report then deport illegals.

  • Craig Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2011 7:36 a.m.

    It is not the far right who oppose the bill but mainstream Utah'ns. There is nothing extreme about following the law and allowing people from all nations a chance to come to the USA. The current preference for law breakers from our south is hurting many honest imagrants from other parts of the world.

  • lost in DC West Jordan, UT
    June 12, 2011 6:03 a.m.

    why can't Pignanelli tell the difference between legal and illegal immigration?

    And why do you characterize those who support upholding the law as far-right? By your definition everyone who is not "far-right" has no respect for the law.

  • anti-liar Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2011 4:23 a.m.


    "without all the nasty rhetoric"

    Kind of like "Right-wing and left-wing extremists hate the plan, which is clear evidence of its fairness?"

    By the way: the assertion on the part of both Pignanelli and Webb that those who oppose HB116 constitute only an extreme fringe minority of Utah citizens is absolutely ridiculous and of course false.

  • Utah_1 Salt Lake City, UT
    June 12, 2011 1:26 a.m.

    You are missing an important point. The resolution that passed in Washington County dealt with HB 116 and the GOP Platform. The Resolution being considered on Saturday not only deals with that, but it deals with the constitutional nature of HB 116 as a state power.

    HB 469 is a key to the question. Most of not all conservative legislature members voted for HB 469. Several of these members did not vote for HB 116. The reasons for the votes against HB 116 vary, as do the reasons for those that voted for HB 116.

    HB 469 raises the same question, under the US Constitution is Immigration an enumerated power? Obviously not, if you read the current Deseret News Editorial.

    If the Resolution on Saturday fails, it may be that a very few conservative activists care more about censuring the legislature over the finding an answer to immigration. The Resolution on Saturday fatally questions the oath of office of its own co-sponsors.

    Is HB 116 flawed? Yes. Is HB 116 unconstitutional? No. Is that understood by many conservatives? Yes.

  • EJM Herriman, UT
    June 12, 2011 1:04 a.m.

    I am betting on the far right to win at the convention. Then this will get to be really fun. I just hope that the one thing that comes out of all this is an end to the caucuses and the introduction of the open primary system.